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WTF is going on with Foster?

DocBar

DocBar

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
I haven't seen anyone post much about Foster's lackluster play, so I figured I'd bring up the subject.

It seems like he's succumbed to the big payday and just isn't performing up to his new contract. No one could bring down Foster with an ankle tackle for 2 years and now he can't seem to break one.

I know he's been run in a lot of short yardage situations, but he just doesn't to be the same back he was the last 2 years. WTF has happened?
 
well it could be either 2 things

A

Hes not that good

or B

Leech Winston and Mike .B and Dreessen his blocking buddies.... are gone and now he cant do it without them


is there a option C ....????? LOL
 
Norg said:
well it could be either 2 things

A

Hes not that good

or B

Leech Winston and Mike .B and Dreessen his blocking buddies.... are gone and now he cant do it without them


is there a option C ....????? LOL
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Option B gets invalidated, somewhat, by Tate and Forsett doing pretty dang well. Foster is getting tripped up yards past the LOS as well as near or behind it.
 
He doesn't look like the same back. I think he was averaging 3.9 a carry coming into the Patriots game. While tate and Forsett come into the game and look explosive as hell.
 
Heh, well....I was one of only about three people calling attention to it from the beginning of the reg season.

I don't know if it's the diet, the new $$$, the lack of Winston and Brisiel, some sort of situation involving Tate....but he's shutting it down early in a lot of games.

He's also running more through the middle when his bread and butter is always the edge and then a cutback. Don't know if he's trying to prove (to himself?) that he can run anywhere ,even the middle, or what.

But it's been off all season. He might not have been a big fan of seeing Winston and Brisiel leave. Because he's not running as well, for sure.
 
Or he's getting used TOO much. Our run game is better when BOTH Foster and Tate get the ball. Too bad Tate's been in the dog house for being injured and Kubes isn't playing him. But hey good thing that 3rd down scat is delivering punishment to the D and softening them up for Arian huh?
 
GP said:
Heh, well....I was one of only about three people calling attention to it from the beginning of the reg season.

I don't know if it's the diet, the new $$$, the lack of Winston and Brisiel, some sort of situation involving Tate....but he's shutting it down early in a lot of games.

He's also running more through the middle when his bread and butter is always the edge and then a cutback. Don't know if he's trying to prove (to himself?) that he can run anywhere ,even the middle, or what.

But it's been off all season. He might not have been a big fan of seeing Winston and Brisiel leave. Because he's not running as well, for sure.
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He should just get a side as a first read and be able to cut where he sees the lane. inside or outside just depends on the lane he sees. That looks OK to me. It's the shoestring tackles that are killing him. If he breaks one shoestrng ankle tackle, he's gone for 15+ yards on a lot of carries. It seems like shying away from contact and trying to take whats there and keep himself healthy, to me. PFF has called him out for the last 1 1/2 years on their elusivity stat. He's not elusive. It's just that he's now going ultra turtle, like Schaub, if pressure is even moderately applied. Maybe Kubiak is handing out death sentences for fumbles? I bet Tate would agree.
 
It's really simple.

I had listed several reasons at different times, I won't bother listing them again.

Instead, I will give some very basic numbers.

So far, Foster had played in 13 games (as many as he did the entire last year.)

He has 20 more caries, but he has 80 few yards.

A couple of simple queries using Play Finder at ProFootball Reference .com
Shows that he has 2 fewer plays of more than 20 yards (5 as opposed to 7).

The additional yardage gain on those 2 extra plays is 81 yards.

That's right there is the simplest answer.

Then I used Game Rewind to go back and watch those plays to verify them.

A question for you guys is how often did you hear an announcer call out a name of a blocker on our run plays?

Not very often, right?

Well, on those long plays, at least one or two guys were called out because of their blocking near the POA.

It's as simple as that, really.
I don't even need to recount the other factors and reasons.
 
Look at his number of carries.

He has been run into the ground.

Tate and Forsett look like they have pop because they are FRESH.
 
As y'all can see, it only takes 2 plays to get the same numbers he did last year.

Good blocking = big gain

And defenders taking bad angles also help.
 
76Texan said:
It's really simple.

I had listed several reasons at different times, I won't bother listing them again.

Instead, I will give some very basic numbers.

So far, Foster had played in 13 games (as many as he did the entire last year.)

