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Ed Reed agrees to terms with Texans

So this year should be like the others? Your just gonna rebuild your defense and Jacoby is gonna step into the shoes of Bolden?

Lol. Now that is some funny chit right there.

Jacoby is not 'stepping into' Boldin's shoes- that's for Tandon Doss, Deonte Thompson, et al. Jacoby is the PR, KR and Speedy WR on the outside.

We signed Chris Canty of the Giants, Marcus Spears for the DLine, Some our own FA's and Dumervil for the DLine.

We lost Ellerbe- but at 7 mill he's over paid by Miami

We Lost Kruger- Browns paid more than double- stupid move- they will cut him in 2 years. Waste of money.

Now Ed leaves in FA- Harbaugh solidifies his hold on the team.

End of the defensive stranglehold in Baltimore.

Ozzie always likes the below the radar signings- not the big splashy ones. Ask Jerry Jones and Dan Snyder how many SB's they have won since signing all these FA's.
 
The Labrum Tear didn't prevent that- it was his nerve impingement.

Not once over the past few seasons where reports have come out concerning “nerve impingement” with neck and shoulder pains, has there ever been referral to a "cervical disc" as his source for his nerve compression. Strange? No. This is evidently because the source is not a cervical disc. When a player like Reed has sustained repeated shoulder trauma including dislocations or subluxations (pop in and out), labrum and/or rotator cuff tears, it can lead to a condition known as Thoracic Outlet Syndrome which causes impingement of all the major nerves to the shoulder and arms......and not only creates weakness in this distribution and pain in these areas, but also many times throughout the distribution of the side of the neck. Repeated trauma to the shoulder area leading to increased inflammation and swelling and thus pressure (impingement) on the nerves only serves to aggravate the severity of the condition.

bc-injury-law-thoracic-outlet.png
 
Not once over the past few seasons where reports have come out concerning “nerve impingement” with neck and shoulder pains, has there ever been referral to a "cervical disc" as his source for his nerve compression. Strange? No. This is evidently because the source is not a cervical disc. When a player like Reed has sustained repeated shoulder trauma including dislocations or subluxations (pop in and out), labrum and/or rotator cuff tears, it can lead to a condition known as Thoracic Outlet Syndrome which causes impingement of all the major nerves to the shoulder and arms......and not only creates weakness in this distribution and pain in these areas, but also many times throughout the distribution of the side of the neck. Repeated trauma to the shoulder area leading to increased inflammation and swelling and thus pressure (impingement) on the nerves only serves to aggravate the severity of the condition.

bc-injury-law-thoracic-outlet.png




For additional explanation of What is thoracic outlet syndrome?, click the link.

Hey DocJean, what's the difference between a torn labrum and a rotator cuff injury? If need be, and not to derail this conversation maybe you could start a thread further down the dial (if you know what I mean)... Thanks, my brother.

Lay terms... please! :D
 
Jacoby is not 'stepping into' Boldin's shoes- that's for Tandon Doss, Deonte Thompson, et al. Jacoby is the PR, KR and Speedy WR on the outside.

We signed Chris Canty of the Giants, Marcus Spears for the DLine, Some our own FA's and Dumervil for the DLine.

We lost Ellerbe- but at 7 mill he's over paid by Miami

We Lost Kruger- Browns paid more than double- stupid move- they will cut him in 2 years. Waste of money.

Now Ed leaves in FA- Harbaugh solidifies his hold on the team.

End of the defensive stranglehold in Baltimore.

Ozzie always likes the below the radar signings- not the big splashy ones. Ask Jerry Jones and Dan Snyder how many SB's they have won since signing all these FA's.

Let me translate.

Everybody we lost is overpaid and sucked.

Everybody we got is not a big name but great.

Lol.
 
Hey DocJean, what's the difference between a torn labrum and a rotator cuff injury? If need be, and not to derail this conversation maybe you could start a thread further down the dial (if you know what I mean)... Thanks, my brother.

Lay terms... please! :D

I'm not the Doc but as a lifter who couldn't touch the top of his head for a year because he blew out his shoulder in competition, I know a thing or four about rotator cuff injuries.

There are 4 muscles that make up the rotator cuff: supraspinatus, infraspinatus, subscapularis, and teres minor. They basically attach your arm to your shoulder blade in a bizarre and confusing tangle.

