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Should the Redskins change their name?

Should the Washington Redskins change their name?

  • Yes

    Votes: 34 29.1%
  • No

    Votes: 83 70.9%

  • Total voters
    117

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Over sensitive America ....


Too many people worried about what someone else does offending someone ... & the people it might be offensive to aren't the ones making a stink.
 

Playoffs

Hall of Fame
This has nothing to do with the past, and everything to do with political correctness as a means to exercising power.

WHY LEFT VICIOUSLY ATTACKS RGIII, BEN CARSON
'There's too much political correctness going on in our country'


...
Borelli said the liberal culture fiercely condemns anyone who dares to challenge the ideology of the left, but she said there is special venom reserved for conservative blacks who dare to speak their minds.

“It’s all about control. The people on the left are unable to control people’s words and their actions. When you have someone like RGIII or someone like Dr. Benjamin Carson, even myself, who was vocal about liberty and people being independent and not relying on the government for example, that’s a problem for those on the left who want to control the message,” said Borelli, who noted that the liberal fear of independent thought is especially evident in the hostility aimed at Dr. Carson. She said his life is the embodiment of what is great about America, but his personal ideology makes him a target of scorn from the left instead.

Borelli said the intensity of the criticism aimed at black conservatives comes with a very clear message to all blacks from the liberal establishment.

“That is to set an example for others to not do the same thing, for anyone else to not be vocal about what they really think. Unfortunately, that works. It’s something that is very effective, making people an example of something and no one else is going to step up and challenge the so-called status quo,” Borelli said.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Yes and changed the name of that stupid team in Florida with my picture on the helmet. signed Flipper
 

Thorn

Dirty Old Man
So who is going to admit to voting "yes" on this?

I'm with the others who've posted so far, this PC crap can kiss my ass.
 

Rey

Guest
I voted yes just for the entertainment factor.

Would love for the skins to announce they are changing their name just to see all the hoopla around it...
 

Yvette

Waterboy
cak, no amount of spin will cause me to feel any different or think it's any less racist and derogatory.

Obviously, what I say and how I feel doesn't matter to the majority of you all either.
 

Rey

Guest
cak, no amount of spin will cause me to feel any different or think it's any less racist and derogatory.

Obviously, what I say and how I feel doesn't matter to the majority of you all either.
Actually it does matter to me.

I think people that have strong Native American ancestry are the exact people that should be voicing their opinions on this...
 

infantrycak

Hall of Fame
cak, no amount of spin will cause me to feel any different or think it's any less racist and derogatory.

Obviously, what I say and how I feel doesn't matter to the majority of you all either.
Context is not spin - please don't lower your discourse in that fashion. I respect your opinion. I also take it in context. The polling of Native Americans shows you are in a small minority on this issue.
 

Dan B.

Hall of Fame
My best friend's sister's boyfriend's brother's girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who's going with the girl who saw a Native American at 31 Flavors last night. Does that make me Indian?
 

Yvette

Waterboy
The polling of Native Americans shows you are in a small minority on this issue.
http://www.annenbergpublicpolicycenter.org/downloads/political_communication/naes/2004_03_redskins_09-24_pr.pdf

A telephone poll? Seriously? Where anyone can claim ancestry? How many of those 768 were really NAI? How many were federally recognized tribes? How many were state? How many of them were cultural? How many were just claiming blood quantum of 1/100?

Does that make me Indian?
Sure, if you answer the phone during a redskins poll.
 

infantrycak

Hall of Fame
http://www.annenbergpublicpolicycenter.org/downloads/political_communication/naes/2004_03_redskins_09-24_pr.pdf

A telephone poll? Seriously? Where anyone can claim ancestry? How many of those 768 were really NAI? How many were federally recognized tribes? How many were state? How many of them were cultural? How many were just claiming blood quantum of 1/100?


Sure, if you answer the phone during a redskins poll.
Apparently not too many were racing to call themselves Native American.

This report deals with interviewing conducted from Oct. 7, 2003, through September 20, 2004. In that period 65,047 adults were interviewed, of whom 768 identified themselves as Indians or Native Americans.
That would be 1.2% of people contacted. I am sure there was a conspiracy to skew the results - "hey maybe if I am called on this non-publically announced poll I will claim I am Native American to keep a derogatory name." So seriously right back at ya.

What do you want freaking DNA results? Please by all means state the acceptable "Native American" levels to have an opinion.

