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State of the O-line

Is Rankin still hurt or is his confidence just shattered into a million little pieces? When Lamm had to come out of the game a guy in the game thread goes "well so much for a clean game" or something like that, and right on cue Rankin gives up the pressure. Im so disappointed in that guy man, he showed so much more heart and fight in college and the first few games this year that it makes me wonder what happens when guys just fall of the face of the earth athletically speaking.
 
steelbtexan said:
Chubb is a rookie and has had an avg yr up until this week. If you were talking Davenport against Miller I would agree with you. Miller was Lamm's primary responsibility and I thought he held up surprisingly well. Lamm has surprised me with his in season improvement.
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That's not correct SteelB because Chubb had 7 sacks coming into the Texans game which made him anything but an average edge guy in the NFL but rather put him among the top 10 in that category.
Davenport might not be our long-term answer at LT but why not let the year play out before you completly write him off ?
 
steelbtexan said:
Chubb is a rookie and has had an avg yr up until this week. If you were talking Davenport against Miller I would agree with you. Miller was Lamm's primary responsibility and I thought he held up surprisingly well. Lamm has surprised me with his in season improvement.

But keep on with the D love it makes for interesting conversation. Although I've tried to see what you see and just dont get your love for D. I guess the love comes from him being one of the guys you loved comng out of college but expecting more than avg at best from him is unrealistic. He just doesn't have the feet for LT or power for RT.
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Agree on bolded and one of reasons I'm on this MB. Yes I liked him college and for same reason
as I like him as 1 year (based on games) NFL starter. IIRC he has not missed one snap due to injuries. We give other guys credit for that and should him also. His long arms make up some for his feet. I posted somewhere few weeks ago that his first two steps are correct but his third often get him into placement issues. That can be overcome with time and hopefully coaching input. We not only disagree on his evaluation but on any drafted LT replacing him in 2019 even Little or Hyatt. Let's see how D does with the remaining seven games.
 
badboy said:
Agree on bolded and one of reasons I'm on this MB. Yes I liked him college and for same reason
as I like him as 1 year (based on games) NFL starter. IIRC he has not missed one snap due to injuries. We give other guys credit for that and should him also. His long arms make up some for his feet. I posted somewhere few weeks ago that his first two steps are correct but his third often get him into placement issues. That can be overcome with time and hopefully coaching input. We not only disagree on his evaluation but on any drafted LT replacing him in 2019 even Little or Hyatt. Let's see how D does with the remaining seven games.
Click to expand...

I'm betting he does about the same as he has played so far this season. That's not good enough. The fact that you like D more than Little who's a huge dude with great feet and has played in the best conference in college football really makes me think you just loved D and cant see how bad he really is,
 
IDEXAN said:
That's not correct SteelB because Chubb had 7 sacks coming into the Texans game which made him anything but an average edge guy in the NFL but rather put him among the top 10 in that category.
Davenport might not be our long-term answer at LT but why not let the year play out before you completly write him off ?
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They said lets see how this turns out in the offseason. At this point there's enough evidence to make an educated guess on how this is going to turn out.
 
steelbtexan said:
Chubb is a rookie and has had an avg yr up until this week. If you were talking Davenport against Miller I would agree with you. Miller was Lamm's primary responsibility and I thought he held up surprisingly well. Lamm has surprised me with his in season improvement.

But keep on with the D love it makes for interesting conversation. Although I've tried to see what you see and just dont get your love for D. I guess the love comes from him being one of the guys you loved comng out of college but expecting more than avg at best from him is unrealistic. He just doesn't have the feet for LT or power for RT.
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Average? He had 7 sacks coming into the game...
 
steelbtexan said:
I'm betting he does about the same as he has played so far this season. That's not good enough. The fact that you like D more than Little who's a huge dude with great feet and has played in the best conference in college football really makes me think you just loved D and cant see how bad he really is,
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what I said was Little would not beat D out in 2019; if you want (and I can understand if you do) to draft LT round one and sit him then better guy starts 2020 that's another argument. 2020 D at backup is still cost effective but if Little or any other drafted LT can't beat him out in '20 you have egg blunder on your face. We might be facing that with Fulton backing up Mancz at RG. You are right we are both betting our view is correct and as you said that's good conversation. I like that we are not waiting to hear our # called in round one but have time to see if and how this offense develops. Wait until you see my first three picks!
 
