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Chris Myers is still our Center

7

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Watch the 3 TDs we scored in super slo-mo, and you will see that Myers did a good job overall.

On the TD run, Studdard and Dreessen were both blown up terribly, yet we can still score, with Leach ramming it up between Studdard and Myers, allowing the RB to go in on the inside of Leach.

On one of the TD catches, Myers blocked two guys in space, allowing AJ to walk into the endzone (with other guys doing their jobs well also).

On the other TD, Myers got help from Leach to give Schaub all the time in the world to throw the ball.

On the failed goal-line attempt, Studdard had inside position, but allowed his man to cut underneath him; that hindered Leach from moving his legs to drive after he was stopped cold. (Yes, the main thing here is that Leach was stopped cold behind the LOS.) Brisiel and Winston pushed a defender into the backfield, but the guy ended up behind the DT who was on Myers. This also made it hard for Myers and any other guy who came in and want to push Chris Brown into the endzone.
 
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The other thing is that if you wish to see Caldwell in there, I want to ask whether you have seen him play against the back up in the Saints game?

Do you know that he was owned the whole third quarter by the guy?

He played better in the fourth quarter at Guard, but still had many bad plays against a scrub.

In the Vikings game, he came in (4th qtr) and play at G against a 2nd yr back-up and performed poorly. (This backup's only tackle in his career was against the Lions.)
 
The Texans like to play with 2 or 3 guys leading our back. If any of them get plugged, we're screwed. If you're 3 inches away, why not just QB sneak it?
 
gtexan02 said:
The Texans like to play with 2 or 3 guys leading our back. If any of them get plugged, we're screwed. If you're 3 inches away, why not just QB sneak it?
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I have no idea. Maybe Kubiak remember the Steelers game from last year, when Schaub supposedly made the 4th down conversion, but the ref called it short! :gun:
 
76Texan said:
Watch the 3 TDs we scored in super slo-mo, and you will see that Myers did a good job overall.

On the TD run, Studdard and Dreessen were both blown up terribly, yet we can still score, with Leach ramming it up between Studdard and Myers, allowing the RB to go in on the inside of Leach.

On one of the TD catches, Myers blocked two guys in space, allowing AJ to walk into the endzone (with other guys doing their jobs well also).

On the other TD, Myers got help from Leach to give Schaub all the time in the world to throw the ball.

On the failed goal-line attempt, Studdard had inside position, but allowed his man to cut underneath him; that hindered Leach from moving his legs to drive after he was stopped cold. (Yes, the main thing here is that Leach was stopped cold behind the LOS.) Brisiel and Winston pushed a defender into the backfield, but the guy ended up behind the DT who was on Myers. This also made it hard for Myers and any other guy who came in and want to push Chris Brown into the endzone.
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The television announcers on the last play twice said "the center was pushed back". I am ok with Myers until it's 10 yards or less and then Caldwell (our big, strong center that everyone thought was great) should be in there. He was a 3rd round pick and outweighs Chris by 22 ounds.
 
gtexan02 said:
The Texans like to play with 2 or 3 guys leading our back. If any of them get plugged, we're screwed. If you're 3 inches away, why not just QB sneak it?
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"Yeah, the starting QB needs to carry the ball a whole lot more" signed Rex G.
 
I trust 76's word on this, I'm sure he's watched more game film than I have. I think Meyers is a pretty decent center, provided we're not asking him to do something we KNOW he can't do. It's like the OC calling up a QB draw play on 4th and 15. We all know Schaub isn't real mobile, just like we all know Meyers isn't the best at generating push or holding at the point of attack.

He's apparantly good at blocking in space and getting to the second level. Let's utilize our strengths instead of setting up the players for failure.
 
TimeKiller said:
76 + Chris Myers = Man love
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Can I get some of that?

I understand we didn't draft Chris Myers.... & I understand that he came from Denver... around here, that's two strikes against. But if you watch them play, no one on our offensive line does his job as well as, or as consistently as Chris Myers.

Yes, he gets tossed around by the likes of Pat Williams... but in that same game, Pitts was tossed more frequently than Myers..... but every body likes Pitts.

Duane Brown may be our second best OLman. He's still young... & he plays very well..... still makes mistakes in the running game.

