Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
They still can.
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"Is Obrien Really An NFL Caliber Head Coach"??
- Thread starter Phoenix
- Start date
They still can.
HJam72
Hall of Fame
They still won't, though.
Bulls on Parade
2017 Astros: Earn It!
The Texans will be 2015 AFC South Champions.
I like our chances to go 6-0 in the division this year.
Probably 9 wins total. Maybe 10 will be enough.
HJam72
Hall of Fame
I'd like to know what your kool-aid is laced with, LOL.
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
^^^ I'd like to know too.
I laced it, but I won't tell you with what.
Ok ok it's viagra, we all got a hard on for the texans.
Yes , he was actually a QB guru .... Dude turned Matt Schaub into a Pro Bowl QB , got a playoff W out of TJ Yates .... and had us believing that Case Keenum could be successful in the league.
The current clown in charge .... has tried to sell us three loads of sh!t in Fitz , Mullet & Hoyerable.
Not to mention I don't get to watch the games from the sideline anymore ....
Marshall
Not pretty, but ALIVE!
Cal - Suggestion - The Davis Clinic
It's right off the Katy Freeway so it's local.
I wish I hadn't wasted several years before going.
Now proceed with the unending consternation with all things Texan. It's like water off a ducks back.
Texian
Hall of Fame
I just lost 50 lbs and want to lose 15 more. I did it with a focused mindset and a dedication to make less poop.
RTP2110
All Pro
If it doesn't change soon, it looks like BoB's legacy may be that he can beat the bad teams but not the good ones. That was definitely the theme last year, and it looks to be repeating so far this season. Beating up on Jacksonville, Cleveland, and Oakland is great, but this team has to figure out how to start beating winning teams. Otherwise, we're pretty much locked into mediocrity. Baltimore is probably the only good team that we've beaten since BoB took over. Quick glance, combined record of teams in BoB's 10 wins: 0.336. Combined record of teams in BoB's 10 losses: 0.639.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
QB Guru?? Lol!
Schaub was never a Pro Bowl QB, so lets stop that right there. He got in as an alternate because others didn't want to make the trip to Hawaii. And one year at a Pro Bowl makes a coach a QB Guru?? In what world? Only yours.
And T.J Yates? Are you kidding me? Would you like to go back and look at his numbers? He was terrible. Kubiak had no success at all with Yates. The Texans won games that year on pure defense and a running game behind Foster. They won in spite of Yates.
And Keenum?? Keenum never even could get a win for Kubiak, and helped Kubiak to get canned.
Those are the worst examples you could have tried, and actually makes a better argument for OB, since OB actually got two wins with Keenum which is something KUbiak never could get out of Keenum.
At least you admitted that these statements are out of anger from Kubiak being gone, so it indicates where these statements are coming from like trying to suggest that we somehow got lucky last season knowing good and well that was a load of bull. I don't get this Kubiak bitterness though. He is gone and he aint coming back EVER. Do yourself a favor and let it go, because there is no point in holding this grudge against all future coaches because of some previous coach that is never coming back.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
I agree that they won't. I'm not suggesting they will, but they are still in it. This division is crap this year, and the Texans have plenty of time to make a run. Stranger things have happened.
He went twice. 2009 as a replacement, 2012 selected.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
I seem to remember Schaub always getting in due to others turning down the offer. He actually did get in in 2012 though.
In 2012 Schaub threw 22 TD's and 12 INT's, and went a little over 4,000 yards.
That is not a Pro Bowl caliber type season right there. The numbers are that of most average QB's. And if you remember, that was the season where the Texans won a lot of games with the running game, and Schaub completely nose dived down the stretch of the season. Hell, this entire board blew up and many fans were suggesting that we should bench Schaub as the season was ending for Yates as we were headed into the playoffs. For that to be a season that fans are trying to brag on for Schaub, that isn't a good example to bring up at all when dozens of fans wanted him benched, and that team lost what was like the last 3 out of 4 games of their season mainly due to Schaub's ineptitude that took place at that time. And I'm not trying to even bash Schaub honestly. I liked the guy for a while, and thought it was ridiculous to want to bench him for Yates at that time, but Schaub continued to spoil from that point on. As well as the Texans did record wise that year. It wasn't one of Schaub's best years honestly. DOn't forget when we played real elite QB's that year, their performances blew Schaub out of the water and made him look completely pedestrian when Schaub faced Brady in the regular season and in the playoffs and against Rogers. We saw what real Pro Bowl caliber QB's looked like.