Uncle Rico said:
Is Rankin still hurt or is his confidence just shattered into a million little pieces? When Lamm had to come out of the game a guy in the game thread goes "well so much for a clean game" or something like that, and right on cue Rankin gives up the pressure. Im so disappointed in that guy man, he showed so much more heart and fight in college and the first few games this year that it makes me wonder what happens when guys just fall of the face of the earth athletically speaking.
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Ease up a mite Uncle, Rankin is sort of in same place Big D was last season; first year NFL one game at LT and then a play or so at RT against a very good DE. Rankin should be alright although he might end up at Guard rather than OT as I hoped. Few are the tackles who start and do well first season especially third and fourth rounders.
 
badboy said:
what I said was Little would not beat D out in 2019; if you want (and I can understand if you do) to draft LT round one and sit him then better guy starts 2020 that's another argument. 2020 D at backup is still cost effective but if Little or any other drafted LT can't beat him out in '20 you have egg blunder on your face. We might be facing that with Fulton backing up Mancz at RG. You are right we are both betting our view is correct and as you said that's good conversation. I like that we are not waiting to hear our # called in round one but have time to see if and how this offense develops. Wait until you see my first three picks!
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Little is a better LT right now

Not that that's saying much
 
badboy said:
Ease up a mite Uncle, Rankin is sort of in same place Big D was last season; first year NFL one game at LT and then a play or so at RT against a very good DE. Rankin should be alright although he might end up at Guard rather than OT as I hoped. Few are the tackles who start and do well first season especially third and fourth rounders.
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...........Let's remember, that was after missing the entire offseason and TC with a foot fracture surgery........and suffering a compensatory ankle sprain when he tried to return for the Giants game.
 
steelbtexan said:
Davenport stunk up the joint against Chubb last week.
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I don't agree with that at all. I thought Davenport had a good game. Gives me hope for the future.

Right now, I'd be on board with drafting on OT in the first round, if a guy I really liked fell in my lap. But I'm not "in the market" just yet.

If Davenport continues to improve like he has over the first 8 games & Rankin meets up to our expectations, OT may be off my list... unless an unbelievable talent falls in my lap.

Offensive Guard/Center is more of a concern for me right now.
 
thunderkyss said:
I don't agree with that at all. I thought Davenport had a good game. Gives me hope for the future.

Right now, I'd be on board with drafting on OT in the first round, if a guy I really liked fell in my lap. But I'm not "in the market" just yet.

If Davenport continues to improve like he has over the first 8 games & Rankin meets up to our expectations, OT may be off my list... unless an unbelievable talent falls in my lap.

Offensive Guard/Center is more of a concern for me right now.
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****************************************************************************************
PFF HOU Texans @PFF_Texans

Pass-blocking grades and pressures allowed for the #Texans O-line vs the Broncos:

Davenport: 65.8 (4)
Kelemete: 87.4 (0)
Martin: 69.6 (1)
Fulton: 65.3 (2)
Lamm: 74.2 (3)

It is the first time this season that all starters on the O-line graded above-average in pass-blocking.