Brisiel gets overpowered often.... but when he's on, he's on.

Pitts IMHO has only been good for us, when we pull him & use him as a lead blocker, running ahead of our RB. When we're running a plain old regular Zone play.... for some reason the play looks all combobulated when you get to him. Everybody wants to move to the left.... but he's sitting there standing his guy up... Can't move to the left, if the guy on the end isn't moving.

Studdard just sucks. & Winston is right there with him, pass blocking, run blocking..... LBs over power him, fat guys beat him to the edge. He plays over his feet, and he's usually lying on the ground at the end of the play.

IMHO, the people here that want Myers gone, are just as guilty of wanting their "favorites" in the game as Kubiak is..... Pitts, Studdard & Winston shouldn't be starting....

I know what people are going to say.. "but he got blew up here" , "but he got pushed back there" , "but.... "

No he didn't.

I'm not saying he doesn't get blown up. I'm saying if he took 65 snaps, 60 of them were very good. Everyone else on the OL has a much lower ratio than that. & yeah, that might be the problem, that our best OL can only put together 60 out of 65 snaps.... I won't deny that either.

Get rid of Studdard. Get rid of Winston.... then we'll be able to run like we want..... like Kubiak wants.
 
76Texan said:
On the failed goal-line attempt, Studdard had inside position, but allowed his man to cut underneath him; that hindered Leach from moving his legs to drive after he was stopped cold. (Yes, the main thing here is that Leach was stopped cold behind the LOS.) Brisiel and Winston pushed a defender into the backfield, but the guy ended up behind the DT who was on Myers. This also made it hard for Myers and any other guy who came in and want to push Chris Brown into the endzone.
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In the epic failure of a 1 yard run in the endzone not a single texan got any push on the DL, all of them allowed the cardinals to get underneath their pads and shove them straight up.

Our LT went for a cut block and ended up flopping into the endzone, too bad he didn't have the ball?

Again ultimately Kubiak knows that we can't run the ball, and have been ineffective the entire season at it, hell he even admitted that "wasted" the entire second half to get film to figure out why they can't run the ball. I have to wonder why he doesn't try something different like spreading the formation and trying to run with wider splits, and the defense spread out isn't that the whole basis of the ZBS?

Oh well.. oh epic fail for not having AJ on the field for the last run play are you )(*()$@)# kidding me?
 
HOU-TEX said:
:rolleyes: Good grief!

The interior of our line sucks. Myers is the center of suck.
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I know....the guy sucks ass.

I can't believe some people actually think he's the best offensive lineman on this team :rolleyes: What the hell can they possibly be looking at?

It's also funny to hear lines like, "I think Meyers is a pretty decent center" and then they follow that up with, "as long as we don't ask him to do something we know he can't do....like generate push or hold up at the point of attack." LMAO... Umm...can someone fill me in here??...what's the primary job of any NFL center? I mean I would love to hear of a NFL system that doesn't require a center to get push or hold up at the point of attack.. LOL, that one really cracked me up.
 
White was rotating w/Studdard not Myers which makes me beleive the coaching staff recognize room for improvement @ LG (which is position Caldwell should play IMO). back to Meyers didn't he have a high ankle sprain in training camp keeping him sidelined until the end of pre-season maybe they rushed him back to soon? If he can't push off enough or hold his ground he will be engulfed against bigger stronger nose tackles (more pronounced against the Jets). So I think Myers could be playing less than 100% but does not complain because its not his nature. The playcalling sucks in goal line situations, you have to get your best players on the field & spread the D otherwise Myers becomes the lightening rod :tinfoil: :lightning:
 
badboy said:
The television announcers on the last play twice said "the center was pushed back". I am ok with Myers until it's 10 yards or less and then Caldwell (our big, strong center that everyone thought was great) should be in there. He was a 3rd round pick and outweighs Chris by 22 ounds.
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The announcer only saw things right then and there, and of course, it was there.

But there were other things he (they) did not notice.

Watch the replay from the back of the end zone.

Notice where Brisiel was.
Notice where Winston was.

Then you can get a better picture of the play.

Yes, Myers was pushed initially, but he fought back.
It was Brisiel who turned the DT toward playside and into the pile.
Winston ended up on the goal line.
How the heck are you to cross the goal line with a guy lying rigth there?

