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WolverineFan's 2016 Mock Draft - v1.0

WolverineFan

WolverineFan

Hall of Fame
After 3 games we sit at 1-2 and don't look anything close to a playoff team. I see us finishing with a 7-9 or 8-8 type season and drafting in the middle of the 1st round yet again. I'm firmly on the Jared Goff bandwagon, but I don't see us being in any position to draft him from the middle of the round. Therefore, this is my best attempt at a talent grab in a Goff-less draft.


1) Ezekiel Elliott - RB, Ohio State
6-0, 225
- In an era where most college teams run the position by committee, Elliott is a rare feature back. He totes the rock, catches the ball, and pass protects. He has ideal size for an NFL RB but also has home run speed and was the catalyst for Ohio State's national title run last year running for 796 yards and 8 TD's in their final 3 games. Despite his size he is also elusive in the open field and excels at using his burst to destroy angles and leave defenders grasping at air. In 26 career games at OSU he has 2,595 rushing yards and 25 TD's while averaging 6.8 yards per carry. If you're looking for an immediate successor to Arian Foster as our feature back, here's your answer.

2) Cody Kessler - QB, USC
6-1, 215
- He has the numbers and the pedigree to be a top 20 pick but will be regarded lower than guys like Cook, Hackenberg, etc because he is "too short". I don't care. He is the ultimate distributor and would thrive in a system where he is allowed to be the point guard. He's very accurate and doesn't turn the ball over. He's not the sexiest pick at QB because he lacks the upside of a guy like Andrew Luck, but there's nothing wrong with being a top notch distributor. I see him as a poor man's Drew Brees at the next level.

3) Jason Spriggs - OT, Indiana
6-7, 306
- Former TE recruit that had a growth spurt his redshirt year and moved to OT. He has 34 career starts at LT coming into his senior season. He's a 3-time honorable mention All-Big Ten selection and should take the next step this year. He paved the way for Tevin Coleman's 2,000+ rushing yards last year with 45 knockdowns and current transfer RB, Jordan Howard, leads the NCAA in rushing yards. Being a former TE, he is a great athlete running a 4.82 forty, jumping 37.5 inches in the vertical, and lifting 33 bench reps. IMO, he would be a borderline 1st round prospect if he played at a more prominent program.

4) Drew Ott - DE, Iowa
6-4, 272
- A Jared Crick clone that has 18.5 TFL and 10.5 Sacks coming into his senior year. He was 2nd Team All-Big Ten as a junior and was off to a quick start this year (3 Sacks in 2 games) before injuring his wrist. The wrist injury will likely hold him out for a large portion of the season, which will likely drop him a round or so in the draft, thus making him available this late. He has a relentless motor and is very powerful at the point of attack and we need depth on the D-Line, especially with Crick being a free agent this offseason.

5) De'Vondre Campbell - OLB, Minnesota
6-5, 238
- Campbell has an insane combination of size and speed. He can set the edge, rush the passer, and is great in open space. He's a little raw with only 1 year of starting experience under his belt, but displays natural instincts and has a great motor. I know we have continually addressed the OLB position recently (to little success) but I could see Campbell being a long-term option as a SAM linebacker. He won't be an immediate impact player, but has extremely high upside and could make the underwhelming John Simon expendable pretty quickly.

5 (from NE) Connor McGovern - OG, Missouri
6-4, 304
- A natural OG with 28 career starts coming into his senior season (24 at RG, 4 at RT). He is playing out of position this year at LT out of team necessity. McGovern is a great athlete that runs 4.9 in the forty, jumps 34 inches in the vertical, and can lift 40 bench reps. He also broke the school squat record with an 810 pound squat. He's less heralded than teammate Evan Boehm, but his game might be a better fit for the pros because of his athleticism and pure power. He's a former wrestler and power-lifter and a two-time All-SEC academic selection. He adds depth inside to an underwhelming interior group.
 
WolverineFan said:
74 TD's to 13 INT's and a 68.5% while playing in (primarily) a WCO.

If he's 6-4 people are talking about him as a top 10 lock. He's 6-1 though so all the hype is on guys like Jones and Hackenberg who just don't have the tape to support that kind of grade.
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Let Jones and Hack get the hype. I'll prefer Kess to be there when we pick.
 
