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Thank YouHeres an article to back it up
http://www.xtrapointfootball.com/201102231057/2011-articles/february/trading-mario-williams-for-elvis-dumervil-its-a-good-thing.html
Interesting idea to say the least.
We're going to 3-4 and would get a 17 sack OLB and they're going to a 4-3 and would get a player Fox hopefully looks at as a future Peppers.
Could be a win-win
Mario for a draft pick? That's not very good for us. To much uncertainty, especially with Rick Smith drafting. You would have to get a haul. Similar to Jared Allen.I am not a huge Mario guy, but that would be a bad trade. If it was for a healthy and productive Elvis that had had a good year and wasn't coming off a major injury, I would be more open to it...but Elvis was hurt.
I would be open to trading Mario for a Top5 maybe a Top10 overall pick in this NFL draft, but other than that we just need to see how Mario does in the new 3-4 alignment.
Just speculation.who's proposing the trade - Houston, Denver, or 790?
If Josh McDaniels was still there, this would not sound so unlikely...Mario for Dumervil and there 1st this year and 2nd next year would do it for me.
Sounds just as crazy now as it ever did.A long time ago I either posted or created a thread talking about this possibility. I mentioned that my brother talked about the reasons why trading Mario wouldn't be a bad idea. Some of you agreed and some thought we were crazy. It doesn't seem so crazy now but like Second Honeymoon said, Mario for a previously injured player is not a good idea IMO. However I do have to consider the fact that every year we are given the same line that Mario disappearing in November is because he's playing injured.
Johnny hammersticks ova here hammerin away.Absolutely not. Mario is a guy you build your entire defense around. He is going to be great for a long time. He provides other things to our defense other than sack totals.
Not my chair, not my problem. Nope. Not eva.
Dumervill excelled in the 4-3 as a DE.Just speculation.
And Dumervil has an extremely odd contract that pays $14 mil next year and goes down each year after. If he performs well that is just begging for problems. Plus while I agree Dumervil is not as well suited to a 4-3 I think Mario can excel in either system.
Dumerville is more inclined to injury than Mario. I dont' like it.
There shouldn't be a discussion of trading Mario unless he is refusing to accept the new system.
Mario is hurt every year also.... it's only a matter of time until those injuries start stacking up and he also misses games. Then throw in the fact that nobody knows what kind of player he's going to be in a 3-4 defense (He is no Bruce Smith).I am not a huge Mario guy, but that would be a bad trade. If it was for a healthy and productive Elvis that had had a good year and wasn't coming off a major injury, I would be more open to it...but Elvis was hurt.
I would be open to trading Mario for a Top5 maybe a Top10 overall pick in this NFL draft, but other than that we just need to see how Mario does in the new 3-4 alignment.
I'm not sure I would do the deal. One thing to think about, though, is the contract situation. Mario has one year left on his deal. Elvis has 5, I think. What is most significant about that is the trading team is responsible for the signing bonus figure on the salary cap... So, while trading Mario away would cost the Texans about a $3 million hit on the cap for 2011, none of Dumervil's signing bonus would ever count against the Texans cap. Therefore, his rather large contract would turn into a heck of a bargain because the Texans would only owe him his actual yearly salaries through 2015... In that respect, it would be an unbelievable deal...Mario is hurt every year also.... it's only a matter of time until those injuries start stacking up and he also misses games. Then throw in the fact that nobody knows what kind of player he's going to be in a 3-4 defense (He is no Bruce Smith).
I'd do this deal in a heartbeat.
Dumervil is great at getting sacks but that isn't the only thing a 4-3 DE has to do. He isn't near the complete DE Mario is hence his having almost half as many tackles.Dumervill excelled in the 4-3 as a DE.
2007 :as a rookie, 8.5 sacks in 13 games.(Denver in 4-3)
2008: second year player, 12.5 sacks in 16 games (Denver in 4-3)
2009: Third year, 5 sacks in 16 games, (first year in 3-4)
2010: Fourth year, 17 sacks in 16 games (second year in 3-4).