10:23 AM - Nov 6, 2018

*****************************************************************************************

When looking at the 10 pressures above, keep in mind that Watson only had 24 pass attempts.
 
badboy said:
You expected D or any of our OTs to look good against Chubb? I want and expect D to hold his own which he basically did against one of best in NFL. He does get better every game but you must figure in his opponent as we should with all players. I am mocking an OT but he will replace Lamm not D.
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JB said:
D is in his second year... how many years of suckitude did Lamm get?
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Good points guys but this is all the more reason, the OT's have to be addressed in the 2019 NFL Draft. Jury is still out on both Davenport and Lamm. The jury will also remain out on both Henderson and Rankin. If I'm Gaine, I'm taking either the top rated LT or CB in RD1. My preference, if their both on the board and the team could move back later into RD1 or into the top 1-7 picks in RD2 while picking up another RD3 and still get one of the athletes, I'd be all over this move.

First 3 picks in RD1 and RD2, or in my move, later in RD1 or in RD2.....I'm taking (2) LT, (2) CB and Risner (OC/OG). Did I mention that I'm not exactly sold on Martin either. Risner would be a solid insurance piece for the OL. Having an extra RD3 would be invaluable since the defensive athletes in this draft are plentiful. I think Gaine could shine with 5 picks in RD's 2 & 3.

The team made no move in regards to trading for a RB. This could be addressed in FA but I really like Michigan RB, Karan Higdon I'd he was still on the board in RD2....not likely though.
 
Uncle Rico said:
Is Rankin still hurt or is his confidence just shattered into a million little pieces? When Lamm had to come out of the game a guy in the game thread goes "well so much for a clean game" or something like that, and right on cue Rankin gives up the pressure. Im so disappointed in that guy man, he showed so much more heart and fight in college and the first few games this year that it makes me wonder what happens when guys just fall of the face of the earth athletically speaking.
Click to expand...

Rankin was projected as an interior lineman....only O'Brien and Devlin would want to prove everyone wrong. Put this man at LG and his talent/confidence should be renewed. It'll be even more renewed with a true "starting caliber" LT.
 
badboy said:
Agree on bolded and one of reasons I'm on this MB. Yes I liked him college and for same reason
as I like him as 1 year (based on games) NFL starter. IIRC he has not missed one snap due to injuries. We give other guys credit for that and should him also. His long arms make up some for his feet. I posted somewhere few weeks ago that his first two steps are correct but his third often get him into placement issues. That can be overcome with time and hopefully coaching input. We not only disagree on his evaluation but on any drafted LT replacing him in 2019 even Little or Hyatt. Let's see how D does with the remaining seven games.
Click to expand...

The level of competition that Little and Hyatt have faced would better prepare them for the NFL. Yes, they will both have their training wheels on but I'd fully expect them to remove them by mid-season and progress from there. Davenport, is just a big human who played at an extremely low level of college football. It would've been a big step for him to play against solid D2 teams much less make the jump to NFL DE's or OLB's. He's still not strong enough for these battles. Not to mention, the Texans don't exactly have a juggernaut at OL Coach, which is going to slow his progression. Little or Hyatt would both be arriving with much better coaching so their progression could come from being on the field.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
The level of competition that Little and Hyatt have faced would better prepare them for the NFL. Yes, they will both have their training wheels on but I'd fully expect them to remove them by mid-season and progress from there. Davenport, is just a big human who played at an extremely low level of college football. It would've been a big step for him to play against solid D2 teams much less make the jump to NFL DE's or OLB's. He's still not strong enough for these battles. Not to mention, the Texans don't exactly have a juggernaut at OL Coach, which is going to slow his progression. Little or Hyatt would both be arriving with much better coaching so their progression could come from being on the field.
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So they would have further to regress?
 
JB said:
So they would have further to regress?
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No, Davenport hasn't progressed that much. Thank you Devlin. As for Little or Hyatt, I don't think regress simply b/c they've had better coaching and competition to get ready for the next step. Sort of like Watson, he's been good to great in spite of O'Brien.
 
An area where worlds collide, is elite talent on the offensive line is essential. What detractors are pointing out with lines such as the Cowboys is talent isn't a cure-all. What's missing is COACHING. The Cowboys' line has gone from monstrous and talented, to talented and inefficient. Give Alex Gibbs or any notable coach 3 months with that line and Zeke ... it's the #1 unit in football again by a ridiculous margin. Same with us and my biggest fear. We've got 'good enough' (not my opinion) talent at a few places on the line ... and we have to select a major addition or two early ... but who's picking them and who's going to coach them? A season of 'out-talenting' our coaching staff (Watson) isn't a favorable long term future.
 
