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Cushing's contract: Are we going to have to rip it up?

H

houstonspartan

All Pro
I'm burned out on the Kubiak saga. I'm even tired of hearing myself talk about it.

Let's talk some football. We can all agree that we have an exciting squad. I was thinking about Cushing. He's an amazing player. I don't want to jinx our boy, but if he plays next year like he did this year, 12 months from now we may have to rip up his contract, start all over, and re-sign him with an extension and a big-ass raise.

Also, a buddy of mine was saying that he thinks Cushing is going to be even better after he puts on what he calls "NFL weight." He was saying that linebackers tend to be small when they get into the NFL and that it takes a year for them to put on weight and adust.

I've never heard of that theory. My buddy knows football, but when he's had several beers (as he had when he was yakking about this) his football common sense sometimes goes out the window.

I, personally, think Cushing is a great size, and adding any more weight would slow him down.
 
houstonspartan said:
I'm burned out on the Kubiak saga. I'm even tired of hearing myself talk about it.

Let's talk some football. We can all agree that we have an exciting squad. I was thinking about Cushing. He's an amazing player. I don't want to jinx our boy, but if he plays next year like he did this year, 12 months from now we may have to rip up his contract, start all over, and re-sign him with an extension and a big-ass raise.

Also, a buddy of mine was saying that he thinks Cushing is going to be even better after he puts on what he calls "NFL weight." He was saying that linebackers tend to be small when they get into the NFL and that it takes a year for them to put on weight and adust.

I've never heard of that theory. My buddy knows football, but when he's had several beers (as he had when he was yakking about this) his football common sense sometimes goes out the window.

I, personally, think Cushing is a great size, and adding any more weight would slow him down.
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I dunno, NFL.com lists Cush at 6'-3", 260 lbs. By comparison they list Ray Lewis at 6'-1", 250 lbs
and Patrick Willis at 6'-1", 240 lbs.
 
Texan_Bill said:
I dunno, NFL.com lists Cush at 6'-3", 260 lbs. By comparison they list Ray Lewis at 6'-1", 250 lbs
and Patrick Willis at 6'-1", 240 lbs.
Click to expand...

That's what I was thinking. He's a good size. I acutally think he's big, fast and agile enough to possibly play safety. Though, he still needs to work on his footwork a bit.
 
I wouldn't worry about him adding bad weight, he'll add good weight in the form of muscle for sure. Most NFL players are a different size from age 22 to age 26 to 30. Physically I have no concerns over him losing speed from adding weight because he takes care of himself. Guys who deserve that kind of concern are the one's with poor work ethics or have always had weight problems which Cushing hasn't.

Where Cushing can improve most if he dedicates himself, which I think he has and will is the mental aspect. Watching film on himself and some of the best linebackers in the game and seeing where he's falling short. I think he can take better angles to tackles and work on pass rushing moves other than a bull rush (swim moves etc). He has room to grow and its scary to think how good he can be. Personally I think he could be unquestionably the best linebacker in football at some point in his career from just projecting his progress as a rookie. Keep in mind, this guy played the way he did without a snap of preseason football and missing a ton of training camp, and he won rookie of the year, when has that ever happened?

Contract-wise rookies are inherently over-paid so we won't be worrying about his contract for atleast 5-7 more years.
 
houstonspartan said:
I'm burned out on the Kubiak saga. I'm even tired of hearing myself talk about it.

Let's talk some football. We can all agree that we have an exciting squad. I was thinking about Cushing. He's an amazing player. I don't want to jinx our boy, but if he plays next year like he did this year, 12 months from now we may have to rip up his contract, start all over, and re-sign him with an extension and a big-ass raise.

Also, a buddy of mine was saying that he thinks Cushing is going to be even better after he puts on what he calls "NFL weight." He was saying that linebackers tend to be small when they get into the NFL and that it takes a year for them to put on weight and adust.

I've never heard of that theory. My buddy knows football, but when he's had several beers (as he had when he was yakking about this) his football common sense sometimes goes out the window.

I, personally, think Cushing is a great size, and adding any more weight would slow him down.
Click to expand...

