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Brandon Flowers?

Goldensilence

Goldensilence

hipster elite
I keep seeing his name starting to pop up as high riser at CB.

Saw in Lance Z's Mock he scratched out Cason whom I have penciled in as a 1st rounder in his favor. I admit I've seen Flowers play a few times and I like his game. But I dunno if he's got 1st round talent.

Was hoping a few of the gurus around here would share their thoughts and insight.
 
PHAROAH said:
No way guys on flowers.
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Care to explain?

I love all the certainty of draft talk. I remember how certain soooo many people were that Charles Rogers was going to be a star and AJ just ok. Someone needs to tell Dunta he is too small to play in the NFL as more than a NB as well.
 
Flowers could be a solid pick, but I want to see what he does at the combine. As far as his playing ability, his stats are ideal and he's got good size. As of right now I'm iffy, but give it a month and I'll probably think more of it.
 
Not sure if Lance & his source had this idea in mind but I see Flowers having potential to play both CB & FS. thats good value & addresses vital needs :)
 
He is a solid player but he isn't a 1st round pick from what I have seen from him, now we are reaching for need.
 
PHAROAH said:
He is a solid player but he isn't a 1st round pick from what I have seen from him, now we are reaching for need.
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Mike Mayock would also disagree with this assesment. He seems to think he is the 2nd best CB behind Leodis. I am not saying he is right but hearing information from a PRo scout through LZ's blog and Mike Mayock tends to sway me to Flowers being a good option at our pick instead of your statement that it's a reach pick.

When did you see him? One game this year? Again, I am not saying you are wrong but I would like to hear actual examples.
 
Brandon Flowers is probably in the Top 3 of most well rounded corners in this draft. I've been talking about this guy since the middle of the season. His big strength is his physicality. He is a very good tackler, and was a key part of that great VTech defense this year. Flowers does a great job on short routes. Stops, short outs, and slants are all routes he does very well against. His weakness in coverage is his deep speed. When he is forced to turn out of his backpedal and run early in the play he struggles a bit.

Overall, Flowers should be a 2nd round pick. We shouldnt take him in the first, and we won't be able to select him in the 3rd.
 
bigbrewster2000 said:
Mike Mayock would also disagree with this assesment. He seems to think he is the 2nd best CB behind Leodis. I am not saying he is right but hearing information from a PRo scout through LZ's blog and Mike Mayock tends to sway me to Flowers being a good option at our pick instead of your statement that it's a reach pick.

When did you see him? One game this year? Again, I am not saying you are wrong but I would like to hear actual examples.
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Just because one scout like his technique you think he is the 2nd best corner in the draft What about Rodgers-Cromartie, Mike Jenkins, Aqib Talib & Patrick Lee? I am looking at this scouts page and he is ranked 9th!!!! so everyone has there opinion and I have seen him play in multiple games he is a late 2nd or 3rd pick IMO. So to me and other scouts he is a HUGE reach at 18th in round #1. I think a lot guys on hear are consumed with the notion the Texans will take a cornerback in RD #1 I doubt that very seriously and i think that they will take either mendenhall or stewart and bet you believe that Darren Mcfadden will drop to #20 like mike Mayoch said too?



1. Leodis McKelvin Troy 5-11 190 4.45
2. Mike Jenkins South Florida 6-0 200 4.50
3. Aqib Talib Kansas 6-2 205 4.55
4. Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie Tennessee St. 6-2 170 4.45
5. Patrick Lee Auburn 6-0 201 4.45
6. Tracy Porter Indiana 5-11 185 4.40
7. Charles Godfrey Iowa 6-1 208 4.40
8. Justin King Penn St. 6-0 186 4.40
9. Brandon Flowers Virginia Tech 5-10 200 4.50
10. Antoine Cason Arizona 6-0 185 4.55
11. Trae Williams South Florida 5-10 185 4.40
12. Jack Ikegwuonu Wisconsin 6-1 193 4.50
13. Terrell Thomas USC 6-1 195 4.45
14. Terrence Wheatley Colorado 5-10 185 4.45
15. DeJuan Tribble Boston College 5-9 190 4.45
16. Chevis Jackson L.S.U. 6-0 190 4.60



:aggressive: :bat:
 
PHAROAH said:
Just because one scout like his technique you think he is the 2nd best corner in the draft What about Rodgers-Cromartie, Mike Jenkins, Aqib Talib & Patrick Lee? I am looking at this scouts page and he is ranked 9th!!!! so everyone has there opinion and I have seen him play in multiple games he is a late 2nd or 3rd pick IMO. So to me and other scouts he is a HUGE reach at 18th in round #1. I think a lot guys on hear are consumed with the notion the Texans will take a cornerback in RD #1 I doubt that very seriously and i think that they will take either mendenhall or stewart and bet you believe that Darren Mcfadden will drop to #20 like mike Mayoch said too?