Dumervill is a football player. He excels in the 4-3 as a DE and the 3-4 as an OLB.
The $3 mil is chicken feed. The major guarantee in Dumervil's contract is the salaries for the first three years, two now, because they are fully guaranteed. And the contract is set up as a hand grenade with the salaries front loaded. I just don't like the situation. Either you are guaranteeing a huge salary next year of $14 mil ($12 mil the next year) and he gets injured or if he stays healthy and plays well he is not playing out a contract that pays him millions less each year.I'm not sure I would do the deal. One thing to think about, though, is the contract situation. Mario has one year left on his deal. Elvis has 5, I think. What is most significant about that is the trading team is responsible for the signing bonus figure on the salary cap... So, while trading Mario away would cost the Texans about a $3 million hit on the cap for 2011, none of Dumervil's signing bonus would ever count against the Texans cap. Therefore, his rather large contract would turn into a heck of a bargain because the Texans would only owe him his actual yearly salaries through 2015... In that respect, it would be an unbelievable deal...
actually, I just talked myself into it. I wish it wasn't make-believe, because the Texans would be foolish not to do it!
At the risk of asserting certainty despite a total lack of information: There is no way Dumervil's salary is $14 million next year. Perhaps his cap # is scheduled to be that in Denver next season... However, the cap # is figured by adding the scheduled salary with the signing bonus divided by contract years. So, if the signing bonus was $24 over the six year contract, then $4 million of that $14 million wouldn't transfer to Houston in a trade.Dumervil is great at getting sacks but that isn't the only thing a 4-3 DE has to do. He isn't near the complete DE Mario is hence his having almost half as many tackles.
The $3 mil is chicken feed. The major guarantee in Dumervil's contract is the salaries for the first three years, two now, because they are fully guaranteed. And the contract is set up as a hand grenade with the salaries front loaded. I just don't like the situation. Either you are guaranteeing a huge salary next year of $14 mil ($12 mil the next year) and he gets injured or if he stays healthy and plays well he is not playing out a contract that pays him millions less each year.
I'm going off what Rotoworld says and they are usually pretty good.At the risk of asserting certainty despite a total lack of information: There is no way Dumervil's salary is $14 million next year. Perhaps his cap # is scheduled to be that in Denver next season... However, the cap # is figured by adding the scheduled salary with the signing bonus divided by contract years. So, if the signing bonus was $24 over the six year contract, then $4 million of that $14 million wouldn't transfer to Houston in a trade.
Very small signing bonus, lots of guaranteed salary including salaries of $14 mil for the next two seasons.7/22/2010: Signed a six-year, $61.5 million contract. The deal contains $43.156 million guaranteed, including a $3 million signing bonus and Dumervil's first, second, and third years' base salaries. 2011-2012: $14 million, 2013: $12 million, 2014: $10 million, 2015: $8,193,335, 2016: Free Agent
From Rotoworld's Dumervil page:At the risk of asserting certainty despite a total lack of information: There is no way Dumervil's salary is $14 million next year.
Dumervil is making $14 million this year and next year. Guaranteed. Just insane.7/22/2010: Signed a six-year, $61.5 million contract. The deal contains $43.156 million guaranteed, including a $3 million signing bonus and Dumervil's first, second, and third years' base salaries. 2011-2012: $14 million, 2013: $12 million, 2014: $10 million, 2015: $8,193,335, 2016: Free Agent
ummmm if so i say W. Philips needs to gotoday on 790 The Mighty Quin spoke of a proposed trade between houston and denver of Mario Williams for Elvis Dumervil anyone else hear this?
Care to expound on this a bit? I don't quite understand your reasoningummmm if so i say W. Philips needs to go
I was just about to post this about MG. He is horrible.Who wants to believe the Mighty *********? He is the worst sports talk host in Houston (Rich Lord comes reallyyyyyyyyy close).
