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Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

eriadoc

eriadoc

Texan-American
Gregg Rosenthal ranked the following QBs ahead of Schaub, in order of tiers:

Rogers, Brady, Brees

Roethlisberger, Newton, PManning

EManning, Cutler, Rivers, Romo, Stafford

Vick, Ryan, Flacco, Luck

He ranked Schaub in the same tier with RG3, Dalton, Palmer, and Freeman.
 
He should probably be up in the vick/flacco tier.

You could maybe even make the argument that he should replace Culter in the one above that.

Pretty accurate rank though.
 
343.53.jpg
 
disaacks3 said:
Yep, Cam in the same category as Manning makes me want to hurl.
Click to expand...

And ahead of Eli Manning.

If it were me, I'd swap Peyton and Eli, since this is a current evaluation and not an All-Time thing. Cam would drop down a tier, probably two. Schaub, Cutler, and Rivers are essentially equal, in my eyes. Cutler and Rivers are perceived as more talented, but they haven't done anything Schaub hasn't, as far as I'm concerned.
 
eriadoc said:
Gregg Rosenthal ranked the following QBs ahead of Schaub, in order of tiers:

Rogers, Brady, Brees

Roethlisberger, Newton, PManning

EManning, Cutler, Rivers, Romo, Stafford

Vick, Ryan, Flacco, Luck

He ranked Schaub in the same tier with RG3, Dalton, Palmer, and Freeman.
Click to expand...

let's take em one tier at a time:

Tier 1: Agreed. Schaub is not on the level of Rogers, Brees, or Brady
Tier 2: Roethlisberger and Manning I agree. Big Ben and Peyton have done it consistently for years at a higher rate than Schaub. Manning I am giving the benefit of the doubt to until the regular season.

Newton is a big disagreement. He had a redhot start but then fell down to earth. Let's see him for a couple of full seasons before we say he is better than Schuab.

Tier 3: EManning: yes. He has made the big throws in the big games. Schaub hasn't as of yet. Cutler: No. Highly overrated gunslinger attitude passer. Throws a bunch of poorly thought out passes. Rivers/Romo. I see them in the same group as Schaub, solid have some issues, but can win with them. Neither,(like Schaub) has thrown the big passes in the big game. Stafford: has had 1 year where he wasn't injured. Let's see if he can put together another one before we put him this high.

Tier 4: Vick. Prior to Philly he was an overrated QB: poor passer great runner. Now he has reformed his passing ability to compliment his running. Problem is he cannot stay healthy. Injury concerns will only increase with age, but I would put him in the Schaub/Rivers/Romo group. Ryan: Hasn't really gotten it done. Has a ton of weapons but stunk it out in the playoffs last year. For now, put him in the Schaub group. Flacco: A QB who takes advantage of a steller running game and Defense. Doesn't have to do much. I would put him in the Schaub group. Luck hasn't done anything.

Tier 5:RG3: See Luck. Dalton: one solid year. Let's see what he can do with more than 1 year under his belt. Palmer: fallen off quite a bit. Freeman: highly overrated. Big arm but not much else.

Here is how I would stack it:

Tier 1: Rogers. Brady, Brees

Tier 2:Roethlisberger, P Manning, E Manning

Tier 3: Schaub, Romo, Rivers, Stafford, Vick, Ryan, Flacco,

Tier 4: Cutler, Freeman, Palmer

Tier Rookie/2nd year: Luck, Newton, RG3, Dalton
 
He said his evaluation is not based on past performance or results:, but rather "Who would we want as our QB leading a team this year and this year only".

Ok, by that logic I can understand why Schaub would be rated lower than others because of injury concerns. But why the hell is Vick ahead of him then? The same injury concerns are there and Schaub has the ability to move his team more efficiently.
 
eriadoc said:
Gregg Rosenthal ranked the following QBs ahead of Schaub, in order of tiers:

Rogers, Brady, Brees

Roethlisberger, Newton, PManning

EManning, Cutler, Rivers, Romo, Stafford

Vick, Ryan, Flacco, Luck

He ranked Schaub in the same tier with RG3, Dalton, Palmer, and Freeman.
Click to expand...

