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If Bush fails to run a sub 4.5 40-dash will it change...

If Bush fails to run a sub 4.5 40-dash at his pro will it change his draft position?

  • Yes, Reggie needs that extra burst to be elite in the NFL.

    Votes: 29 47.5%
  • No, Reggie is game day fast and is a proven commodity.

    Votes: 32 52.5%

  • Total voters
    61

Tale Gator

________
If Bush fails to run a sub 4.5 40-dash at his pro will it change his draft position?

Personally, I think that Reggie will run in the low 4.4's --but-- seeing as some were surprised by VY's and some others slower (or faster) times how do you think it will effect the decisions of those making the big call?

A speedier than expected sprint in the 40 from a prospect can certainly bump them up -- could a slower than expected run notch the Heisman Trophy winner out of the number one spot...
 

Vinny

shiny happy fan
Bubbajwp said:
We already know what he can do on the field so no it wouldnt matter to me.
we already know what he can do on a College field. Last year JJ Arrington had just as impressive YPC, and he was the super flop of the draft for the Cards. Same skillset. There are no sure things out there.
 

Vinny

shiny happy fan
tulexan said:
JJ averaged 7 ypc, Reggie averaged ~9 ypc

Big difference
no it's not a big difference. They both have the exact same skillset and the exact same questions about their abilities to run inside. Bush had nearly 100 less carries and was on a team with the best offensive talent in decades. Arrington didn't have Lendale White, and several NFL prospects taking the attention away form him.

http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaaf/stats/bycategory?cat=Rushing&sort=10&conference=I-A_PAC10&year=2004
http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaaf/stats/bycategory?cat=Rushing&conference=I-A_PAC10&year=2005
 

HJam72

Hall of Fame
In answer to the original question, I think it would definitely change his status, even though it shouldn't. For instance, I made fun of Young some about the Wonderlic score(s) and it did hurt him a lot I think, but I don't think his IQ has anything at all to do with his ability to play QB. If it did, he would've sucked at the college level. All this pre-draft stuff seems over-hyped to me and looking back at what they did in college (and who they played with and against) SHOULD carry much more weight.

Looking at your choices, I can't answer. He will be an elite player (if he can stay healthy and run descent between the tackles some), but I think a slower than expected time would hurt his pre-draft status. We'll probably take him anyway though.

Which freaking side am I on anyway? :) :idonno:
 

tulexan

Hall of Fame
I've seen both play many games and Reggie is much better. JJ isn't nearly as explosive as Reggie.
 

Bubbajwp

All Flopper
Vinny said:
we already know what he can do on a College field. Last year JJ Arrington had just as impressive YPC, and he was the super flop of the draft for the Cards. Same skillset. There are no sure things out there.
I didnt realy mean he was a sure thing. I meant more we know he is quick and has good speed whether it be timed speed or not.
 

Tale Gator

________
HJam72 said:
In answer to the original question, I think it would definitely change his status, even though it shouldn't. For instance, I made fun of Young some about the Wonderlic score(s) and it did hurt him a lot I think, but I don't think his IQ has anything at all to do with his ability to play QB. If it did, he would've sucked at the college level. All this pre-draft stuff seems over-hyped to me and looking back at what they did in college (and who they played with and against) SHOULD carry much more weight.

Looking at your choices, I can't answer. He will be an elite player (if he can stay healthy and run descent between the tackles some), but I think a slower than expected time would hurt his pre-draft status. We'll probably take him anyway though.

Which freaking side am I on anyway? :) :idonno:
Thanks, great post.

:)
 

texasguy346

Mod Squad
No it won't effect his draft status anymore than VY's 40 time will effect his draft status. The game tape on both guys have more weight than any 40 time or Wonderlic score. The scouts know what they can do long before they ever line up to run that 40 yd track.

On a side note I'd say that JJ Arrington didn't demonstrate near the vision that Bush did in college, and I think that's his biggest problem in the NFL (that and being part of the Arizona Cardinals). It seems like guys like Kevin Jones had the same problem too.
 