Mollywhopper said:
Let Jones and Hack get the hype. I'll prefer Kess to be there when we pick.
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So would I. I think Goff is clearly tier 1 in this draft. That 2nd tier would be Cook and Kessler and I prefer Kessler. Cook just screams game manager to me. I also like Nate Sudfeld but I think he's a guy you need to sit down for a year.
 
Not a fan of RB in RD 1 unless it is a Peterson type back. At this point I think Texans have to go Goff, Cook or Wentz in RD 1. Kessler is just another USC QB, I like Spriggs but also like John Theus as much or more and the guy I really like from Missouri is Evan Boehm.
 
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I like Elliott a lot but I think you can get much better value going RB in the 2nd or 3rd unless we're talking about a guy who is just otherworldly good. And while Elliott is clearly the top back in this class, I don't think he's that good. I understand the need and the want but the drop-off at the position is so much smaller than what you get at other positions. I'll give an example using last year's draft:

Say you're picking right in the middle and you need a RB and a CB. Would you rather have:

Melvin Gordon and P.J. Williams/Alex Carter/Craig Mager
OR
Kevin Johnson/Marcus Peters and Tevin Coleman/David Johnson/Matt Jones

The gap between Johnson and Mager dwarfs the gap between Gordon and Jones. And it's not really close. That's not to say you can't still get good players. A RB in the first just has to be absolutely special for me to want to pull the trigger that early.
 
I really like Kessler. I do think the height could be an issue though. I'm not saying it is, I'm just saying it could be. The throwing lanes won't be the same in the pros and there is no way to know if he'll be able to find them until you throw him out there. I love everything else about his makeup, and taking him in the 2nd instead of the 1st makes me fell better about the pick. It's certainly worth the risk.

I know about Spriggs. I like what I've seen so far. But I haven't really done enough homework on him yet to judge. This seems like about the area he would go though.

I love Ott and I love Campbell. I think both of those guys are underrated in scouting circles right now. Both studs who could fall through the cracks.

McGovern is another guy that I like. I probably like Boehm a little bit more. I love OL with wrestling backgrounds.
 
bah007 said:
I like Elliott a lot but I think you can get much better value going RB in the 2nd or 3rd unless we're talking about a guy who is just otherworldly good. And while Elliott is clearly the top back in this class, I don't think he's that good. I understand the need and the want but the drop-off at the position is so much smaller than what you get at other positions. I'll give an example using last year's draft:

Say you're picking right in the middle and you need a RB and a CB. Would you rather have:

Melvin Gordon and P.J. Williams/Alex Carter/Craig Mager
OR
Kevin Johnson/Marcus Peters and Tevin Coleman/David Johnson/Matt Jones

The gap between Johnson and Mager dwarfs the gap between Gordon and Jones. And it's not really close. That's not to say you can't still get good players. A RB in the first just has to be absolutely special for me to want to pull the trigger that early.
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I would be more willing to go QB in round 1 and RB in round 2 if I thought there was a worthwhile QB available in round 1. With Goff off the board I'd rather have Elliott/Kessler than Cook/Booker. I also considered OT but Tunsil/Stanley are off the board at this point and I'm not all that impressed with Decker or Conklin.

Going RB in the 1st is a bit against the grain nowadays but I'm really more concerned with talent than position. Elliott is more talented than the other guys I see available at that point and it still allows for Kessler in the 2nd (who I like).
 
I know both of you guys are big Booker fans (I liked him coming into the season) but I've watched 3 of his games this year and he looks noticeably less explosive. Not sure if he's hurt or what but he doesn't have the same pop with the ball in his hands as he did last year. He's averaging barely over 4 ypc and only has like 7 carries of 10+ yards on over 100 carries.
 
WolverineFan said:
I would be more willing to go QB in round 1 and RB in round 2 if I thought there was a worthwhile QB available in round 1. With Goff off the board I'd rather have Elliott/Kessler than Cook/Booker. I also considered OT but Tunsil/Stanley are off the board at this point and I'm not all that impressed with Decker or Conklin.