He has 20 more caries, but he has 80 few yards.

A couple of simple queries using Play Finder at ProFootball Reference .com
Shows that he has 2 fewer plays of more than 20 yards (5 as opposed to 7).

The additional yardage gain on those 2 extra plays is 81 yards.

That's right there is the simplest answer.

Then I used Game Rewind to go back and watch those plays to verify them.

A question for you guys is how often did you hear an announcer call out a name of a blocker on our run plays?

Not very often, right?

Well, on those long plays, at least one or two guys were called out because of their blocking near the POA.

It's as simple as that, really.
I don't even need to recount the other factors and reasons.
Click to expand...
Then I guess everything equals out because Schaub hasn't been destroyed as much and we don;t have near the false start/holding penalties as we did with Winston. I still don't miss that guy. Road grader of a run blocker and turnstile on pass pro.

Maybe Winston faking out a DE, making him think it was a pass play is the difference in Foster's yardage?
 
Foster is currently 6th in the league in rushing, but he is only 118 yards away from being 1st in yards.

He leads the league in rushing TD's.

I'm not seeing this whole "Foster is slowing down" thing. He is at the top of the league in all important stats for a RB other then YPC. I have felt like Kubes has run him way to much in a lot of games considering all of our other guys being available. Forsett has been more then capable of gaining yards.
 
The biggest difference in the 2012 from the 2011 Foster is his impact as a receiver. Foster is averaging only 13.5 receiving yards/game, as opposed to 47.5 last season. I don't know if that's due to Arian staying in to block more. But going from a 11.2 yards/catch to 5.1 is noticeable.
 
Lucky said:
The biggest difference in the 2012 from the 2011 Foster is his impact as a receiver. Foster is averaging only 13.5 receiving yards/game, as opposed to 47.5 last season. I don't know if that's due to Arian staying in to block more. But going from a 11.2 yards/catch to 5.1 is noticeable.
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Agree here, but the real thing I notice is he looks about 15-20lbs lighter this year.
 
Lucky said:
The biggest difference in the 2012 from the 2011 Foster is his impact as a receiver. Foster is averaging only 13.5 receiving yards/game, as opposed to 47.5 last season. I don't know if that's due to Arian staying in to block more. But going from a 11.2 yards/catch to 5.1 is noticeable.
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That ties in to him being unable to break as many tackles this year. For RBs, a lot of those catches will net you huge gains if you break that one tackle from that linebacker/safety in your way.
 
DocBar said:
Then I guess everything equals out because Schaub hasn't been destroyed as much and we don;t have near the false start/holding penalties as we did with Winston. I still don't miss that guy. Road grader of a run blocker and turnstile on pass pro.

Maybe Winston faking out a DE, making him think it was a pass play is the difference in Foster's yardage?
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If we're going there, I miss Mario.
Yeah, he may have taken plays off, but the numbers were there..... if he were healthy.

I miss Demeco. Who better to have in the event Cushing got hurt?

I miss Dresson. We don't have enough TEs for this offense.

I miss Walter, Barwin, & Casey. I know they're still on the team, but I miss them just the same.
 
Texecutioner said:
Foster is currently 6th in the league in rushing, but he is only 118 yards away from being 1st in yards.

He leads the league in rushing TD's.

I'm not seeing this whole "Foster is slowing down" thing. He is at the top of the league in all important stats for a RB other then YPC. I have felt like Kubes has run him way to much in a lot of games considering all of our other guys being available. Forsett has been more then capable of gaining yards.
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1st in yards? I'm confused. Adrian Peterson leads the league in rushing yards by a huge margin so it can't be that.

I agree for the most part, but his low YPC has to be a concern. He's still done well all things considered but it's obvious he's not playing as well as last year. Hopefully that's due to the O-line not playing as well and not him slacking after the big contract, but who knows.
 
Didn't read the entire thread...

One of the biggest problems that I see with Arian this season is that he can't seem to be able to stay on his feet. No, I don't mean because he's being tackled. I see the guy trip, slip and fall AT LEAST 3 times a game in every single stadium that we play at. Don't know if it's cleats, balance, too much tape, or what--but it seems like every time he really cuts hard he looses his footing.

Thoughts?
 
The guy had some problems in college, too, which along with his hamstring injury had people not on his bandwagon come draft day.

