OptimisticTexan Post Combine Mock

[OptimisticTexan]

I'm going back to well once again and I'm talking to the Browns about Deandre Hopkins. I'm shipping Hopkins b/c my concern is...if he doesn't get his new contract this off-season he could pull another stunt like he did in his 1-Day Holdout last season and then deliver another sub-par season. I like what I might get in picks more than hoping he will deliver a great season playing out the final season of his rookie contract.

Cleveland Gets:
Hopkins
RD2-25-057

Texans Get:
RD2-01-033
RD2-20-052
RD5-01-145
2018: RD2-(Hou Pick)

2017 Post Combine Mock
RD1-25-025: Cam Robinson / RT / Alabama
RD2-01-033: Chidobe Awuzie / CB / Colorado
RD2-20-052: Tyus Bowser / OLB / Houston
RD3-25-089: Jake Butt / TE / Michigan
RD4-24-131: Zach Banner / OG / USC
RD4-36-142: D'Onta Foreman / RB / Texas
RD5-01-145: Josh Harvey-Clemons / SS / Louisville
RD5-25-169: Josh Malone / WR / Tennessee
RD7-25-243: Josh Topou / DT / Colorado

2017 UDFA Class Targets (If Available)
Cooper Rush / QB / Central Michigan
Brady Gustafson / QB / Montana
Zach Johnson / OG / North Dakota State
Andreas Knappe / OT / Connecticut
Jonah Pirsig / OT / Minnesota
Pharoh Brown / TE / Oregon **Depends On Injury**
Colin Jeter / TE / LSU
Speedy Noil / WR / Texas A&M
Nick Kurtz / WR / BYU
Jake Maulhardt / WR / Wyoming
Chase Allen / ILB / Southern Illinois

 

[JB]

you're loving the idea of trading Hopkins

 

[OptimisticTexan]

you're loving the idea of trading Hopkins

I'm only basing this on what he did last season when he didn't get his new contract. I believe, if he doesn't get taken care of this off-season and is forced to play out the final season of his rookie contract...there is going to be one very disappointed Hopkins arriving to Camp. Is there a possibility that he could possibly arrives to camp much later than 1 day hold-out? I'm thinking there are 2 ways this scenario may play out:

1. He decides to play lights out since it's his final year on his rookie contract, then he leaves the Texans for the highest bidder to stick it to McNair and RS.
2. Or, he holds-out for an extended period of time, comes back and possibly delivers a mediocre season, then leaves for the best team desiring his services....maybe it's the Colts, Titans or Jaguars so he has a chance to stick it to McNair and RS twice a year.

Of course, this could all be diverted if the Texans decide give him the extension he has desired, at the dollar figure he has in mind so they can be done with this drama...but for some strange reason, it hasn't happened yet.

 

[infantrycak]

Nothing strange about it, the Texans like many teams don't renegotiate with more than a year left as a general rule.

Sand bagging your contract year is stupidly self-destructive. Most folks try to play lights out to maximize value.

 

[Corrosion]

Nothing strange about it, the Texans like many teams don't renegotiate with more than a year left as a general rule.

Sand bagging your contract year is stupidly self-destructive. Most folks try to play lights out to maximize value.

Hopkins wasn't sandbagging .... He just didn't have a QB worth a heap of smoking sh!t. He posted fantastic numbers with .... Fitzcraptrick , Hoyerable and a host of other poor to mediocre passers. Azwiper took bad quarterbacking to a whole new level of suckitude.


Most mocks don't even come close .... adding trades moves them even further from reality.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

This Mock is going to include my trade of Hopkins to Cleveland. We need picks due to the FO not making moves on FA's to help plug holes created by some starting personnel movement to new teams...not to mention the holes that needed attention in the draft. Now, everything must be addressed in the draft. Why Cleveland? They have picks I want and the Texans have a solid veteran they would covet, not to mention, they have the cap space to give him the new contract he desires. This would actually work for all parties involved. Cleveland gives up their 2017 RD2-20, RD4-01 and either of their 2018 RD2 picks...whichever is the better position for Hopkins.

2017 Mock:

RD1-25-025: RT / Garrett Bolles / Utah / 6-5 @ 297 lbs / He very well could be here for the picking and man does supply an answer to the RT question.

RD2-20-052: (CLE) OLB / Tyus Bowser / Houston / 6-3 @ 247 lbs / Answers Simon's departure in a big way.

RD2-25-057: RG / Issac Asiata / Utah / 6-3 @ 323 lbs / Nice plug and play at RG. Gives Bolles and Asiata the right side and allows for continuity. Would that be a bad thing?

RD3-25-089: LT / Antonio Garcia / Troy / 6-6 @ 302 lbs / My developmental/rotational LT who will have the time to learn his skills from the OL Coach and observing Brown before he would be expected to replace him. He could also swing to RT depending on Bolles play.