Going RB in the 1st is a bit against the grain nowadays but I'm really more concerned with talent than position. Elliott is more talented than the other guys I see available at that point and it still allows for Kessler in the 2nd (who I like).
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Of course, it's impossible to judge in a vacuum. It matters who was taken before the pick and who will be on the board later.

I don't even hate the Elliott pick. I think he'll be a good player. It's just not the pick I would make.
 
WolverineFan said:
I know both of you guys are big Booker fans (I liked him coming into the season) but I've watched 3 of his games this year and he looks noticeably less explosive. Not sure if he's hurt or what but he doesn't have the same pop with the ball in his hands as he did last year. He's averaging barely over 4 ypc and only has like 7 carries of 10+ yards on over 100 carries.
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I just think a lot of the little things that Booker does now will transition to the pros well. Perhaps even a little better than Zeke.

How he gets yards in creases, runs behind his pads, gets off the ground quickly laterally, and is often seemingly fighting past defenders from his own backfield. The pro game might actually be smoother for him. His pass protection and catching ability are also huge bonuses.

But this isn't a thread for that kid. I like Elliot. I'm just concerned with him running in NFL traffic. The tools are fantastic. I'm hoping he's mature enough to deal with some initial pushback at the next level.
 
WolverineFan said:
After 3 games we sit at 1-2 and don't look anything close to a playoff team. I see us finishing with a 7-9 or 8-8 type season and drafting in the middle of the 1st round yet again. I'm firmly on the Jared Goff bandwagon, but I don't see us being in any position to draft him from the middle of the round. Therefore, this is my best attempt at a talent grab in a Goff-less draft.


1) Ezekiel Elliott - RB, Ohio State
6-0, 225
- In an era where most college teams run the position by committee, Elliott is a rare feature back. He totes the rock, catches the ball, and pass protects. He has ideal size for an NFL RB but also has home run speed and was the catalyst for Ohio State's national title run last year running for 796 yards and 8 TD's in their final 3 games. Despite his size he is also elusive in the open field and excels at using his burst to destroy angles and leave defenders grasping at air. In 26 career games at OSU he has 2,595 rushing yards and 25 TD's while averaging 6.8 yards per carry. If you're looking for an immediate successor to Arian Foster as our feature back, here's your answer.

2) Cody Kessler - QB, USC
6-1, 215
- He has the numbers and the pedigree to be a top 20 pick but will be regarded lower than guys like Cook, Hackenberg, etc because he is "too short". I don't care. He is the ultimate distributor and would thrive in a system where he is allowed to be the point guard. He's very accurate and doesn't turn the ball over. He's not the sexiest pick at QB because he lacks the upside of a guy like Andrew Luck, but there's nothing wrong with being a top notch distributor. I see him as a poor man's Drew Brees at the next level.

3) Jason Spriggs - OT, Indiana
6-7, 306
- Former TE recruit that had a growth spurt his redshirt year and moved to OT. He has 34 career starts at LT coming into his senior season. He's a 3-time honorable mention All-Big Ten selection and should take the next step this year. He paved the way for Tevin Coleman's 2,000+ rushing yards last year with 45 knockdowns and current transfer RB, Jordan Howard, leads the NCAA in rushing yards. Being a former TE, he is a great athlete running a 4.82 forty, jumping 37.5 inches in the vertical, and lifting 33 bench reps. IMO, he would be a borderline 1st round prospect if he played at a more prominent program.

4) Drew Ott - DE, Iowa
6-4, 272
- A Jared Crick clone that has 18.5 TFL and 10.5 Sacks coming into his senior year. He was 2nd Team All-Big Ten as a junior and was off to a quick start this year (3 Sacks in 2 games) before injuring his wrist. The wrist injury will likely hold him out for a large portion of the season, which will likely drop him a round or so in the draft, thus making him available this late. He has a relentless motor and is very powerful at the point of attack and we need depth on the D-Line, especially with Crick being a free agent this offseason.