Here was an article written about Schaub by Pro Football Talk at the end of that season criticizing Schaub's Pro Bowl selection, and highlighting his poor performances in big games that year.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...erback-becomes-houstons-weak-link-on-offense/
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Texian
Hall of Fame
IF O'BRIEN DOESN'T WIN TONIGHT THEN HE NEEDS TO GO!
Schefter @AdamSchefter 29m29 minutes ago
Neither Colts' QB, Andrew Luck and Matthew Hasselbeck, threw passes in practice this week. Not ideal situation for Thursday, or any, night.
Aaron Wilson @AaronWilson_NFL 32m32 minutes ago
Matt Hasselbeck expected to start for Colts tonight against Texans with Andrew Luck shoulder injury per @AdamSchefter
Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter 34m34 minutes ago
Colts' starting QB Matt Hassebleck was in emergency room until 2 am Monday morning, dealing with a virus he's still feeling effects of.
Chris Mortensen @mortreport 37m37 minutes ago
That Matthew Hasselbeck starts again for Andrew Luck (as @AdamSchefter reports) is not shock to those who observed Luck in practice.
Schefter @AdamSchefter 29m29 minutes ago
Neither Colts' QB, Andrew Luck and Matthew Hasselbeck, threw passes in practice this week. Not ideal situation for Thursday, or any, night.
Aaron Wilson @AaronWilson_NFL 32m32 minutes ago
Matt Hasselbeck expected to start for Colts tonight against Texans with Andrew Luck shoulder injury per @AdamSchefter
Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter 34m34 minutes ago
Colts' starting QB Matt Hassebleck was in emergency room until 2 am Monday morning, dealing with a virus he's still feeling effects of.
Chris Mortensen @mortreport 37m37 minutes ago
That Matthew Hasselbeck starts again for Andrew Luck (as @AdamSchefter reports) is not shock to those who observed Luck in practice.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
2009 he was sent when there were injuries in front of him, but he posted 67.9% 4,770yds 8.2ypa 29td 15int 98.6rat; completely deserving season.
2012 he was selected off the numbers you said, maybe a little more on past performance, but that justifies 2009 and says that people knew he was a good QB.
He was a good QB. And he was a good QB the large majority of which was Kubiak's doing. Which was the original point, whether you want to use the "G" word with Kubiak or not.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
I disagree that he should have gotten in for 2009. Brady, Manning, and Rivers were selected before him. All of them had better stats than Schaub and better teams. Rivers numbers were close, but still better but I don't think anyone would have argued that Schaub was better than Rivers at that time.
2012 has nothing to do with 2009. It was three years later. Again, read the article I posted above which indicated all of the points I made earlier. Schaub took a huge nose dive in 2012 to the point to where NO ONE gave the Texans a chance as a contender once the playoffs started. It wasn't all Schaub's fault for the record. The entire offense caved and looked like they quit on Kubiak that year.
How was that all on the coach? So now the actual QB that played doesn't get his due? That is silly. Schaub played pretty well in ATL every time Vick would get hurt. He was a hot name on the market when we acquired him.
The original point was that Kubiak was a QB guru, which was mentioned with examples of Schaub, Yates, and Keenum which is one of the most laughable statements ever based on that group of players. The biggest knock on the Texans franchise has always been their QB problems. Schaub was good at times. I'm not saying he wasn't, but he was never really a gamer, and he never scared any teams around the league.
That's why I say OB needs to decide whether he'll
- let the guys off the hook & "simplify" what the offense & defense is trying to do, or
- turn the screw & tell these guys we expect them to get this "complicated" offense/defense sooner rather than later. Guys who can pick it up will most likely (still not guaranteed) have a place here next season. Those who don't will have to hope some simple JV team can use their services.
I said 2009 was a deserving Pro Bowl level season. It was.
I said 2012 was largely on past performance, which happens all the time. It was.
I said Schaub owed a lot of his success to Kubiak. He does.
I couldn't care less about the title of "guru". It should go on the pile of tangent sports terms like "elite" quarterback. And I know you refuse to give Kubiak any credit, so whatever. But Kubiak made Schaub a better QB than he likely would have been without him. That's what a good QB coach does.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Not over the three that were selected above him. Look at the numbers for Manning, Brady, and Rivers.
No it really doesn't. Three years between a guy's career has really nothing to do with anything. Are you telling me that Stafford should make the Pro Bowl this season based on a season he had several years ago where he threw for almost 40 TD's? I don't think so. Should Brees get in this year based on his past success of breaking records and winning a SB like 5 or so years ago? Hell no.
