I Know it's too early.. But Davis vs Morency

Human Highlight Reel · May 3, 2005

Okay I know it's too early too really tell who is better.. but just for the sake of the thread let's just try to pick one..

I'mma go wit Morency, I've seen him play several times.. He has better field vision than Davis. Wit Zone Block I will always go wit the person wit the better vision.

Who do you think?

STEEL BLUE TEXANS · May 3, 2005

I think Morency takes the job some time in the middle of the season.

Human Highlight Reel · May 3, 2005

I can believe that..

Davis will start the season, but eventually Morency will be impressive when he does relieve Davis that in the middle of the season Davis will see a lot less carries as Morency slowly gets more and more carries and eventually is the Fulltime Starter next year.. when Davis will prolly seek a trade..

edo783 · May 3, 2005

Unless DD gets injured (highly likely) Morency will not be the starter, but rather a role player about mid year who gets 10-15 carries a game spelling DD. His hands are an unknown as well as blitz pick up skills, both of which are very important in our game.

El Tejano · May 3, 2005

DD has rushed for over 1,000 yards in each of his two seasons with the team, he also has quite a few rushing TDs. Morency has done none of that yet in the NFL so I am going with DD until Morency does otherwise.

Beastlyman2003 · May 3, 2005

What is the deal with these haters? DD has been one of two consistent productors on our young offense, the other being AJ. Why are all yall busters trying to disrespect or downplay all of DD accomplishments? NOW, yall are talking about getting rid of him? Good thing none of yall are the Texans GM. :brickwall :bomb:

:brickwall

wiley2002 · May 3, 2005

DD is on the verge of being the next Curtis Martin and people are chastising him for being injury prone. Fred Taylor was to and the Jags still have him.

Vinny · May 3, 2005

I think if you are gonna take the time to type wit.....why not add an 'h'? Chat language is all cool and stuff and I use it...but it makes reading posts...er, nevermind.

DD will start at first...get nicked up and run poorly like he always does when nicked up, Morency comes in, and never looks back.

Word, crunk, and all of dat, wit shizzle-dizzle

texasguy346 · May 3, 2005

Vinny said:
Word, crunk, and all of dat, wit shizzle-dizzle

I'm tempted to use that as my new signature, but I think Ali still wins out. That's a close second.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS · May 3, 2005

Vinny said:
DD will start at first...get nicked up and run poorly like he always does when nicked up, Morency comes in, and never looks back.

Word, crunk, and all of dat, wit shizzle-dizzle

Fo shizzle dizzle. Holla front

wags · May 3, 2005

Vinny said:
.DD will start at first...get nicked up and run poorly like he always does when nicked up, Morency comes in, and never looks back.

So does this mean you would not resign DD after this year?

Vinny · May 3, 2005

wags said:
So does this mean you would not resign DD after this year?

I give him a high tender and hope someone gives me a high pick for him. Otherwise he is my ideal 3rd down back/complimentary back/Kick returner.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS · May 3, 2005

Give DD the mid level tender (1st round pick compensation)

RiotCommander · May 3, 2005

I love DD, and I think we drafted another RB only because our backups were a joke. I think we could have gone a different direction with the pick, but I have to live with it so I honestly don't think they were looking for DD's replacement.

Dionysus22 · May 3, 2005

Vinny said:
I think if you are gonna take the time to type wit.....why not add an 'h'? Chat language is all cool and stuff and I use it...but it makes reading posts...er, nevermind.

DD will start at first...get nicked up and run poorly like he always does when nicked up, Morency comes in, and never looks back.

Word, crunk, and all of dat, wit shizzle-dizzle

Dude, you just made my day!! Hilarious!!

Lucky · May 3, 2005

Right now, Domanick is the complete back. He's had a year in the zone blocking scheme, he can pass block, he can catch, he's a good short yardage runner. He's the starter. Morency is a big ? in all of these areas. What Morency can do for this team is to take 8 -10 carries a game in the middle of the field (the way the Packers use Davenport) and lessen the load on Davis. Maybe then, DD's less likely to get nicked up so much.

No one gave a high pick this offseason to Alexander or James. No one will give up a high pick for Davis. Davis will be with the team at least until his UFA year of '07. Bring up the Davis vs Morency thread then. The next 2 seasons it will be Davis & Morency.

Vinny · May 3, 2005

Chester Taylor was signed by the Browns with a high RFA tender, but the Ravens matched.

wags · May 3, 2005

Vinny said:
I give him a high tender and hope someone gives me a high pick for him. Otherwise he is my ideal 3rd down back/complimentary back/Kick returner.

That shows a lot of faith in Morency. Morency is good, but still unproven at the NFL level.

Just wondering, but wouldn't DD hold out if he is given just a one-year tender?