Dunta_23

Rookie
Im hoping he is high 4.2's....would love to see him go low 4.2's just to add some hype but I think he'll be mid 4.3's
 
with the extra weight bush has put on it would not surprise me if he ran a 4.5
unless he has already ajusted to his weight. but i wonder what if he had a bad 40 i guess we could take mario williams.
 

Tejaspro

Waterboy
The Dude Abides said:
It's not like Bush is that athletic. I'm expecting something around the 4.8-4.9 range. :cool:
Dude.

How much did you see Bush play this last season? I live in Southern California and saw him play probably as much as you saw Vince Young play. And I can safely say, he is a very special player. I'm not saying that VY isn't special, but Bush is ready for the NFL right now. I believe VY is a few years away, especially for the position he plays. Bush has been a can't miss player since he was playing high school ball in San Diego. Even then, people were saying he was going to be a star. And, by the way.... Bush IS that athletic.
Do you think EVERYONE is wrong? You might expect something around the 4.8 - 4.9 range.... just pass me what you're smokin' Dude. And you are right about one thing...."The Dude Abides".:redtowel:
 
Vinny said:
we already know what he can do on a College field. Last year JJ Arrington had just as impressive YPC, and he was the super flop of the draft for the Cards. Same skillset. There are no sure things out there.


In that case.

We Should avoid Vince Young, he kind of reminds me of Andre Ware... same style...he is going to be a bust. And AJ Hawk..that build reminds me a little of the Boz's...bust written all over it.


Reggie Bush could be compared to JJ Arrington, or compared to LT. You can't just assume he will be a "clone" of JJ.
 

texasguy346

Mod Squad
Nighthawk said:
What was DD's 40, anybody? Morency's?
All it takes is a simple google search.

Morrency's 40 times were 4.66 & 4.67. He didn't run at the combine due to a hamstring injury.
link 1

As for DD his 40 time was 4.63 at the combine & 4.56 at his pro day.
link 2
 

Maddict5

Hall of Fame
yourfavoritetexan42 said:
In that case.

We Should avoid Vince Young, he kind of reminds me of Andre Ware... same style...he is going to be a bust. And AJ Hawk..that build reminds me a little of the Boz's...bust written all over it.


Reggie Bush could be compared to JJ Arrington, or compared to LT. You can't just assume he will be a "clone" of JJ.
really??? i think VY reminds me more of Kordell Stewart, D'brick reminds me of Mike Williams, and Mario reminds me of Courtney Brown...hey, basically same skill set...:rolleyes: :homer:
 
Tejaspro said:
Dude.

How much did you see Bush play this last season? I live in Southern California and saw him play probably as much as you saw Vince Young play. And I can safely say, he is a very special player. I'm not saying that VY isn't special, but Bush is ready for the NFL right now. I believe VY is a few years away, especially for the position he plays. Bush has been a can't miss player since he was playing high school ball in San Diego. Even then, people were saying he was going to be a star. And, by the way.... Bush IS that athletic.
Do you think EVERYONE is wrong? You might expect something around the 4.8 - 4.9 range.... just pass me what you're smokin' Dude. And you are right about one thing...."The Dude Abides".:redtowel:
You obviously missed his sarcasm there buddy.

:ok:
 

TheOgre

All Pro
The only way Bush runs higher than 4.5 is if he pulls a hammy or trips over his feet and goes falling to the ground.
 

nunusguy

Hall of Fame
I'm a big Bush fan (the football player, starting to have a lot of second thoughts about the politician lately), but I "expect" him to run in the 4.3s,
and will disappointed if he fails to break 4.4.
Bush certainly has football speed, but he was also an accomplished sprinter at the scholastic level, but don't think he has continued to compete after entering college. He is not and never has been rated a "world class" sprinter as some have said, but was one of the 2 or 3 best sprinters in the state of CA while he was in HS there
The attached link is from the Cal state track championships in 2002, when Bush was a HS jurnior. As an aside the the story, the guy who won the 100 & 200 meters that year was, according to this story, the first white sprinter to do that in 40 years. Surprising bit of info for ultra poly correct Cal.
Anyway, Bush ran a 10.42 in the prelims but not that fast when he finished third in the finals.
I dunno.....apparently Bush didn't compete in Track his senior year in HS, as I've not found any documentation on his HS track career after his jurnior year.
http://www.dyestat.com/state/ca/2out/statemeet/r-10.htm
 