And you don't even see the irony in your bringing in "Federal recognition" on this issue?
 

eriadoc

Texan-American
http://www.annenbergpublicpolicycenter.org/downloads/political_communication/naes/2004_03_redskins_09-24_pr.pdf

A telephone poll? Seriously? Where anyone can claim ancestry? How many of those 768 were really NAI? How many were federally recognized tribes? How many were state? How many of them were cultural? How many were just claiming blood quantum of 1/100?


Sure, if you answer the phone during a redskins poll.
Apparently not too many were racing to call themselves Native American.



That would be 1.2% of people contacted. I am sure there was a conspiracy to skew the results - "hey maybe if I am called on this non-publically announced poll I will claim I am Native American to keep a derogatory name." So seriously right back at ya.

What do you want freaking DNA results? Please by all means state the acceptable "Native American" levels to have an opinion.

And you don't even see the irony in your bringing in "Federal recognition" on this issue?
LOL, this is like a "not black enough" argument. LMAO
 

Yvette

Waterboy
There are almost 3 million NAI from federally recognized tribes. The distinction between federal and state recognition is there for a reason. Anyone can claim NAI blood but to obtain federal recognition you must prove it. Lots of people attempt to claim federal NAI ancestry because of real or imagined benefits. There are also quite a few out there who claim tribal affiliation but are 'adopted' (an honorary status).

If Natives from NAI colleges, reservations, outreach offices were polled, I would give serious consideration to those results, as I would any opinion from cultural Indians.

'In name only' doesn't count and I have no reason to believe those 768 people are anything other than that.
 

eriadoc

Texan-American
'In name only' doesn't count and I have no reason to believe those 768 people are anything other than that.
So they're not Indian/Redskin/Native American enough for ya.

I'm either 1/16 or 1/32 Nez Perce. The ancestry is just a little fuzzy, and frankly, I've never given enough of a damn to track it down and clear it up. I've never applied for any sort of recognition or benefits, because in the end, I am an American. That means I am a mutt, just like everyone else here. Only, I embrace it instead of seeking some sort of exclusivity. So where does that attitude fit in your worldview of who should and should not be responding to polls?
 

Yvette

Waterboy
If you don't identify as a Native in ancestry and culture, then your opinion of Native ancestry and culture doesn't count.
 

toronto

Hall of Fame
So who is going to admit to voting "yes" on this?

I'm with the others who've posted so far, this PC crap can kiss my ass.
I voted yes. Always found the name in poor taste. Just me. Strongly expect to be in a massive minority here.

I don't feel strongly on the subject, I don't have a dog in the fight like Yvette.
 

HOU-TEX

Ah, Football!
Pretty sure the Redskins have been the team name since the 30's, right? Yet, it's becoming an issue 80 years later? PC my ass, just straight pansy-ass if you ask me. Then again, seems right for todays culture
 

eriadoc

Texan-American
If you don't identify as a Native in ancestry and culture, then your opinion of Native ancestry and culture doesn't count.
Ancestry is what it is. I can't change it and neither can you. Culture is what you live, so I can agree with that part of your statement. But I am descended from the Nez Perce tribe and that's just a fact.

Just so everyone knows, I'm resurrecting this thread the next time we have a "cornball brother" or "Uncle Tom" debate, LOL.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
cak, no amount of spin will cause me to feel any different or think it's any less racist and derogatory.

Obviously, what I say and how I feel doesn't matter to the majority of you all either.
I have a significant amount of Native American's in my family tree - three of my four great grandmothers were either Comanche or Cherokee .... I got the dark skin (who needs sunscreen?!)..... with blonde hair and blue eyes. Im probably bout as indian they come off the reservation .... Maybe that explains why I don't handle liquor well.

The term while historically derogatory is buried so far back in the history of this country , it just doesn't carry much meaning to me.


Context would have to be taken into consideration for me , Im not offended by a word , rather how its used.
 

Yvette

Waterboy
Yet, it's becoming an issue 80 years later?
It was an issue then, among many others, but no one was listening.

Natives were first declared US citizens in 1924 but were not uniformly allowed to vote until the establishment of the 1965 Voting Rights Act.
 

HOU-TEX

Ah, Football!
I've been called a "cracker" before. First time I'd ever heard the term and damn near passed out from laughing so hard. Have a smirk on my face by just typing this. lol
 

infantrycak

Hall of Fame
It was an issue then, among many others, but no one was listening.