Vinny · May 3, 2005

I'm not real big on DD and think he gets much of his yardage because teams lay back in cover-2's and don't bring up their safeties to stop him. If he holds out, I'm not going to cry.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS · May 3, 2005

Ravens gave Chester Taylor the low tender hoping no one would offer him a contract. The Browns offered him a 1 yr/3 million dollar contract that the Ravens eventually matched.

Lucky · May 3, 2005

Vinny said:
Chester Taylor was signed by the Browns with a high RFA tender, but the Ravens matched.

Where are you getting that info? If the Ravens hadn't matched, they would've received a 6th round pick from the Browns.

Notes Ravens RFA RB Chester Taylor signed a one-year, $3 million offer sheet with Cleveland, March 16. Baltimore matched the offer March 21, retaining Taylor rather than receiving a 2005 sixth-round draft choice from the Browns as compensation.

Link from PFW

Vinny · May 3, 2005

Baltimore Ravens restricted free agent running back Chester Taylor signed a $3 million offer sheet Wednesday with the Cleveland Browns. The Ravens have seven days under league rules to decide whether they want to match a contract that includes a $2 million base salary and a $1 million signing bonus, according to NFL Players' Association figures. If the Ravens opt not to match the offer, they would receive the Browns' sixth-round draft pick as compensation.

http://story.scout.com/a.z?s=117&p=2&c=360698

Lucky · May 3, 2005

wags said:
Just wondering, but wouldn't DD hold out if he is given just a one-year tender?

Not going into his UFA year. Sure, he'd like to get an extension from the Texans then. But he wouldn't risk losing his job right before he's looking at a $20 million contract.

infantrycak · May 3, 2005

Vinny said:
Chester Taylor was signed by the Browns with a high RFA tender, but the Ravens matched.

Taylor had a low tender and the Browns only would have had to give up a 6th rounder for him.

Link

Nevermind--hadn't read the rest of the thread.

It is primarily going to come down to injuries. DD stays healthy, and yes it can happen--Taylor has only missed 2 games in the last 3 years after being Fragile Fred, although it may have returned again--then DD remains the starter. If he gets more than dinged then Morency MAY get his shot. At this point we don't even know he will show enough blitz recognition and hands to be 2nd on the depth chart--he probably will, but how about we see him in training camp.

Hervoyel · May 3, 2005

I see these "Morency will take the job by mid-season" posts and I have to shake my head. Hollings was going to do that too remember?

Davis remains the starter I think. It's not like we brought in Brown, Benson, or Williams. We brought in Morency. DD's job is pretty safe IMO.

Injury of course changes everything.

Vinny · May 3, 2005

I thought Chester had a higher tender...but all the same, if the team wasn't worried about Dom long-term they use a second day pick instead of a first day pick on a RB for a 'compliment' since most of the backs were on the table when we picked in the 3rd round.

Lucky · May 3, 2005

Vinny said:
...if the team wasn't worried about Dom long-term they use a second day pick instead of a first day pick on a RB for a 'compliment' since most of the backs were on the table when we picked in the 3rd round.

Since we now know that 3rd round picks have a 30% chance at becoming starters, let's just say that Vernand has a 30% chance at becoming the Texans starting RB. Even Charley Casserly would say that's a fair statement.

Human Highlight Reel · May 3, 2005

look man ain't nobody's hating on DD, all i was asking is who do you think is gonna be our guy and why..

Now don't get me wrong I like DD, I even met the guy before good guy, but DD has proven to be sort of injury prone and once he gets injuried again Morency is gonna step in and do such a good job that we could use Davis as trade bait for maybe a 1st or 2nd round next year.. so we oculd have the RB we've been waiting for and an extra 1st or 2nd rounder next year.. that's all I'm saying..

MightyTExan · May 3, 2005

Greetings, everyone! Long time lurker, first time poster. Just wanted to say that I don't think I've seen this scenario the boards- but what if we're clearing up cap space to offer DD a huge contract? Would the front office have made him an offer by now?

texasguy346 · May 3, 2005

Human Highlight Reel said:
Now don't get me wrong I like DD, I even met the guy before good guy, but DD has proven to be sort of injury prone and once he gets injuried again Morency is gonna step in and do such a good job that we could use Davis as trade bait for maybe a 1st or 2nd round next year.. so we oculd have the RB we've been waiting for and an extra 1st or 2nd rounder next year.. that's all I'm saying..

It's a nice dream scenario, but I doubt we'd be able to get a 1st rounder for DD. Alexander and Edge weren't even able to garner a trade with a price tag of a 2nd round pick. If we found a team in desperate need of a RB they might give up a 2nd Rounder, but even that would be a stretch. In any event I think infantrycak brings up a good point.

infantrycak said:
If he gets more than dinged then Morency MAY get his shot. At this point we don't even know he will show enough blitz recognition and hands to be 2nd on the depth chart--he probably will, but how about we see him in training camp.

