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A Scout's Take on the Texans

m5kwatts said:
http://podcast.footballguys.com/2009/Footballguys-Audible-2009-Vol298a.mp3

Former NFL scout Daniel Jeremiah ( http:www.twitter.com/MoveTheSticks ) does this weekly podcast... the Texans are the 3rd topic discussed if you don't wanna hear the whole thing

When a scout says the team lacks mental toughness I'll listen... I know fans have been saying it for awhile and I've denied it but its become apparent now. And thats a head coach's responsibility.
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Just about everywhere I've looked or listened to where analysts or reporters from other cities have talked about the Texans they've all basically said this exact same thing and blamed the Texans failures on coaching.
 
The team is a reflection of our powder puff owner, who I have the deepest gratitude for bringing an NFL franchise to Houston, btw. But he's still a powder puff until he proves otherwise. 31 NFL owners agree. ;)
 
Texecutioner said:
Just about everywhere I've looked or listened to where analysts or reporters from other cities have talked about the Texans they've all basically said this exact same thing and blamed the Texans failures on coaching.
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I'm more apt to listen to a scout than some reporter or radio host though so this was more of a wake up call for me because I always denied it but I can't anymore. This team lacks the toughness to close out games. We continue to think that just because we dominate a 1st 2nd or 3rd quarter that its over. This is the reason why I think the season is over and we need a new head coach that can install a close out the game attitude. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if we jumped out on Jacksonville this weekend and so on and we see this same pattern.
 
Double Barrel said:
The team is a reflection of our powder puff owner, who I have the deepest gratitude for bringing an NFL franchise to Houston, btw. But he's still a powder puff until he proves otherwise. 31 NFL owners agree. ;)
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You sound like you have lost faith.
dont let the frustration get to you my friend.....drink some battle red koolaid.

granted I understand the frustration...but take a drink or two or a hundred and get back to the good ole fashioned DB.
 
spurstexanstros said:
You sound like you have lost faith.
dont let the frustration get to you my friend.....drink some battle red koolaid.

granted I understand the frustration...but take a drink or two or a hundred and get back to the good ole fashioned DB.
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yeah, you're right, bro'. Unfortunately, it's the result of high expectations being deflated at this point.

But I'm still with ya', rooting every Sunday and hoping that the football gods bestow a miraculous and unprecedented 5 game win streak on us along with the losses we need from other teams to squeak into the playoffs!

How's that for some battle red koolaide for ya'! :redtowel: GO TEXANS!!
 
I know Michael Lombardi has said this repeatedly over the last year, but everytime someone mentions his name we spend most of thread hearing how he is not a credible source. the perception that the Texans are soft, especially mentally is not new.
 
ArlingtonTexan said:
I know Michael Lombardi has said this repeatedly over the last year, but everytime someone mentions his name we spend most of thread hearing how he is not a credible source. the perception that the Texans are soft, especially mentally is not new.
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What they call "mental softness", I call "youth". None of the high impact players on this team, other than Antonio Smith, have any real experience winning in the NFL. So, it's taking a little more time than we'd like. On the bright side, with the wealth of young talent in place, time is something this organization may have. TexanChick has been ahead of this issue all season... even her current article about Schaub sheds light on it as well. Other than A. Rodgers, none of the top throwing QBs have fewer starts than he does. Interestingly, Rodgers has also taken a lot of heat for losing games even when his numbers are good.
 
Seems to me that the road to mental toughness starts in training camp with tackling and hitting drills.

Have any of you guys that have been to TC sessions actually seen these drills?
 
dalemurphy said:
What they call "mental softness", I call "youth". None of the high impact players on this team, other than Antonio Smith, have any real experience winning in the NFL. So, it's taking a little more time than we'd like. On the bright side, with the wealth of young talent in place, time is something this organization may have. TexanChick has been ahead of this issue all season... even her current article about Schaub sheds light on it as well. Other than A. Rodgers, none of the top throwing QBs have fewer starts than he does. Interestingly, Rodgers has also taken a lot of heat for losing games even when his numbers are good.
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Yeah, but young players who do not win can become old players that do not win. I mean how many times can we point to the old Saints who had lots of youthful teams that went absolutely nowhere. How about the pre/post Barry Sanders Detroit Lions. We have players on our team that have expierenced winning at College and below levels. Just to name a few: Cush(USC), AJ(Miami), Meco(Bama), Caldwell(Bama), Studdard(Texas), Winston (Miami), etc. They have experienced winning before. All of these guys (and lots of others on the team) came from schools that routinely won more games than they lost. Many of them came from schools that competed for division or Natl Championships each year. They may not have won at the NFL level, but they know what winning is like.
 
steelbtexan said:
I would describe them as vanilla, unwilling to take risks and a corporate team.