Eli is one of five QBs in NFL history to have 2 Super Bowl MVPs.

It's a joke that this guy puts Cam over Eli.

After reading that far, I lost all respect for his perspective and chalk it up to the "everyone has one and they all stink" routine.

Luck hasn't even thrown a pass in a regular season game and he's already better than Schaub? yeah, I smell something stinky.
 
Double Barrel said:
Eli is one of five QBs in NFL history to have 2 Super Bowl MVPs.

It's a joke that this guy puts Cam over Eli.

After reading that far, I lost all respect for his perspective and chalk it up to the "everyone has one and they all stink" routine.

Luck hasn't even thrown a pass in a regular season game and he's already better than Schaub? yeah, I smell something stinky.
Click to expand...

This is what I hate about evaluating QB's. Because QB's like Eli and Big Ben have won multiple Super Bowls they will automatically be ranked higher than they otherwise would be. And the opposite is true for QB's like Romo, Stafford, Cutler, Rivers, etc.. The playoffs factor in too much when evaluating the QB play.
 
Putting Schaub , a guy who is one of 11 QB's in history to throw for 4500+ yards in consecutive seasons below Luck and even with RG3 - two guy's who have never completed a pass in a regular season game .... I cant give this list any credibility.
 
eriadoc said:
Gregg Rosenthal ranked the following QBs ahead of Schaub, in order of tiers:

Rogers, Brady, Brees

Roethlisberger, Newton, PManning

EManning, Cutler, Rivers, Romo, Stafford

Vick, Ryan, Flacco, Luck

He ranked Schaub in the same tier with RG3, Dalton, Palmer, and Freeman.
Click to expand...

Newton,Cutler,Romo,Stafford,Vick,Ryan,Flacco,Luck WTF!!!!! Hell no Schaub above those QB'S SMH ridiculous Romo I'm iffy on Could say him and Schaub are in the same class but those other guys No No No No
 
Señor Stan;2003756 said:
here is a top five list of things i hate

5. Slideshows
4. Power Rankings
3. Polls
2. Lists
1. Irony
Click to expand...
Mine:

5. Hemmorhoids
4. Foods that inflame #5
3. Stress that inflame #5
2. People that inflame #5
1. Realizing I'm out of Prep H :hankpalm:
 
Peyton should be tier 1 and I'd take all of tier 3 before I took Newton. I'd also take Schaub before Newton and any of the rookies who have yet to prove ANYTHING in the NFL.
 
I've been calling Schaub TOP 10 for the last few years. I'd say that if you made a list though, you could argue that other guys belong over him in the top 10. It's all about perspective really. No way he is out of the top 15 though.

I'm only concerned with RIGHT NOW as far as Schaub goes though, and RIGHT NOW Schaub is looking damn good going into the season. Schaub looks crisp, focused, and as sharp as I have ever seen Schaub look. I'm proud that he our QB.
 
JCTexan said:
This is what I hate about evaluating QB's. Because QB's like Eli and Big Ben have won multiple Super Bowls they will automatically be ranked higher than they otherwise would be. And the opposite is true for QB's like Romo, Stafford, Cutler, Rivers, etc.. The playoffs factor in too much when evaluating the QB play.
Click to expand...

lol! Playoff performance is not indicative of quality of QB?

Look, you can stick with your fantasy football stats, but bigger picture analysis should be inclusive of post-season performances, as well.

Eli just got a ring and MVP earlier this year. Yet Cam Newton is already better than him when he has earned nothing?
 
Double Barrel said:
lol! Playoff performance is not indicative of quality of QB?

Look, you can stick with your fantasy football stats, but bigger picture analysis should be inclusive of post-season performances, as well.