RD4-01-108: (CLE) FS / Rayshawn Jenkins / Miami / 6-1 @ 214 lbs / Hope he's still available at this pick since he could be competing for the FS starting job.

RD4-24-130: RB / Brian Hill / Wyoming / 6-1 @ 219 lbs / Strong runner who produces yards and TD's. Has good hands and would be threat at any time both as a runner and receiver which creates coveted versatility. Ran a solid 4.5 - 40 at the Combine. I think Hill would fit O'Brien's mold for a RB.

RD4-36-142: SS / Josh Harvey-Clemons / Louisville / 6-4 @ 217 lbs / Answers the SS need for this team and provides the hitting power to command respect.

RD5-25-169: WR / Josh Malone / Tennessee / 6-3 @ 208 lbs / Could be a deep threat in 2017 but takes a little time to build to his burn speed. Solid hands and strong route runner. Catching Malone this late in RD5 could be highly rewarding.

RD7-25-243: DT / Josh Topou / Colorado / 6-3 @ 353 lbs / I would have a slam dunk draft if he's available here. That gives me a rotational player from Day 1 to work with Reader and he's from RD7.

If moving Hopkins allows me to have this type of draft haul then I'm moving him and freeing up more cap space in the future. Get Clowney and Brown taken care of while leaving plenty of money in the cap kitty for future moves when and if needed.

 

[infantrycak]

Did you set aside $1 mil for scratch offs?

 

[JB]

If moving Hopkins allows me to have this type of draft haul then I'm moving him and freeing up more cap space in the future. Get Clowney and Brown taken care of while leaving plenty of money in the cap kitty for future moves when and if needed.

No QB? I'd consider the draft a failure.

Would like to see your mock with no trades because this isn't gonna happen.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

No trades involved in this Mock. I believe the Texans should attempt to gain more picks but based on their current moves, they could be setting the table for a bigger and better draft in 2018. They can help set the table by filling as many holes as possible for 2017. To be a successful draft, the team cannot afford the luxury of rolling the dice on a project QB who would be carrying a clipboard in 2017,competing in 2018 and potentially coming into his own in 2019. Sorry, I'm rolling with Savage, Weeden, and a inexpensive QB3 for 2017. The defense was very good last year without JJ, so I'm guessing that with a productive Watt returning, the losses on defense won't be as severe as it appears. My focus is correcting the offense to a point that they could elevate their production across the board to Top 15. By the way, I'd love to add a TE since the talent pool for the position is deep but it appears the Texans feel they are set with the re-signing of Griffin.

RD1-25-025: RT / Garrett Bolles / Utah / 6-5 @ 297 lbs or OLB / TJ Watt / Wisconsin / 6-4 @ 252 lbs

RD2-25-057: RG / Issac Asiata / Utah / 6-3 @ 323 lbs

RD3-25-089: LT / Antonio Garcia / Troy / 6-6 @ 302 lbs or RT / Will Holden / Vanderbilt / 6-7 @ 311 lbs

RD4-24-130: RB / Brian Hill / Wyoming / 6-1 @ 219 lbs

RD4-36-142: SS / Josh Harvey-Clemons / Louisville / 6-4 @ 217 lbs

RD5-25-169: OT / Storm Norton / Toledo / 6-8 @ 311 lbs

RD7-25-243: DT / Josh Topou / Colorado / 6-3 @ 353 lbs

 

[PapaL]

So you traded out best weapon on offense for another OLB? I think this board would die a fiery death if that would happen

 

[Corrosion]

No QB? I'd consider the draft a failure.

Agreed , no QB is a failure ..... At best we'll be starting a 37 year old at QB who has essentially been out of the league for two years due to injuries .... then his backup hasn't been able to stay healthy holding a clip board , he's also in the final year of his contract and has shown nothing that makes us believe he deserves long term consideration at the position.


QB is an absolute must in this draft .... Romo or no Romo.

Would like to see your mock with no trades because this isn't gonna happen.

Projecting the draft is a crap shoot at best ,adding trades to the equation ..... makes it an exercise in futility , especially when you are trading away your best offensive weapon.

 

[Corrosion]

So you traded out best weapon on offense for another OLB? I think this board would die a fiery death if that would happen

I think this guy thinks Savage is gonna throw the ball to ..... himself and win us a Lombardi trophy.

 

[Lucky]

I think this guy thinks Savage is gonna throw the ball to ..... himself and win us a Lombardi trophy.

It would work if we had this guy.

 

[PapaL]

It would work if we had this guy.

That's actually really impressive hahaha. What happened to that kid? He throws a mean jump ball.

 

[Mollywhopper]

That's actually really impressive hahaha. What happened to that kid? He throws a mean jump ball.

Couple seasons at Louisiana Lafayette..

Gary Haynes

and then..

Gary Haynes Leaving Ragin’ Cajuns Football Team

I imagine he threw a ball from Louisiana before he left back for Manvel to come snag it..