The LABRUM is actually the tissue on the inside of the shoulder joint that the ball that forms the head of the upper arm bone (the humerus) fits into. There are also bursa sacks up in there that get inflamed (I had one of those and it hurt. Bad.)

So the Labrum and the Rotator Cuff are kinda separate things but they're very closely inter-related in the way they work with each other. There are strength tests that can usually determine which one of the RC muscles is damaged.
 
I'm not the Doc but as a lifter who couldn't touch the top of his head for a year because he blew out his shoulder in competition, I know a thing or four about rotator cuff injuries.

There are 4 muscles that make up the rotator cuff: supraspinatus, infraspinatus, subscapularis, and teres minor. They basically attach your arm to your shoulder blade in a bizarre and confusing tangle.

The LABRUM is actually the tissue on the inside of the shoulder joint that the ball that forms the head of the upper arm bone (the humerus) fits into. There are also bursa sacks up in there that get inflamed (I had one of those and it hurt. Bad.)

So the Labrum and the Rotator Cuff are kinda separate things but they're very closely inter-related in the way they work with each other. There are strength tests that can usually determine which one of the RC muscles is damaged.
You forgot to mention that the cure is damn near as bad as the ailment. I spent almost 3 months sleeping sitting up and over 6 months rehabbing. My torn rotator cuff was severe and had a torn labrum to boot. It was absolute hell getting over the surgery.
 
Hey DocJean, what's the difference between a torn labrum and a rotator cuff injury? If need be, and not to derail this conversation maybe you could start a thread further down the dial (if you know what I mean)... Thanks, my brother.

Lay terms... please! :D

I'm not the Doc but as a lifter who couldn't touch the top of his head for a year because he blew out his shoulder in competition, I know a thing or four about rotator cuff injuries.

There are 4 muscles that make up the rotator cuff: supraspinatus, infraspinatus, subscapularis, and teres minor. They basically attach your arm to your shoulder blade in a bizarre and confusing tangle.

The LABRUM is actually the tissue on the inside of the shoulder joint that the ball that forms the head of the upper arm bone (the humerus) fits into. There are also bursa sacks up in there that get inflamed (I had one of those and it hurt. Bad.)

So the Labrum and the Rotator Cuff are kinda separate things but they're very closely inter-related in the way they work with each other. There are strength tests that can usually determine which one of the RC muscles is damaged.

You forgot to mention that the cure is damn near as bad as the ailment. I spent almost 3 months sleeping sitting up and over 6 months rehabbing. My torn rotator cuff was severe and had a torn labrum to boot. It was absolute hell getting over the surgery.

Bill, The Pencil Neck and DocBar both share good information.

To summarize an answer to your question:

Labral tears are not uncommonly misdiagnosed as as rotator cuff tears by many lay persons and even some physicians. It is importance to distinguish the difference since the former is much more serious and much more potentially debilitative.

A labrum tear is a tear in the cartilage that lines the inside of the shoulder joint. That cartilage is there to help secure the arm in the socket, as the joint is somewhat unstable by nature. If the socket rim is disrupted, the ball can pop out (shoulder subluxation or dislocation).

Labral%20Tear.jpg


Many are quick to ascribe shoulder pain to rotator cuff strains but that may be a dangerous self-diagnosis. Rotator cuff injuries affect the smaller, secondary, stabilizing muscles that surround the shoulder joint. These muscles include the teres minor, infraspinatus, supraspinatus and subscapularis. These injuries are usually small strains (muscle or musculotendinous tears) and will usually heal on their own with rest, ice and proper rehab, many times even in the case of severe tears. Those that don't will require surgery.

Rotator%20Cuff.jpg


shoulder_rotator_cuff_intro01.jpg


Why is a labrum tear more serious? Tears in the labrum will not heal on their own. They can become less symptomatic or even asymptomatic if treated properly. The tear remains but by strengthening and retraining the surrounding (rotator cuff )musculature, you may be able to continue activity symptom free. But this isn’t always the case. Many of these tears will require surgery. This depends on the type and level of activity/competition you are involved in. A competitive athlete would need to seriously consider surgery to remain at peak performer.