Eli just got a ring and MVP earlier this year. Yet Cam Newton is already better than him when he has earned nothing?
Click to expand...

Nothing but a losing record ..... :bubbles:
 
JCTexan said:
This is what I hate about evaluating QB's. Because QB's like Eli and Big Ben have won multiple Super Bowls they will automatically be ranked higher than they otherwise would be. And the opposite is true for QB's like Romo, Stafford, Cutler, Rivers, etc.. The playoffs factor in too much when evaluating the QB play.
Click to expand...

It wasn't the case in the old days, but increasingly since 1978 the QB is the most important player on the field. The last decade, the QB is at such a premium that it's probably the #1 indicator of whether or not your team is going to be a winning one. So when a QB has Super Bowl wins, especially in the past decade, it probably means he's really damn good. There are exceptions to any rule, but none of the current QBs that have won SBs are an exception.
 
Corrosion said:
Nothing but a losing record ..... :bubbles:
Click to expand...

Sometimes I wonder if some people are more focused on how good a player looks in a football uniform than what he actually does in that uniform.

I'm not saying that Eli is "elite" in this thread, but c'mon, diminishing his accomplishments when he's one of only 5 QBs in NFL history that have two SB MVPs? That's laughable analysis, to put it in respectful terms.
 
Double Barrel said:
Sometimes I wonder if some people are more focused on how good a player looks in a football uniform than what he actually does in that uniform.

I'm not saying that Eli is "elite" in this thread, but c'mon, diminishing his accomplishments when he's one of only 5 QBs in NFL history that have two SB MVPs? That's laughable analysis, to put it in respectful terms.
Click to expand...

I have to wonder if his name wasnt Manning , would he get more respect ....


Who woulda thunk that Eli would have more rings and SB-MVP's than Peyton .... :truck:


Looking at the results , you have to put Eli up there with the elite group .... no two ways around it.
 
I haven't read the article nor people's responses. I just looked at the tiers.

That said, this article has no validity in my mind's eye whenever you rank an unproven, untested rookie ahead and another unproven, untested rookie in the same tier as a guy that through for 9,000 yards over two seasons. And Joe Flacco? Are you kidding me?? A 5th round rookie QB had a chance to beat him in a playoff game at Flacco's yard.. In the words of the immortal Private John Winger, "Cut it out! Cut it out! Cut it out! The hell's the matter with you? Stupid!"

As they would say in that lame BSPN segment, "C'mon Man!!"
 
And if Schaub's injury history played a part, HELLO McFly!! As it turns out Mike Vick isn't the most durable guy out there. Romo?? Hilarious!!!

Another, New York City honk Muff-Hugga!

*EDIT*

Sumbitch must be a Giants fan because if he was a Jets fan, he would ranked Sanchez AND Tebow ahead of Schaub.

/endrant
 
The guy, for whatever the reason may be, can't stay on the field. Half a season with Schaub is not more valuable than entire season of Flacco, etc.

That's how I could justify middle-of-the-pack

TJ
 
Schaub should be in the Cutler/Romo/Ryan/Flacco level. Very good, but still has ?'s. Luck may be on that level now, but I highly doubt it.

disaacks3 said:
Yep, Cam in the same category as Manning makes me want to hurl.
Click to expand...
Cam accounted for 35 TDs and over 4700 yards as a rookie. Stats aren't everything. But Cam should improve in his 2nd year. I think we're looking at a league MVP before long. Peyton still has to prove he's still Peyton.
eriadoc said:
If it were me, I'd swap Peyton and Eli...
Click to expand...
I agree. Peyton has to show he can get back to 80% of his former level. In the games I've watched, I haven't seen it.

Señor Stan;2003756 said:
here is a top five list of things i hate

5. Slideshows
4. Power Rankings
3. Polls
2. Lists
1. Irony
Click to expand...
Oh, sweet Irony.
 
speedfreek said:
The guy, for whatever the reason may be, can't stay on the field. Half a season with Schaub is not more valuable than entire season of Flacco, etc.