 

[thunderkyss]

No trades involved in this Mock. I believe the Texans should attempt to gain more picks but based on their current moves, they could be setting the table for a bigger and better draft in 2018. They can help set the table by filling as many holes as possible for 2017. To be a successful draft, the team cannot afford the luxury of rolling the dice on a project QB who would be carrying a clipboard in 2017,competing in 2018 and potentially coming into his own in 2019. Sorry, I'm rolling with Savage, Weeden, and a inexpensive QB3 for 2017. The defense was very good last year without JJ, so I'm guessing that with a productive Watt returning, the losses on defense won't be as severe as it appears. My focus is correcting the offense to a point that they could elevate their production across the board to Top 15. By the way, I'd love to add a TE since the talent pool for the position is deep but it appears the Texans feel they are set with the re-signing of Griffin.

RD1-25-025: RT / Garrett Bolles / Utah / 6-5 @ 297 lbs or OLB / TJ Watt / Wisconsin / 6-4 @ 252 lbs

RD2-25-057: RG / Issac Asiata / Utah / 6-3 @ 323 lbs

RD3-25-089: LT / Antonio Garcia / Troy / 6-6 @ 302 lbs or RT / Will Holden / Vanderbilt / 6-7 @ 311 lbs

RD4-24-130: RB / Brian Hill / Wyoming / 6-1 @ 219 lbs

RD4-36-142: SS / Josh Harvey-Clemons / Louisville / 6-4 @ 217 lbs

RD5-25-169: OT / Storm Norton / Toledo / 6-8 @ 311 lbs

RD7-25-243: DT / Josh Topou / Colorado / 6-3 @ 353 lbs

I think this is exactly the kind of draft we need to prepare ourselves for. The only difference, we may use our 5th/7th rounder to swap Cleveland's fourth for an earlier pick who won't play in 2017.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

So you traded out best weapon on offense for another OLB? I think this board would die a fiery death if that would happen

Should've paid more attention to the entire thought. I would draft an OLB (Bowser) and a FS (Jenkins) in 2017...and both would wind up starters while filling holes that are needed in 2017. I also would have the better of the Browns 2018 RD2 picks.

Based on the fact that the team should have some strong Comp Picks...I could bundle the required picks to move up in RD1 -if required- to obtain a top QB (probably not the top QB but a high RD1) who would have a much better chance at success and possibly a faster route getting there due to the upgrades made in 2017.

As for the receiver situation, sure Hopkins is better than good but by no means is he the glue that holds this offense together. Improve the line / running game and I believe the WR's and TE's on this roster will be more than enough to keep defenses honest. At the moment, there are 3 guys (Fuller, Miller, Williams) who can take the top off defenses, with the added draft pick, there would be 3 receivers (Strong, Malone and Anderson) who have good catch radius', good hands and could be described as possession receivers only they have deceiving speed and then there are 2 guys (Fiedorowicz and Griffin) who could be described as possession receivers who will also work the seams on occasion. Mumphrey would be out in this scenario.

So that's my reasoning and I wouldn't hesitate to help Hopkins pack his bags for a new organization. It's not personal...it's business.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

No QB? I'd consider the draft a failure.

Would like to see your mock with no trades because this isn't gonna happen.

Hey JB, which QB are you taking in RD1-25 thru RD3-89? And with your hand-picked QB...at which point does he become a viable contributor to this offense? Seriously hope you haven't convinced yourself that it would be by game 7 or 8 in 2017. If so, yikes! I'll let you be "OptimisticTexan" from here on out. If the Texans pick a QB this year...best case scenario, he becomes a productive member of this offense by mid-season 2018.

This group of QB's have been so over-hyped that that there will be several teams making knee-jerk decisions. Same goes for Romo and Cutler which at the moment seems like the FO may have come to their senses and have decided not to make same mistake twice.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

Did you set aside $1 mil for scratch offs?

Last I remember, there isn't anyone's post making its way to the FO and changing their decision making processes. These boards are for folks to come online and discuss fact, non-fact and ideas openly. The way you and Corrosion reply to posts, it makes me wonder which of you think you're sitting in the office next to RS's and actually have input into his decisions.

 

[Corrosion]

Should've paid more attention to the entire thought. I would draft an OLB (Bowser) and a FS (Jenkins) in 2017...and both would wind up starters while filling holes that are needed in 2017. I also would have the better of the Browns 2018 RD2 picks.

Based on the fact that the team should have some strong Comp Picks...I could bundle the required picks to move up in RD1 -if required- to obtain a top QB (probably not the top QB but a high RD1) who would have a much better chance at success and possibly a faster route getting there due to the upgrades made in 2017.

As for the receiver situation, sure Hopkins is better than good but by no means is he the glue that holds this offense together. Improve the line / running game and I believe the WR's and TE's on this roster will be more than enough to keep defenses honest. At the moment, there are 3 guys (Fuller, Miller, Williams) who can take the top off defenses, with the added draft pick, there would be 3 receivers (Strong, Malone and Anderson) who have good catch radius', good hands and could be described as possession receivers only they have deceiving speed and then there are 2 guys (Fiedorowicz and Griffin) who could be described as possession receivers who will also work the seams on occasion. Mumphrey would be out in this scenario.