How would you describe them?
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That may be your opinion, and an attempt at describing Bob McNair, but it shows how little you know about Bob McNair more than anything else. If you did a little research on Mr. McNair instead of making assumptions you'd find out that Mr. McNair made his fortune being a risk taker.
 
This picture reminds me of something the Texans could use .

church-bells.jpg
 
Well maybe in business that he is familiar with.

Not with a business that he admitted he didn't know much about when he bought the team.

This explains why the Texans are a sucessful franchise $ wise but not on the field.

Bob knows the corporate side of the NFL and is willing to take risks. He doesn't know the on the field product and has now hired 2 regimes to help him in his understanding.

He lets those people call the shots except when it comes to laying out big contracts.

I believe the combination of getting burned on the Carr extention and getting burned with the crappy FA signings by the CC and Smithiak regimes has made McNair gun shy and rightfully so might I add.

This attitude however is hurting the Texans in the process of putting a winning team on the field. You have to be a risk taker to win in the NFL. IMO (Talent wins out ove character in some cases,see Randy Moss for ex.)
 
steelbtexan said:
Well maybe in business that he is familiar with.

Not with a business that he admitted he didn't know much about when he bought the team.

This explains why the Texans are a sucessful franchise $ wise but not on the field.

Bob knows the corporate side of the NFL and is willing to take risks. He doesn't know the on the field product and has now hired 2 regimes to help him in his understanding.

He lets those people call the shots except when it comes to laying out big contracts.

I believe the combination of getting burned on the Carr extention and getting burned with the crappy FA signings by the CC and Smithiak regimes has made McNair gun shy and rightfully so might I add.

This attitude however is hurting the Texans in the process of putting a winning team on the field. You have to be a risk taker to win in the NFL. IMO (Talent wins out ove character in some cases,see Randy Moss for ex.)
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I think that might have been the case back in the day when he first started the team, but I think McNair is a LOT more savvy now than he was then. You can even tell by the interviews he gives. He's a lot more in control and up to date on things now than he was before. I think the Casserly/Capers era burned him and he realized he needed to take a more active role.

And, if I'm not mistaken, he sold his interests in race horses - a major passion of his - to focus on the football team.

If you think Rick Smith and Gary Kubiak don't get taken to the woodshed by Bob McNair, you're kidding yourself. I saw the look on his face after the game last week. He is not playing around.

Also, McNair knows that more wins = more $$$. It's a fact.
 
BattleRedToro said:
If you did a little research on Mr. McNair instead of making assumptions you'd find out that Mr. McNair made his fortune being a risk taker.
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Him and every other billionaire.

His history as an owner shows that he'd rather protect a profit than take risks.
 
houstonspartan said:
I think that might have been the case back in the day when he first started the team, but I think McNair is a LOT more savvy now than he was then. You can even tell by the interviews he gives. He's a lot more in control and up to date on things now than he was before. I think the Casserly/Capers era burned him and he realized he needed to take a more active role.

And, if I'm not mistaken, he sold his interests in race horses - a major passion of his - to focus on the football team.

If you think Rick Smith and Gary Kubiak don't get taken to the woodshed by Bob McNair, you're kidding yourself. I saw the look on his face after the game last week. He is not playing around.

Also, McNair knows that more wins = more $$$. It's a fact.
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I hope you're right as they say the proofs in the pudding. So far the pudding has tasted like crap. Winning doesn't always translate to more $$$$.
 
Mr. White said:
Him and every other billionaire.

His history as an owner shows that he'd rather protect a profit than take risks.
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The texans take risks, but for some reason have an aversion with "name" players/coaches. Rookie QBs, trading picks for Schaub, trading multiple picks for Babin, and Mario williams are actually all risky moves, but move away from "known" quanities versus lesser known ones.

Example, there is very little public risk (only monetary) in spending bunches of money to bring in a name brand coach such as Cowher, Holmgren or Grudden this off season. If one of those guys fail at least you tried, but if you put the franchise in the hands of the next hot coordinator (at a much cheaper cost) it actually a much riskier deal from public perception because you could went with a proven option, even if finding a 40 year old who really gets it could set the franchise up nicely for 10-15 years versus the more experienced guys.
 
Co-ordinators that get HC jobs come cheaper than proven SB winning SB caoches. Add that to the fact that getting great asst. coaches cost $$ also your cost goes way up and cuts into the profit.

What do the Colts and Steelers have in common

1. Young HC's
2. Vet Co-ordinators with proven track records. (Pitt. LeBeau,Arians, Colts. Moore and Coyer) both have over 20 yrs exp. but it costs top $$ to keep them.) Compare that to the Texans (F.Bush and K.Shanahan) I thnk you can see where the problems lie with the Texans leadership.

This lack of leadership comes from the top down.
 
steelbtexan said:
Co-ordinators that get HC jobs come cheaper than proven SB winning SB caoches. Add that to the fact that getting great asst. coaches cost $$ also your cost goes way up and cuts into the profit.