I always thought he seemed a little small for LB when he was in his regular clothes. He looked more like a safety.

But then when I saw him after pre season in his Texans uniform he looked much bigger and like any typical LB in the NFL. Not the smallest or the biggest. After watching him all season though, he looks just fine size wise. I'm not sure that I would want him to gain that much weight, because I like his abilities to rush the passer and wreck havoc on pass plays in coverage as well. The extra weight could possibly slow him down and it's not like he's having trouble bringing guys down or anything on tackles.
 
houstonspartan said:
I'm burned out on the Kubiak saga. I'm even tired of hearing myself talk about it.

Let's talk some football. We can all agree that we have an exciting squad. I was thinking about Cushing. He's an amazing player. I don't want to jinx our boy, but if he plays next year like he did this year, 12 months from now we may have to rip up his contract, start all over, and re-sign him with an extension and a big-ass raise.

Also, a buddy of mine was saying that he thinks Cushing is going to be even better after he puts on what he calls "NFL weight." He was saying that linebackers tend to be small when they get into the NFL and that it takes a year for them to put on weight and adust.

I've never heard of that theory. My buddy knows football, but when he's had several beers (as he had when he was yakking about this) his football common sense sometimes goes out the window.

I, personally, think Cushing is a great size, and adding any more weight would slow him down.
Click to expand...

Was this the same friend who told you that Dunta led the team in sacks this year?
 
ChampionTexan said:
Was this the same friend who told you that Dunta led the team in sacks this year?
Click to expand...

LOL!!!!

You know what, it was. And he's out of town, and due back in a few days and I'm going to nail him on it. And there were witnesses.

Seriously, the guy is smart, but when he's drinking, he really yaps and yaps and talks out of his butt. The only thing I can assume is that he meant to say that Dunta leads the team in picks, not sacks, but I don't even think that's true.
 
Cushing is my favorite Texan player probably of all time, but why rip the contract up? Because he is actually earning it? Can we rip up the contracts of players not earning it? No....then why should we carebear Cushing another contract before its time?

Cushing is going to be a Texan until we decide he no longer fits our plans. There is no reason to rush towards re-signing him to a longterm deal less than 8 months after we drafted him. That is just ludicrous. Having Cushing at fair value is the reward for drafting well...plus with his injury history we need to be cautious and not dig ourselves a hole trying to show a player that we believe in him. Didn't we learn anything from Domanick Davis and David Carr's contract when we went above and beyond what was prudent only to be burned by injuries and suckitude, respectively?
 
Second Honeymoon said:
Cushing is my favorite Texan player probably of all time, but why rip the contract up? Because he is actually earning it? Can we rip up the contracts of players not earning it? No....then why should we carebear Cushing another contract before its time?

Cushing is going to be a Texan until we decide he no longer fits our plans. There is no reason to rush towards re-signing him to a longterm deal less than 8 months after we drafted him. That is just ludicrous. Having Cushing at fair value is the reward for drafting well...plus with his injury history we need to be cautious and not dig ourselves a hole trying to show a player that we believe in him. Didn't we learn anything from Domanick Davis and David Carr's contract when we went above and beyond what was prudent to try and overplay our hand?
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No, I'm not saying re-sign him now, I'm saying if he plays well again next year, would we have to do it after next season, which would be two years into his contract.

I'm not saying we should. Just thought I'd toss it out there. I believe we did something similar with Eric Winston.

I agree about being careful regarding his injury history.
 
Its not like the guy was a 2nd round pick. As a 15th overall pick he has a rock solid contract. When we get to year 4 or 5 I'm sure he will get a healthy extension. As far as weight goes he doesn't need to add any, hes huge. He doesn't need to lose any either because he obviously carries it well. He is pretty much prototype 4-3 strongside LB size as a rookie.
 
houstonspartan said:
LOL!!!!

You know what, it was. And he's out of town, and due back in a few days and I'm going to nail him on it. And there were witnesses.