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Scooter said:
An area where worlds collide, is elite talent on the offensive line is essential. What detractors are pointing out with lines such as the Cowboys is talent isn't a cure-all. What's missing is COACHING. The Cowboys' line has gone from monstrous and talented, to talented and inefficient. Give Alex Gibbs or any notable coach 3 months with that line and Zeke ... it's the #1 unit in football again by a ridiculous margin. Same with us and my biggest fear. We've got 'good enough' (not my opinion) talent at a few places on the line ... and we have to select a major addition or two early ... but who's picking them and who's going to coach them? A season of 'out-talenting' our coaching staff (Watson) isn't a favorable long term future.
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Now we agree on this matter.....I've said numerous times that the OL can't get better until Devlin is replaced. Devlin has done squat in coaching up the OL. I've called for his firing far too many times.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
...........Let's remember, that was after missing the entire offseason and TC with a foot fracture surgery........and suffering a compensatory ankle sprain when he tried to return for the Giants game.
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Watch makes one wonder what on Earth OBrien was thinking starting him at LT when Henderson got hurt
 
thunderkyss said:
I don't agree with that at all. I thought Davenport had a good game. Gives me hope for the future.

Right now, I'd be on board with drafting on OT in the first round, if a guy I really liked fell in my lap. But I'm not "in the market" just yet.

If Davenport continues to improve like he has over the first 8 games & Rankin meets up to our expectations, OT may be off my list... unless an unbelievable talent falls in my lap.

Offensive Guard/Center is more of a concern for me right now.
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Shocking you would disagree,

I'm not just for drafting a LT, I'm for trading up to get the LT of the future. No more of this 10 pressures and sacks in 28 pass attempts and that's altering the offense to try and give the OT's some help. If this is good enough for you it's easy to see why we disagree. Keeping Watson healthy is job #1 and you have to invest to make sure this happens.

Look at the Miami game to see what Watson is capable of when protected properly. I want to see more of that in the future and less of Watson running for his life. Also picking up 3rd and 1's would be nice.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Now we agree on this matter.....I've said numerous times that the OL can't get better until Devlin is replaced. Devlin has done squat in coaching up the OL. I've called for his firing far too many times.
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My radio pretty much stays on the NFL channel and a bunch of well respected guys on there are giving the Texans, in general, and OB & Devlin, in particular, a lot of love during this six game winning streak for keeping DW4 mostly upright and the running game doing a little something.

An OL takes time to gel and the limited game reps in pre-season games and TC aren't enough. With so many new starters and injuries, I'm not at all surprised that it's taken 9 weeks to start getting average or better play out of that unit.

Since it's looking more likely that the Texans will be drafting in the 20s, what moves would you make personnel and coaching wise in the offseason?
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Good points guys but this is all the more reason, the OT's have to be addressed in the 2019 NFL Draft. Jury is still out on both Davenport and Lamm. The jury will also remain out on both Henderson and Rankin. If I'm Gaine, I'm taking either the top rated LT or CB in RD1. My preference, if their both on the board and the team could move back later into RD1 or into the top 1-7 picks in RD2 while picking up another RD3 and still get one of the athletes, I'd be all over this move.

First 3 picks in RD1 and RD2, or in my move, later in RD1 or in RD2.....I'm taking (2) LT, (2) CB and Risner (OC/OG). Did I mention that I'm not exactly sold on Martin either. Risner would be a solid insurance piece for the OL. Having an extra RD3 would be invaluable since the defensive athletes in this draft are plentiful. I think Gaine could shine with 5 picks in RD's 2 & 3.