5) De'Vondre Campbell - OLB, Minnesota
6-5, 238
- Campbell has an insane combination of size and speed. He can set the edge, rush the passer, and is great in open space. He's a little raw with only 1 year of starting experience under his belt, but displays natural instincts and has a great motor. I know we have continually addressed the OLB position recently (to little success) but I could see Campbell being a long-term option as a SAM linebacker. He won't be an immediate impact player, but has extremely high upside and could make the underwhelming John Simon expendable pretty quickly.

5 (from NE) Connor McGovern - OG, Missouri
6-4, 304
- A natural OG with 28 career starts coming into his senior season (24 at RG, 4 at RT). He is playing out of position this year at LT out of team necessity. McGovern is a great athlete that runs 4.9 in the forty, jumps 34 inches in the vertical, and can lift 40 bench reps. He also broke the school squat record with an 810 pound squat. He's less heralded than teammate Evan Boehm, but his game might be a better fit for the pros because of his athleticism and pure power. He's a former wrestler and power-lifter and a two-time All-SEC academic selection. He adds depth inside to an underwhelming interior group.
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I think Kessler is my favorite QB in the class . He can stick the ball in a tight spot and watching him at USC looks like the minor league version of Green Bay .
 
bah007 said:
I like Elliott a lot but I think you can get much better value going RB in the 2nd or 3rd unless we're talking about a guy who is just otherworldly good. And while Elliott is clearly the top back in this class, I don't think he's that good. I understand the need and the want but the drop-off at the position is so much smaller than what you get at other positions. I'll give an example using last year's draft:

Say you're picking right in the middle and you need a RB and a CB. Would you rather have:

Melvin Gordon and P.J. Williams/Alex Carter/Craig Mager
OR
Kevin Johnson/Marcus Peters and Tevin Coleman/David Johnson/Matt Jones

The gap between Johnson and Mager dwarfs the gap between Gordon and Jones. And it's not really close. That's not to say you can't still get good players. A RB in the first just has to be absolutely special for me to want to pull the trigger that early.
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Agreed,

What I really would like would be to get a Prosseire type RB in the 3rd in the 16 draft and then draft a true difference maker Fournette/Chubb/Cook/Hurd in the 1st in 2017.
 
steelbtexan said:
Agreed,

What I really would like would be to get a Prosseire type RB in the 3rd in the 16 draft and then draft a true difference maker Fournette/Chubb/Cook/Hurd in the 1st in 2017.
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Rick Smith will just pluck another future all pro running back as an undrafted free agent. We'll probably do what we always do. Go defense in first round (safety we need big time), and hopefully we target some huge needs in round two and three. Quarterback will be one of them if Ryan Mallett doesn't light it up the rest of the season. I thought he played well versus Tampa Bay so that was a good sign.
 
Bulls on Parade said:
I don't like his size. 6'1 and 215? Seems kind of small for a pro level QB. Maybe he's the next Drew Brees. What is Brees? 6 foot and 209 or so? But those guys are in the minority.
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He's an inch shorter than Rodgers or Bridgewater and and inch or two taller than Brees or Wilson. He's spot on even with Tyrod Taylor.

It's something, but it doesn't have to be a deal breaker. He's a smart, athletic kid. I think he can make it work. His tape seems to too.
 
Bulls on Parade said:
I don't like his size. 6'1 and 215? Seems kind of small for a pro level QB. Maybe he's the next Drew Brees. What is Brees? 6 foot and 209 or so? But those guys are in the minority.
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Minority sure but hardly nonviable:

Brees 6' 209 lbs
Wilson 5'11" 203 lbs
Rodgers 6'2" 223 lbs

Bridgewater 6'2" 214 lbs
Manziel 6' 207 lbs

I get when people are hung up on an inch or 2 out of 6 but not 75.
 
Remember that game, last year I think it was, against Notre Dame.
A guy like that would definitely be a dream come true for Bill O'Brien.