So that's my reasoning and I wouldn't hesitate to help Hopkins pack his bags for a new organization. It's not personal...it's business.

So .... You want to put off development of a quarterback .... for another year.


Every year we don't is another year behind , another year wasted.


Hopkins is a guy who can make a quarterbacks life easy .... You want to trade away your best offensive weapon , and quarterbacks best friend .... for a couple defensive prospects .... when you already have the leagues best defense .... while putting off quarterback for another year .... makes no sense to me.


Hopkins draws double teams on damn near every snap .... taking pressure off of another aspect of the offense on every snap. None of those other guys have shown that ability ...



How about we fix what's broken (QB) , and leave what aint broken alone (D) .... or break something else (Hopkins).

 

[steelbtexan]

So .... You want to put off development of a quarterback .... for another year.


Every year we don't is another year behind , another year wasted.


Hopkins is a guy who can make a quarterbacks life easy .... You want to trade away your best offensive weapon , and quarterbacks best friend .... for a couple defensive prospects .... when you already have the leagues best defense .... while putting off quarterback for another year .... makes no sense to me.


Hopkins draws double teams on damn near every snap .... taking pressure off of another aspect of the offense on every snap. None of those other guys have shown that ability ...



How about we fix what's broken (QB) , and leave what aint broken alone (D) .... or break something else (Hopkins).

The only way I would trade Hopkins is if I could use him to trade up to get Mahomes if needed. But I would rather keep Hopkins and draft Kelly. My #2 QB.

 

[JB]

Hey JB, which QB are you taking in RD1-25 thru RD3-89? And with your hand-picked QB...at which point does he become a viable contributor to this offense? Seriously hope you haven't convinced yourself that it would be by game 7 or 8 in 2017. If so, yikes! I'll let you be "OptimisticTexan" from here on out. If the Texans pick a QB this year...best case scenario, he becomes a productive member of this offense by mid-season 2018.

This group of QB's have been so over-hyped that that there will be several teams making knee-jerk decisions. Same goes for Romo and Cutler which at the moment seems like the FO may have come to their senses and have decided not to make same mistake twice.

I'd probably take Trubisky, Watson or Mahomes in Rnd 1 or Peterman in Rnd 2. NO I wouldn't expect them to be instant starters, but the longer we delay starting the process the longer it will take to get where we want to be. Every year we hear about how much better next years class gonna be, that has to stop. Ignore the position at your peril. We've seen what that brings.

 

[Corrosion]

The only way I would trade Hopkins is if I could use him to trade up to get Mahomes if needed. But I would rather keep Hopkins and draft Kelly. My #2 QB.

I wouldn't trade Hopkins for Mahomes or any of these quarterbacks , I'd just move to the next one on my list - Trubisky > Mahomes > Watson > Kizer > Peterman > Webb > Kelly.

All of them gotta have a guy to chuck the ball to .... and Hopkins is one of the best , he's gonna make a quarterbacks transition from NCAA - NFL easier.

I'd like to solve the position for the next decade .... but not at the expense of losing one of the best WR's in the league , I'll keep him and take the best I can get otherwise , worst case is you have a 4-5 year backup out of this draft and we try again next year for that franchise guy. Bottom line is you aint gonna hit on that franchise guy if you don't take your hacks .... take a hack and if it don't work keep swinging.

I'd probably take Trubisky, Watson or Mahomes in Rnd 1 or Peterman in Rnd 2. NO I wouldn't expect them to be instant starters, but the longer we delay starting the process the longer it will take to get where we want to be. Every year we hear about how much better next years class gonna be, that has to stop. Ignore the position at your peril. We've seen what that brings.

I don't expect any of them to be instant starters but you never know , its not like the Texans have much talent at the position to begin with .... Wouldn't take much to beat out Savage or Weeden.

 

[PapaL]

Peterman in Rnd 2

I think we're in sync JB. I'd gladly take Peterman in the 2nd if he's available. Hell I'd even consider taking him in the first just for the 5th year option.

 

[thunderkyss]

I'd probably take Trubisky, Watson or Mahomes in Rnd 1 or Peterman in Rnd 2. NO I wouldn't expect them to be instant starters, but the longer we delay starting the process the longer it will take to get where we want to be. Every year we hear about how much better next years class gonna be, that has to stop. Ignore the position at your peril. We've seen what that brings.

As long as we're talking about guys who aren't true 1st round QBs. They lack experience in a pro offense.

If we take a true #1 next year, we can start him day one...

I'm not saying there will be a true #1 next year. But if we're talking about developmental guys... We've spent the last three years developing Tom Savage. He's got the size, he's got the arm, he's got the accuracy. He only lacks experience.