Of course, the left side is more difficult to see, but what bad with our LG and LT were there as I had described.
 
Carr Bombed said:
I know....the guy sucks ass.

I can't believe some people actually think he's the best offensive lineman on this team :rolleyes: What the hell can they possibly be looking at?

It's also funny to hear lines like, "I think Meyers is a pretty decent center" and then they follow that up with, "as long as we don't ask him to do something we know he can't do....like generate push or hold up at the point of attack." LMAO... Umm...can someone fill me in here??...what's the primary job of any NFL center? I mean I would love to hear of a NFL system that doesn't require a center to get push or hold up at the point of attack.. LOL, that one really cracked me up.
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I was under the impression that our ZBS relied on offensive linemen getting to the second level and cut blocking to open up the run game.
 
The other thing is that I had reviewed all the offensive plays, and Myers was only PART of one drive-stopping play (beside this fail goal-line attempt).

It was in the first half on Slaton 3rd and 1 run at 5:12 to go in the half.
Myers, Winston, and OD were the culprits.

And that was it; unlike the other linemen.
 
buddyboy said:
I was under the impression that our ZBS relied on offensive linemen getting to the second level and cut blocking to open up the run game.
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That's not all zone lineman are required to do... Even ZB lineman have to line up in short yardage/goal line situations and get push up the middle and open up holes...even ZB lineman have to hold up against big physical tackles in pass protection...they required that in Denver (which is why Myers was let got for a 6th round pick, despite the fact that they're long time starter Tom Nalen was retiring) and it's also required here (which is the reason we've sucked in the redzone the last couple of years...the same time Myers has been starting at center).

Yes you need agile lineman in this scheme, but that doesn't mean you can also just throw pansies out there who get tossed around like rag dolls and expect to get by in the NFL. I don't care what "SYSTEM" you play in...NFL centers are required to be able to hold up at the point of attack and that's why I laugh my ass off every time someone says "Myers is decent, the coaching staff is just asking him to do things he struggles as....like getting push or holding up at the point of attack" WTF, That's his JOB, those are his MAIN duties as a NFL center lol.
 
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Chris Myers sucks. Wake up to reality.

This has been going on for like 3 seasons. We have NEVER had a good center. EVER.

Chris Myers is what he is. A backup who happens to be our starter. And why is anyone surprised when we fail time after time running on goal line?

Its not all Myers, Kubiak/Shanahan's short yardage playcalling is and always has been pathetic, but its obvious Myers sucks.
 
76Texan said:
The announcer only saw things right then and there, and of course, it was there.

But there were other things he (they) did not notice.

Watch the replay from the back of the end zone.

Notice where Brisiel was.
Notice where Winston was.

Then you can get a better picture of the play.

Yes, Myers was pushed initially, but he fought back.
It was Brisiel who turned the DT toward playside and into the pile.
Winston ended up on the goal line.
How the heck are you to cross the goal line with a guy lying rigth there?

Of course, the left side is more difficult to see, but what bad with our LG and LT were there as I had described.
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Ok, good info that leads to these questions. If Myers was pushed back and it took him a couple seconds to "fight back" where was the ball by then? I assume his "re-establishing his position" was too late. Question # 2, if FB had been given the ball would he have scored since he was lying on the ground in the end zone or would Leach have started further back and been stopped also?

LT Duane Brown 6'4" 329 lbs; LG Studdard 6'3" 300 lbs, Center Caldwell 6'3" 309 lbs RG Brisiel 6'5" 295 lbs, Winston 6'5" 285lbs, FB Leach 6'0 253 and Brown 6'3" 220 and we can't go 1/2 of a yard? Caldwell can't snap for one play? That still leaves two WRs to pull defense and a TE. Something is really wrong in Westworld.
 
76Texan said:
The announcer only saw things right then and there, and of course, it was there.

But there were other things he (they) did not notice.

Watch the replay from the back of the end zone.

Notice where Brisiel was.
Notice where Winston was.

Then you can get a better picture of the play.

Yes, Myers was pushed initially, but he fought back.
It was Brisiel who turned the DT toward playside and into the pile.
Winston ended up on the goal line.
How the heck are you to cross the goal line with a guy lying rigth there?