I don't argue that. Of course Kubiak helped him with the little success that he had. The discussion you jumped in on was regarding the statements of Kubiak being called some QB guru with the examples of Schaub, Keenum, and Yates. Overall that is one bad batch of examples as a whole to make a statement for. And as far as elite QB's go, it has never been stupid when roughly 4 QB's have owned the rest of the league for the last 10 years practically being Brady, Manning, Rogers, and Brees.
Thorn
Dirty Old Man
Speaking of QBs, here are all the super bowl starting QBs since 2000, with the number of SBs they were in. Junk QBs do make it to the super bowl sometimes. I don't think that'll be the case with the Texans, just saying.
Tom Brady 6
Ben Roethlisberger 3
Kurt Warner 3
Peyton Manning 3
Eli Manning 2
Russell Wilson 2
Aaron Rodgers 1
Brad Johnson 1
Colin Kaepernick 1
Donovan McNabb 1
Drew Brees 1
Jake Delhomme 1
Joe Flacco 1
Kerry Collins 1
Matt Hasselbeck 1
Rex Grossman 1
Rich Gannon 1
Steve McNair 1
Trent Dilfer 1
Tom Brady 6
Ben Roethlisberger 3
Kurt Warner 3
Peyton Manning 3
Eli Manning 2
Russell Wilson 2
Aaron Rodgers 1
Brad Johnson 1
Colin Kaepernick 1
Donovan McNabb 1
Drew Brees 1
Jake Delhomme 1
Joe Flacco 1
Kerry Collins 1
Matt Hasselbeck 1
Rex Grossman 1
Rich Gannon 1
Steve McNair 1
Trent Dilfer 1
I jumped in the discussion to point our where you were wrong. Done. I tossed my opinion out, and ran with it about "elite", because it does get silly when fans try and delineate terms like that amongst players where there is no hard and fast rule for the general term.
And I ended that, like I will here, in saying that Kubiak did the job of a QB coach in bringing out all there was to in Schaub. That's whether anyone wants to get into an internet tussle over imaginary terms or not.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
It was a term suggested as Guru again, and part of that discussion hinged upon his "pro bowl" status as a talking point. You can try and act like that wasn't part of it all you want, but that is exactly what created the dialogue which has been shown to be nothing of the sort. QB guru of a guy that made one Pro Bowl when he completely crashed in his last 4 games and had average stats didn't indicate anything describing a QB Guru and you are well aware of that whether you want to admit it or not.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
I have said this for years that elite QB's and top 8 type QB's are always in the SB. They may not win it, but they're always there somehow. Of course there are the Rex Grossman and Delhomme types that get in here and there, but there is always an elite type of guy for that season that is there which again and again shows why those types of players are so important to a franchise on a consistent basis. The teams that go to SB's without one usually have the best defense in the league or have a guy like Flacco who all of a sudden plays out of his mind to take his team there when their team gets hot at the right time. The common denominator is the franchise QB though.
You want me to admit that Kubiak should have continued to squeeze more out of Schaub by the time he had physically become toast? That's absolutely silly.
But if you want to be the Term Guru then knock yourself out. All that is is a vehicle for you to spit more nonsense rhetoric. Franky, you can have it.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
You've said nothing here this entire time other than pointing out a Pro Bowl in 2012 that Schaub shouldn't have gotten, and have tried to change what the discussion was originally about which is what I've had to remind you several times. Don't jump into a discussion next time if you don't want to discuss the facts or what was originally said. Otherwise, go kick rocks and stop wasting people's time.
Sure thing Term Guru ...
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
I was the one who originally responded to your rejection of QB Guru for Kubiak and those were not my examples. I pointed out that as much as they were already HoF QBs both Elway and Young have repeatedly credited Kubiak for their best seasons. If that was some talking head I'd entertain your poofooing that idea, but not straight from the horses' mouths. The other examples were Griese, Plummer and Schaub all having their probowl seasons with him. I left off but should have included Flacco having his best year with Kubiak (and so far dramatically reverting without him).
Really it's pretty silly to argue Kubiak hasn't earned the moniker if anyone has but I suspect there is no standard you would acknowledge.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Elway and Young? Lol! Those dudes were all times greats, and Elway made Kubiak just like he made Shanahan who was one of the most overrated coaches ever. Elway had to teach Kubiak for the most part and still is RIGHT NOW. Elway had already been to what 3 SB's before Kubiak ever coached him and had to learn FROM HIM? Walsh was the genius in San Francisco, and is considered by most the best offensive genius of all time who invented the West Coast offense. Steve Young had been successful every time he stepped on the field as Montana's back up when he would get hurt. Everyone knew that Young was going to play like an elite level QB when he took the reins for Montana. Funny, I don't see you running around calling Shanahan or Reeves a QB guru.