Personally, I'd be trying to acquire picks for 2018. Trade down, maybe even completely out of the first round to add picks next season. So we can move up & get the QB we really want.

Unless the guy you really want falls to you, or is not expected to go until a later round. But I'm not going to fault anyone if they just don't like the QBs in this draft.

We should have traded up to get Mariota or Winston. That's my stance. If you felt strongly about Wentz, we should have traded up to get Wentz. However, it would have cost us dearly, because we didn't have the extra picks to do it. My thinking, instead of making another mistake you'll have to correct later, start acquiring picks so next time the opportunity arises, go get your guy.

If you're in love with Mahommes, or whoever, fine. Go get him.


But if we're talking about getting a guy we can develop...

 

[PapaL]

As long as we're talking about guys who aren't true 1st round QBs. They lack experience in a pro offense.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/profiles/nathan-peterman?id=2558191

Peterman's experience in a pro-style passing attack gives him a head start headed into the league.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

As long as we're talking about guys who aren't true 1st round QBs. They lack experience in a pro offense.

If we take a true #1 next year, we can start him day one...

I'm not saying there will be a true #1 next year. But if we're talking about developmental guys... We've spent the last three years developing Tom Savage. He's got the size, he's got the arm, he's got the accuracy. He only lacks experience.

Personally, I'd be trying to acquire picks for 2018. Trade down, maybe even completely out of the first round to add picks next season. So we can move up & get the QB we really want.

Unless the guy you really want falls to you, or is not expected to go until a later round. But I'm not going to fault anyone if they just don't like the QBs in this draft.

We should have traded up to get Mariota or Winston. That's my stance. If you felt strongly about Wentz, we should have traded up to get Wentz. However, it would have cost us dearly, because we didn't have the extra picks to do it. My thinking, instead of making another mistake you'll have to correct later, start acquiring picks so next time the opportunity arises, go get your guy.

If you're in love with Mahommes, or whoever, fine. Go get him.


But if we're talking about getting a guy we can develop...

I'm on board with thunderkyss and want to add this simple example.

The Browns take Prescott in RD3 in the 2016 NFL Draft and insert him as the starter, does he have the same NFL impact that he had in Dallas? That should be a resounding no!

I think the Browns have seen the light and went about fixing their offense this off-season in the hopes that they have improved their OL and receivers before investing a RD1-12 pick in a rookie QB or trading that pick along with another to the NE for Garoppolo. Bottom-line, they've made the required moves to expedite the success of any QB brought into the fold.

Texans haven't done that this season and I feel they're going to try and solve these issues via the draft. Nothing wrong with that provided they have enough of the right kind of picks available. In my book, drafting a project QB this season doesn't allow the team to address some real areas of need first. Using a RD1 to RD5 pick on a QB reduces to 4 impact players available to fill immediate needs. Build the OL and running game this season and give them a year to get better. Savage and Weeden can carry the torch this season and if they don't improve the position...get your QB in 2018.

 

[PapaL]

Using a RD1 to RD5 pick on a QB reduces to 4 impact players available to fill immediate needs. Build the OL and running game this season and give them a year to get better. Savage and Weeden can carry the torch this season and if they don't improve the position...get your QB in 2018.

So keep doing what we've been doing and hope it works next time? Enough is enough. Draft a talented guy and let him learn how to be a pro. He's more likely to learn from Savage/Weeden/Romo. Yes our high draft pick would not be playing this upcoming season in this scenario. Will it work? Maybe. Has what we've been doing worked? Nope.

Using the Browns as an example is actually pretty good. What they've been doing didn't work so now they're trying something. Meanwhile our plan is to keep doing what we've been doing. Loading up on defense, check, get weapons on offense, WR and RB check. At what point is the most valuable position on offense addressed? Next year.

 

[steelbtexan]

I wouldn't trade Hopkins for Mahomes or any of these quarterbacks , I'd just move to the next one on my list - Trubisky > Mahomes > Watson > Kizer > Peterman > Webb > Kelly.

All of them gotta have a guy to chuck the ball to .... and Hopkins is one of the best , he's gonna make a quarterbacks transition from NCAA - NFL easier.

I'd like to solve the position for the next decade .... but not at the expense of losing one of the best WR's in the league , I'll keep him and take the best I can get otherwise , worst case is you have a 4-5 year backup out of this draft and we try again next year for that franchise guy. Bottom line is you aint gonna hit on that franchise guy if you don't take your hacks .... take a hack and if it don't work keep swinging.



I don't expect any of them to be instant starters but you never know , its not like the Texans have much talent at the position to begin with .... Wouldn't take much to beat out Savage or Weeden.

If you think you found a franchise QB to draft, trading Hopkins to get him shouldn't be a deal breaker. Finding a franchise QB is worth 5 Hopkins. IMHO

I think you're very much underrating Savage. I thought he looked pretty good in the game and a half he played last yr. It certainly looks like he understands the offense very well and has the arm talent. He just needs to stay healthy. I wouldn't expect a rookie to be able to beat him out.