How can you tell the difference? It’s very difficult. If the injury doesn’t improve with treatment, that’s a good indicator you’re probably dealing with your labrum. After an initial diagnosis, a doctor will usually use an MRI to confirm the finding. Bottom line, if you have shoulder pain or instability that isn’t improving with therapy and rest, you need to see a doctor well-versed in shoulder injuries.
 
So, simply put, Labral tears are basically damage to the cartilage of the shoulder joint and rotator cuff injuries are failures (tears) to the muscles that provide mobility to the shoulder??

thanks again!
 
So, simply put, Labral tears are basically damage to the cartilage of the shoulder joint and rotator cuff injuries are failures (tears) to the muscles that provide mobility to the shoulder??

thanks again!

Correct.l And basiclally, the labrum contributes to the stability (by containing the ball in the socket in suction cup-like fashion) and allows "smooth" movement of the shoulder, whille the totator cuff contributes to providiing full range of motor function and stability to the shoulder (by maintining even pressure of the ball to remain firmly in contact with the socket throughout range of motion). The "stability" is thus provided through different mechanism iby each entity.
 
Correct.l And basiclally, the labrum contributes to the stability (by containing the ball in the socket in suction cup-like fashion) and allows "smooth" movement of the shoulder, whille the totator cuff contributes to providiing full range of motor function and stability to the shoulder (by maintining even pressure of the ball to remain firmly in contact with the socket throughout range of motion). The "stability" is thus provided through different mechanism iby each entity.

So, with all that's been said, is Ed Reed damaged goods? Will the time off help heal his situation or does he need surgery?
 
You forgot to mention that the cure is damn near as bad as the ailment. I spent almost 3 months sleeping sitting up and over 6 months rehabbing. My torn rotator cuff was severe and had a torn labrum to boot. It was absolute hell getting over the surgery.

I can agree here. Last year I had surgery on another shoulder. I tore the rotator cuff, labrum and had a clavicle resection done. My labrum was torn pretty bad and needed 4 anchors (I think that's the right term) to reattach. It's my understanding that labrum tears take longer to heal than cuffs.

IMO, I think the "ED Reed had a torn labrum" talk is bull-butter. Otherwise, there would've been an operation involved. Maybe there was? Dunno
 
“There's one problem: The Ravens didn't list him on the injury report, which is a violation of league rules,” wrote ESPN’s Jamison Hensley. “So either the Ravens chose not to disclose the injury or Reed isn't really that hurt.”

I said when I read this that he was covering for his poor play by saying this. The Ravens didn't put him on an injury report before this.

It may be something, may not be.

BTW, get used to a guy named Glenn Younes; he's on the radio here in Baltimore, 105.7 The Fan...he's the director of Ed Reed's Foundation also. Huge player apologist.
 
“There's one problem: The Ravens didn't list him on the injury report, which is a violation of league rules,” wrote ESPN’s Jamison Hensley. “So either the Ravens chose not to disclose the injury or Reed isn't really that hurt.”

I said when I read this that he was covering for his poor play by saying this. The Ravens didn't put him on an injury report before this.

It may be something, may not be.

BTW, get used to a guy named Glenn Younes; he's on the radio here in Baltimore, 105.7 The Fan...he's the director of Ed Reed's Foundation also. Huge player apologist.

:chickendance:
 
Well, we need to get rid of Ed Reed since he won't really help us.

And while we're at it, let's get rid of our new fullback, Greg Jones, too.

And our punter.

After all, we're better with Glover Quin and James Casey and Donnie Jones. I mean, last year proved it...oh wait, whoops. My bad. Glover maxed out his ceiling in terms of his coverage skills on the deep ball vs. great QBs, James Casey was a hybrid FB/HB/TE experiment that involved us also adding Lawrence Vickers (thinking the hybrid solution would suffice, but it didn't), and Donnie Jones shanked punts down the stretch and into the playoffs that hurt us.

Not to mention the cost of keeping Quin would have been $1 million more than what we're giving Ed per-year, and the Eagles overpaid for James Casey just like the Raiders overpaid for Brisiel, the Bengals overpaid for Jason Allen, the Bills WAY overpaid for Williams, I could go on and on with how many teams overpaid for our players in terms of what production they received.

Yet Ed Reed is garbage. LOL. "Ozzie knows how to let a guy go a year early rather than a year too late" and yet Ozzie has had eight departures of key starters this off-season. I mean, it's not like there's a MONSTER quarterback contract driving these moves or anything, right? Heh.