Maybe the guy is just an over-thinker. Seems to be a knowledgable enough guy, openly admits he's into learning new things and being proactive with life, especially the whole diet thing.

So for me, I do wonder if maybe he is over-thinking things. You don't want your players to be total meat heads (no pun intended), but you don't want your players trying to be overly nuanced "outside the box" type people either.

Brian Cushing and JJ Watt really are the types of guys you need on your team. They eat, sleep, and breathe football. They will obviously have other interests, but when I look at guys like Foster and Barwin...I sense that football is not exactly the top priority in life.

Look, I am NOT saying these two guys are as bad as Okoye or Carr who obviously were really bad pros at their jobs. I just wanted to say that Foster, to me, looks like the "I've arrived" type of player this year. I don't think it's the money, either. It's the idea that he now knows he belongs, he's been validated. Where do you go from there? You might try to make sure you stay healthy and in each game, so that's something to consider.

His cuts, as mentioned by another poster in this thread recently, seem very exaggerated this year. Like he's literally LEAPING. I think he's trying to hang into the lane way too long and is trying to make way too big or way too dramatic of a cut, in order to get to the cutback lane. I wonder if he's just trying to push himself TOO hard, trying to make the GREATEST cuts of all time (no offense to Taylor Swift, your cuts are good too - Kanye West).

Overall, I just don't see him having the critical, game-changing moments he had in 2011. He had moments in 2011 where he literally pulled our asses out of the fire in a lot of games. The huge sideline run, IIRC, was a game changing moment in one of the divisional games that seriously was the difference maker in that game. So while he has had decent yardage, his "big moments", IMO, are a lot less this year than last year.
 
Sigh, I need to really clarify that I don't think Arian Foster is a slacker, nor do I think he is a bad pro.

I think the guy is solid.

I just cannot put my finger on why this year feels so opposite of what he looked like in 2011. For me, the "big moment" factor is what is missing in 2012 that he had performed a lot in 2011. And frankly, those things are not scripted...so those moments happen or they don't. It's sports.
 
Another note: I guess we could go back to the days of Tony Hollings and Wali Lundy and stuff.

Nah, I think Arian Foster will do just fine!
 
Vinny said:
maybe his favorite player as a kid was Franco Harris?
Click to expand...

Did you see that play where Tate was stumped in the backfield, he bounced off the intial contact, then broke another tackle in the back field, then stiff armed another defender to get to the corner, & actually made a positive play.

That was more Franco Harris than anything I've seen Foster do this year

I may be completely wrong & this may be more emotions talking than anything, but that 12 yard run by Foster to start the game & the 15 yard run he followed with, I just think those would have went for scores with Ben Tate carrying the rock.
 
wolf123 said:
Has not been running very hard. Looks to run out of bounds at the first sign of contact.:foottap:
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Yep. I used to say I wanted him to stay in to keep the clock running but now I see him not looking to the middle of the field at all like Tate does.
 
El Tejano said:
Yep. I used to say I wanted him to stay in to keep the clock running but now I see him not looking to the middle of the field at all like Tate does.
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The past few games, he looks like he's got Steve Slaton syndrome: Find the pile and run right up the middle of it, Sanchez style.
 
He needs more rest. The last two years he would get two series then tate would be in for a series. This year he has not had that luxury and we are now going into week 15.
 
Vinny said:
I'm too old to post when nobody gets my Franco Harris reference.
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Speaking of which, the NFLN's series "A Football Life" is doing one on the Immaculate Reception reception next week.

These young whippersnappers are confused about your reference. :winky:
 
Double Barrel said:
Speaking of which, the NFLN's series "A Football Life" is doing one on the Immaculate Reception reception next week.

These young whippersnappers are confused about your reference. :winky:
Click to expand...
nice. Just for some reference on my post - the one thing that really got on all old Oiler fans nerves was Franco Harris running out of bounds over and over and over. :specnatz:
 
Vinny said:
nice. Just for some reference on my post - the one thing that really got on all old Oiler fans nerves was Franco Harris running out of bounds over and over and over. :specnatz:
Click to expand...

John McClain was talking about that in the off-season (the one thing he's good at is nostalgia).