The team made no move in regards to trading for a RB. This could be addressed in FA but I really like Michigan RB, Karan Higdon I'd he was still on the board in RD2....not likely though.
Click to expand...
Problem with this is weakness at position. At least the best 2 LTs will go before our pick maybe 3 or 4. I'm concerned my 4th pick Scharping will move into round 2. Unlike CB OTs isn't deep.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
No, Davenport hasn't progressed that much. Thank you Devlin. As for Little or Hyatt, I don't think regress simply b/c they've had better coaching and competition to get ready for the next step. Sort of like Watson, he's been good to great in spite of O'Brien.
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You say D hasn't progressed but PFF has him at best game ever against upper level DE.
 
badboy said:
You say D hasn't progressed but PFF has him at best game ever against upper level DE.
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Do you subscribe to PFF Badboy ? Do you get all of those NFL player ratings/rankings with the less expensive version of the subscription ? Good college & mock draft section ?
 
IDEXAN said:
Do you subscribe to PFF Badboy ? Do you get all of those NFL player ratings/rankings with the less expensive version of the subscription ? Good college & mock draft section ?
Click to expand...
No don't subscribe any site. Try to use only what source all have access to. Just don't rule out source like John McClain because others say he is pancakes. Lol
 
Scooter said:
An area where worlds collide, is elite talent on the offensive line is essential. What detractors are pointing out with lines such as the Cowboys is talent isn't a cure-all. What's missing is COACHING. The Cowboys' line has gone from monstrous and talented, to talented and inefficient. Give Alex Gibbs or any notable coach 3 months with that line and Zeke ... it's the #1 unit in football again by a ridiculous margin. Same with us and my biggest fear. We've got 'good enough' (not my opinion) talent at a few places on the line ... and we have to select a major addition or two early ... but who's picking them and who's going to coach them? A season of 'out-talenting' our coaching staff (Watson) isn't a favorable long term future.
Click to expand...

I think what you're seeing from the cowboys is what the loss of an all-pro center in Travis Frederick means to an o-line.

& Talent's not a cure-all, but damn if it doesn't make your job easier.

KC Chiefs O-line:

Erik Fischer - 1st round
Mitch Morse - 2nd round
Mitchell Schwartz - 2nd round
Cam Erving - 1st round (browns)
Andre Wylie -undrafted.

That's serious draft capital dedicated to the o-line. Is it any wonder then that Kareem Hunt could burst on the scene like he did last year as a rather unheralded rook? Is it also any wonder too then that Mahomes is amongst the least sacked Qbs in the game that has allowed him to throw 30 damn TD's at the half way mark of the season?

Now, i'm not up on my o-line coaches, but i'm not aware of KC's o-line coach being highly regarded and if you read up on Devlin & KC's o-line coach Andy Heck, you won't see much of a difference between the 2.
 
IDEXAN said:
Do you subscribe to PFF Badboy ? Do you get all of those NFL player ratings/rankings with the less expensive version of the subscription ? Good college & mock draft section ?
Click to expand...

the pr
Mr teX said:
I think what you're seeing from the cowboys is what the loss of an all-pro center in Travis Frederick means to an o-line.

& Talent's not a cure-all, but damn if it doesn't make your job easier.

KC Chiefs O-line:

Erik Fischer - 1st round
Mitch Morse - 2nd round
Mitchell Schwartz - 2nd round
Cam Erving - 1st round (browns)
Andre Wylie -undrafted.

That's serious draft capital dedicated to the o-line. Is it any wonder then that Kareem Hunt could burst on the scene like he did last year as a rather unheralded rook? Is it also any wonder too then that Mahomes is amongst the least sacked Qbs in the game that has allowed him to throw 30 damn TD's at the half way mark of the season?