Kaiser Toro

Native Mod
nunusguy said:
I'm a big Bush fan (the football player, starting to have a lot of second thoughts about the politician lately), but I "expect" him to run in the 4.3s,
and will disappointed if he fails to break 4.4.
Bush certainly has football speed, but he was also an accomplished sprinter at the scholastic level, but don't think he has continued to compete after entering college. He is not and never has been rated a "world class" sprinter as some have said, but was one of the 2 or 3 best sprinters in the state of CA while he was in HS there
The attached link is from the Cal state track championships in 2002, when Bush was a HS jurnior. As an aside the the story, the guy who won the 100 & 200 meters that year was, according to this story, the first white sprinter to do that in 40 years. Surprising bit of info for ultra poly correct Cal.
Anyway, Bush ran a 10.42 in the prelims but not that fast when he finished third in the finals.
I dunno.....apparently Bush didn't compete in Track his senior year in HS, as I've not found any documentation on his HS track career after his jurnior year.
http://www.dyestat.com/state/ca/2out/statemeet/r-10.htm
Thank you. If I were a Bush fan I would set expectations more in line with nunusguy on what his 40 time will look like.
 

Texas

Veteran
Wow whoever said 4.7/4.8 your out of your mind. I think maybe somewhere around 4.38...I guess we will see!
 

Lucky

Ride, Captain, Ride!
Staff member
nunusguy said:
Anyway, Bush ran a 10.42 in the prelims but not that fast when he finished third in the finals.
Bush was running against the wind in the finals. Which makes me ask, why don't these pro day 40 times include the wind speed?

Also, Maurice Drew ran a 10.8 in the prelims. And I thought WRs had all the speed.
 
HeroTime said:
Bush has a 4.28 40 time already on his resume.
That's what a Sporting News article had him at last year. RB wants to be 1st pick, I'd bet he's been training like a mad man. I'm looking for 4.27-4.33 range at about 208.
 

PapaL

Loose Screw
So who remembers Terrell Suggs? Great college DE/LB. Was a "speed guy" in college. When he ran a slow 40 (4.63), every said he couldnt play in the Pros like he did in college. Drafted #10 overall, 30 sacks and 3 years later I'm sure someone in the top 10 would take him him. Or how about Anquan Boldin? Another "slow" player he has set the league on fire. Some guys flat out play faster then they run.
 

nunusguy

Hall of Fame
HeroTime said:
Bush has a 4.28 40 time already on his resume.
It certainly wouldn't surprise me to see Reggie knock out a sub 4.3, that would be icing on the cake. But I think we all have every right to expect "atleast" one time in the 4.3s. Raw speed is part of his array of athletic talents, and this is one position and he is "the" guy at that position
where 40 times are very relavant and meaningful.
 

Tale Gator

________
Let me add a 'bonus' question to the discussion which shouldn't effect the poll:

If Reggie blasts through the 4.3 barrier and runs in the 4.2's -- will it sway some VY supporters or trade downers over to the Bush camp?

[Sub 4.3 in the 40 being rarified world-class speed]
 

tulexan

Hall of Fame
He is a track guy who was the third fastest guy in California. A time around 4.3 wouldn't surprise me.
 

MorKnolle

All Pro
Napa Auto Parts said:
with the extra weight bush has put on it would not surprise me if he ran a 4.5
unless he has already ajusted to his weight. but i wonder what if he had a bad 40 i guess we could take mario williams.
What extra weight? At the Combine he weighed in at 201 lbs. If he was wanting to impress people by gaining weight and looking bigger he should have done that at the Combine, then lost it back again for his pro day so he could run faster, just like D'Brickashaw Ferguson did. If he didn't add that weight for his Combine weigh-in when he knew he wasn't working out, he isn't going to add a bunch of weight now for his pro day. I don't expect him to weigh more than the 200 to maybe 202 range.