In fact, this guy reminds me of Aaron Rodgers when he played at CAL.

 
steelbtexan said:
Agreed,

What I really would like would be to get a Prosseire type RB in the 3rd in the 16 draft and then draft a true difference maker Fournette/Chubb/Cook/Hurd in the 1st in 2017.
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I think we're at the point where we can't just keep waiting for the next class or the next class or the next class to replace Foster. He's always hurt, he's almost 30, and he has a ton of tread on his tires. I love Fournette but I'm not going to throw all my post-Foster cards into that basket and just hope for the best. The odds of being in the right spot to take him are not all that high. I think Fournette, Elliott, and Gurley are all extremely talented backs. In terms of talent I would put them at Fournette > Gurley > Elliott although in terms of draft-ability I would put them at Fournette > Elliott > Gurley because Gurley's knee injuries scare me. I don't think passing on Elliott just for the hope of getting Fourentte is a very sound long-term plan (obviously the caveat being that we like Elliott).
 
Bulls on Parade said:
I don't like his size. 6'1 and 215? Seems kind of small for a pro level QB. Maybe he's the next Drew Brees. What is Brees? 6 foot and 209 or so? But those guys are in the minority.
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The whole QB size prototype is being debunked by the year. Would you prefer a guy who is 6'5, 235 because he is likely more durable? Sure. But this mindset of automatically discounting any QB who isn't prototype size is ridiculous. 3 of the top 5 QB's in QB Rating this year are 6'2 or shorter.
 
WolverineFan said:
The whole QB size prototype is being debunked by the year. Would you prefer a guy who is 6'5, 235 because he is likely more durable? Sure. But this mindset of automatically discounting any QB who isn't prototype size is ridiculous. 3 of the top 5 QB's in QB Rating this year are 6'2 or shorter.
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Agreed.

If you don't meet the size criteria that should be a ding on your grade. Not because it's a definite issue but because it's a potential issue. It shouldn't automatically disqualify you from the conversation.

The thing with Kessler is that it's just about his only ding. I also worry if he has the zip to drive the ball to the sideline against quicker NFL CBs but he seems adequate enough in that area. That's something I'm still studying, not necessarily a ding at this moment.

The whole idea about only drafting "prototypes" is ridiculous in nature anyway. That goes for all positions, not just QB. I remember size being a big concern about Odell Beckham on this board when I said he was a better prospect than Watkins and Evans. I remember size being used against Aaron Donald. It's one piece of information that goes along with dozens of others. Take it into account. But don't base the entire decision on it.
 
WolverineFan said:
I think we're at the point where we can't just keep waiting for the next class or the next class or the next class to replace Foster. He's always hurt, he's almost 30, and he has a ton of tread on his tires. I love Fournette but I'm not going to throw all my post-Foster cards into that basket and just hope for the best. The odds of being in the right spot to take him are not all that high. I think Fournette, Elliott, and Gurley are all extremely talented backs. In terms of talent I would put them at Fournette > Gurley > Elliott although in terms of draft-ability I would put them at Fournette > Elliott > Gurley because Gurley's knee injuries scare me. I don't think passing on Elliott just for the hope of getting Fourentte is a very sound long-term plan (obviously the caveat being that we like Elliott).
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I like all 4 RB's that I listed as much or more than Elliot. Although I do think Elliot is talented. The chances of one of the 4 I listed falling to 15 or so in 2017 are good. Elliott who is good but not as good as those I listed will go in the top 10-15 and the Texans have bigger holes to fill.

In 2016 give me Foster and Booker etc... and in 2017 Booker and one of the 4 I listed, letting Foster go.
 
steelbtexan said:
I like all 4 RB's that I listed as much or more than Elliot. Although I do think Elliot is talented. The chances of one of the 4 I listed falling to 15 or so in 2017 are good. Elliott who is good but not as good as those I listed will go in the top 10-15 and the Texans have bigger holes to fill.

In 2016 give me Foster and Booker etc... and in 2017 Booker and one of the 4 I listed, letting Foster go.
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So we have too big of holes to fill to use a 1st on a RB this year but you have no problem using a 2nd/3rd this year and 1st next year to shore up the position? That doesn't make much sense.
 
steelbtexan said:
I like all 4 RB's that I listed as much or more than Elliot. Although I do think Elliot is talented. The chances of one of the 4 I listed falling to 15 or so in 2017 are good. Elliott who is good but not as good as those I listed will go in the top 10-15 and the Texans have bigger holes to fill.

