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jump the shark
- Thread starter rickyb
- Start date
What, perzactly, does that mean??Here's a fun question.
At what point during last year did Carr jump the shark?
Tulip
Veteran
Here's a fun question.
At what point during last year did Carr jump the shark?
...and why is that a "fun question"?
Arky
Veteran
IMO, he never jumped the shark. About the first 6 or 7 games of the season, he was among the league leaders in QB rating. After that, very inconsistent. Good to very good one game, terrible the next, a couple - just OK....
The coaches will be evaluating his entire year... the good and the bad...
The coaches will be evaluating his entire year... the good and the bad...
run-david-run
All Pro
The Titans game was probably the tipping point for Carr. Losing a game many thought we would win, to a divison rival, VY, and all that, and Sage looking significantly better then him. After, that, it was very much a downward spiral, and I think he only threw about 2 or 3 TD's the rest of the season after that game.
Bob McNair
Waterboy
For me (apparently only me) it was not one of the horror shows in Tennessee or New England it was --- the Buffalo game. Carr tied the all time NFL record for consecutive pass completions, AND the running game went off for over 180 yards - the second best ever in franchise history at the time - and the offense scored - 14 POINTS! (The Texans scored 21 in the game - that included an interception return for a TD by D. Robinson). The final straw was not one of the bad games - it was THIS IS AS GOOD AS IT CAN GET - 14 points and a loss to a mediocre team.
With 22 consecutive pass completions and over 180 yards rushing you should have - 49 points or 63 points - lets be conservative and say 52 points from the offense. NO! 14 STINKING POINTS! At least once in the game, the Texans had 3 completions for 9 yards and had to punt! You complete 3 consecutive passes and have to punt!! :brickwall AARRGGHH!!
There is "making winning plays" and "not making winning plays". Some QBs can barely complete over 50% of their passes and still have a 6 game winning streak because they make winning plays. Some QBs (well, OK, only one in the entire history of the NFL) can complete 22 consecutive passes and still lose because they don't make winning plays.
With 22 consecutive pass completions and over 180 yards rushing you should have - 49 points or 63 points - lets be conservative and say 52 points from the offense. NO! 14 STINKING POINTS! At least once in the game, the Texans had 3 completions for 9 yards and had to punt! You complete 3 consecutive passes and have to punt!! :brickwall AARRGGHH!!
There is "making winning plays" and "not making winning plays". Some QBs can barely complete over 50% of their passes and still have a 6 game winning streak because they make winning plays. Some QBs (well, OK, only one in the entire history of the NFL) can complete 22 consecutive passes and still lose because they don't make winning plays.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
I think that's a strong argument for the Bills game but personally, it was the Raiders game. If it had JUST been the Raiders game, I'd take a stand that everyone has bad games and the Raiders defense is bad-ass yadda yadda yadda. But that Raiders game after everything else that had happened up to that point and it was just the last straw for me. Personally, I would have been pleased to see Sage starting after that. Just to see what he could do.
I don't know if this is true but Carr has to be the first QB in a very, very long time to have 2 games in consecutive years where he has played a full game and had less than 20 yards net passing... and still been starting for the same team. And if someone has done that, I bet there were extenuating circumstances: bad weather, playing through injury for the good of the team, or something. And only 1 300 yard passing game this year and it was on 50+ attempts?
Yeah, for me, it was the Raider game.
I don't know if this is true but Carr has to be the first QB in a very, very long time to have 2 games in consecutive years where he has played a full game and had less than 20 yards net passing... and still been starting for the same team. And if someone has done that, I bet there were extenuating circumstances: bad weather, playing through injury for the good of the team, or something. And only 1 300 yard passing game this year and it was on 50+ attempts?
Yeah, for me, it was the Raider game.
painekiller
All Pro
Well for me, Carr jumped the shark during the 2004 the season. Carr had a decent first half of the season, the team showed some signs of growth. we had a 4-4 record. We played the Colts and they exposed Carr inability to read and beat the cover 2 defense. He had 3 INT that day. We lost and then had a 4-5 record. The team only went 3-4 after that week. And teams started playing more and more cover 2 against us.
When the season ended, I thought Capers and at the very least Palmer/Fangio should be replaced right then. I did not come to this conclusion because we lost to the Browns, I had come to this conclusion over the entire second half of the season. I think that is when Carr quit on that staff.
I saw the 2-14 season coming.