That's how I could justify middle-of-the-pack

TJ
Click to expand...

It matters not. The Ravens and Texans were in the same exact spot this past January with a 3rd string QB, OH and BTW Schaub was what, when he went down? 7 - 3? (*ahem* should've been 8-2, thanks Jacoby v. the Raiders). And again, if injuries were a concern, than at the very least Schaub should've been in the same tier as Vick.

Why do I continue to read nonsensical garbage from hack writers during the (sorta) off-season is beyond me!!

:facepalm: Bill!
 
Listen, I don't have Schaub in my top 10 QB's, but I ("where do you slot him? - inside joke) do have him within 10-12(ish). 16-20 is asinine!
 
Double Barrel said:
lol! Playoff performance is not indicative of quality of QB?

Look, you can stick with your fantasy football stats, but bigger picture analysis should be inclusive of post-season performances, as well.

Eli just got a ring and MVP earlier this year. Yet Cam Newton is already better than him when he has earned nothing?
Click to expand...

Oh, I wasn't saying I agreed with the guys rankings at all. Eli is way better than Newton. There is no question of that. I just see QB's like Eli/Big-Ben in a tier to their self when they should be in the same tier as Stafford, Cutler and Rivers.
 
Texan_Bill said:
And if Schaub's injury history played a part, HELLO McFly!! As it turns out Mike Vick isn't the most durable guy out there. Romo?? Hilarious!!!

Another, New York City honk Muff-Hugga!

*EDIT*

Sumbitch must be a Giants fan because if he was a Jets fan, he would ranked Sanchez AND Tebow ahead of Schaub.

/endrant
Click to expand...

:clap:

This dude has no idea what the hell he's talking about. :faildetector:


There are certain articles I will read and take them with a grain of salt if it's negative. Then, there are ones that I read and just shake my head, and quit reading, because the journalist has no idea what the hell he's talking about. This one falls in the latter category.
 
Double Barrel said:
lol! Playoff performance is not indicative of quality of QB?

Look, you can stick with your fantasy football stats, but bigger picture analysis should be inclusive of post-season performances, as well.

Eli just got a ring and MVP earlier this year. Yet Cam Newton is already better than him when he has earned nothing?
Click to expand...

Take that defense away.... better yet, swap Carolina's defense with New Yorks. We'd all have a different view of these QBs.

Personally, I am not sold on Eli Manning. I don't agree with the MVPs... but who am I?

I also think he's about right on Matt, so far.... give or take.
 
eriadoc said:
It wasn't the case in the old days, but increasingly since 1978 the QB is the most important player on the field. The last decade, the QB is at such a premium that it's probably the #1 indicator of whether or not your team is going to be a winning one. So when a QB has Super Bowl wins, especially in the past decade, it probably means he's really damn good. There are exceptions to any rule, but none of the current QBs that have won SBs are an exception.
Click to expand...

Based on the information you just provided, what can we say about Schaub? Think about his two healthy seasons.... What you just wrote puts him squarely in mediocre.
 
eriadoc said:
Gregg Rosenthal ranked the following QBs ahead of Schaub, in order of tiers:

Rogers, Brady, Brees

Roethlisberger, Newton, PManning

EManning, Cutler, Rivers, Romo, Stafford

Vick, Ryan, Flacco, Luck

He ranked Schaub in the same tier with RG3, Dalton, Palmer, and Freeman.
Click to expand...

This is comical. He ranks Newton after ONE season and 6 wins total???

The kid has talent but by no means is he in the same company as Pmanning.

Then he ranks Andrew Luck above Schaub? The dude needs to be kicked in the nuts and stripped of whatever liscense he has. Journalism liscense?? Hell I dont know...take his drivers liscense for all I care.
 