In 2016 give me Foster and Booker etc... and in 2017 Booker and one of the 4 I listed, letting Foster go.
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We have more holes to fill but let's draft one position early in the next two drafts ... ok.
 
WolverineFan said:
So we have too big of holes to fill to use a 1st on a RB this year but you have no problem using a 2nd/3rd this year and 1st next year to shore up the position? That doesn't make much sense.
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I just like Fournette/Chubb/Cook/Hurd alot more than I like any RB in the 2016 draft and settling for a lesser RB because you need one in 2016 would be a mistake. IMHO
 
Are there any safeties who you think we could draft in the second or third round? I definitely want to draft one early. Maybe even in the first round. What safety prospects are there? No disrespect but the two starting safeties we have now are complete garbage.
 
Cant take a runningback in the first round. If a quarterback isn't available, you draft an inside linebacker or offensive lineman. And that's all I have to say about that.
 
Bulls on Parade said:
Are there any safeties who you think we could draft in the second or third round? I definitely want to draft one early. Maybe even in the first round. What safety prospects are there? No disrespect but the two starting safeties we have now are complete garbage.
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FS
Jalen Ramsey, Florida St - Top 10 Pick
Jalen Mills, LSU - 2nd/3rd Round
Karl Joseph, West Virginia - 3rd Round

SS
Vonn Bell, Ohio St* - 2nd Round
Darian Thompson, Boise St - 2nd Round
Jeremy Cash, Duke - 2nd/3rd Round
 
Scooter said:
Cant take a runningback in the first round. If a quarterback isn't available, you draft an inside linebacker or offensive lineman. And that's all I have to say about that.
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Right now I have (3) QBs who could be potential first rd picks, my preference, 1. Carson Wentz 2. Jared Goff 3. Connor Cook (subject to change). If the Texans are picking in the Top 15 they should have a good chance at one of the three.
 
bah007 said:
FS
Jalen Ramsey, Florida St - Top 10 Pick
Jalen Mills, LSU - 2nd/3rd Round
Karl Joseph, West Virginia - 3rd Round

SS
Vonn Bell, Ohio St* - 2nd Round
Darian Thompson, Boise St - 2nd Round
Jeremy Cash, Duke - 2nd/3rd Round
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Love Cash and Joseph.

If I were drafting this is what I would hope would happen

Rd.1 Hackenberg or Wentz
Rd.2 Theus
Rd.3 Booker
Rd.3 after trading up Joseh or Cash.

I'm really just starting look at the 2016 draft.
 
bah007 said:
FS
Jalen Ramsey, Florida St - Top 10 Pick
Jalen Mills, LSU - 2nd/3rd Round
Karl Joseph, West Virginia - 3rd Round

SS
Vonn Bell, Ohio St* - 2nd Round
Darian Thompson, Boise St - 2nd Round
Jeremy Cash, Duke - 2nd/3rd Round
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Also Elijah Shumate (Notre Dame), Tony Conner (Ole Miss), and Jordan Lucas (Penn State). The Safety group this year is very top heavy. Not a lot of depth although Ramsey is an elite prospect and I wouldn't be shocked to see Bell go 1st round.
 
Scooter said:
Cant take a runningback in the first round. If a quarterback isn't available, you draft an inside linebacker or offensive lineman. And that's all I have to say about that.
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So just a hypothetical but would you take a LB or OL even if you thought he was an inferior player to an available RB?
 
WolverineFan said:
Ezekiel Elliot 2nd half vs Indiana...

13 carries for 234 yards and 3 TD's.
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I am a huge Elliot fan (still mock him as the Texans first round pick), but those stats make him look better than he was. Not only was Indiana's best DL missing, but the OSU OLine opened some huge holes for Elliot.

That said, his speed is incredible for a 225 lbs back, and he does a fantastic job upsetting the defenders' angles, which is why he does not get caught from behind very often.

EDIT- and Cardale Jones sucks. It is amazing what being 6'5" 250 lbs will do for a prospect's hype.
 
rmartin65 said:
I am a huge Elliot fan (still mock him as the Texans first round pick), but those stats make him look better than he was. Not only was Indiana's best DL missing, but the OSU OLine opened some huge holes for Elliot.