That's not the worst deal in the world but Dumervilles contract is really ugly. I've liked Doom since he came into the league the same year as Mario and I've always thought he was underrated.If Denver was willing to give up Elvis and a 2011 2nd plus a 2011 2nd.
I would do that trade in a second.
MW is injury prone too.
I can see why Denver would be up for a trade.Dumervil is making $14 million this year and next year. Guaranteed. Just insane.
Man, it kills me to continue to see people act like Mario Williams is some guy that can't be parted with by some fans here. We had one of the worst pass rushes in the league before Mario got here and we still have one of the worst pass rushes in the league since he's been here. Mario is a good DE, but he is not a game changer on defense.
If Dumberville wasn't coming off a major injury this trade would be a no brainer. His salary wouldn't bother me that much at all really, but his injury was pretty bad. Mario is constantly having nagging injuries though or always has some sort of problem going on with him. Either way, he's nowhere near the player people try and act like he is around here and he's had a lack of motivation type of problem since college and I can't stand players like that especially on the Dline where you have to have a high motor. I doubt this has anything to it though. Mario is one of those guys that Bob sees as an investment because of his hype and his stature. Mario could put up 4 sacks and he'd still be looked at as a beast around here. Bob cares about money and Mario has the fan support because he was a #1 draft pick and hasn't been arrested. He's going nowhere.
If Mario doesn't excell in this 3-4 defense or gets injured this season his stock won't be worth jack after this season compared to what it is now though. I'd love to see him traded while the value is still pretty high. It's not like it would hurt the worst defense in the league either way.
Whether Mario succeeds in the 3-4 will be entirely dependent upon his motivation and his health. I don't want to hear fans excusing poor play on Mario's part with the "wrong defensive scheme for him". He's a physical freak. Essentially, he will be playing similarly to LDE, which I think was his stronger side.Like I-Cak said already, Mario is a more complete player than Dumerville ans it's not really a close comparison. Is Mario going to fit in our 3-4? Only time will tell, but if we're going to discuss imaginary trades for him we should at least make them good ones.
And who the hell is Mighty Quin? He should be fired just for the queer nickname alone.
My guess is that the only way this trade goes down, it's because Wade and the Texans know something about Mario's injury status that we don't know...............and neither does Denver.If Denver was willing to give up Elvis and a 2011 2nd plus a 2011 2nd.
I would do that trade in a second.
MW is injury prone too.
That contract is not big. It's obscene. It will be an albatross around the neck of that franchise.We need a OLB anyways, so why not get a proven guy with a big contract instead of a rookie we hope does well?
What does it mean to play LDE?Essentially, he will be playing similarly to LDE, which I think was his stronger side.
Most of us, and Wade (judging by what he's said) don't see Mario as an OLB like Merriman, or Ware.Mario will be the guy we all want him to be!!! ie..DeMarcus Ware and Shaun Merriman. Wade wil work with Mario.....or not!
This won't go down, because this is not a trade proposal. It's not on the table, Denver is not talking to Houston. Houston is not talking to Denver.My guess is that the only way this trade goes down, it's because Wade and the Texans know something about Mario's injury status that we don't know...............and neither does Denver.
Normally, the LDE is covered by a tackle and a TE. He almost never plays the 9 technique (which is lining up very wide, even wide of the TE).What does it mean to play LDE?
What's the difference between LDE & RDE?
Why is he stronger on the Left side?
I agree that Mario played better on the strong side of the formation..He seems to thrive when he's consistently engaging blockers...Normally, the LDE is covered by a tackle and a TE. He almost never plays the 9 technique (which is lining up very wide, even wide of the TE).
i'm saying that Williams is a fast powerful Defensive End and to get rid of such a play maker would be foolish, especially to bring in a guy who recently came off of a bad injury.Care to expound on this a bit? I don't quite understand your reasoning