Natives were first declared US citizens in 1924 but were not uniformly allowed to vote until the establishment of the 1965 Voting Rights Act.
Which means zilch to whether a mascot name is derogatory.

Fundamental fact - mascots are chosen out of RESPECT not derision.
 

eriadoc

Texan-American
Fundamental fact - mascots are chosen out of RESPECT not derision.
Which is why we don't have the Washington Liars or Washington Crooks. Or hey, now we could have them change their name to the Washington Snoops and put the NSA seal on the helmet.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Since Redskins owner Snyder came out just the other day and publically stated he WILL NOT change the teams name, it's gonna be interesting to see if that
solidifies or undermines support for retaining the name ?
 

Yvette

Waterboy
I've been called a "cracker" before.
I don't remember the Houston Crackers being a choice when choosing the team name.

Which means zilch to whether a mascot name is derogatory.
My factoid pointed out that hardly anyone gave a damn what Indians thought back then.

Thought I'd mention that I'm not debating with any of you. I have no illusions about changing your minds. I hope you all understand I'm not wavering either.

Anyone want to celebrate with me on the 24th? We can all raise a toast together lol

Never mind! I'm late. Citizenship was on 6/2/24.
 
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toronto

Hall of Fame
Which is why we don't have the Washington Liars or Washington Crooks. Or hey, now we could have them change their name to the Washington Snoops and put the NSA seal on the helmet.
Washington Liars has a nice ring to it actually!
 

Rey

Guest
I don't think the Redskins name was chosen as an insult. The original club name was Braves, then Red Sox and eventually Red Skins. They've always had some name dealing with Native Americans.

But I don't think that matters. If the term Redskins is seen as a derogatory name then I think they should at least consider a name change just to not offend anyone. If people aren't really offended by it, and no one cares, then leave it alone.

But if they change mascots I vote for a better version of this one:



Without a doubt, one of the strangest college sports mascots has to be Scrotie, the unofficial mascot of the Rhode Island School of Design. The costume is unique and at the same time horrific, looking exactly like a giant penis wearing a red cape with the scrotum hanging beneath.

The school's basketball team is known as the Balls, and their slogan is, "When the heat is on, the Balls stick together." The hockey team is called the Nads, and their cheer is "Go Nads!" Scrotie was created to cheer on the Nads in 2001. Despite his status as an unofficial mascot, he's present at all the games and widely accepted by the student body. (Link)

Read more at http://www.oddee.com/item_96800.aspx#JoCu798jVl52RZEr.99
http://www.oddee.com/item_96800.aspx

Maybe they can have a female verion and name it Gina.
 

Dutchrudder

Hall of Fame
We really need something much more derogatory and offensive if we are going to go with a political theme .... Liars is much too nice a word to describe politicians.
I think the Washington Redcoats has a nice ring to it. It's a minimal change to the existing name, so it should go over well with fans. Just gotta change the maroon to firetruck red.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
If you don't identify as a Native in ancestry and culture, then your opinion of Native ancestry and culture doesn't count.
Really

My great uncle on my mothers side was a full blood Alabama-Cousha. So I know I've got alot of Native blood in my family. My Dads side has a few Native Americans in his family as well.

But I guess my opinion doesn't count because A. I dont agree with you. B. I dont dwell on these kinds of thing, unlike you.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Actually it does matter to me.

...
Not to me.

I think I'm a worldly man. I've been all over this great country, spoken to all kinds of people. I've heard or read just about every racial pejorative there is... or at least I'd like to think so. I've never heard anyone refer to anyone as a 'skin, I've never heard anyone denigrate anyone using the word "Redskin"

I've heard the pejoratives for Native Americans. Several of them. Never Redskin or 'skin.

To me, this is akin to me waking up tomorrow & saying I find it offensive when people call me a "Bad Mofo"


Now Redman.... I think he should change his name.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Fundamental fact - mascots are chosen out of RESPECT not derision.
A little ot..... not the same thing, but kinda

What do you think about Uncle Kracker? Do you think white folk find that offensive (I'm assuming you're white folk).
 

Dan B.

Hall of Fame
Which means zilch to whether a mascot name is derogatory.

Fundamental fact - mascots are chosen out of RESPECT not derision.
They are chosen to sell jerseys. That's why there is a team called the Nads. It's not out of respect for Nads.