That said, his speed is incredible for a 225 lbs back, and he does a fantastic job upsetting the defenders' angles, which is why he does not get caught from behind very often.

EDIT- and Cardale Jones sucks. It is amazing what being 6'5" 250 lbs will do for a prospect's hype.
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Indiana is usually a stat padder so yea they made him look pretty good. He was 10 for 39 without the 3 long TD runs. He did pretty much single handedly win OSU the game though and on two of those long TD runs he made a guy miss at the LOS and then outran everyone else. He's one of those unique guys who can fight for the tough yards inside but also hit the home run if you give him a crease.
 
WolverineFan said:
Indiana is usually a stat padder so yea they made him look pretty good. He was 10 for 39 without the 3 long TD runs. He did pretty much single handedly win OSU the game though and on two of those long TD runs he made a guy miss at the LOS and then outran everyone else. He's one of those unique guys who can fight for the tough yards inside but also hit the home run if you give him a crease.
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Which is why he translates to the NFL, despite playing behind a good line. He is the total package.
 
I have to admit I really haven't seen enough of Eliot to make a fair and honest evaluation. What I did see in his 3 BIG runs is 2 of 3 no one laid a hand on him. It reminded a lot of Ryan Mathews when he was at Fresno State. Most of Mathews best runs were very similar in that no one laid a hand him. For me it's hard to evaluate a RB when most of his highlights are unimpeded TD runs. At the time I said that Mathews was not a first rounder and any team who took him early would have buyers remorse and San Diego did. Mathews success came against average or below average defenses. Against better defenses, Mathews was pretty much a non factor and why I had graded Mathews as a 3rd rounder.
 
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I find it exceedingly difficult to mock for this organization going on 14 years now but you guys keep turning out good mocks that lift my hopes - but only momentarily. Because long as McNair's own Texans and they are satisfied with talent Rick Smith provides their Head Coach this thing ain't ever getting fixed.

This mock may need to be adjusted due to under performance & higher slotted draft pick than anticipated?

QB with that first pick is a must for me to even move forward. We cannot continue to subject teammates, fans & city of Houston to this continued, woeful display from the QB position.

Much as I like Elliot, which is a lot Texans need to focus on-

Jared Goff, QB Cal 6'4" 210 lbs.
 
beerlover said:
Much as I like Elliot, which is a lot Texans need to focus on-

Jared Goff, QB Cal 6'4" 210 lbs.
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If Goff is available you take him. No hesitation.

I took Elliott in my mock because I figured we would be drafting in the mid-teens again. After today...not so much. This thing looks like its ready to snowball and we could conceivably end up with a top 3 pick in the end if we don't get this thing back on the tracks.
 
The texans will be drafting top 5. Goff will be close enough to get as long as a couple of qb needy teams aren't worse. The Texans look like the worse team in football.
 
Mollywhopper said:
But what about a lesser LB or OL?

:kitten:
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Tease all you want, but today's game is about 2 things. Time in the pocket, and taking away the middle of the field. Aaron Rodgers gets MVP with screens, YAC and time to do his taxes in the pocket. Malcolm Smith gets the first defensive Superbowl MVP in 11 years, as the Seahawk's LOB gets all the recognition for ridiculous linebackers (and Kam) taking away the center of the field. Pats have 6 great linebackers (includes undersized DE's). 5 were drafted by the Pats in the first 2 rounds, 4 were taken by the Pats in the first round. Ninkovich is the anomaly. Offensive line and linebackers - this is the game.

I wanted a 'give me anything' trade down for Jake Matthews and an 'offer anything' trade up for CJ Mosley. Also had Devonta Freeman in the 4th and McCarron in the 5th ... but hey, take those high ceiling players skill players like other losing franchises. On my imaginary GM Recliner, I draft lifetime players - repeatedly. Quarterbacks make and break franchises, but there's a lot of bend available when drafting 'lifetime' players to carry the franchise. Legacies are a premium, offensive linemen and interior linebackers are the core, take them at every opportunity. 'Oh No! I have to pay too many offensive linemen!' -- said no GM ever.

This post was made after Midnight. It might have a nugget of sanity, so I'll leave it.
 