1. Leodis McKelvin Troy 5-11 190 4.45
2. Mike Jenkins South Florida 6-0 200 4.50
3. Aqib Talib Kansas 6-2 205 4.55
4. Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie Tennessee St. 6-2 170 4.45
5. Patrick Lee Auburn 6-0 201 4.45
6. Tracy Porter Indiana 5-11 185 4.40
7. Charles Godfrey Iowa 6-1 208 4.40
8. Justin King Penn St. 6-0 186 4.40
9. Brandon Flowers Virginia Tech 5-10 200 4.50
10. Antoine Cason Arizona 6-0 185 4.55
11. Trae Williams South Florida 5-10 185 4.40
12. Jack Ikegwuonu Wisconsin 6-1 193 4.50
13. Terrell Thomas USC 6-1 195 4.45
14. Terrence Wheatley Colorado 5-10 185 4.45
15. DeJuan Tribble Boston College 5-9 190 4.45
16. Chevis Jackson L.S.U. 6-0 190 4.60



:aggressive: :bat:
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somewhere in here are the Senior bowl weigh ins....I believe it stated that DRC was up to 183 . I've also seen where he will run in the four threes.

Jack Ikegwuonu: I also posted that Jack blew out his knee a couple of weeks ago (end of January) in a work out...he's liable to go from a frist day prospect to undrafted.

Tribble looked lost durring the Senior bowl week. Every one owned him. Goin' by the Tony Ugoh line, I guess that makes him a sure third rounder and lock for a blue chip starter in the NFL.

Just my knee jerk, a lot of these times are guesses. We'll see next week.

I think Flowers tackles very well and is use to an aggresive D scheme. Which I believe is exactly what the Texans have looked for in the past for a Cb. He fits. Lowery doesn't. Gotta be able to support the run on the Texan's defense.


http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/players.php?genpos=CB&draftyear=2008&sortorder=tsxpos&order=ASC


.
 
bigbrewster2000 said:
Mike Mayock would also disagree with this assesment. He seems to think he is the 2nd best CB behind Leodis. I am not saying he is right but hearing information from a PRo scout through LZ's blog and Mike Mayock tends to sway me to Flowers being a good option at our pick instead of your statement that it's a reach pick.

When did you see him? One game this year? Again, I am not saying you are wrong but I would like to hear actual examples.
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PHAROAH said:
Just because one scout like his technique you think he is the 2nd best corner in the draft What about Rodgers-Cromartie, Mike Jenkins, Aqib Talib & Patrick Lee? I am looking at this scouts page and he is ranked 9th!!!! so everyone has there opinion and I have seen him play in multiple games he is a late 2nd or 3rd pick IMO. So to me and other scouts he is a HUGE reach at 18th in round #1. I think a lot guys on hear are consumed with the notion the Texans will take a cornerback in RD #1 I doubt that very seriously and i think that they will take either mendenhall or stewart and bet you believe that Darren Mcfadden will drop to #20 like mike Mayoch said too?


1. Leodis McKelvin Troy 5-11 190 4.45
2. Mike Jenkins South Florida 6-0 200 4.50
3. Aqib Talib Kansas 6-2 205 4.55
4. Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie Tennessee St. 6-2 170 4.45
5. Patrick Lee Auburn 6-0 201 4.45
6. Tracy Porter Indiana 5-11 185 4.40
7. Charles Godfrey Iowa 6-1 208 4.40
8. Justin King Penn St. 6-0 186 4.40
9. Brandon Flowers Virginia Tech 5-10 200 4.50
10. Antoine Cason Arizona 6-0 185 4.55
11. Trae Williams South Florida 5-10 185 4.40
12. Jack Ikegwuonu Wisconsin 6-1 193 4.50
13. Terrell Thomas USC 6-1 195 4.45
14. Terrence Wheatley Colorado 5-10 185 4.45
15. DeJuan Tribble Boston College 5-9 190 4.45
16. Chevis Jackson L.S.U. 6-0 190 4.60



:aggressive: :bat:
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Thanks for actually reading my post. I dont live and breath what Mike Mayock has to say. If you had actually paid attention to what I said instead of getting you panties in a wad about it, you wouldnt be making that smart @$$ comment. Which site did you get that list from? Is it actually a scout or just a draft site? I would like to see a link.
 
bigbrewster2000 said:
Thanks for actually reading my post. I dont live and breath what Mike Mayock has to say. If you had actually paid attention to what I said instead of getting you panties in a wad about it, you wouldnt be making that smart @$$ comment. Which site did you get that list from? Is it actually a scout or just a draft site? I would like to see a link.
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First off I'm a grown man and I don't wear womens under wear and it wasn't a smart ass comment I was just pointing out what you stated about Mike Mayoch was swaying your opinion towards taking Brandon Flowers in the 1st Round. and at best he is a low 2nd to high 3rd round pick and makes no since at #18 in the first round.
 