Guessing at things like this gives us something to do with our time during the long offseason, but it's just an endless debate until we see some action in training camp and the preseason.

Vinny · May 3, 2005

Lucky said:
Since we now know that 3rd round picks have a 30% chance at becoming starters, let's just say that Vernand has a 30% chance at becoming the Texans starting RB. Even Charley Casserly would say that's a fair statement.

Charley's pie charts are popping up everywhere.

TheOgre · May 3, 2005

Hollings is fastly becoming a forgotten man. I hope we give him this season to show his stuff.

TexansJunkE · May 3, 2005

STEEL BLUE TEXANS said:
Give DD the mid level tender (1st round pick compensation)

what makes you think we can get a first rounder for him if nobody wanted to give a 1st for Alexander or James, who are franchise backs who can do everything?

Vinny · May 3, 2005

Market drives many of these situations. Much of the value in the player lies in the market. If 2005 has tons of RB injuries this glut can thin in a hurry.

TexansJunkE · May 3, 2005

true, but DD is not a 1st round pick

texasguy346 · May 3, 2005

Vinny said:
Market drives many of these situations. Much of the value in the player lies in the market. If 2005 has tons of RB injuries this glut can thin in a hurry.

That's very true, but teams in need of a RB could look to the draft for help rather than give up a 1st or 2nd Round pick on DD. Miami opted not to go after Edge/Alexander/Henry and looked to the draft to pick up Brown. They were a team in desperate need of a RB. If tons of injuries happen to RBs this season then it would be a good time to be a surgeon. They'd be :drool:

over the thoughts of all that money they'd make.

infantrycak · May 3, 2005

TexansJunkE said:
what makes you think we can get a first rounder for him if nobody wanted to give a 1st for Alexander or James, who are franchise backs who can do everything?

The situations are just very different. DD is 24 and making $380k ($497 on the cap). Teams would be looking to sign him to a $2.0 to $3.5 mil per year contract.

Alexander is 28 and James is 27 and were #2 and #4 in the league last year and want contracts like LT and Portis got last year--players Alexander and James can claim they outperformed. The signing bonuses on those contracts are only palitable because they are long 6 or 7 year deals. So two huge questions--philosophically does the team believe in paying that kind of money for RB's and will Alexander and James play until they are 34-35?

IMO DD would have to go 1400 yds+ next year for anyone to be interested in giving up a 1st, but another 1200-1300 yd season and I could see a team that thought their OL was better giving up a 2nd for him.

ATX · May 3, 2005

morency still has to beat out wells and hollings before he can replace DD. my question is do we go with 3 or 4 RBs this season?

BornOrange · May 3, 2005

I don't know if Morency is going to take over for Davis or not, but I do know that he will start at least one game this year.

I don't think Davis has ever lasted a whole year in football without missing a game due to injury.

That's a 10 year track record of high school, college, and pro football.

michaelm · May 3, 2005

texasguy346 said:
It's a nice dream scenario, but I doubt we'd be able to get a 1st rounder for DD. Alexander and Edge weren't even able to garner a trade with a price tag of a 2nd round pick.

I don't think that we'd be able to get a first rounder either, but the Edge/Alexander comparison is inaccurate. The reason no team would give up a 2nd rounder for one of these guys has more to do with the size of their current contracts than the value of the draft pick. The wild card with DD is that his contract is certainly reasonable given his production to date.

Having said all that, I still agree with you that a 1st rounder is out of the question...

texasguy346 · May 3, 2005

As I stated right after that we'd have to find a team in desperate need for a chance at getting a 2nd Round pick.

texasguy346 said:
It's a nice dream scenario, but I doubt we'd be able to get a 1st rounder for DD. Alexander and Edge weren't even able to garner a trade with a price tag of a 2nd round pick. If we found a team in desperate need of a RB they might give up a 2nd Rounder, but even that would be a stretch.

DD is affordable, but then so is a rookie RB from the 06 Draft. It all depends on the team, and what sort of value they'd place on DD. While next year's draft isn't as deep at RB it certainly has some very good prospects such as Bush, Maroney, Washington, or Williams that would be intriguing to any team in need of a RB.

Ouch! I quoted myself. My ego is about to burst. :bomb:

Lucky · May 3, 2005

michaelm said:
...The wild card with DD is that his contract is certainly reasonable given his production to date.

My rebuttal to that line of thinking is...

If DD's contract request will be so reasonable, why wouldn't the Texans sign him? The reasons guys make it to RFA without contracts are a) theyre asking for big contracts or b) the team that drafts them don't want them anymore. Unless something happens to Davis over the course of next season, I think the Texans will want him back. Rudi Johnson signed a 5 year, $26 million contract with the Bengals this offseason (with $12 mil guaranteed). That's the likely neighborhood Domanick will try to move into. Is a team going to give up a $25 million contract & a 1st round pick as compensation? No one offered that deal to Brian Westbrook & the Eagles this offseason. No one will offer that deal to Davis and the Texans next offseason.

michaelm · May 3, 2005

Lucky said:
My rebuttal to that line of thinking is...