Now, i'm not up on my o-line coaches, but i'm not aware of KC's o-line coach being highly regarded and if you read up on Devlin & KC's o-line coach Andy Heck, you won't see much of a difference between the 2.
Click to expand...

talent is part of the problem, scheme is another part. Early in the year we didn't scheme to help our line be successful. Maybe this was OB and Devlin's way of trying to feel out what the line could do, and you always rather have your playmakers out running routes then in blocking. But the decision for the first few games to rarely give our line any help is crazy to me. I mean our line was essentially a brand new line with a 2nd year 4th rounder LT and a RT that hasn't played in over a year due to illness. That is a coaching decision that could have made a difference. We have been giving our line more help recently and our lines passing grades have shown the improvement. I know it's not ideal to leave in extra blockers, but if it keeps Deshaun from getting killed it's what you have to do.
 
Shishkabob said:
the pr


talent is part of the problem, scheme is another part. Early in the year we didn't scheme to help our line be successful. Maybe this was OB and Devlin's way of trying to feel out what the line could do, and you always rather have your playmakers out running routes then in blocking. But the decision for the first few games to rarely give our line any help is crazy to me. I mean our line was essentially a brand new line with a 2nd year 4th rounder LT and a RT that hasn't played in over a year due to illness. That is a coaching decision that could have made a difference. We have been giving our line more help recently and our lines passing grades have shown the improvement. I know it's not ideal to leave in extra blockers, but if it keeps Deshaun from getting killed it's what you have to do.
Click to expand...


Thank you, I mean why don't some people see this that way. They act like this is a unit that's been together for years. They couldn't have seen our preseason games because if they did, they would know the ones didn't get the adequate amount of time together as a whole.
 
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CloakNNNdagger said:
****************************************************************************************
PFF HOU Texans @PFF_Texans

Pass-blocking grades and pressures allowed for the #Texans O-line vs the Broncos:

Davenport: 65.8 (4)
.
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Yeah... didn't say he's an all-pro. Only that he appears to be getting better. Just like I'm sure you're much better at your job now than you were two years out of school.
 
Shishkabob said:
the pr


talent is part of the problem, scheme is another part. Early in the year we didn't scheme to help our line be successful. Maybe this was OB and Devlin's way of trying to feel out what the line could do, and you always rather have your playmakers out running routes then in blocking. But the decision for the first few games to rarely give our line any help is crazy to me. I mean our line was essentially a brand new line with a 2nd year 4th rounder LT and a RT that hasn't played in over a year due to illness. That is a coaching decision that could have made a difference. We have been giving our line more help recently and our lines passing grades have shown the improvement. I know it's not ideal to leave in extra blockers, but if it keeps Deshaun from getting killed it's what you have to do.
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I’m not disagreeing with u entirely. I just think u guys overplay your hands when it comes to the flaws on this team. Coaching wasn’t going to make up the deficit in talent on the o-line. What we’re doing right now is covering **** up....in which case it’s bound to get exposed in the playoffs by a good defense.

I definitely think more reps for the o-line and the starters in general in the preseason would’ve smoothed out the start of the season for us a little better..so yeah you’re right, coaching decision not to play those guys more, but at the end of the day, preseason is still doesn’t match the real intensity of play in the regular season and we were still starting a completely new o-line. We were bound to have problems that better talent would’ve been able to somewhat overcome in the interim while they gelled together. Obviously we didn’t have that talent and it showed...badly.

Aside from that, every team struggles at the beginning of the regular season in 1 aspect or another b/c truthfully u as a coach don’t really know what u have until the live bullets start flying. I only brought up the chiefs o-line b/c they are 1 of the few teams who started fast and it doesn’t appear they’re ready to slow down. And when u look at the investment they made on the front line, you can see why they were able to do it despite them having a guy under center making only his 2nd career start.

IOW, u need good materials to work with to make quality products.
 
DocBar said:
My radio pretty much stays on the NFL channel and a bunch of well respected guys on there are giving the Texans, in general, and OB & Devlin, in particular, a lot of love during this six game winning streak for keeping DW4 mostly upright and the running game doing a little something.

