Rumblings

Pure Speculation

I am hearing from a source close to the team that Kubiak is seriously considering trading down. However, contrary to most assumptions on this board it would not mean taking D'Brickashaw Ferguson.

The scenario I am hearing most frequently is

1. Trade 1st pick to Jets for 4th Pick, Abraham, and 3rd rounder next year.
2. Use the 4th pick on Mario Williams (DE)
3. Use 2nd round pick on Darryn Colledge (LT)
4. Use one 3rd rounder on a MLB and TE (best available)
5. Use 4th or 5th round pick on Greg Eslinger (C)
6. Use 4th or 5th (whichever is not used on Eslinger) on a MLB
7. 6th and 7th round (projects for DL and OL - particularly guard)

All these specific players are subject to change, but are really liked by the coaching staff (there is some thought that the team may need to give up the first pick in the 2nd round and future 3rd rounder from the Jets to move up into the later part of the first round to get Colledge).

All signs are pointing toward Seth Wand being the starting RT opening day.

FA: Bring in a quality WR, veteran DE, and possibly Putzier (depending on price on open market)

Apparently, DD, Morency, and Wells (who will play both TB and FB) are more than fine in the minds of the new offensive staff.

So we essentially trade the rights to bush/young/an offensive lineman for mario williams and john abraham, and no 1st rounder next year? not liking it, not at all.

I have no problem welcoming Abraham (if he keeps his work ethic up), Williams and Colledge, etc. to the Texans--what is supposed to happen to Wade?

bdiddy said:

Pure Speculation

I am hearing from a source close to the team that Kubiak is seriously considering trading down. However, contrary to most assumptions on this board it would not mean taking D'Brickashaw Ferguson.

The scenario I am hearing most frequently is

1. Trade 1st pick to Jets for 4th Pick, Abraham, and 3rd rounder next year.
2. Use the 4th pick on Mario Williams (DE)
3. Use 2nd round pick on Darryn Colledge (LT)
4. Use one 3rd rounder on a MLB and TE (best available)
5. Use 4th or 5th round pick on Greg Eslinger (C)
6. Use 4th or 5th (whichever is not used on Eslinger) on a MLB
7. 6th and 7th round (projects for DL and OL - particularly guard)

All these specific players are subject to change, but are really liked by the coaching staff (there is some thought that the team may need to give up the first pick in the 2nd round and future 3rd rounder from the Jets to move up into the later part of the first round to get Colledge).

All signs are pointing toward Seth Wand being the starting RT opening day.

FA: Bring in a quality WR, veteran DE, and possibly Putzier (depending on price on open market)

Apparently, DD, Morency, and Wells (who will play both TB and FB) are more than fine in the minds of the new offensive staff.

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I would love that trade down if it happens, although I think we could likely get more in the trade than that which would only make the deal sweeter. Ordinarily I would give Abraham a value of a lower 1st round pick for the trade, but since the Jets are going to have cap problems and will likely lose him anyways I think that lowers his value. I think we can at least add another pick this year (probably 3rd or maybe 2nd) and upgrade next year's pick to at least a 2nd rather than a 3rd. I'm not sure we can get a whole lot more (even though I would like to) because I think the Jets are ok with the idea of staying at #4 and getting D'Brickashaw and aren't going to give away a whole lot for him. I would target Eric Winston over Daryn Colledge if he is available at #33, or else go after an interior OL like Nick Mangold here. MLB and TE in the 3rd would be good, but I think it would be better to get a CB in the 3rd and then get the MLB in the 4th or 5th, since guys like Anthony Schlegel or Rocky McIntosh should be available there. Casserly had said a while ago on the radio that they need to decide if Pitts is their long term solution at LT. I don't know what they have decided on that issue, but if they decide Pitts is their man then I could definitely see them not going for Ferguson and leaving Pitts there, but I'd still like to see them get Winston, if nothing else just to get Todd Wade off the field, and then Winston and Pitts can duke it out for the two OT positions. It will definitely be interesting to see if a deal does go down, and adding John Abraham and Mario Williams to our DLine would be great. This deal might not have as much value as some people would like, but at the same time, like I posted a while ago, if Kubiak and the management decide Mario is the top guy that they most want in the draft, then they will be willing to take a lesser trade to get him since they get their favorite guy and additional picks/players in the deal, whereas if Bush or Vince is their top guy then it will take a much bigger deal to trade out of the spot to get one of them. It all depends on how Kubiak rates our guys and what he thinks this team needs the most.

Sounds good to me. We need to get more from Jets,though. another 3rd this year and at least 2007 2nd round. Wade? redo his deal,keep him as backup for this year.

Are your sources solid? I know revealing them would cease all information but they are not from bubba down at the barber shop right?

CoastalTexan said:

Are your sources solid? I know revealing them would cease all information but they are not from bubba down at the barber shop right?

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Sounds like Bubba to me.

Sounds good to me. I will take Abraham and Williams. Anything to create some sort of pass rush. Defense does win championships.