Ozzie put together a Super Bowl team and tore it down a few weeks later when he had to save face for the organization by overpaying a mediocre QB. I'm not happy that McNair extended Schaub, but at least he didn't do it up as bad as the Ravens did for Flacco. So we got that going for us, which is nice.

Just thought I'd feed the troll since it's 5:00 and quitting time around here.
 
I like this shunning tactic in order not to feed the troll! If you dont respond to any of his posts, and dont direct anything his way, why would he stay? He could go hang out in the KC board, or heck why not just join any random team and start padding that post count? LOL
 
I like this shunning tactic in order not to feed the troll! If you dont respond to any of his posts, and dont direct anything his way, why would he stay? He could go hang out in the KC board, or heck why not just join any random team and start padding that post count? LOL

I thought it was the Titans and How Pollard sucks without Reed covering for him thread.
 
I heard the troll was full and left. No???

Maybe so.

Maybe his keeper has him on a Traveling Oddities Tour where he goes from board to board, trolling a team's fans and seeing if he can get love for his Ravens while also finding ways to make a-hole comments about their team at the same time.

You can't keep a talent like handswarmer in one location for too long. You have to keep the gypsie wagon rolling along, always looking for greener pastures out there. Trolls require an insane amount of food and attention, of course, so it's imperative that he stays as active as he can.

The last thing this world needs is a troll who is barely getting by. Please consider joining me in the Adopt A Troll coalition. We can make all trolls know that they are needed and valued. Friends don't let friends starve trolls.

LOL.
 
They don't take an MRI during a player's physical exam?

They should evaluate this type of injury with a RECENT MRI. But I've seen some "evaluations" based on old MRIs where progressive changes are not recognized....thus negating the validity of an adequate evaluation. Hopefully, the Texans requested their own "contemporary" study prior to the contract as part of their physical.
 
They should evaluate this type of injury with a RECENT MRI. But I've seen some "evaluations" based on old MRIs where progressive changes are not recognized....thus negating the validity of an adequate evaluation. Hopefully, the Texans requested their own "contemporary" study prior to the contract as part of their physical.

I hope they are not neglecting it.
 
After all, we're better with Glover Quin...

Not to mention the cost of keeping Quin would have been $1 million more than what we're giving Ed per-year

Actually, it looks like we're paying Reed more.

Glover's deal =5 year deal - $23.5M - $5.25 signing bonus - $2.05M cap hit for 2013 - $5.05M cap hit for 2014 - $5.05M cap hit for 2015


Reed's deal =3 year deal - $15M - $2M signing Bonus - $3.3M cap hit for 2013 - $5.3M cap hit for 2014 - $6.3M cap hit for 2015

Ed Reed counts more against our cap over the next three years than Quin will count vs the Lions' cap.
 
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Actually, it looks like we're paying Reed more.

Glover's deal =5 year deal - $23.5M - $5.25 signing bonus - $2.05M cap hit for 2013 - $5.05M cap hit for 2014 - $5.05M cap hit for 2015


Reed's deal =3 year deal - $15M - $2M signing Bonus - $3.3M cap hit for 2013 - $5.3M cap hit for 2014 - $6.3M cap hit for 2015

Ed Reed counts more against our cap over the next three years than Quin will count vs the Lions' cap.
cap space is different than what we actually dishes out each year .

We are only responsible to pay $6M to get Reed to play in 2013; the Lions spend $250K more.

If both players last thru 2014, the Lions would still have to spend $250K more in actual money.

There's no guarantee that we even bring Reed back on 2014.
 
cap space is different than what we actually dishes out each year .

We are only responsible to pay $6M to get Reed to play in 2013; the Lions spend $250K more.

If both players last thru 2014, the Lions would still have to spend $250K more in actual money.

There's no guarantee that we even bring Reed back on 2014.

I thought that $5 mil was guaranteed.......and that there was only a potential for an additional $1 mil bonus for meeting goals of staying on the field/performance........POSSIBLY making a total of $6 mil for 2013?
 
Actually, it looks like we're paying Reed more.