An OL takes time to gel and the limited game reps in pre-season games and TC aren't enough. With so many new starters and injuries, I'm not at all surprised that it's taken 9 weeks to start getting average or better play out of that unit.

Since it's looking more likely that the Texans will be drafting in the 20s, what moves would you make personnel and coaching wise in the offseason?
Click to expand...

My first move in any season begins with a solid draft. I just posted a Mock Draft. I'd like some young but talented athletes to compete for starting positions on the OL. This current OL personnel would be back and in competition to keep their roster spots. CB has to be addressed. RB could get a pick in the draft but definitely RB would be a FA pick up as well.
 
I’m really interested in seeing Rankin next season assuming an offseason of full health and moved inside to LG. I am considering this a “redshirt season” for him. But think he can give us Chester Pitts solid starter production at LG going forward.
 
badboy said:
Problem with this is weakness at position. At least the best 2 LTs will go before our pick maybe 3 or 4. I'm concerned my 4th pick Scharping will move into round 2. Unlike CB OTs isn't deep.
Click to expand...

Not true, I asked one of the talent evaluatiors on this MB if he saw Cajuste like I did, he said he liked Cajuste a lot and had him at the top of the second round. So picking Cajuste at 20 wouldn't be much of stretch.


Texansballer74 said:
Thank you, I mean why don't some people see this that way. They act like this is a unit that's been together for years. They couldn't have seen our preseason games because if they did, they would know the ones didn't get the adequate amount of time together as a whole.
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BTW, the OL still sucks and needs a major talent infusion. What I want to know is when is it going to be long enough that you can admit the OL badly needs a talent upgrade? You said lets see how the OL plays out before judging. I've seen enough to know what my eyes are telling me. The talent isn't there and never will be there to be one of the top OL's.
 
Mr teX said:
I’m not disagreeing with u entirely. I just think u guys overplay your hands when it comes to the flaws on this team. Coaching wasn’t going to make up the deficit in talent on the o-line. What we’re doing right now is covering **** up....in which case it’s bound to get exposed in the playoffs by a good defense.

I definitely think more reps for the o-line and the starters in general in the preseason would’ve smoothed out the start of the season for us a little better..so yeah you’re right, coaching decision not to play those guys more, but at the end of the day, preseason is still doesn’t match the real intensity of play in the regular season and we were still starting a completely new o-line. We were bound to have problems that better talent would’ve been able to somewhat overcome in the interim while they gelled together. Obviously we didn’t have that talent and it showed...badly.

Aside from that, every team struggles at the beginning of the regular season in 1 aspect or another b/c truthfully u as a coach don’t really know what u have until the live bullets start flying. I only brought up the chiefs o-line b/c they are 1 of the few teams who started fast and it doesn’t appear they’re ready to slow down. And when u look at the investment they made on the front line, you can see why they were able to do it despite them having a guy under center making only his 2nd career start.

IOW, u need good materials to work with to make quality products.
Click to expand...

I'm not arguing that we don't need more talent on our line, obviously better players make for better results. And I can't say that leaving tight ends/running backs in to block or chip more, or bringing in an extra lineman to help block would've resulted in wins in our early game, but it would have prevented Watson from being hit as much. I rather our offense start off slow because we are being cautious and leaving in to many guys to block, then it start off slow because our QB can't get to the top of his drop consistently without being under pressure.

I agree though having to leave guys into block will get exposed by the better teams, especially in the playoffs but to me my #1 goal for this season, realizing we are not true SB contenders in all likelihood, was to keep Deshaun upright and watch him progress as an NFL QB. So yea I wasn't a fan of leaving a rookie who missed all of camp, and an out of position Davenport on islands by themselves lol
 
steelbtexan said:
Not true, I asked one of the talent evaluatiors on this MB if he saw Cajuste like I did, he said he liked Cajuste a lot and had him at the top of the second round. So picking Cajuste at 20 wouldn't be much of stretch.