My question is what do you do with Peek and Babin? Do they play OLB in the 4-3 with wong in the middle? What do you do with Shantee Orr? Orr was our best pass rush last year and deserves at least consideration for a starting role. Wong is the older player with a bigger contract, so would you cut Wong over Orr? Perhaps Orr takes Peek's spot? We have alot of investment in Babin but would you start either Peek or Orr over him? Perhaps you put Babin back into a 3 point then do you still draft Williams? Alot to consider.

I would have to agree I would want more than Abraham and next years third. What does the draft chart say moving up four spots to the overall first spot is worth? We gave up half our first day draft for Babin so I would think Bush is worth a whole lot more than a Player and a next year pick. But then again what do I know?

TEXANRED said:

I would have to agree I would want more than Abraham and next years third. What does the draft chart say moving up four spots to the overall first spot is worth? We gave up half our first day draft for Babin so I would think Bush is worth a whole lot more than a Player and a next year pick. But then again what do I know?

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this was my first reaction as well ...

How much money would that tie up in our d-line. I mean every d-lineman would make more than the seconday combined excluding Dunta. If that were the case they better get some kind of pass rush going. If we got Abraham why overload on pass rushers when we could solidify the secondary with Huff. That would mean another move down from #4 and get an extra 3rd or so. I don't think collecting additional extra picks with a second move down should be that far out of the question considering the # of holes out there. Abraham, Huff, and two 3rds to go with the 2 3rds we already have. That would create a LOT of options and hole-filling potential. Not really that farfetched.

I hate to break the news here, but Abraham is a FA therefore the Jets would have to resign or franchise him before any moves are made. The deal that was mentioned above is a ripoff for the Texans. Considering we haven't even hit FA yet I would not take any draft trade rumors seriously at this point.

dat_boy_yec said:

Considering we haven't even hit FA yet I would not take any draft trade rumors seriously at this point.

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And that is why the fanatics come to the board.

Doesn't sound good to me. McNair said it would have to be a Godfather deal, and I'm sorry, but this is an offer I CAN refuse.

I am seriously doubting the Abraham trade to us. I mean right now Denver, us, and several other teams are interested in seeing what will happen with Abraham. He proved he can play an entire season and be productive whether in a 43 or 34 defense. The Jets new GM will use Abraham as trade bait for most of the offseason. This means they will have to Franchise him though. His agent will tell him to sign the tender immediately putting the Jets in further cap hell. The Jets are looking to lose Pro Bowl and possible HOFers Kevin Mawae, Curtis Martin, and Ty Law from this years team, which will free up considerable cap, but even after their losses they will need to cut close to 10M more. The cupboards will be stripped pretty bare for the new HC and a trade with them for next years 1st could be the Adrian Peterson or whoever distinguishes themselves as a top 10 draftee next year. The deal the Jets have to send me to make it happen would have to be 06:1st, 2nd 07: 1st, 4th. With Abraham 06: 1st, 4th 07: 2nd

I am definately interested in the trade down for Mario Williams. The guy has played OLB, DT, and DE in college and done it at 280. He is up to 290 now and said to run 4.65-4.8 in the dash. He can play the run as well as the pass. He is a athletic speed rusher who uses his power to do the marquee Reggie White Bull Hump Club move to get inside of Tackles. If you dont know what it is watch almost every sack D'Brick gave up this year and you will understand it. After a pick like Williams regardless of Abraham, because personally I think Peek and Babin can equal his production at a lesser price we would then focus on bringing in hopefully Eric Winston, Jonathan Joseph/Demario Minter, Nick Mangold, Maurice Stovall, Anthony Fasano/T.J. Williams, Rocky McIntosh, and then an athletic project.

Dont know about you guys but I am getting excited about this offseason.

Coach C. said:

I am definately interested in the trade down for Mario Williams. The guy has played OLB, DT, and DE in college and done it at 280. He is up to 290 now and said to run 4.65-4.8 in the dash. He can play the run as well as the pass. He is a athletic speed rusher who uses his power to do the marquee Reggie White Bull Hump Club move to get inside of Tackles.

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That is what I am talling about. Williams/Winston!

I would say that this scenario is one of the more plausible ones that could happen. Our real need on the team is at DE with the new defense.

Eslinger isn't going to be there in the 4th. He may go as high as the bottom 2nd round. We'd have to take him with one of our 3rds. We could then take David Thomas with our 4th.

Colledge would be great. I think he is another Pitts and could play T or G. If he is gone in the 1st then we might take Mangold with our 2nd. McKinney is the weakest link in the line right now IMO.

I don't see why we'd take 2 MLB's at all. Preacher is right, we'd have waaaaay too much money in our DLine by taking Abraham & Williams. Taking Williams and trading a DT or OLB for a DE may be the best bet (Miami?).

We have to get a CB somewhere too...

Nighthawk said:

Sounds like Bubba to me.

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Your opinion means little considering you value flash over a consistent winner.

To others, yes the sources are solid. However, let me say that this is still a very fluid situation - this is only the stance upper level management has right now. There are a ton of contingencies, including the Jets wanting to make the deal, the availability of desired players after combine/individual workouts, and further evaluation of the teams current talent.