Of course they will/should draft a QB because BOB/Savage will probably be gone after this yr and a new HC will need a talented young QB to start his regime with.

 

[steelbtexan]

I think of getting a franchise QB this way, after seeing Wentz would you give this up for Wentz

Fuller/Martin/This yrs #1 and a 2018 #1.

I would and that would've been enough to get Wentz.

This yr I like Mahomes, I would give up 25 and next yrs #1 to get him at 12 or above.

 

[thunderkyss]

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/profiles/nathan-peterman?id=2558191

I'm just projecting on what others have said. I have not looked at this year's QBs, because I don't think the Texans will draft one.

That said, the word is Peterman lacks the talent & upside that would make him a 1st round QB. Put his experience with Mahomme's or Trubisky's talent, & you've got a true 1st rounder.

& I'm not saying these guys aren't worth a first round pick. There's a lot of emotion involved & I don't discount emotion. I'm just saying we're not talking about anyone who would go #1 overall, or even starting these guys day 1.

We're talking about drafting a guy & "letting him learn" on the bench. Not that I have anything against that. But that guy isn't what I want to draft in the first round.

If you think he's able to start day 1, but you want to try something else first, have a Bret Favre on your team, or something, that's not what I'm talking about. We're looking at these guys saying start Savage or Romo until we're out of the playoff race. If I'm going to draft a guy in the first, I want it to be a guy that I absolutely love. A guy that I would trade up to get... not that I have to, if it looks like the draft will fall my way, I'm fine taking him in the 4th. But if I felt I had to trade up I would.

Anyone here want to trade up for Mahommes? Trubisky? Watson?

I'm not running the Texans, we all know that. But that's the way I see it. & if that means we have to wait another season before we start "training" our QB, then so be it. Because next year, if there's a guy who can start day 1, I'm getting him & I'm not worried about "training" him. I've been training Savage & Weeden for two years.

 

[Mollywhopper]

No one knows what kind of alignment we're going to be in for a top flight QB next year.

And finding that out next year may just have us looking at the year after that.

Trubisky (on the outside chance he falls within reach), Mahomes, and Peterman have enough of the goods, imo, to begin their process ASAP. Savage can be tasked with being the numero uno for the time being. If he rises, great, we're in business and we have hopefully a solid backup and future capital. If he stumbles, ok, let's see what the youngster's got when the time's right.

Throughout all of this 2018 will continue to be 2018 when it eventually gets here and we won't have played wait-y, hope-y yet another full cycle.

 

[thunderkyss]

No one knows what kind of alignment we're going to be in for a top flight QB next year.

And finding that out next year may just have us looking at the year after that.

Trubisky (on the outside chance he falls within reach), Mahomes, and Peterman have enough of the goods, imo, to begin their process ASAP. Savage can be tasked with being the numero uno for the time being. If he rises, great, we're in business and we have hopefully a solid backup and future capital. If he stumbles, ok, let's see what the youngster's got when the time's right.

Throughout all of this 2018 will continue to be 2018 when it eventually gets here and we won't have played wait-y, hope-y yet another full cycle.

The main reason I don't want to look at these QBs (the main reason other than I don't think the Texans will draft a QB in the first round) is because I fall in love with QBs easy. Not everybody does. It takes all kinds to make a village.

All opinions are valid, & nobody likes a good debate like me. But if OptomisticTexan doesn't want to draft a QB here, I don't think we should turn his mock draft thread into a, "We must draft a QB now!!!" thread.

 

[Mollywhopper]

All opinions are valid, & nobody likes a good debate like me. But if OptomisticTexan doesn't want to draft a QB here, I don't think we should turn his mock draft thread into a, "We must draft a QB now!!!" thread.

Do you think people can/should critique his mock?

 

[thunderkyss]

Do you think people can/should critique his mock?

Absolutely. But there's a difference between critiquing his mock & highjacking a thread. It's just my opinion, & since the mods haven't jumped in, I'm probably wrong, but I think we're way into hijacking territory with this QB thing.

& I'm just as guilty as anyone.

 

[Mollywhopper]

I'm not sure what highjacked even means here. No one's been pushed out if the thread and worthwhile discussion is fair game.

In fact I don't see a post in here where anyone has been rude or dismissive of opinion. Just concerned and intent on delivering their message. And ok.

 

[cuppacoffee]

I am at the point where I want two qbs drafted every year until we get lucky.

It's gonna take luck because this regime doesn't seem to have the smarts to get it done.

 

[Corrosion]

I am at the point where I want two qbs drafted every year until we get lucky.

It's gonna take luck because this regime doesn't seem to have the smarts to get it done.

I think they are reluctant to take the position early after being bitten in the ass by HWWNBM , they have never taken a QB before round 3 other than that guy ....

