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Eric Winston vs. Indy?
- Thread starter Wolf6151
- Start date
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
I've already made about 5 different posts about this... You can go ahead and rename the thread Eric Winston vs. speed rushers.. he did the same as he always does and has always done his entire NFL career. He got ate up and demolished.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
He dominates pass rushers like Mario (the big guys who's game is built on strength), strength isn't a issue with Winston (reason why he dominates in the running game). It's the fast smaller guys with a quick first step that is his kryptonite.
He may eventually have to be moved inside (he'd be a hellacious pulling guard) and we may need to actually invest a high round draft pick at that position on a guy who's athletic and can stay in front of speed rushers.
Norg
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
That about sums it up. U wanna see your team get better in the off season lets add RT to the need list. ......
Yea, Mathis has been eating his lunch since the day he became the starter. Speedy dudes just had their ways with him and the guy never could figure it out. The Winston experiment at RT needs to end this off-season.
WR and RT - First two rounds.
Thanks, I've been preaching for a while now that Winston needs to be moved to RG because of his short arms and getting slow. He would vastly improve the RG position, vastly improve our O-line depth by moving Brisiel and Caldwell to backups, and get better at RT with a 2nd round draft pick that's more athletic.
dream_team
Hall of Fame
How about have Butler play RT and move Winston inside?
How come out of all of the OL on the Texans, Winston seems to be the most popular? When anyone talks about a potential pro bowler on the OL, they bring up Winston? Brown & Myers are our clear two best lineman.
How come out of all of the OL on the Texans, Winston seems to be the most popular? When anyone talks about a potential pro bowler on the OL, they bring up Winston? Brown & Myers are our clear two best lineman.
GP
Go Texans!
I've been watching him get our QB blown up all season long.
Which usually happens from the QB's BLIND side...not the side where the QB can see the guy coming (which is Winston's side). It takes a special kind of right tackle to do what Winston has been doing all season this year.
Other than Kareem Jackson, I can't think of another Texans player who has been abused and ate up as much as Winston has. This two guys, IMO, are the weakest links on this team.
I used to think QB or WR was a 1st round need in the 2012 draft. Until now. I'm convinced that RT might have to be in the mix for round 1. Because #73 needs to wear a number in the 60s in 2012. Period.
Which usually happens from the QB's BLIND side...not the side where the QB can see the guy coming (which is Winston's side). It takes a special kind of right tackle to do what Winston has been doing all season this year.
Other than Kareem Jackson, I can't think of another Texans player who has been abused and ate up as much as Winston has. This two guys, IMO, are the weakest links on this team.
I used to think QB or WR was a 1st round need in the 2012 draft. Until now. I'm convinced that RT might have to be in the mix for round 1. Because #73 needs to wear a number in the 60s in 2012. Period.
Brisco_County
Apples and roadmaps
Clone Duane Brown, problem solved.
NastyNate
I go kerplunk
Briesel isn't much better? I think you got a firsthand look at how important continuity is on our starting O-line and why it works so well when we're healthy. Caldwell got destroyed on Thursday, Winston looked okay albeit a few plays. Freeney and Mathis are very good pass rushers and are paid to get to the qb... heaven forbid they do their job.
HJam72
Hall of Fame
Actually, these guys giving up sacks are doing us a big favor, because I'm just waiting for the refs to put a short, pink skirt on our QB just like all the other ones wear. We could use all those yards on offense. Yates could scream at the officials, "He touched me! He touched me!" just like good ole Peyton.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
maybe the refs got confused & thought it was Peyton Manning back there in a Colt uniform?
Kthx
Rookie
Its probably because he is a huge asset when it comes to our running game more than his pass rush blocking skills.
Duane Brown pwned, in both the run game & passing game.
NastyNate
I go kerplunk
That play was pretty hard to forget. C'mon MAN!
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
moving winston to rg? couldn't be bothered diging out the 'not this **** again' picture but it fits
why are ppl surprised a RT struggles with speed rushers? geez winston must be the only one of those
this forum gets pretty dumb after losses
Gee I guess Mathis leads the league in sacks and has about 20 already then huh? Oh wait.......he doesn't, hmm I guess not every RT in the league gets their ass kicked by speed rushers.
Next time how about you just don't bother to post at all in threads like this, we don't really need you telling us how "dumb" we are.
Winston is a weak link on the line when he's matched up against players like that and no....not every RT has that glaring hole in their game, it would be "dumb" to think that and to make excuses and write off Winston's inability to stay in front of players like that.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
Not bad for a player who was a "reach" huh?
Duane Brown has developed into a elite LT and he's one of the best in the league now. They need to go ahead and lock him up with a long term contract.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Gee I guess Mathis leads the league in sacks and has about 20 already then huh? Oh wait.......he doesn't, hmm I guess not every RT in the league gets their ass kicked by speed rushers.
Next time how about you just don't bother to post at all in threads like this, we don't really need you telling us how "dumb" we are.
Winston is a weak link on the line when he's matched up against players like that and no....not every RT has that glaring hole in their game, it would be "dumb" to think that and to make excuses and write off Winston's inability to stay in front of players like that.
The Texans will always have problems with good and savy Ds. They play to this weakness. We can't always move another O player over to compensate for his deficiency or we will end up seeing the other side break down..........and so will D coaches.
As our RT, Winston is expected to chew up good Ds. Unfortunately, he ends up more the chewee.........unless he's sitting down and concentrating at WingStop.
Maddict5
Hall of Fame
Gee I guess Mathis leads the league in sacks and has about 20 already then huh? Oh wait.......he doesn't, hmm I guess not every RT in the league gets their ass kicked by speed rushers.
Next time how about you just don't bother to post at all in threads like this, we don't really need you telling us how "dumb" we are.