If I had to rank the current QB's .... based upon what they have done at their position it woud look something like the following.



Peyton Manning.

Rogers , Brady , Brees , Eli Manning

Roethlisberger , Flacco , Schaub , Rivers

Cutler , Romo, Stafford , Vick

Ryan , Dalton , Palmer , Freeman , Newton

Luck , RG3
 
Double Barrel said:
lol! Playoff performance is not indicative of quality of QB?

Look, you can stick with your fantasy football stats, but bigger picture analysis should be inclusive of post-season performances, as well.

Eli just got a ring and MVP earlier this year. Yet Cam Newton is already better than him when he has earned nothing?
Click to expand...

OK.. thanks for posting this and saving me time.

If playoffs and Super Bowls didn't mean much Warren Moon would always be mentioned up there with Joe Montana, John Elway, etc. However because Warren Moon was a choker that could never get it done when it mattered he will always be remembered as that guy that threw a pretty spiral and could rack up a ton of yards. However never in the same category as those other guys.

Also, that guy's list is a joke. Putting Eli where he put him is a disgrace and putting Andrew Luck (who has never taken an NFL snap when it matters) over Schaub is just as bad.

BTW where is Vince Young on that list??

:kitten:
 
How I ranked them at the end of the 2011-2012 season:

Rodgers, Brees, Brady
----------------
Eli, Forehead, Stafford
-------------
Schaub, Rapistburger, Rivers
-------------
Romo, Cutler, Newton
-------------
Ryan, Flacco, Vick

Romo could be higher if he wasn't a choke artist.
 
Goatcheese said:
How I ranked them at the end of the 2011-2012 season:

Rodgers, Brees, Brady
----------------
Eli, Forehead, Stafford
-------------
Schaub, Rapistburger, Rivers
-------------
Romo, Cutler, Newton
-------------
Ryan, Flacco, Vick

Romo could be higher if he wasn't a choke artist.
Click to expand...

Cortland Finnegan, Josh Wilson, Michael Huff, Jabari Greer. Do these names ring a bell?
 
Corrosion said:
Who woulda thunk that Eli would have more rings and SB-MVP's than Peyton .... :truck:
Click to expand...

You look at that and the obvious conclusion you come up with is that Eli is "better" than Peyton... or even in the same league? What does that say about Warren Moon, Dan Foust (sp), & Marino??

The Giants have a better team than the Colts... that's all I take from that. As far as MVP goes.. which is an individual award, call me when Eli gets a league MVP. Not as prestigious, I know, but it includes all players... even those that did not qualify for the Super Bowl MVP.
 
Fiddler said:
You look at that and the obvious conclusion you come up with is that Eli is "better" than Peyton... or even in the same league? What does that say about Warren Moon, Dan Foust (sp), & Marino??

The Giants have a better team than the Colts... that's all I take from that. As far as MVP goes.. which is an individual award, call me when Eli gets a league MVP. Not as prestigious, I know, but it includes all players... even those that did not qualify for the Super Bowl MVP.
Click to expand...

Hell no , Eli isnt as good as Peyton .... I honestly think Peyton Manning is the best QB this league has ever seen. He's taken QB play to a whole nother level .... Man do I hate that guy, only because he doesnt play for my team.

But with two SB-MVP's and two rings .... I'll plug him in with the next tier of QB's which includes Brady , Brees and Rodgers.


My point was more that he gets overshadowed by Peyton more because his name is Manning .... If he was anyone else we wouldnt get near as many comparisons.
 
kwayshauntay said:
Cortland Finnegan, Josh Wilson, Michael Huff, Jabari Greer. Do these names ring a bell?
Click to expand...

Didn't the all say that if you hit Schaub once, he pretty much gives up?

I know Albert Fatworth has said that many times.

Never really seen anyone but blind Cowboys haters put Schaub over Romo.
 