Of course, the left side is more difficult to see, but what bad with our LG and LT were there as I had described.
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Notice that Winston actually pushed Brisiel inside.
Look where Brisiel ended up.
He's the one at the bottom of the pile, OUTSIDE of the end zone, right in the back of the DT and Myers.

On the other side, notice how another D-lineman got underneath and inside of Studdard, crowding the running lane. He was almost directly in front of Leach. His inside shoulder was past Leach's mid-section. Where can Leach go?
 
badboy said:
Ok, good info that leads to these questions. If Myers was pushed back and it took him a couple seconds to "fight back" where was the ball by then? I assume his "re-establishing his position" was too late. Question # 2, if FB had been given the ball would he have scored since he was lying on the ground in the end zone or would Leach have started further back and been stopped also?

LT Duane Brown 6'4" 329 lbs; LG Studdard 6'3" 300 lbs, Center Caldwell 6'3" 309 lbs RG Brisiel 6'5" 295 lbs, Winston 6'5" 285lbs, FB Leach 6'0 253 and Brown 6'3" 220 and we can't go 1/2 of a yard? Caldwell can't snap for one play? That still leaves two WRs to pull defense and a TE. Something is really wrong in Westworld.
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LOL, it all happened in a flash. Leach was outside of the endzone (as I just posted in the above) due to Studdard's failure.

Actually, Leach was a little outside of the D-lineman who undercut Studdard, so he had to veered back inside.

And yes, he has a good chance to dive over that lineman into the endzone.
But since he veered inside to a little, we can't visualize that happening.

But yes, I would say if Leach got the ball, he had a good chance to cross the goal-line.
 
76Texan said:
Notice that Winston actually pushed Brisiel inside.
Look where Brisiel ended up.
He's the one at the bottom of the pile, OUTSIDE of the end zone, right in the back of the DT and Myers.

On the other side, notice how another D-lineman got underneath and inside of Studdard, crowding the running lane. He was almost directly in front of Leach. His inside shoulder was past Leach's mid-section. Where can Leach go?
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He went into the end zone.
 
badboy said:
He went into the end zone.
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You are talking about the 2nd and goal play.
Of course, it would have been a TD if Leach was handed the ball on that play.

Chris Brown was behind him, so in this case, the RB can push the big guy into the endzone!
 
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76Texan said:
You are talking about the 2nd and goal play.
Of course, it would have been a TD if Leach was handed the ball on that play.

Slaton was behind him, so in this case, the RB can push the big guy into the endzone!
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Brown was the RB
 
Anyway, back to the fourth down play.

Since Leach was stopped due to Studdard, Chris Brown had to veer further inside.

That's how Leach ended up trying to push Chris Brown into the endzone.
That ought to tell you that Myers had fought back.

If Winston and Brisiel were able to push #90 Dockett backward instead of allowing him to get to the inside, I would say it's a TD as well.

Remember, Dockett lined up between Brisiel and Winston.
It was terrible that these two guys can't do the job two-on-one.
 
badboy said:
Schaub pitches ball to Leach (as he did Slaton earlier in game) and Leach goes in with Brown pushing.
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Hey, I was calling for Leach from 2nd down on in that series. I think he would've punched it in eventually. I just didn't think he would've gotten it in if he had the ball on that 4th down play.
 
When i saw Leach get locked up, i was screaming for Chris Brown to jump over the pile. He would have made it. Everybody was locked up. This run is on Chris Brown for not making something happen.
 
If we had HHWNBN back in the fold he would've been able to leap over the trenches and get the game winning td!!! If he could do anything, he could QB sneak with the best in the business. We dont need to fix the line, just get a short yardage back like ocho stinko back in the game!!!

See: 2003 Texans/Jags home game!!!
 
HOU-TEX said:
Hey, I was calling for Leach from 2nd down on in that series. I think he would've punched it in eventually. I just didn't think he would've gotten it in if he had the ball on that 4th down play.
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You're right.
That can only happen if Studdard, D.Brown, and Dreessen can do a better job on this side.

It's just a series of unfortunate blockings.
On the other side, had Casey been able to do a better job on #78 or cut block him, that would have been a TD also.