If DD's contract request will be so reasonable, why wouldn't the Texans sign him?

Is a team going to give up a $25 million contract & a 1st round pick as compensation? No one offered that deal to Brian Westbrook & the Eagles this offseason. No one will offer that deal to Davis and the Texans next offseason.

To be fair, I repeatedly said that a first rounder is out of the question...
I was mainly pointing out that the Edge/Alexander comparison was not a good one.
I don't think we should/could realistically trade DD, because any suiter is likely to want a new contract in place with him before making a move.
Anyway, it's FAR too early to be talking trade about DD. It sure is a sign of how little respect he gets around here that the subject keeps coming up.
I, for one, hope he continues his level of performance and shuts his critics up (even though I was for drafting one of the big three RBS if he fell to us...).

infantrycak · May 3, 2005

michaelm said:
I don't think we should/could realistically trade DD, because any suiter is likely to want a new contract in place with him before making a move.

Having a new contract in place is part of the RFA process. The Texans pick one of three tender levels--high (1st and 3rd round compensation), mid (1st round), low (original draft round, in DD's case 4th). Other teams are then free to meet with DD and try to work out a deal with him. IF they come to terms, they can either (a) hold off on signing an offer sheet and negotiate something less in trade than the standard rates above for the tenders, or (b) sign him to an offer sheet. If they sign him to an offer sheet the Texans have 7 days to decide whether or not to match the offer sheet. If they do, DD is still a Texan with a contract he worked out with the other team. If they do not, DD goes to the new team with his new contract and the Texans get compensated according to the tender.

Texan Dave · May 3, 2005

Hulk75 said:
if dd had break away speed he would be the best in the league! maybe this guy is a little faster.............I like DD though.

DD vs VM............ during training camp

VM runs a 4.6 in the 40, I seriously doubt you'll see break away speed in him.
Also didn't DD bust a 40+ yard touchdown last year?? you have to be pretty fast to do that in the NFL. It's not the whole feild like Coleman, but still a pretty long run for an NFL runningback.

You also have to remember, everyone in the NFL draft was good in college. VM could also turn out to be a Leland McElroy, except slower.

outofhnd · May 3, 2005

If DD doesnt have breakaway speed then why was has he been a return man? He was in college and was brought in to possibly be a return man on special teams and a backup RB, until he did extremely well.

Its way to early to tell if Morency is a challenger or someone that maybe we can count on to stay healthy and provide quality rest for DD. Maybe we can run a fullhouse backfield with Morency, DD, and Norris. Or the Wishbone.

trutexan02 · May 3, 2005

What's all this talking about getting rid of DD. How is this even a topic of converstion? In case none of you have noticed Houston has the pieces t o win, they are simply adding depth ond youth. DD's job is safe... period. Wells did a fine job in his place when he went down. DD still winsout in the end and keeps running. Besides you all act like DD is the focal point of our offense. What are you thinking? In the off season everyone was talking about drafting to protect Carr (pass blocking anyone?) No one said "they need to beef up their running game" Come on! Davis is doing exactly what he's supposed to do. Gain 80- 115 yards to make defenses play honest enough Carr can go down the field to Johnson. Morency is (if anything) Hollings replacement. Any one remember his reoccuring stints on the injury list?
Kill the Debate, there is none.

jacquescas · May 4, 2005

DD doesn't have any option but the tender i think. he can get 1 of 3 or 4 levels, we will probably give him one of the 2 highest.

TexansNeedRBin05 · May 4, 2005

Beastlyman2003 said:
What is the deal with these haters? DD has been one of two consistent productors on our young offense, the other being AJ. Why are all yall busters trying to disrespect or downplay all of DD accomplishments? NOW, yall are talking about getting rid of him? Good thing none of yall are the Texans GM. :brickwall :brickwall

I think getting his a** driven back 5 yds is hardly an "accomplishment" :drool:

As far as my take on it my motto is "Anyone better than DD" I may change this later but lets see what the young gun can do.

royce1054 · May 4, 2005

Well i think DD will start the season. Then Hollings will be the backup and Wells getting some light duty. Morrency to me will have his situations where he will come in. I think if DD starts fumbling like he did last year by game 3 or 4 i think he will flip to the 3rd down back and we will see Hollings start and Morrency getting more work. I just think it depends on how well DD plays. I hope he plays good and we can give Morrency a good 1 year learning curve. I also think that 1 of the 3 DD, Hollings, or Wells wont be back next year so this is another good way of finding out.

I Know it's too early.. But Davis vs Morency

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