Seriously, the guy is smart, but when he's drinking, he really yaps and yaps and talks out of his butt. The only thing I can assume is that he meant to say that Dunta leads the team in picks, not sacks, but I don't even think that's true.
Click to expand...

Robinson is the Texans career leader in INTs.
 
houstonspartan said:
No, I'm not saying re-sign him now, I'm saying if he plays well again next year, would we have to do it after next season, which would be two years into his contract.

I'm not saying we should. Just thought I'd toss it out there. I believe we did something similar with Eric Winston.

I agree about being careful regarding his injury history.
Click to expand...

Winston was a third round pick & to some people he probably outplayed his contract.

Cushing won't outplay his first round contract. Impossible. The only way the Texans would re-do his contract, would be to restructure to help Salary Cap situations.

& we may not see that again.
 
DiehardChris said:
If Cushing was any bigger, they'd have to move him to DE!

MORE weight? C'mon, man!
Click to expand...

I know. He ain't built like any safety I've ever seen.

Adibi looks like a safety.

Demeco used to look like a safety.

Cushing looks like a badd ass LB.
 
Second Honeymoon said:
Can we rip up the contracts of players not earning it? No...
Click to expand...
Sure, they can. No one has a guaranteed contract (except maybe Mario). The Texans can rip up any contract and make that player a free agent. And this would be the year to do it, without taking a cap hit. Because, there isn't a salary cap this offseason.
 
Lucky said:
Sure, they can. No one has a guaranteed contract (except maybe Mario). The Texans can rip up any contract and make that player a free agent. And this would be the year to do it, without taking a cap hit. Because, there isn't a salary cap this offseason.
Click to expand...

Just for conversation's sake... would you happen to have a list of players you would cut, to take advantage of the situation?
 
thunderkyss said:
Just for conversation's sake... would you happen to have a list of players you would cut, to take advantage of the situation?
Click to expand...
I'd have already cut Kris Brown.

I would probably cut Andre Davis and Orlovsky, as well. They're not worth their contracts. Amobi Okoye is only making $765K, so I would keep him. But, I wouldn't just hand him a roster spot. Ok0ye hasn't earned his big $$$, but you can't take his bonus back.
 
thunderkyss said:
Just for conversation's sake... would you happen to have a list of players you would cut, to take advantage of the situation?
Click to expand...

I'll be surprised if Andre Davis is on the team next season and I know he has a couple years left on his contract. Other than that I don't think we are in bad shape with anyone. People might get cut but there's turnover on every roster every year.
 
Lucky said:
Sure, they can. No one has a guaranteed contract (except maybe Mario). The Texans can rip up any contract and make that player a free agent. And this would be the year to do it, without taking a cap hit. Because, there isn't a salary cap this offseason.
Click to expand...

i realize that, i guess i meant you just cant rip it up and not have to deal with the implications of that both $$ wise and salary cap wise. either way, you are right in that the NFL allows you to just cut someone under contract.
 
Cushing is going to be under his rookie contract at least a couple years. As a first rounder he is not under paid. No reason to rip it up especially with other players needing money. It would be a horrible move, no matter how good you think Cushing is.
 
thunderkyss said:
I know. He ain't built like any safety I've ever seen.

Adibi looks like a safety.

Demeco used to look like a safety.

Cushing looks like a badd ass LB.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I found the "small" talk quite humorous. DeMeco even said in an interview that when Cushing walked out the first practice that he was surprised how BIG this kid was.
 
Imagine what cushing wouldve done if he hadnt been semi injured for some of the season. He missed many practices because of his foot and ribs. Its scary to think of
 
Goatcheese said:
Robinson is the Texans career leader in INTs.
Click to expand...

With 6.

Man what I would give for us to have a true ballhawk in the secondary.
.
.
.
.
.

(Yes I know that 6 is not the actual total, I was making a point about how bad our secondary has been since.... well forever.)
 
thunderkyss said:
Winston was a third round pick & to some people he probably outplayed his contract.

Cushing won't outplay his first round contract. Impossible. The only way the Texans would re-do his contract, would be to restructure to help Salary Cap situations.

& we may not see that again.
Click to expand...