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Scooter said:
Tease all you want, but today's game is about 2 things. Time in the pocket, and taking away the middle of the field. Aaron Rodgers gets MVP with screens, YAC and time to do his taxes in the pocket. Malcolm Smith gets the first defensive Superbowl MVP in 11 years, as the Seahawk's LOB gets all the recognition for ridiculous linebackers (and Kam) taking away the center of the field. Pats have 6 great linebackers (includes undersized DE's). 5 were drafted by the Pats in the first 2 rounds, 4 were taken by the Pats in the first round. Ninkovich is the anomaly. Offensive line and linebackers - this is the game.

I wanted a 'give me anything' trade down for Jake Matthews and an 'offer anything' trade up for CJ Mosley. Also had Devonta Freeman in the 4th and McCarron in the 5th ... but hey, take those high ceiling players skill players like other losing franchises. On my imaginary GM Recliner, I draft lifetime players - repeatedly. Quarterbacks make and break franchises, but there's a lot of bend available when drafting 'lifetime' players to carry the franchise. Legacies are a premium, offensive linemen and interior linebackers are the core, take them at every opportunity. 'Oh No! I have to pay too many offensive linemen!' -- said no GM ever.

This post was made after Midnight. It might have a nugget of sanity, so I'll leave it.
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wut?
 
Scooter said:
Exactly.

There's a reason so many of my posts are "edit" and "nevermind".
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I mean, there's nuggets of info in there but nothing cohesive to take and discuss with. Except you seem to be sold on LBs being so much more important, which is kinda just a running in circles debatable. After QB, or a premier LT or premier pass rusher, everything just kinda falls into one mess of either scheme or uber-talent. And the whole point here is that Elliot may be an uber-talent at RB (he may not be, different discussion) and with Foster winding down taking that uber-RB takes priority over a lesser LB or OL who could be one of a few others later in the draft.
 
Mollywhopper said:
I mean, there's nuggets of info in there but nothing cohesive to take and discuss with. Except you seem to be sold on LBs being so much more important, which is kinda just a running in circles debatable. After QB, or a premier LT or premier pass rusher, everything just kinda falls into one mess of either scheme or uber-talent. And the whole point here is that Elliot may be an uber-talent at RB (he may not be, different discussion) and with Foster winding down taking that uber-RB takes priority over a lesser LB or OL who could be one of a few others later in the draft.
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I don't think so. We have (when healthy) the best runningback in the NFL. We had him at his peak under a head coach who could make the most of his talents and a scheme to maximize that talent. And what came of it? Is Elliot better than prime Foster? Can he quite literally carry the franchise? I don't think so, because the odds of him being as good as Foster or Peterson (who also can't carry the franchise alone) are slim. Jim Brown on the Texans is not going to change our fate. Jake Matthews and CJ Mosley would do quite a bit of good for the next 10 years. Franchise players, lifetime players. They're not pretty, but winning teams without all-world quarterbacks like the Steelers and Ravens have never been called pretty.

Edit: The best example I can think of is Dallas taking Frederick an entire round early (with cooler heads adding Martin the following draft). They got their center for the next 15 years ... done. This is a winning philosophy IMO. First 2 rounds need to be players who are expected to be lifetime players - not projects, not greatest evers ... lifetime starters. Swing for the fences after that.
 
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Scooter said:
I don't think so. We have (when healthy) the best runningback in the NFL. We had him at his peak under a head coach who could make the most of his talents and a scheme to maximize that talent. And what came of it? Is Elliot better than prime Foster? Can he quite literally carry the franchise? I don't think so, because the odds of him being as good as Foster or Peterson (who also can't carry the franchise alone) are slim. Jim Brown on the Texans is not going to change our fate. Jake Matthews and CJ Mosley would do quite a bit of good for the next 10 years. Franchise players, lifetime players. They're not pretty, but winning teams without all-world quarterbacks like the Steelers and Ravens have never been called pretty.
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You're now counting Jake Matthews and CJ Mosley as lesser LBs or OL? And we aren't arguing over whether Elliot is that good, that's not the premise. And why are you arguing taking two guys over one?

I think this has jumped the track.
 
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