OK I am no professional scout, but I am a serious fan, and I watch and disect the games, not to the level Vinny does but pretty deep. And I admit this team has not done right by Davis Carr when it come to OL and talent around him, they have when it come to pay, and benefit of the doubt. That all said, I saw Carr give up, at least in my mind. I believe that is why Gary Walker got in his face on the sideline and he is now gone.
I wanted Vince Young to be a Texans for about a month, then the team excercised Carrs option and I knew they where not taking VY, so I dropped it and moved on. BTW I love Mario and I look forward to him becoming the player I believe he can be.
This season when we where at the Titians during week 8, it became clear David was struggling. By the Raider game, I think Kubiak lost faith in him. Now I do not see the team being able to sell Carr to the fans again as the sole option at QB. And I think David needs a place to land for him to hopefully become the player we saw beat Dallas in the first game.
Can Davis play in the Super Bowl, yes he is as good/better as Grossman. And a team can build up a strong defense, a good running game and have above average pass protection and David might manage the offense to a Super Bowl. But David is not Montona/Elway/Brady, he cannot be the guy that puts a team on his shoulders and carries them for a season to win the ultimate game IMO.
But David's time here is close to being done, and he needs to go to a team like the Vikings or even the Bears to revive his career.
When the season ended, I thought Capers and at the very least Palmer/Fangio should be replaced right then. I did not come to this conclusion because we lost to the Browns, I had come to this conclusion over the entire second half of the season. I think that is when Carr quit on that staff.
I saw the 2-14 season coming.
OK I am no professional scout, but I am a serious fan, and I watch and disect the games, not to the level Vinny does but pretty deep. And I admit this team has not done right by Davis Carr when it come to OL and talent around him, they have when it come to pay, and benefit of the doubt. That all said, I saw Carr give up, at least in my mind. I believe that is why Gary Walker got in his face on the sideline and he is now gone.
I wanted Vince Young to be a Texans for about a month, then the team excercised Carrs option and I knew they where not taking VY, so I dropped it and moved on. BTW I love Mario and I look forward to him becoming the player I believe he can be.
This season when we where at the Titians during week 8, it became clear David was struggling. By the Raider game, I think Kubiak lost faith in him. Now I do not see the team being able to sell Carr to the fans again as the sole option at QB. And I think David needs a place to land for him to hopefully become the player we saw beat Dallas in the first game.
Can Davis play in the Super Bowl, yes he is as good/better as Grossman. And a team can build up a strong defense, a good running game and have above average pass protection and David might manage the offense to a Super Bowl. But David is not Montona/Elway/Brady, he cannot be the guy that puts a team on his shoulders and carries them for a season to win the ultimate game IMO.
But David's time here is close to being done, and he needs to go to a team like the Vikings or even the Bears to revive his career.
IMO there are no Qbs in draft this year to take us to another level. I would select Kevin Kolb from UH in 2or 3rd and pray hard. I do not see a free agent that excites me either. Some of our Denver hand me downs have been ok but none truly stood out. Plummer may be something to get by with but not take us much further, same with Sage. That being said, why not keep Carr one more year and eliminate one year of salary/bonus? If he does well, keep him or have better trade options for the next year. If he does no better, we have not lost much. I do not see Plummer or anyone else this season bringing more wins. Train Kolb and then look hard at the QBs available after this season. We should take care of LT (Spencer or a pick), CB (f/A or draft) RB (AP or another pick) L/B (draft or F/A) and maybe add a safety. We should be in much better shape to decide on QB in 2008 if Carr/Kolb do not work out.
texan_fan_8
Noob
Here's a fun question.
At what point during last year did Carr jump the shark?
Titans game where he was benched and then out played. He needed not to be put back in and relegated to back up from that point on.
texan_fan_8
Noob
I really don't want david training anyone and passing down his bad , its not my fault attitude. Negativity breeds and frankly we just dont need it.
shinerbock_girl
All Pro
I'm glad you asked that...lol
Bob McNair
Waterboy
I'm not putting the defensive performance on Carr, just the offensive. True, if the defense had shut out the Bills, the Texans would have won - but the offense would still have only scored 14 points.
The real killer was that after the defense scored to give the Texans a 4 point lead early in the 3rd quarter, the offense had several chances to drive down the field, score a TD, and put the game out of reach. No incomplete passes but no scores.
With the two 83 yard TDs early and the last second TD late, yes, the defense "lost" the Bills game (although a defense that only gives up 17 more points than it scores is not that bad).
The point is - Carr did not make the plays to lose the game, but even with his record setting performance he did not make the plays to win the game. If he can't make winning plays in that situation he can't make them often enough to keep the starting job.