In another word, the whole O-line sucked on that play, saved for O.D. who was too far out and was not involved.
 
TheRealJoker said:
If we had HHWNBN back in the fold he would've been able to leap over the trenches and get the game winning td!!! If he could do anything, he could QB sneak with the best in the business. We dont need to fix the line, just get a short yardage back like ocho stinko back in the game!!!

See: 2003 Texans/Jags home game!!!
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Yeah, I think it would take HHWNBN to be able to leap that far.
Chris Brown ain't gonna cut it! :headhurts:
 
The two guys who were better on the O-line, I would say, were Myers and D.Brown.

Winston and Brisiel, not so much.
I have to watch them again to decide between Studdard and White; I saw something good and something bad at that LG spot yesterday.
 
76Texan said:
You're right.
That can only happen if Studdard, D.Brown, and Dreessen can do a better job on this side.

It's just a series of unfortunate blockings.
On the other side, had Casey been able to do a better job on #78 or cut block him, that would have been a TD also.

In another word, the whole O-line sucked on that play, saved for O.D. who was too far out and was not involved.
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2of 3 are backups if that helps.
 
I noticed where Myers was on that 4th and 1...watching from wayyy behind the formation just like I was.
 
thunderkyss said:
Yes, he gets tossed around by the likes of Pat Williams and Jenkins and Dockett and the rookies playing for Tennathee and the guy from Jacksonville and will probably get killed by just about everyone he plays... but in that same game, Pitts was tossed more frequently than Myers..... but every body likes Pitts.
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Uh...at best I was a meh with Pitts. At least he had the frame and look of a legit NFL lineman.
Brisiel gets overpowered often.... but when he's on, he's on.
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I guess that's worth keeping
Studdard just sucks.
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Well it's good to see you aren't completely oblivious to suck.
I know what people are going to say.. "but he got blew up here" , "but he got pushed back there" , "but.... "

No he didn't.
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WTF? Yes he did. He got pushed back. That's the ****ing problem right there.
I'm not saying he doesn't get blown up. I'm saying if he took 65 snaps, 60 of them were very good..
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And 5 of them were on the Goalline and mofo couldn't push anyone or anything over it. L column plus 1, Myers ever looking strong column still 0.

Did you get some of what you were looking for?
 
I don't want to keep piling on Myers, but last night I noticed something during the MNF game. Jake Grove had a decent game against the Jets/Jenkins. He's listed at 6'4" 300 and Myers is listed at 6'4" 295. Take it FWIW.
 
HOU-TEX said:
I don't want to keep piling on Myers, but last night I noticed something during the MNF game. Jake Grove had a decent game against the Jets/Jenkins. He's listed at 6'4" 300 and Myers is listed at 6'4" 295. Take it FWIW.
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Myers didn't have a bad game against Jenkins.... he got posterized on one play, but other than that he had a good game.

But he also wasn't matched up against Jenkins one on one very often.

It's a misconception that's not very close to the truth. Jenkins abused us... but he played most of the game against someone other than Myers.
 
thunderkyss said:
Myers didn't have a bad game against Jenkins.... he got posterized on one play, but other than that he had a good game.

But he also wasn't matched up against Jenkins one on one very often.

It's a misconception that's not very close to the truth. Jenkins abused us... but he played most of the game against someone other than Myers.
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Ugh, believe what you want, TK. I've seen enough from him, Studdard and Brisiel to form my own opinion. My opinion is, they stink.
 
HOU-TEX said:
Ugh, believe what you want, TK. I've seen enough from him, Studdard and Brisiel to form my own opinion. My opinion is, they stink.
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& I can see how some would think what you think. My opinion... is based on what a ZB team is trying to do.... the way I understand it. Myers, Brisiel, & Brown gets that done on a more consistent basis.

Winston, Pitts, & Studdard don't.

If we were trying to be a power run team, I'd definitely put Pitts & Winston at the top of the list.

But we're not.
 
76Texan said:
And you opine to replace them with ???
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Personally, I'd give White and Caldwell both a shot at earning a spot. Obviously one of them will be stepping in for the injured Brisiel. Give the other a shot at C.

I just find it hard to believe that Myers is the best option we've got. It surely doesn't say much for Caldwell and White.
 
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