BTW, the OL still sucks and needs a major talent infusion. What I want to know is when is it going to be long enough that you can admit the OL badly needs a talent upgrade? You said lets see how the OL plays out before judging. I've seen enough to know what my eyes are telling me. The talent isn't there and never will be there to be one of the top OL's.
Click to expand...
Speaking of admissions:
You know I heard somebody might have asked you to admit that Rick Smith drafted the Texans franchise QB in Deshawn Watson and when you started to make that admission
you instead began to studder & stammer and then started shaking uncontrollably - true ?
 
IDEXAN said:
Speaking of admissions:
You know I heard somebody might have asked you to admit that Rick Smith drafted the Texans franchise QB in Deshawn Watson and when you started to make that admission
you instead began to studder & stammer and then started shaking uncontrollably - true ?
Click to expand...

What?

He hit on a QB after 12 yrs here.

Great job

Is that enough for you or do I need to start up another apology thread?
 
WTF does Mancz need to do to be penciled in as a regular starter? His worst game is better than Fultons best as a Texan and he solidified the whole right side of the line, which was considerably worse last week with Mancz not playing, similar to the first 6 games. I just can't wrap my head around it. It seems the Texans factor in what investment they have in garbage on deciding who plays.
 
gs27 said:
WTF does Mancz need to do to be penciled in as a regular starter? His worst game is better than Fultons best as a Texan and he solidified the whole right side of the line, which was considerably worse last week with Mancz not playing, similar to the first 6 games. I just can't wrap my head around it. It seems the Texans factor in what investment they have in garbage on deciding who plays.
Click to expand...

This goes back to what I was saying before Fulton was back, that the chemistry between Mancz and Lamm, and Mancz and Martin is better than just the natural talent of Fulton over Mancz. Maybe if Henderson was still here it would be a different story, but Mancz just has a report with Lamm and Martin that Fulton doesn't seem to have. When Mancz was asked about his chemistry with Lamm he even said as much, he said based on the defensive front all he and Lamm have to do is give each other a look and they know what they are going to do on that play against that front. Cohesiveness is probably the most important part of a line, you need 5 guys working in perfect unison together
 
Saw the Pats signed a new offensive lineman. Why the hell aren't we bringing in OL right and left and working them out? Again I have said this before I am sure there are better lineman on other team's practice squad that we should bring in.
 
gs27 said:
WTF does Mancz need to do to be penciled in as a regular starter? His worst game is better than Fultons best as a Texan and he solidified the whole right side of the line, which was considerably worse last week with Mancz not playing, similar to the first 6 games. I just can't wrap my head around it. It seems the Texans factor in what investment they have in garbage on deciding who plays.
Click to expand...

as bad as it to wish upon anyone, hopefully Kelemente's injury lingers a bit to force OB/Dev's hand in starting an interior trio of Mancz-Martin-Fulton.
Let Kelemente take his time to fully get 100% and by then hopefully the positive results will be too hard to ignore..
 
vupac1 said:
as bad as it to wish upon anyone, hopefully Kelemente's injury lingers a bit to force OB/Dev's hand in starting an interior trio of Mancz-Martin-Fulton.
Let Kelemente take his time to fully get 100% and by then hopefully the positive results will be too hard to ignore..
Click to expand...

Kelemente has been like our highest graded lineman for the past 3 weeks, why replace him?

and Mancz was pretty bad at LG earlier in the year vs the Giants
 
Mr teX said:
Coaching wasn’t going to make up the deficit in talent on the o-line.
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Why not? Isn't that what Kubiak did?

Look, guys here didn't like Ben Jones but he's part of a pretty good OL in Tennessee & I don't think Martin has played as well for us here.

Brooks is part of a decent line in Philly. However you slice it, the Texans messed that situation up.

That's two positions they spent time, money, & effort on they didn't need to. Could used it on OTs.

But they didn't. Where we are now they have no option. But to coach up what they have.

In January they can asses what they were & weren't able to accomplish via coaching & go from there.
 
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