He said Steelers fans have always loved Earl Campbell because he ran "like a Steeler". They always criticized Franco because he ran out of bounds (Tony Dorsett used to face the same criticism, iirc).

But like McClain pointed out, this habit of running out of bounds added years to Franco's career, and those massive hits obviously took their toll on Earl. He said in a conversation with Earl not long ago, Earl said he should have ran like Franco to preserve his body some and lengthen his career.

I think it's playing smart. Unless you need that extra yard, save yourself to fight another battle.
 
Lucky said:
The biggest difference in the 2012 from the 2011 Foster is his impact as a receiver. Foster is averaging only 13.5 receiving yards/game, as opposed to 47.5 last season. I don't know if that's due to Arian staying in to block more. But going from a 11.2 yards/catch to 5.1 is noticeable.
Click to expand...

I need to dig more into that, but at the moment this much I can tell.

With AJ out for a big portion last year, and the fact that we eased him back in getting ready for the play-offs, we shift some of the load to Foster.

Actually, Foster was targeted just 1. Something more per game last year.
Overall, his number of total involvements has increased this year.

As far as why his receiving yards were so much higher last year, I need to study some more.

I only looked at one game so far, against the Raiders.
He had 4 catches, I think (I don't have my note here with me).
A 60 yd catch and run with nobody really touching him until toward the end of the play. A 22-23 ydr and a couple in the teens also went the same way.

Basically, it was just poor coverage by the Raiders.

Not only that, Foster was nursing a hamstring at that early stage of the season.

There's nothing to suggest that he could have been more explosive or stronger than he is right now.

He even got rolled over by the ankle on one play early in the first quarter.

Everything seems to indicate "coincidence" due to poor coverage and not anything related to him being a Vegeterian or slowing down or that he's not as strong such that he can't break tackle as efficiently as he did last year.
 
GP said:
Sigh, I need to really clarify that I don't think Arian Foster is a slacker, nor do I think he is a bad pro.

I think the guy is solid.

I just cannot put my finger on why this year feels so opposite of what he looked like in 2011. For me, the "big moment" factor is what is missing in 2012 that he had performed a lot in 2011. And frankly, those things are not scripted...so those moments happen or they don't. It's sports.
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One thing I know is that a few ex-coaches (Gruden, Billick) talked about Foster as a patient runner.

He's learned as the years move along to press the heels of his blockers to set up the block before he makes the cut.

When you do this, and the block gets blown up, there's not much room to go.
In the long term, it should pay off; only if he gets the same blocking he received last year.

We don't have the same continuity of the 6 guys we had last year (including Dreessen).

Wade Smith has been playing hurt basically from the start.
Caldwell was also hurt most of the time.
And we have a carousel at RG and RT.

The numbers with Forsett and Tate are of a small sample size.
Nothing is definitive there; only I know that "coincidentally" they've been getting better blocking and they are not used anywhere as often in "tough situations".
 
I am really starting to wonder when Tate is going to start shouldering some of the load again like he did last year. Foster and Tate were great together last year and provided the defense to gameplan for both. I loved it when we pitched the ball out to Tate wide for 7 yards each time.
 
Tailgate said:
I am really starting to wonder when Tate is going to start shouldering some of the load again like he did last year. Foster and Tate were great together last year and provided the defense to gameplan for both. I loved it when we pitched the ball out to Tate wide for 7 yards each time.
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Tate was on the radio after the game & they asked him how he was feeling, if he was ready to take on the role he had last year. He basically said no. He wants to be, but he isn't.

He said he was winded in the Titans game even though he didn't play much. He felt good during Monday's game, but the recovery wasn't where he wants it to be.

& I agree, when it looks like Tate & Foster are competing against each other, it's good news for the Texans.
 
I think Foster has misplaced his vision, I will not say he lost it because I don't think you can entirely lose it, but he makes TERRIBLE reads sometimes. He always seemed to forget about the cutback, but he would do it a few times a game, not its RARE that you see him cutback at all, not sure why, because thats where we get out biggest runs, when the defense over pursues. He needs to watch a little more film from last season and maybe it will click for him....
 
GP said:
Heh, well....I was one of only about three people calling attention to it from the beginning of the reg season.

I don't know if it's the diet, the new $$$, the lack of Winston and Brisiel, some sort of situation involving Tate....but he's shutting it down early in a lot of games.