PHAROAH said:
Just because one scout like his technique you think he is the 2nd best corner in the draft What about Rodgers-Cromartie, Mike Jenkins, Aqib Talib & Patrick Lee? I am looking at this scouts page and he is ranked 9th!!!!
Click to expand...

bigbrewster2000 said:
Which site did you get that list from? Is it actually a scout or just a draft site? I would like to see a link.
Click to expand...

Settle down, guys. Let's wait until the combine is over before becoming so testy. :)

Actually Pharoah, I wouldn't mind seeing a link to your corner list. Unless, that's just your own list. What I'm seeing is that a) there's a lot of varied opinion on this group of corners and b) this is a pretty deep draft class at CB. There may not be one guy who separates himself from the group.

Some of these CBs are better at press coverage, others have better ball skills and would flourish in zone coverage. There are corners with good recovery speed, and corners who can come up and hit. It will really depend on what team is making the pick as to where these CBs fall in the draft. And, I can't honestly say what attribute the Texans hold most desirous in a CB.

I like Mike Mayock as a draft analyst. Like the great Mel Kiper (;)), he voices his opinion very strongly. But, he seems to me more technically informative. Still, Mayock isn't perfect (he was on the Reggie Bush is God train), and will make mistakes. Like any other draft guru, he's just a data point for NFL draft geeks.
 
infantrycak said:
Care to explain?

I love all the certainty of draft talk. I remember how certain soooo many people were that Charles Rogers was going to be a star and AJ just ok. Someone needs to tell Dunta he is too small to play in the NFL as more than a NB as well.
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Yeah, no kidding. And Demeco sliding to the second round because he wasn't quite fast enough or big enough to be a first round pick. :)
 
Lucky said:
Settle down, guys. Let's wait until the combine is over before becoming so testy. :)

Actually Pharoah, I wouldn't mind seeing a link to your corner list. Unless, that's just your own list. What I'm seeing is that a) there's a lot of varied opinion on this group of corners and b) this is a pretty deep draft class at CB. There may not be one guy who separates himself from the group.

Some of these CBs are better at press coverage, others have better ball skills and would flourish in zone coverage. There are corners with good recovery speed, and corners who can come up and hit. It will really depend on what team is making the pick as to where these CBs fall in the draft. And, I can't honestly say what attribute the Texans hold most desirous in a CB.

I like Mike Mayock as a draft analyst. Like the great Mel Kiper (;)), he voices his opinion very strongly. But, he seems to me more technically informative. Still, Mayock isn't perfect (he was on the Reggie Bush is God train), and will make mistakes. Like any other draft guru, he's just a data point for NFL draft geeks.
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Your Right and I will add the link to the draft site and I think that Mike Mayock is much better at evaulating talent than Kiper but I disagree on the cornerback he referenced going at #18. :cool:


http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/sub/rankings.html
 
Lucky said:
Some of these CBs are better at press coverage, others have better ball skills and would flourish in zone coverage. There are corners with good recovery speed, and corners who can come up and hit. It will really depend on what team is making the pick as to where these CBs fall in the draft.
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this is true every year.

Lucky said:
And, I can't honestly say what attribute the Texans hold most desirous in a CB.
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I'm a little surprised with this remark? Most all of us look to you for the inside scoop, cut through the rhetoric & crap telling us excatly who/what the Texans real plans are.

Lucky said:
I like Mike Mayock as a draft analyst. Like the great Mel Kiper (;)), he voices his opinion very strongly. But, he seems to me more technically informative. Still, Mayock isn't perfect (he was on the Reggie Bush is God train), and will make mistakes. Like any other draft guru, he's just a data point for NFL draft geeks.
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sounds like a lot of us on this board doesn't it but we all still like each other right :thisbig:
 
maybe not....oh well :specnatz:

returning to football talk, Flowers is an interesting pick. I've stated numerous times he is an excellent FS prospect & can play CB in cover 2. Its been well documented Rhodes likes his corners to play off & keep the play in front of them in prevent mode, force mistakes/turnovers, aggressive in run support & excell in blitz situations. Flowers should grade high here, maybe higher than most others.