HeroTime said:
Bush has a 4.28 40 time already on his resume.
Bush has supposedly run a 4.28 at some point. It wouldn't surprise me if he has seeing how fast he is on the field, but I expect him anywhere between 4.32 and 4.38 at his pro day, partially depending on what type of surface he's running on too.
 

uhcougar08

SHSUKATS08
MorKnolle said:
What extra weight? At the Combine he weighed in at 201 lbs. If he was wanting to impress people by gaining weight and looking bigger he should have done that at the Combine, then lost it back again for his pro day so he could run faster, just like D'Brickashaw Ferguson did. If he didn't add that weight for his Combine weigh-in when he knew he wasn't working out, he isn't going to add a bunch of weight now for his pro day. I don't expect him to weigh more than the 200 to maybe 202 range.



Bush has supposedly run a 4.28 at some point. It wouldn't surprise me if he has seeing how fast he is on the field, but I expect him anywhere between 4.32 and 4.38 at his pro day, partially depending on what type of surface he's running on too.
He said he wanted to weigh in the 210-215 range in his interview at he combine.
 

Kaiser Toro

Native Mod
Tale Gator said:
Let me add a 'bonus' question to the discussion which shouldn't effect the poll:

If Reggie blasts through the 4.3 barrier and runs in the 4.2's -- will it sway some VY supporters or trade downers over to the Bush camp?

[Sub 4.3 in the 40 being rarified world-class speed]
Not at all. Reggie and VY are football fast. I do not need a clock to tell me so.
 

Dr. Toro

Rookie
Vinny said:
no it's not a big difference. They both have the exact same skillset and the exact same questions about their abilities to run inside. Bush had nearly 100 less carries and was on a team with the best offensive talent in decades. Arrington didn't have Lendale White, and several NFL prospects taking the attention away form him.

http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaaf/stats/bycategory?cat=Rushing&sort=10&conference=I-A_PAC10&year=2004
http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaaf/stats/bycategory?cat=Rushing&conference=I-A_PAC10&year=2005
I didn't know that comparison was as close as it was. People seriously underestimate how good that offensive unit was, which I think deserves some consideration.

It's blasphemy to question Reggie's athleticism, but I'd also be interested to see how he can cut/maneuver in the backfield/through the line (not talking about counter plays). He was always getting a pretty healthy push from that line and had the luxury/ability of getting into space pretty consistently. I'd like to see some of the patience and subtle moves that Edge, Priest Holmes, DD and Warrick Dunn have made a living off of. Perhaps Bush compares favorably to LT, who is fantastic in space, but is good in tight spaces too. No matter how uniquely you utilize him, if he can't work those tight places, he might not be worth the #1 pick... you can't always get him to the edge.

Scouts Inc. could give him a grade of 101, but it's tough to give him lock status given some of those concerns. All that being said, don't be shocked to see him do 15-20+ reps on the bench and elicit numerous ("I told you he could run inside" posts).
 

Please_Evolve

Waterboy
It's kind of like working out your biceps...sure it looks great but it's not where all the real work is done.

I don't see all the big deal over 40 times except i guess for a wideout. Even then it's not going to matter if you're a guy that's going over the middle. What was Jerry Rice's 40 time? Tim Brown? et al? Game speed is so different then 40 track times guys. Really it's an inflated stat.

In the running back spot it's rare you're going to get a straight 40 yeard sprint. Espescially if you're running through the tackles...or got a line that can really open up holes. What matter is elusiveness, quick thinking, instinct, vision and toughness. While i am not sure on the last with Reggie the others he seems to have those in hand.

I'm not a big Reggie fan and i'm in the trade down camp. I think if we weren't asking a king's ransom to trade down we would get it. I hope the FO coems around closer to draft day. If not and we take bush...I bet Kubes could just eat up opposing D's with our projected line up and a better O line.

Btw go Texans.
 
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