Glover's deal =5 year deal - $23.5M - $5.25 signing bonus - $2.05M cap hit for 2013 - $5.05M cap hit for 2014 - $5.05M cap hit for 2015


Reed's deal =3 year deal - $15M - $2M signing Bonus - $3.3M cap hit for 2013 - $5.3M cap hit for 2014 - $6.3M cap hit for 2015

Ed Reed counts more against our cap over the next three years than Quin will count vs the Lions' cap.

Honestly I'd be surprised if we keep Reed around for the 3rd year. Granted I haven't really looked at the contract figures too closely but I feel like we'll keep Reed for two years and then release him with very minimal cap consequences. Glover on the other hand would be more severe. I really liked him on this team and wish him the best but personally I'd rather have Reed over Quin for the next two seasons even at their respective ages.
 
This is Reeds retiriment money and he knows that. I'm sure he will do his best to squeeze all the money out of this deal that he can. I expect Reed to play like a HOFer just for that reason. IMO
 
I thought that $5 mil was guaranteed.......and that there was only a potential for an additional $1 mil bonus for meeting goals of staying on the field/performance........POSSIBLY making a total of $6 mil for 2013?

Spottrac has him at $5 Million guaranteed, a $4 Million sigining bonus, a $1 Million 2013 roster bonus, and a $1 Million 2013 base salary. This is a $3.33 cap hit for 2013.

Other reports I've seen (Rotoworld for one) have described it as a $2 Million signing bonus, $1 Million dollar 2013 roster bonus, and a $3 Million base salary for 2013 ($6 million guaranteed). This would be a $4.67 Million 2013 cap hit

If Spottrac's wrong, it wouldn't be the first time for them to take a little while to get their act together. ( In fact, they currently indicate a $2 Million signing bonus, but then calculate the cap hit using $4 Million).

The $6 Million for the first year (cash payment - not cap figure) seems to be pretty consistent. Everything else, I'll hold off on buying into.
 
Spottrac has him at $5 Million guaranteed, a $4 Million sigining bonus, a $1 Million 2013 roster bonus, and a $1 Million 2013 base salary. This is a $3.33 cap hit for 2013.

Other reports I've seen (Rotoworld for one) have described it as a $2 Million signing bonus, $1 Million dollar 2013 roster bonus, and a $3 Million base salary for 2013 ($6 million guaranteed). This would be a $4.67 Million 2013 cap hit

If Spottrac's wrong, it wouldn't be the first time for them to take a little while to get their act together. ( In fact, they currently indicate a $2 Million signing bonus, but then calculate the cap hit using $4 Million).

The $6 Million for the first year (cash payment - not cap figure) seems to be pretty consistent. Everything else, I'll hold off on buying into.

^^^ This
 
cap space is different than what we actually dishes out each year .

I mispoke. The fact remains, that we did not sign Ed Reed for a $1M less (for 2013) than the Lions signed Quin.

Signing Reed (in lieu of Quin) has little to do with saving cap space this year, or "saving money for Cushing" next year either. Reed's cap number is more than Quins in both years.

Yes, he can be cut for the 2015 season if needed to pay Watt, or if he decides to retire, or if flat out can't play.
 
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cap space is different than what we actually dishes out each year .

We are only responsible to pay $6M to get Reed to play in 2013; the Lions spend $250K more.

If both players last thru 2014, the Lions would still have to spend $250K more in actual money.

There's no guarantee that we even bring Reed back on 2014.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who understands basic math.
 
Not to mention the cost of keeping Quin would have been $1 million more than what we're giving Ed per-year...


I feel personally responsible for this as I had stated that Reed would cost $1M less than Quin would for 2013. That was upon seeing the initial numbers of both contracts & not the structure. I didn't even know what the signing bonuses were at the time.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who understands basic math.

In this situation, the actual money paid to the player is of little concern to us, especially if you are not among those who frequently pay for game day tickets, and the overpriced foods & beverages they serve on game day.

As far as an organization goes & the future of this team, the only thing that really matters is the cap number. The Detroit Lions signed Quin for a smaller cap number in 2013, 2014, & 2015, than Reed's cap numbers for those same years.

My friend '76 is a dyed in the wool homer. He will find anything to twist & put a situation in the Texans' favor. But the fact remains in this situation we are paying a premium for Ed Reed (over Glover Quin) the question should be is he worth it?