@ this point I don't see the need to be concerned with Brandons value or placement. he does have the ability to help this team in a major area of concern however & could fit in beautifully with scheme & personel. these are the factors that come into play leading up to the draft in the final weeks. right now everything is dicatated by skill assesment, tools, team needs now & into future. when they put the puzzle together don't be shocked if somebody unfamilar rises up like Mario Williams did two years ago, despite being touted right here on this board (MorKnolle) as the pick.

I'm not ready to call out just anyone as the logical pick (well except for Mendenhall, McKelvin, Clady) rather there is enough to at least consider Brandon Flower a viable propsect for :logo:
 
PHAROAH said:
First off I'm a grown man and I don't wear womens under wear and it wasn't a smart ass comment I was just pointing out what you stated about Mike Mayoch was swaying your opinion towards taking Brandon Flowers in the 1st Round. and at best he is a low 2nd to high 3rd round pick and makes no since at #18 in the first round.
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I was not intending on coming off as testy however I was not simply basing my opinion squarely on what Mike Mayock said, I simply found it interesting that LZ had info from a Pro Scout that matched up with what Mayock said. So my swaying came from 2 people that probably know more than I do about the players in this draft. And if 2 guys are telling me something I would tend to be swayed their way over 1 guy saying something else.

I guess my biggest irritation was that it didnt look like you really read my posts fully.

It doesnt really matter anyway because I want Mendenhall.:)

Well really just want the best guy thats available but I would definantly be happy about him in a Texans uni.
 
macho harris was the better corner of those 2 IMO.. More speed & versatility, same aggression & ball skills. Having said that though, i'd be fine if they picked up flowers at some point.
 
bigbrewster2000 said:
I was not intending on coming off as testy however I was not simply basing my opinion squarely on what Mike Mayock said, I simply found it interesting that LZ had info from a Pro Scout that matched up with what Mayock said. So my swaying came from 2 people that probably know more than I do about the players in this draft. And if 2 guys are telling me something I would tend to be swayed their way over 1 guy saying something else.
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The funny thing is that those two guys were probably swayed by the opinion of someone else.

Mr teX said:
macho harris was the better corner of those 2 IMO.. More speed & versatility, same aggression & ball skills. Having said that though, i'd be fine if they picked up flowers at some point.
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Possibly. Harris was only a sophomore last year so it may be another two years before we are talking about him for the draft. I think Harris benefited more from playing on the other side of Flowers than vice versa.

Brandon Flowers was a good player for Virginia Tech and probably will be a good pro when it is all said and done, but I do not think he is worth our #18 pick and probably will not be a first rounder. You've got Mike Jenkins, Aqib Talib, Leodis McKelvin, and Antone Cason all rated higher than him on most people's boards. Then you have the guys like Dominque Rodgers-Cromartie, and Reggie Smith who will most likely impress at the combine. Those two are rated right there with him if not higher in my book. After that you have Charles Godfrey, Patrick Lee, Trae Williams, Terrell Thomas, Tracy Porter, Dwight Lowery, Chevis Jackson, etc. There are alot of solid guys there. Brandon Flowers is going to have to do some serious impressing at the Combine and at the Virginia Tech Pro Day if he wants to be selected on the first day, much less in the first round.
 
Hey, I like DB's who'll lay the wood and given the video I just saw, I wouldn't mind seeing Flowers on our team.

Since I don't watch a bunch of college football, I usually use write-up from .coms like FootballsFuture to make my opinion. I couldn't find much on this guy. So other then the video, I can't say much.
 
TexansSeminole said:
The funny thing is that those two guys were probably swayed by the opinion of someone else.



Possibly. Harris was only a sophomore last year so it may be another two years before we are talking about him for the draft. I think Harris benefited more from playing on the other side of Flowers than vice versa.

Brandon Flowers was a good player for Virginia Tech and probably will be a good pro when it is all said and done, but I do not think he is worth our #18 pick and probably will not be a first rounder. You've got Mike Jenkins, Aqib Talib, Leodis McKelvin, and Antone Cason all rated higher than him on most people's boards. Then you have the guys like Dominque Rodgers-Cromartie, and Reggie Smith who will most likely impress at the combine. Those two are rated right there with him if not higher in my book. After that you have Charles Godfrey, Patrick Lee, Trae Williams, Terrell Thomas, Tracy Porter, Dwight Lowery, Chevis Jackson, etc. There are alot of solid guys there. Brandon Flowers is going to have to do some serious impressing at the Combine and at the Virginia Tech Pro Day if he wants to be selected on the first day, much less in the first round.
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I think he'd be a solid pick up either way, just not in the 1st round. IMO whomever we get i don't feel they have to be shut down just b/c of the way we're building this team (pass rush 1st), just aggressive & fast enough to be able to make plays on the ball. He's already aggressive (like most VT DB's) so the wildcard will be how he runs & his technique. i think he might be okay in the latter but his speed......
 