 

[OptimisticTexan]

I'm always game for a good debate and enjoy defending my position. But, a debate involves identifying your position as well, not just jumping in and offering critiques, this way I know where you're coming from.

My position is really simple, Obie has 3 years of development in the books with Savage and will be starting a 4th and final year. He's got to roll with him to find out what the end product looks like. First, they have to improve the OL and running game so he's given Savage the best opportunity to survive and succeed. So, using a pick this year on another body in the QB Room just doesn't make sense when fixing the other offensive problems will be better for 2017. They have 5 picks to find those solutions since the team didn't use the FA period to find them. Weeden more than covers Savage in the event of an injury situation. Texans can sign an inexpensive veteran with some system knowledge while using this draft to do a better job on the foundation.

I like a great QB but he ain't gonna have a lot of chances at success if the trenches that protect him are porous. If you're not 100% certain what I mean by this statement...please contact Andrew Luck and ask him what kind of "Franchise" QB he's become behind a poor OL and no running game.

 

[thunderkyss]

My position is really simple, Obie has 3 years of development in the books with Savage and will be starting a 4th and final year. He's got to roll with him to find out what the end product looks like.

I don't believe this to be true.

I wouldn't have a problem with starting Savage/Weeden (which I believe is what we're going to do) but it would be nice if they'd already start talking as if that was the plan all along. Instead, when it happens it's going to come across as they weren't able to accomplish anything they wanted to do & we're going into the season not with plan A, B, or C, but plan D.

Actions speak loudly & they've been watching Tom Savage for three years. Each of those three years, they felt there were better options... Fitzpatrick/Mallett was a better option in 2014 (rookie, ok no big deal). Hoyer/Mallett was a better option in 2015 (something is not right). Osweiler was a better option at $19M/yr (if your red flag hadn't gone up yet, something is wrong).

They see Tom Savage on a daily basis once the season starts... they know & their actions pretty much tells us what they think. He's a last chance, worst case scenario QB.

 

[YoungTexanFan]

So keep doing what we've been doing and hope it works next time? Enough is enough. Draft a talented guy and let him learn how to be a pro. He's more likely to learn from Savage/Weeden/Romo. Yes our high draft pick would not be playing this upcoming season in this scenario. Will it work? Maybe. Has what we've been doing worked? Nope.

Using the Browns as an example is actually pretty good. What they've been doing didn't work so now they're trying something. Meanwhile our plan is to keep doing what we've been doing. Loading up on defense, check, get weapons on offense, WR and RB check. At what point is the most valuable position on offense addressed? Next year.

You mean the Browns who have had something like 47 QBs over the last decade? Where they keep drafting guys and putting them on a team that wasn't ready? Behind a bad offensive line? With no skill players? The same Browns who have invested more 1st round picks into that position than any team?

Their version of "trying something" is them trying to build an actual team around them and then plug in a worthwhile QB. Think of it like what we did to David Carr. I still firmly believe we destroyed him because we didn't have an offensive line or enough actual talent around him. I think he would have been a very good NFL QB if he walked into a better situation.

 

[YoungTexanFan]

I am at the point where I want two qbs drafted every year until we get lucky.

It's gonna take luck because this regime doesn't seem to have the smarts to get it done.

I'll let you in on a secret: Nobody has the smarts to get it done. Andrew Luck or a Peyton Manning are exceptions with huge concensous. The Redskins drafted RGIII to be the starting QB. The other guy they drafted that year? He's making 24 million this year and has had real success. QB success is so random there isn't a single FO that has it down. If that's the case Brett Farve wouldn't have been a 3rd round pick, Tony Romo would have been drafted, and every team in the league would have traded every draft pick for two years to trade up to #1 overall for Tom Brady. Do I think Dak Prescott is a good QB? No. There is a reason he was a 4th round pick. He just happened to play behind the best OL in the league, with a top 3 RB, a HOF TE, and a true #1 WR. Romo's injury was a fluke and allowed a rookie 4th rounder who no one (including the Cowboys) expected to be a starter, to have a very good year.

We can't draft multiple QBs every year because of roster spots and not being able to actually evaluate them enough before we have to cut them. You have to just pray that we get lucky with a guy or that he develops. Build the OL. We have a good RB, a stud WR, It's not like our OL is terrible either, but we have to address the gaping hole on the right side. Get the rest of the team ready. We can mask a QB like Prescott behind a great OL. I really don't think Prescott is a good QB, but he walked into the great situation. I think Savage is a better QB (by far on actual talent) but Prescott had the ideal situation. Let's give our next QB an ideal situation.

 

[infantrycak]

We have a good RB, a stud WR, It's not like our OL is terrible either, but we have to address the gaping hole on the right side. Get the rest of the team ready.

You just blew 4 paragraphs of verbosity. We are not the 4-12 Browns trying to insert Weeden into a 24th ranked O and 23rd ranked D. The Texans were 9-7 with lots of pieces on O and the 1st D. The O could take a massive jump with 2 players changing, QB and RT.