Winston is a weak link on the line when he's matched up against players like that and no....not every RT has that glaring hole in their game, it would be "dumb" to think that and to make excuses and write off Winston's inability to stay in front of players like that.
sorry but it is dumb to want to change your good RT to guard after 6 seasons (with 1 game to go before the playoffs!
) after a few poor pass protection outings v smallish speed rushers. everybody who follows the texans knows thats erics weakness just like it is with the majority of RT's (obviously they are a couple elite exceptions but generally RT's are run blocking maulers with less agility and quickness). im not exactly going out on a limb saying that so why argue? he makes up for it with his very good-great run blocking. possibly related: texans have one of the top run games last two yrsmathis is one of the best pass rushing lde's in the league. you're trying to argue that with sack stats? real insightful
just as an example if a stat guy like yourself were to go by the sack stats jason babin is one of if not the best DE in the league?
theres a handful of guys that give eric problems but he handles 90% of them fine. its just that hes faced two of the few that do give him trouble in recent weeks in abraham and mathis. unless ive overlooked somebody, i see none of the teams we're due to face in the playoffs having one of those guys
silvrhand
All Pro
How about we just use the TE to chip the speed rushers when we know it's a passing down then release into their route. Gary is very stubborn sometimes and refuses to change his tactics based on personnel.
Dutchrudder
Hall of Fame
Iirc, the sack Winston allowed to Mathis, wasn't all that much his fault, but moreso on Yates for not stepping up into the open pocket. Winston was pushing Mathis to the outside, but Yates took 5 steps back and never took one forward, so he was right there once Mathis got to the top of the pocket.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
sorry but it is dumb to want to change your good RT to guard after 6 seasons (with 1 game to go before the playoffs!
mathis is one of the best pass rushing lde's in the league. you're trying to argue that with sack stats? real insightful
just as an example if a stat guy like yourself were to go by the sack stats jason babin is one of if not the best DE in the league?
theres a handful of guys that give eric problems but he handles 90% of them fine. its just that hes faced two of the few that do give him trouble in recent weeks in abraham and mathis. unless ive overlooked somebody, i see none of the teams we're due to face in the playoffs having one of those guys
Nobody was talking about "changing him out with 1 game before the playoffs"...they were talking about drafting someone in the offseason. As in after this season is over.Jason Babin IS one of the best pass rushers in the league now...what's your point?
Fact is Winton is a liability in pass protection against the type of DEs that play in our division and the type that you see in the playoffs...if you can upgrade the position you do it. Nobody is irreplaceable and it's not "dumb" to have a debate about it. That is the purpose of this board is it not? If you thought it was a "dumb" idea or discussion, then maybe you should just move on to another topic in another thread.
Uhm, several of us were "bitching" after the Miami game...which we won. Winston has played like he was wearing cement shoes several times this year. They were all against speed rushers.moving winston to rg? couldnt be bothered diging out the 'not this **** again' picture but it fits
why are ppl surprised a RT struggles with speed rushers? geez winston must be the only one of those
this forum gets pretty dumb after losses
Yeah, I score that 60/40 Yates, but others might see differently.
TejasTom
All Pro
I believe the only LT to not give up a sack this year!
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
As I've said before, if you have to steal from another position to re-inforce the tackle, another area is left weakened, mostly likely collapse of the pocket from pressure up the middle.
TejasTom
All Pro
Not a good situation with a backup guard.
Winston only gave up two sacks, he had help on one, the one he got called for the holding penalty.
This quote makes it sound like he wasn't the only one who gave up a sack when help was there.
My question is, what does this really mean?
Did the TEs/RBs not pick up effectively or did Yates not "feel" where the rush was coming from and correctly step into the pocket? Or did the help not create a proper pocket?
I've only noticed 2 plays where this was a problem.
The most obvious one was where Winston gets called on a holding penalty & gives up the sack. He's got Dressen outside of him, and instead of protecting his inside, he let himself get beat to the inside. He should have protected the inside against all odds. Never should have happened.
There was another, where Tj takes a quick 3 step drop, pulls the ball down then rolls around to his left & get sacked. Vickers is the help, coming out of the backfield. He thinks (judging by what he does) Caldwell is getting beat on the inside & tries to slide to the inside to help. But he runs right into Yates, disturbing his throwing motion, causing Yates to pull it back down.
The sack strip, Winston had no help, but Tj should have "felt" it & stepped up...... I mean other than Winston doing a better job & forcing Mathis on a wider arc.... Tj could have helped out there.
I don't know what the other one was.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
He had problems with Robert Mathis?
In a John Granato voice: "Who doesn't?"
In a John Granato voice: "Who doesn't?"
GP
Go Texans!
Winston is the blocker who got beat on the play where Leinart was drilled into the ground and lost for the season.
He was playing patty-cake with his defender, it was amateur hour for who everyone thinks Winston to be (A Pro Bowl-caliber RT).
Look, I don't know what the deal is with him this season. I didn't see this consistent level of suckage from him early on in the season. I wonder if he's got some injuries or overall "banged up" problems that have hobbled him to the point of not being out of games but not being in prime condition either.
I don't even think Kubiak would move him to RG in 2012 either. Hopefully they're working on "blocking to their help" as Kubiak put it.
He was playing patty-cake with his defender, it was amateur hour for who everyone thinks Winston to be (A Pro Bowl-caliber RT).
Look, I don't know what the deal is with him this season. I didn't see this consistent level of suckage from him early on in the season. I wonder if he's got some injuries or overall "banged up" problems that have hobbled him to the point of not being out of games but not being in prime condition either.
I don't even think Kubiak would move him to RG in 2012 either. Hopefully they're working on "blocking to their help" as Kubiak put it.
TejasTom
All Pro
Can we get you press credentials?