Richard Smith LOVES Mario Williams.

Htown34s said:

I would say that this scenario is one of the more plausible ones that could happen. Our real need on the team is at DE with the new defense.

Eslinger isn't going to be there in the 4th. He may go as high as the bottom 2nd round. We'd have to take him with one of our 3rds. We could then take David Thomas with our 4th.

Colledge would be great. I think he is another Pitts and could play T or G. If he is gone in the 1st then we might take Mangold with our 2nd. McKinney is the weakest link in the line right now IMO.


I don't see why we'd take 2 MLB's at all. Preacher is right, we'd have waaaaay too much money in our DLine by taking Abraham & Williams. Taking Williams and trading a DT or OLB for a DE may be the best bet (Miami?).

We have to get a CB somewhere too...

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Checkout Mel Kiper's projections for Eslinger (a second day pick). Centers are generally drafted lower in the draft, especially when they are undersized.

Realistically, Abrahams, the #4 pick and the Jets 3rd RD pick this year is very close to fair value for the Texans #1 pick. 1200 is the difference in value between 1 and 4. The Jets will probably consider Abrahams value, after he is franchised, to be worth 1000 since he was the 13th pick in the 00' draft and is now a premier pass rusher in the league. The Jets 3rd RD pick has value of 230 which make it very close to the 1200 difference.

I know many will question this post, so if you do and want some kind of confirmation check out the 01 draft when Atlanta #5 traded up with San Diego #1 to get Mike Vike.

Atlanta traded their 01' #5 pick, Tim Dwight WR (a 4th RD 114th pick), 01'-3rd RD and their 02'-2nd RD to move up to #1. The difference here is San Diego placed a value of 480 on Dwight to achieve fair value. Abrahams has considerably more value. San Diego then drafted Tomlinson with the 5th pick.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/6330687

bdiddy said:

Pure Speculation

I am hearing from a source close to the team that Kubiak is seriously considering trading down. However, contrary to most assumptions on this board it would not mean taking D'Brickashaw Ferguson.

The scenario I am hearing most frequently is

1. Trade 1st pick to Jets for 4th Pick, Abraham, and 3rd rounder next year.
2. Use the 4th pick on Mario Williams (DE)
3. Use 2nd round pick on Darryn Colledge (LT)
4. Use one 3rd rounder on a MLB and TE (best available)
5. Use 4th or 5th round pick on Greg Eslinger (C)
6. Use 4th or 5th (whichever is not used on Eslinger) on a MLB
7. 6th and 7th round (projects for DL and OL - particularly guard)

All these specific players are subject to change, but are really liked by the coaching staff (there is some thought that the team may need to give up the first pick in the 2nd round and future 3rd rounder from the Jets to move up into the later part of the first round to get Colledge).

All signs are pointing toward Seth Wand being the starting RT opening day.

FA: Bring in a quality WR, veteran DE, and possibly Putzier (depending on price on open market)

Apparently, DD, Morency, and Wells (who will play both TB and FB) are more than fine in the minds of the new offensive staff.

Click to expand...

I love this, and the picks they are targeting as well. My only beef would be to try and pry a higher pick from the Jets. I hear very good things about Colledge, but I don't know about trading up to get him. We have too many holes. If we got a 2nd and a 3rd from the Jets maybe I could see using their 3rd as trade bait. Admittedly, I haven't seen Colledge play, but I hear he is pretty simliar to Dbrick, in that he excels more in pass blocking than run blocking, but he is similar in a lot of ways, including overall size. Interesting side note - Colledge is from the North Pole. No lie.

Nighthawk said:

Sounds like Bubba to me.

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What do you have a problem with me.

My only problem with this trade is if we get Abraham we dont realy need Mario Williams any more so I would take Dbrick. If you take Abraham out of the trade then the jets would have to add another first round pick atleast. Then I would use the fourth pick on Mario williams.

Yesterday someone posted that there was an article in some paper saying that NYJ and SD were talking about a trade involving Abraham for Rivers so, hold that thought.

bdiddy said:

All signs are pointing toward Seth Wand being the starting RT opening day.

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I asked my Magic 8-Ball the same question, and its answer was "Outlook not so good."

Bubbajwp said:

What do you have a problem with me.

My only problem with this trade is if we get Abraham we dont realy need Mario Williams any more so I would take Dbrick. If you take Abraham out of the trade then the jets would have to add another first round pick atleast. Then I would use the fourth pick on Mario williams.

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Because you can never have too much pass rush. It instantly makes everyother position on the field better. With those two at DE, you change a teams whole approach. Then your DT's get one on one and if you blitz on top of that, it makes for a top 10 D. And if you havnt noticed, what kind of teams have won the SB in the last couple of years...

I will say that if Mario Williams turns out to be as good as he is projected, a line of Williams and Abraham on the ends would be very scary.

Williams and Abraham would make the oposing QB feel like David Carr. It would be great... I've seen a couple games with Colledge and hes a very good pass blocker. I think the announcer said he hadnt allowed a sack since his freshman or sophmore year. I always saw him running down field to run block as well. I wonder what we would do with the FS dilema?