Let's give our next QB an ideal situation.

You don't waste the careers of 21 players waiting to get a QB. That's just dumb.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

A couple of poster's also hinted at a Hopkins trade versus him more than likely leaving the team via FA if he doesn't get a new contract. Again, this team has holes to fill on both sides of the ball and Hopkins would give me a couple of extra picks this season and another in 2018. But, I need more...so I trade down in RD1 and gain another pick in 2017.

This isn't meant to offend anyone but it's brainstorming in how I would personally go about helping this team...if I were making the calls.

Trade:
Browns Get:
Hopkins

Texans Get:
2017 RD2-20-052, RD4-01-108 / 2018 RD3- Browns Top RD3 Pick

Trade:
Saints Get:
2017 RD1-25-025

Texans Get:
2017 RD1-32-032, RD3-12-076

MOCK 3.0
RD1-32-032: OLB / TJ Watt / Wisconsin / 6-4 @ 252 lbs

RD2-20-052: RG / Dan Feeney / Indiana / 6-4 @ 305 lbs
RD2-25-057: RT / Taylor Moton / Western Michigan / 6-5 @ 319 lbs

RD3-12-076: WR / JuJu Smith-Schuster / USC / 6-2 @ 220 lbs
RD3-25-089: OT / Will Holden / Vanderbilt / 6-7 @ 311 lbs

RD4-01-108: DT / Carlos Watkins / Clemson / 6-3 @ 309 lbs
RD4-24-130: RB / Samaje Perine / Oklahoma / 5-11 @ 233 lbs
RD4-36-142: FS / John Johnson / Boston College / 6-0 @ 208 lbs

RD5-25-169: SS / Josh Harvey-Clemons / 6-4 @ 217 lbs

RD7-25-243: QB / Chad Kelly / Ole Miss / 6-2 @ 224 lbs

**Harvey-Clemons and Kelly are available here for a reason, they're guys who have had their fair share of off the field issues. But, why are they both in a position to be drafted? Their on the field production has been solid. Both guys would need contracts with very short leashes just to remind both players of the opportunity they've been given. Run with it or find out what your college educations can get you in the real world. If both were to arrive ready to take the reins of their new professional careers...then this becomes a very deep draft.**

 

[Insideop]

A couple of poster's also hinted at a Hopkins trade versus him more than likely leaving the team via FA if he doesn't get a new contract. Again, this team has holes to fill on both sides of the ball and Hopkins would give me a couple of extra picks this season and another in 2018. But, I need more...so I trade down in RD1 and gain another pick in 2017.

This isn't meant to offend anyone but it's brainstorming in how I would personally go about helping this team...if I were making the calls.

Trade:
Browns Get:
Hopkins

Texans Get:
2017 RD2-20-052, RD4-01-108 / 2018 RD3- Browns Top RD3 Pick

Trade:
Saints Get:
2017 RD1-25-025

Texans Get:
2017 RD1-32-032, RD3-12-076

MOCK 3.0
RD1-32-032: OLB / TJ Watt / Wisconsin / 6-4 @ 252 lbs

RD2-20-052: RG / Dan Feeney / Indiana / 6-4 @ 305 lbs
RD2-25-057: RT / Taylor Moton / Western Michigan / 6-5 @ 319 lbs

RD3-12-076: WR / JuJu Smith-Schuster / USC / 6-2 @ 220 lbs
RD3-25-089: OT / Will Holden / Vanderbilt / 6-7 @ 311 lbs

RD4-01-108: DT / Carlos Watkins / Clemson / 6-3 @ 309 lbs
RD4-24-130: RB / Samaje Perine / Oklahoma / 5-11 @ 233 lbs
RD4-36-142: FS / John Johnson / Boston College / 6-0 @ 208 lbs

RD5-25-169: SS / Josh Harvey-Clemons / 6-4 @ 217 lbs

RD7-25-243: QB / Chad Kelly / Ole Miss / 6-2 @ 224 lbs

**Harvey-Clemons and Kelly are available here for a reason, they're guys who have had their fair share of off the field issues. But, why are they both in a position to be drafted? Their on the field production has been solid. Both guys would need contracts with very short leashes just to remind both players of the opportunity they've been given. Run with it or find out what your college educations can get you in the real world. If both were to arrive ready to take the reins of their new professional careers...then this becomes a very deep draft.**

I wish it were this easy to solve all the Texans problems. But, in reality ........

 

[OptimisticTexan]

I wish it were this easy to solve all the Texans problems. But, in reality ........

Trading back and trading Hopkins wouldn't be that difficult at all. What is received in return could be subjective to other opinions.

I always like to discuss the opinions of others, so.....

1. What do you think the Texans could receive in return for Hopkins and which team might have the most interest?

2. If the Texans were to trade down from their RD1-25 slot, which team might have the desire to move up and what would the compensation be?

3. What kind of draft could you put together with the extra picks?