Thunder,

Great points. I forgot that Winston was a Third rounder. As others have said, Cush was a round one, which means that, at the end of the day, he's well paid.

Good points all around.
 
houstonspartan said:
That's what I was thinking. He's a good size. I acutally think he's big, fast and agile enough to possibly play safety. Though, he still needs to work on his footwork a bit.
Click to expand...

Are you sick, the one major improvement that Cushing needs to have is in the coverage area, god he got smoked a couple times this year by TE's and backs out of the backfield.
 
Second Honeymoon said:
no beef, just the fact that Asserley gave him a new contract way before it was prudent. they could have easily waited till the next year to make a new deal. they were just trying to reward someone that they thought was their future.
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To be fair (and accurate), CC was long gone by the time Davis was initially signed by the Texans, let alone when he got his current deal. Additionally, the new contract came because that initial deal was one year, not as a result of an early extension. The initial signing was great. The current deal, not so much. Both the good (bringing him here), and the bad (spending so much to keep him here) fall at the feet of the current regime.

But to another point, Davis is arguably the 4th or 5th WR on the roster, and while he's a competent kick returner, I don't recall much he did this season (or last for that matter) that can't be relatively easily replaced by a new less expensive addition. In fact, if you look at his kick return average, he was 48th in the NFL this year, and didn't make the top 50 in '08. Not exactly indispensable.

I think he'll be gone before next year regardless of what happens (or doesn't happen) with the salary cap.
 
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Ndevine7 said:
Imagine what cushing wouldve done if he hadnt been semi injured for some of the season. He missed many practices because of his foot and ribs. Its scary to think of
Click to expand...

I don't think we should be expecting a lot of seasons out of Cushing where he isn't banged up part of the year. It comes with the territory and it's the downside of how hard he plays. I think he'll usually be a little dinged up and the years where he isn't we should consider ourselves lucky.
 
ChampionTexan said:
To be fair (and accurate), CC was long gone by the time Davis was initially signed by the Texans, let alone when he got his current deal. Additionally, the new contract came because that initial deal was one year, not as a result of an early extension. The initial signing was great. The current deal, not so much. Both the good (bringing him here), and the bad (spending so much to keep him here) fall at the feet of the current regime.

But to another point, Davis is arguably the 4th or 5th WR on the roster, and while he's a competent kick returner, I don't recall much he did this season (or last for that matter) that can't be relatively easily replaced by a new less expensive addition. In fact, if you look at his kick return average, he was 48th in the NFL this year, and didn't make the top 50 in '08. Not exactly indispensable.

I think he'll be gone before next year regardless of what happens (or doesn't happen) with the salary cap.
Click to expand...

This is true but an "Asserly" has become a widespread term for a foolish or incompetent NFL front office exec of any kind and doesn't always refer just to Charlie Casserly. The only thing worse a GM can do in this league than "Pulling an Asserly" is the legendary and rarely seen "Landing a Full Millen"

In this instance Rick Smith appears to have pulled an asserly in signing Andre Davis to such a generous contract.
 
Hervoyel said:
This is true but an "Asserly" has become a widespread term for a foolish or incompetent NFL front office exec of any kind and doesn't always refer just to Charlie Casserly.
Click to expand...

I am unfamiliar with this usage of the term, and even as an avid (perhaps too avid) follower of this message board, do not recall a single instance of "Asserly"/"Asserley" utilized in the manner you describe. (Although now that you mention it, I think I might have heard Rich Eisen use it a couple of times on NFLTA) ;)
 
Hey, at least he didn't cave into Dunta's demands and land a Full Millen.

I'm maintaining a "Texans Fan Dictionary" with various sayings I see on the board. It's been slow but we've added a few this year. I should post it in a thread to ask for suggestions on terms I missed. Think I'll do that right now.
 
houstonspartan said:
LOL!!!!

Seriously, the guy is smart, but when he's drinking, he really yaps and yaps and talks out of his butt. The only thing I can assume is that he meant to say that Dunta leads the team in picks, not sacks, but I don't even think that's true.
Click to expand...