Things working in Quin's favor.
  • It appears Wade liked to put a safety in the box
  • Quin got his hands on more balls than just about any safety in the league, passes defensed, interceptions, FF, Fumbles recoverd
  • Quin is younger

Things working in Reed's favor
  • Better ball skills
  • Not intimidated by top QBs
  • Intimidates top QBs

I think Reed is worth the premium, & I'd rather argue that, than argue Reed is cheaper (which isn't true, not where it counts to us).
 
I'm hoping the guy plays so good that most of us start to consider him underpaid! I really have the feeling that he's gonna play great, and hopefully will still get the chance to go out on top.
 
Interdasting....

When the Baltimore Ravens lost Ed Reed to the Houston Texans and released Bernard Pollard, speculation immediately turned to their roles in the near mutiny that came via a closed-door team meeting back on Halloween.

Safeties Reed and Pollard openly challenged John Harbaugh's decision to practice in full pads that day, according to a Yahoo! Sports report. The end result was described as a "big group-therapy session" which Harbaugh handled in "amazing" fashion.

Pollard recently told KILT-AM in Houston there is "no truth at all" to the mutiny story, adding he was "offended" by Harbaugh's handling of the reports.

The word "mutiny" drew plenty of headlines. Pollard maintains Harbaugh simply "opened up the floor" and a healthy discussion ensued. He wonders why Harbaugh hasn't bothered to set the record straight.

"I'm offended by that, because we walked away from that situation thinking, 'OK, everybody's on the same page. We're all good,'" Pollard said. "Like I said, I'm just a little offended that the coach never stepped up and said anything."

Harbaugh's relationship with Reed "just blossomed," according to the coach, and the two remain "very close" despite the future Hall of Famer's departure.

The same can't be said for Harbaugh's relationship with Pollard, who apparently still harbors a grudge. The Ravens freed up $1 million in salary-cap space through Pollard's release. Perhaps more importantly, they got rid of a potential clash between coach and player in 2013.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000156319/article/bernard-pollard-offended-by-ravens-mutiny-story
 
Funny, conflicting story

http://www.rotoworld.com/headlines/nfl/259093/football-headlines?r=1


According to the Baltimore Sun, coach John Harbaugh wanted FS Ed Reed back with the Ravens "as much as he wants a root canal."
In other words, Harbaugh didn't want Reed back at all. The Sun's Mike Preston found it "interesting" that the national media made it seem like the Texans and Ravens were in a "bidding war" for Reed when Baltimore was never serious about re-signing him. On Monday's ESPN Football Today podcast, Scouts Inc.'s Matt Williamson suggested Reed and Michael Huff are similar players at this stage of their careers. Reed got a three-year, $15 million deal from Houston. The Ravens stole Huff for $6 million over three seasons -- George Wilson money.
Source: Baltimore Sun Apr 2 - 12:34 AM
 
This is Reeds retiriment money and he knows that. I'm sure he will do his best to squeeze all the money out of this deal that he can. I expect Reed to play like a HOFer just for that reason. IMO

I hope this isn't a Emmitt to the Cardinals, Mamath to the Rams, Unitas to the Chargers type situation.

Hopefully it's more like Woodson to the Ravens
 
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Breaking down Michael Huff's $6 million Ravens deal, salary-cap update
New free safety given $1.5 million in guaranteed money

By Aaron WilsonThe Baltimore Sun
10:36 a.m. EDT, April 1, 2013


Ravens free safety Michael Huff's three-year, $6 million contract includes a $1.5 million signing bonus, according to a league source with knowledge of the deal.

The replacement for Ed Reed and former Oakland Raiders first-round draft pick is due an $850,000 base salary in 2013 with a salary-cap figure of $1.35 million.

In 2014, Huff is due a $1.75 million base salary and carries a salary-cap figure of $2.25 million.

In 2015, Huff is due a $1.9 million base salary and carries a salary-cap figure of $2.4 million.
 
The more I read, the more I think Ed Reed is not there because the coach doesn't want him there.

If so, this'll play to our advantage. Especially if and when we play the Ravens.

Maybe this is the year the Patriots slide a little, the Ravens slide a little, and we've made some acquisitions and draft picks AND stay healthy enough to maybe get to the AFCC and even the Super Bowl.

If we do, the Ed Reed signing will look like a genius move by the Texans.
 
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