George Marshall bought the Boston Braves and changed the team name to the more offensive term of "Redskins" out of respect? Come on -- at BEST it's a draw as to which name is more inflammatory, and I'm pretty sure on a scale of 1-10 Redskin falls way further down than Braves.

BTW George Marshall was the last guy in football to integrate his team, even when they were a disaster through the 1950's. There's evidence that he was a major force behind the NFL's sudden resegregation in 1933, the year after he bought the Braves. He expressly ordered in his will that his foundation not spend any money on “any purpose which supports or employs the principle of racial integration in any form." He made his "respected" coach dress up in Indian war dress for games. You think Belichek would tolerate that?
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
They are chosen to sell jerseys. That's why there is a team called the Nads. It's not out of respect for Nads.
Redskins
Cowboys
Oilers
Pirates
Patriots
Raiders
Chiefs
49ers
Packers (<-- that's offensive)
Vikings
Buccaneers

All need to change their name before someone finds their "mascot" offensive. Throw Cardinals in there too, ya never know with them Catholics.
 

infantrycak

Hall of Fame
A little ot..... not the same thing, but kinda

What do you think about Uncle Kracker? Do you think white folk find that offensive (I'm assuming you're white folk).
I never thought about it at all.

They are chosen to sell jerseys. That's why there is a team called the Nads. It's not out of respect for Nads.

George Marshall bought the Boston Braves and changed the team name to the more offensive term of "Redskins" out of respect?
Get serious. Like there was some overwhelming anti-Indian demographic when they selected the name which was going to sell more jerseys. That is just ridiculous.

I am sure Marshall was trying to piss off his Indian head coach with a derogatory term.
 

Dan B.

Hall of Fame
I never thought about it at all.



Get serious. Like there was some overwhelming anti-Indian demographic when they selected the name which was going to sell more jerseys. That is just ridiculous.

I am sure Marshall was trying to piss off his Indian head coach with a derogatory term.
Right -- it's just comical to suggest that a pro sports owner in the 1930's didn't respect minorities. Even in 1933, you don't think there were other options besides "Redskins" that might be a little less inflammatory?

Would you support it if we did it here? Say the Texans hired a half Hispanic head coach and McNair made him dress up in a 10 foot sombrero and poncho during games. Then he's sitting around thinking of a new team name for the Texans to honor Texas' Hispanic roots and their new coach:

"Well, we could name them the Matadors, the Warriors, the Vaqueros, or the Wetbacks."
"Hmm... let's go with Wetbacks. that sounds like the most respectful and honorable name."

75 years later, that name would still suck.

George Marshall bought the Redskins in 1932 and owned them until he died in 1969. How many other Native Americans did he honor besides the coach he fired in 1934? What about the other three plus decades, when he was going out of his way to trumpet his racism (playing "Dixie" before the "Star Spangled Banner")? If he was so eager to honor Native Americans he had a great chance to do so -- owning a team where no other race was apparently allowed employment. Why not at least hire Jim Thorpe for PR -- who actually played for the Boston Braves before Marshall bought them?
 
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Dan B.

Hall of Fame
Redskins
Cowboys
Oilers
Pirates
Patriots
Raiders
Chiefs
49ers
Packers (<-- that's offensive)
Vikings
Buccaneers

All need to change their name before someone finds their "mascot" offensive. Throw Cardinals in there too, ya never know with them Catholics.
More like someone buying the team, changing the name from Cardinals to Mackerel Snappers, and then claiming it was out of respect for Catholics.
 

PapaL

Loose Screw
My 2 cents...until the state of Oklahoma changes it's name, the Redskins should not change theirs. Redskins is offensive but red people isn't?
 

Lurvinator11

Veteran
I voted Yes, only because I understand the offensive nature that native American can claim.

Saying that though, if the Redskins were to change their name, then at the very least, I feel like the other Native American themed teams should change their name. That's a lot of trouble to go through, spanning over every major league in the country.

So, it should be changed based on the offending nature to Native Americans, however, I don't think it will be changed. If it was, it would have already happened.
 

Thorn

Dirty Old Man
After reading what Yvette has to say, I can see where some would be offended.

At some point in time though, we have to get past this racial crap and realize we are all one species. Some humans will never understand this however. Narrow-mindedness is something we humans excel at. And we use this against each other while we champion our own version of the "truth".

We are so good at that crap its a wonder we still exist.
 
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