Im sorry to have to break it to you, but you're not talking about your friend, you're talking about me!
 
I actually think it would be alright if Cushing lost 5-10lbs. I think he plays fine (huge understatement) at his current weight, but being lighter should help his knees/ankles and general longevity. Also it seems he has power to spare in terms of breaking blocks and making tackles, so maybe we could see his coverage improve at 250.
 
ChampionTexan said:
To be fair (and accurate), CC was long gone by the time Davis was initially signed by the Texans, let alone when he got his current deal. Additionally, the new contract came because that initial deal was one year, not as a result of an early extension. The initial signing was great. The current deal, not so much. Both the good (bringing him here), and the bad (spending so much to keep him here) fall at the feet of the current regime.

But to another point, Davis is arguably the 4th or 5th WR on the roster, and while he's a competent kick returner, I don't recall much he did this season (or last for that matter) that can't be relatively easily replaced by a new less expensive addition. In fact, if you look at his kick return average, he was 48th in the NFL this year, and didn't make the top 50 in '08. Not exactly indispensable.

I think he'll be gone before next year regardless of what happens (or doesn't happen) with the salary cap.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I thought everyone was talking about Domanic Davis not Andre Davis. Yeah, Andre Davis was overpaid too but he was pretty coveted after doing so well in KR and spot duty as #2 WR when AJ went down and Walter became #1 WR.
 
Hervoyel said:
Hey, at least he didn't cave into Dunta's demands and land a Full Millen.

I'm maintaining a "Texans Fan Dictionary" with various sayings I see on the board. It's been slow but we've added a few this year. I should post it in a thread to ask for suggestions on terms I missed. Think I'll do that right now.
Click to expand...

Here are some other Texans fan terms for your ever-evolving dictionary

Fresno Tuck - Carr's pocket presence
HWSNBM - For those unable to utter DC's name
You Chris/Kris Brown'ed it - You choked
Denny's Menu - Kubiak's playsheet
Pink Soapers - Those disatisfied with .500 Kubiak
Sunshine Kids - Those satisfied with .500 Kubiak
Sausage Party - Vince's shirtless Patron-fest

There are many more so lets hear some other people's
 
houstonspartan said:
LOL!!!!

You know what, it was. And he's out of town, and due back in a few days and I'm going to nail him on it. And there were witnesses.

Seriously, the guy is smart, but when he's drinking, he really yaps and yaps and talks out of his butt. The only thing I can assume is that he meant to say that Dunta leads the team in picks, not sacks, but I don't even think that's true.
Click to expand...
Tell him he owes you $100 and when he denies it say "You have been wrong about everything else are you sure?"
 
kiwitexansfan said:
With 6.

Man what I would give for us to have a true ballhawk in the secondary.
.
.
.
.
.

(Yes I know that 6 is not the actual total, I was making a point about how bad our secondary has been since.... well forever.)
Click to expand...

It's ALMOST to the point that I'd like Earl Thomas to have a bad enough combine performance to have him drop to us...
 
houstonspartan said:
I'm burned out on the Kubiak saga. I'm even tired of hearing myself talk about it.

Let's talk some football. We can all agree that we have an exciting squad. I was thinking about Cushing. He's an amazing player. I don't want to jinx our boy, but if he plays next year like he did this year, 12 months from now we may have to rip up his contract, start all over, and re-sign him with an extension and a big-ass raise.

Also, a buddy of mine was saying that he thinks Cushing is going to be even better after he puts on what he calls "NFL weight." He was saying that linebackers tend to be small when they get into the NFL and that it takes a year for them to put on weight and adust.

I've never heard of that theory. My buddy knows football, but when he's had several beers (as he had when he was yakking about this) his football common sense sometimes goes out the window.

I, personally, think Cushing is a great size, and adding any more weight would slow him down.
Click to expand...


I don't think they'd be inclined to do that because he's not eligible for free agency until after his fourth year in the league. If there is no CBA in place then he won't be eligible until after his sixth year in the league. Besides, they didn't do it for Demeco or OD so I don't see them doing it for him. JMO
 
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