He's also running more through the middle when his bread and butter is always the edge and then a cutback. Don't know if he's trying to prove (to himself?) that he can run anywhere ,even the middle, or what.

But it's been off all season. He might not have been a big fan of seeing Winston and Brisiel leave. Because he's not running as well, for sure.
Click to expand...

Sure it has nothing with his new celebrity endorsement with krogers...i work for krogers and it depressed me and sucks the life out of me...foster is the poor guinea pig of the virus krogitis...
 
amazing80 said:
I think Foster has misplaced his vision, I will not say he lost it because I don't think you can entirely lose it, but he makes TERRIBLE reads sometimes. He always seemed to forget about the cutback, but he would do it a few times a game, not its RARE that you see him cutback at all, not sure why, because thats where we get out biggest runs, when the defense over pursues. He needs to watch a little more film from last season and maybe it will click for him....
Click to expand...

coltfan123 said:
Sure it has nothing with his new celebrity endorsement with krogers...i work for krogers and it depressed me and sucks the life out of me...foster is the poor guinea pig of the virus krogitis...
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Both y'all are misplaced in your thinking... I think other teams are scheming against Foster therefore limiting his game.

Foster will regain his ability to gash teams as he adapts to what they do against him. Meanwhile his 1148 yards will look... "pedestrian".
 
Texan_Bill said:
Both y'all are misplaced in your thinking... I think other teams are scheming against Foster therefore limiting his game.

Foster will regain his ability to gash teams as he adapts to what they do against him. Meanwhile his 1148 yards will look... "pedestrian".
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there is truth to that every team first game plan is to shut foster down..thats why texans have two diffrent types of backs...while they are getting there foster fix look like your going to hand to foster, then flip it to tate or forseet and burn it deep...creative play calling is what was missed monday..
 
Foster biggest strength is his ability to be patient behind his blocker. With the right side of the O line being atrocious as they are, his biggest strength has become his biggest weakness.
When that side of the line is getting breach at the point of handoff he needs to abandon his patient running and hit whatever hole that is in front of him. Instead he gets chase down by the lineman causing the breach.
That's why Tate and Forset are getting more production per carry. Those two are not as patient and that's why it looks like they getting to the holes faster.
If that right side don't improve it's best to play Forset and Tate. But we all know that'll never happen.

That side of the line is also atrocious on pass-blocking. People blame Schaub for not getting us back in the N.E. game. But it was that part of the line that kept getting blown up and missing blitz pickup that ultimately kill our comeback chances.
 
MEGA SWATT said:
Over using him. Tate coming back will help get his explosive big playmaking back in order.
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Which is all well and good except for the fact that Foster's performance hasn't really fallen off the last few games, it's pretty much been at the same level all season.
 
I'm very disappointed in Arian Foster's two primetime games against Super Bowl contenders. Those were the games I expected him to play like a superstar and lead us to a victory.

He had 17 carries for 29 rushing yards (1.7 per) and 2 TDs against the Packers. He then had 15 carries for 46 rushing yards (3.1 per) and 1 TD against the Patriots. That was coming off his 14 carries for 38 rushing yards game against the Titans (2.7 per) and 1 TD game.

He's still managing to score rushing Touchdowns even when he's not playing well but a RB of his caliber should have been gashing those teams for over 100 yards rushing and at least 4 yards per carry if not more. Especially the Packers which were devastated by key injuries in that game. I really felt he was primed for a 25-carry, 220-yard and 3 TD game going into the Packers game and boy was I way off. He only had the worst game of his career in that one.

I don't think it's the blocking either. The holes are still there he's just not hitting them fast enough. Put Adrian Peterson behind our current offensive line and he'd be beasting his way towards the league MVP award on the AFC's best-record team. He's not going to win it in Minnesota unless they make the playoffs which is doubtful considering two of their final three games are against the Texans and Packers.

I believe talent wise, Arian Foster is just as good as Adrian Peterson even though he hasn't played like it all season long. With the exception of scoring more Touchdowns of course.
 
Bulls on Parade said:
I don't think it's the blocking either.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's all on the OL but the holes really haven't been there, especially on the goal line, I can think of 2 times inside the 5 that I think we can credit the OL for a Foster TD. Other than that, it's been all Foster & it shouldn't be so lopsided.
 
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