Texecutioner said:
I've been calling Schaub TOP 10 for the last few years. I'd say that if you made a list though, you could argue that other guys belong over him in the top 10. It's all about perspective really. No way he is out of the top 15 though.

I'm only concerned with RIGHT NOW as far as Schaub goes though, and RIGHT NOW Schaub is looking damn good going into the season. Schaub looks crisp, focused, and as sharp as I have ever seen Schaub look. I'm proud that he our QB.
Click to expand...

Very well said. I agree 100%.

MSR
 
ProFootballFocus has it's own QB Rating (Signature Stats) that takes into account dropped passes, throw aways, spikes, and yards in the air and further adjusts the old formula so it makes more sense and is a more accurate measure. These are based on regular season only.

2008, at least 50% of snaps
1 Aaron Rodgers 97.11
2 Philip Rivers 95.98
3 Peyton Manning 95.00
4 Matt Ryan 92.95
5 Chad Pennington 92.65
6 Jeff Garcia 91.29
7 Kurt Warner 90.87
8 Matt Schaub 90.25

10 Drew Brees 88.94
11 Jay Cutler 88.51
12 Eli Manning 88.41

14 Tony Romo 86.55

19 Ben Roethlisberger 84.50
Click to expand...
2009, at least 50% of snaps
1 Drew Brees 96.89
2 Ben Roethlisberger 95.69
3 Philip Rivers 94.87
4 Brett Favre 94.77
5 Aaron Rodgers 94.62
6 Matt Schaub 92.23
7 Peyton Manning 91.10
8 Eli Manning 88.21
9 Tom Brady 87.95

11 Tony Romo 87.41
Click to expand...
2010, at least 50% of snaps
1 Tom Brady 99.17
2 Aaron Rodgers 95.91
3 Michael Vick 93.57
4 Ben Roethlisberger 92.73
5 Philip Rivers 92.13
6 Peyton Manning 91.11
7 Joe Flacco 90.57
8 Drew Brees 90.41
9 Josh Freeman 90.22
10 Matt Schaub 89.31
11 Matt Ryan 88.13

13 Eli Manning 87.58
Click to expand...
2011, at least 25%* of snaps
1 Aaron Rodgers 108.77
2 Drew Brees 98.26
3 Tom Brady 93.45
4 Matt Ryan 92.45
5 Matthew Stafford 92.32
6 Tony Romo 92.30
7 Eli Manning 91.82
8 Matt Moore 91.75
9 Matt Schaub 90.65
10 Alex D. Smith 90.07
11 Philip Rivers 89.49
12 Michael Vick 88.03

14 Ben Roethlisberger 85.19
15 Jay Cutler 84.90

22 Cam Newton 81.21
23 Joe Flacco 80.63
Click to expand...
*had to drop down to 25% total snaps in 2011 so that Schaub could be included
 
Fiddler said:
Take that defense away.... better yet, swap Carolina's defense with New Yorks. We'd all have a different view of these QBs.

Personally, I am not sold on Eli Manning. I don't agree with the MVPs... but who am I?

I also think he's about right on Matt, so far.... give or take.
Click to expand...

We can play "what if" games until we are old and gray. None of it means anything. Heck, we can play that game going back decades. What if Bud Adams hadn't been stuck at a Houston airport and we had the Houston Cowboys? What if? What if? What if? It's all meaningless imaginary nonsense.

I look at reality. And the reality is that Eli has 2 championship MVPs, one of only 5 QBs in NFL history to accomplish this feat. That fact does not make him the best, but since the NFL is not in the habit of handing out those awards like Halloween candy, I'd say that he certainly deserves more respect than many folks are willing to give him.

And freakin' A this doofus writer is making himself look like a fool to put Newton above him. It reeks of an agenda and lacks any logical objectivity.
 
What? He doesn't look like a guy that really knows football? :lol:

He ain't any different than these other self proclaimed analysts that peruse stat lines to come up with worthless ratings and blogs

greggrosenthal_display_image.jpg
 
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