I really like most of these Corners that should be had in the 1st and early 2nd rounds. I'm looking forward to the combine coming up this weekend- I believe the DB's are the last to perform (sat. or sun)???

I think all these guys are games and would instantly improve our team. A talent like Mendenhall would be hard to pass. I'll be really paying attention to the CB's drills (not so much the 40) but the short shuttle, closing speed, hip turn, change of direction, arm length, vertical jump, etc that is more vital to the position.

Again, I think all these guys are gamers and would love to draft a guy like Fred Bennett but in round 1,2,or 3. I think Smith is going to be creative...
 
Flowers will play CB, not safety and you will start to hear his name mentioned more and more and more. He is a good tackler with good speed and above average ball skills. Some people think he's the 2nd best CB in this draft. Mike Jenkins is the one who teams are starting to sour on a little. "It only takes one", but I think Jenkins will still be on the board at 18 and the Texans will pass on him if he's there.

The Texans might also pass on Flowers if he is there because he has some red flag issues regarding character that might knock him off their board.
 
Ole Miss Texan said:
Just watching NFL Network...

Mayock just made Brandon Flowers his #1 CB and said he was a Top Ten pick.
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Which is funny because he has Leodis McKelvin as a top ten overall player, the only CB on that list. And he thinks McFaddin is overrated and should not be picked before #20.
 
painekiller said:
Which is funny because he has Leodis McKelvin as a top ten overall player, the only CB on that list. And he thinks McFaddin is overrated and should not be picked before #20.
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Mayock's rankings are almost always different than the norm.

He's just like everyone else, misses on some, hits on some.
 
Mayock is not saying, "the way the draft should unfold" but how well "the prospects pan out once in the NFL"? thats the distinction, plus he's not one of those who talks to GM's about their preferences or is connected that way like Kiper or even our own John McClain :rofl:
 
beerlover said:
Mayock is not saying, "the way the draft should unfold" but how well "the prospects pan out once in the NFL"? thats the distinction, plus he's not one of those who talks to GM's about their preferences or is connected that way like Kiper or even our own John McClain :rofl:
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He does his home work & doesn't rely on GM & newapaper gossip like the other so called experts. IMO he is the best in the business. All GM's are liars around draft time.
 
steelbtexan said:
He does his home work & doesn't rely on GM & newapaper gossip like the other so called experts. IMO he is the best in the business. All GM's are liars around draft time.
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Well....he has his blind spots too. Anything from B.C. gets elivated. Ryan may be the seond coming....but he is going to have to go to the correct system and the correct O-C. I don't think any of the Qbs are NFL ready. Going to be very foolish giving some of these guys day one money.
 
threetoedpete said:
Well....he has his blind spots too. Anything from B.C. gets elivated. Ryan may be the seond coming....but he is going to have to go to the correct system and the correct O-C. I don't think any of the Qbs are NFL ready. Going to be very foolish giving some of these guys day one money.
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Tell that to Todd McShay.

He has a hard on for Matt Ryan the size of....well you know...
 
morningcrew said:
The Texans might also pass on Flowers if he is there because he has some red flag issues regarding character that might knock him off their board.
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I've read several places that there may be some character issues with Brandon Flowers and Mike Jenkins. Does anyone know what happened in both cases and what about other Character concerns there may be with the other CB's or draft prospects we may look at???
 
Ole Miss Texan said:
I've read several places that there may be some character issues with Brandon Flowers and Mike Jenkins. Does anyone know what happened in both cases???
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All I know about Flowers is that there was a picture taken of him in a hotel room with cash & what appeared to be cocaine. It may have been taken around New Year's, when the Hokies were in Miami to play in the Orange Bowl.

Jenkins was arrested last spring in a disturbance outside a bar. If you banned every draft eligible player who has been arrested outside a bar, I don't think the NFL could hold a 7 round draft.
 
I do not put a lot of stock in the pundits, but Mayock's insight based on his detailed analysis, access and the fact that he actually played in an NFL secondary provides a solid evaluation to take into consideration when discussing CBs and Safeties.

How that player will scale, and how he will fit in with a team's system, and locker room, are variables that are often left to the team's evaluators, not the draft pundits that climb out of the wood work every year.
 
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