Flacco had already won a SB before Kubiak ever got there under The Lions HC in Jim Caldwell, who also coached Manning during one of his best seasons, and played like an elite QB during that time. Again, where is Caldwell being labeled as this QB guru with you?
You basically mentioned a few QB's here that had success before Kubiak ever was involved. None of those apply. Funny, how I don't see you bringing back up Keenum, Yates, or Rosenfels who were all QB's that weren't already proven commodities that played horribly under Kubiak.
Based on your revionist history you're trying sell, OB is a QB's guru because he helped to coach Tom Brady for a few years even though he was already a HOF caliber QB before he coached him. But I'm sure you'd have a big problem with that statement even though it was be with the same poor logic to want to apply. And I've already stated that OB DOES NOT deserve to be called a QB guru either.
Sorry, but you have zero consistency here. Two cherry picked examples of QB's that were already successful before Kubiak ever entered the picture, while leaving several others out.
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Cheese and rice, what an obtuse conversation.
Guru is defined as an influential teacher. Nothing more, not miracle worker or genius. Simply someone who teaches in an influential way.
Kubiak has three Super Bowl rings as a coach. They don't hand those things out like candy, and if it is some kind of mentality that he did nothing on those coaching staffs to help win those rings, then this conversation is pointless.
But, I don't expect any sort of objectivity from someone that obviously hates the guy for whatever reason(s).
Guru is defined as an influential teacher. Nothing more, not miracle worker or genius. Simply someone who teaches in an influential way.
Kubiak has three Super Bowl rings as a coach. They don't hand those things out like candy, and if it is some kind of mentality that he did nothing on those coaching staffs to help win those rings, then this conversation is pointless.
But, I don't expect any sort of objectivity from someone that obviously hates the guy for whatever reason(s).
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
You can slide in whatever jabs you want for little brownie points, but you bashed Kubiak relentlessly while he was here. Spare me, with the line of objectivity considering how badly you complained about how he coached the Texans for years.
Kubiak has zero rings as a HC. Just a really bad resume with the Texans that pretty much made you a miserable fan for a very long time whether you want to admit that now or not. And acting as if the term Guru in NFL terms of a conversation means just an influential teacher is being about as obtuse as you can attempt to be. The way you just put it could describe every OC that ever coached in the entire NFL.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
Kubiak was not a good head coach here IMO.
But that man knows offense. I can't even take that away from him. The zbs, and kubiak's mastery of it are extremely impressive to me.
But that man knows offense. I can't even take that away from him. The zbs, and kubiak's mastery of it are extremely impressive to me.
Kubiak had his flaws while he was the Texans HC, but I bet he learned a lot of lessons. He will either prove to be the next Bill Belichik or the Next Wade Phillips.
HJam72
Hall of Fame
So he'll start wearing a hoodie and get a big gut.
It was either/or. lol
He'll either prove to be a great HC or great OC. Hoodie or bigger pants.
Foot in mouth. They couldn't beat the Dolts at home with a 40something quarterback ....
I hope OB is gone next week .... He sucks.
Texian
Hall of Fame
With the Flu....
I agree. OB is no Kubiak, which so far has been the only successful coach here.
After 2 seasons here, OB still can't decide who's going to be the qb.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
OB has done a poor job since the end of last season.
I won't call for his firing, but if they did I wouldn't complain.
This is not a well coached team or a well coached coaching staff.
I won't call for his firing, but if they did I wouldn't complain.
This is not a well coached team or a well coached coaching staff.
speedfreek
All Pro
like someone said earlier -- starter pistol..
(or after tonight, maybe cap gun)
(or after tonight, maybe cap gun)
speedfreek
All Pro
It's at least "close to losing it". The defense looked like they were just going through the motions at times..
The biggest thing that has surprised me this year has been the defense's ineptitude. I didn't think they'd be the league leading defense, but I thought they'd be competent - at least top ten.
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
If we just ignored all our qb drama and offensive woes and focused solely on our defensive performance id be disappointed. 8 first round picks? Wtf happened here? Cant stop the run or the pass get pressure or turnovers. Just bad.
Yeah , he's had two drafts and two free agent periods .... or two offseason's in which to acquire his guy at QB and all we have to show for it is Mullet & Hoyerable .... and he cant decide which one of those scrubs he wants to play.
Next week I almost expect him to alternate the two every series ....
Its not even a cap gun , its one of those with the a cork shoved in the end tied to a string.