What do the Colts and Steelers have in common

1. Young HC's
2. Vet Co-ordinators with proven track records. (Pitt. LeBeau,Arians, Colts. Moore and Coyer) both have over 20 yrs exp. but it costs top $$ to keep them.) Compare that to the Texans (F.Bush and K.Shanahan) I thnk you can see where the problems lie with the Texans leadership.

This lack of leadership comes from the top down.
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You do know that the Stealers are 1 game ahead of Houston in the wildcard hunt, and on a 3 game losing spree, right?
 
Goatcheese said:
You do know that the Stealers are 1 game ahead of Houston in the wildcard hunt, and on a 3 game losing spree, right?
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ArlingtonTexan said:
I think winning the Superbowl last year gives them a mediocrity exemption for 2009.
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ArlingtonTexan said:
As a Texans' fan did you really think about that before you posted it?
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In Houston (only), you get a pass for mediocrity if it can be spun that there was better mediocrity that year.
 
Want to see a franchise with an owner who takes a risk on every big name FA on the market, Just watch the Redskins. How far has that taken them? All the way to the Toilet Bowl. We have a good organization, a good HC and a good team. We've lost some heartbreakers this season, but all in all, we're on the cusp of being a great team that can whip all comers. If you want to see the Texans go the route of the Cleveland Browns or Washington Redskins, keep calling for a new HC every time you get butt hurt over losing a game we should've won. Pretty soon, we'll be back to every game we manage to win is an upset. Maybe some of you should trade in your jockstraps for Depends if you can't hold your water.
 
DocBar said:
Want to see a franchise with an owner who takes a risk on every big name FA on the market, Just watch the Redskins. How far has that taken them? All the way to the Toilet Bowl. We have a good organization, a good HC and a good team. We've lost some heartbreakers this season, but all in all, we're on the cusp of being a great team that can whip all comers. If you want to see the Texans go the route of the Cleveland Browns or Washington Redskins, keep calling for a new HC every time you get butt hurt over losing a game we should've won. Pretty soon, we'll be back to every game we manage to win is an upset. Maybe some of you should trade in your jockstraps for Depends if you can't hold your water.
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Redskins have made the playoffs twice since the Texans come into the league. Browns have made it once.

Here is a sobering thought. The only teams that have not had at least one playoff appearence since 2002 are the Houston Texans and the Detroit Lions.
 
ArlingtonTexan said:
As a Texans' fan did you really think about that before you posted it?
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It's a jab at the knee jerk folks around here who constantly say such inspiring things as "you are what your record says you are." As if nothing matters but the win-loss columns.

We are one game behind Pitt on a similar 3 game slide. They are talking about unleashing hell, and fighting hard to make the playoffs. We are talking about who will be the Texans coach next year.
 
DocBar said:
Want to see a franchise with an owner who takes a risk on every big name FA on the market, Just watch the Redskins. How far has that taken them? All the way to the Toilet Bowl. We have a good organization, a good HC and a good team. We've lost some heartbreakers this season, but all in all, we're on the cusp of being a great team that can whip all comers. If you want to see the Texans go the route of the Cleveland Browns or Washington Redskins, keep calling for a new HC every time you get butt hurt over losing a game we should've won. Pretty soon, we'll be back to every game we manage to win is an upset. Maybe some of you should trade in your jockstraps for Depends if you can't hold your water.
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Want to see a franchise with an owner that doesnt know when to cut his ties and move forward, just watch the Texans. Har far has it taken them? All the way to no where. We have an average organization, and average coach and a average team. We've only won 1 game this year against a good team and all in all were on the cusp of ANOTHER mediocre season. If you want to see the Texans go the route of the Saints or the Colts, demand we go after a real coach that is capable of taking us to the promise land. Pretty soon, we'll be finding ways to win close games instead of loosing them. Maybe some of you should trade in your jockstraps for Depends if you cant hold your water. :roast:
 
Goatcheese said:
It's a jab at the knee jerk folks around here who constantly say such inspiring things as "you are what your record says you are." As if nothing matters but the win-loss columns.

We are one game behind Pitt on a similar 3 game slide. They are talking about unleashing hell, and fighting hard to make the playoffs. We are talking about who will be the Texans coach next year.
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The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much.
 
ArlingtonTexan said:
The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much.
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Major rep for you, bro. Totally agree.

Comparing the Steelers struggles this year with the Texans is just dumb. They have way too many Lombardi Trophies to panic about an off year.
 
ArlingtonTexan said:
The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much.
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The funny thing is.... at the end of the season, there will be people who will try to make the argument that this year's mediocre is better than the previous two year's mediocre, even though this year's schedule was easier and more Texan's friendly than the previous two years. But Somehow, we will have proven to have improved.
 
ArlingtonTexan said:
The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much.
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So the Steelers take a giant step backward from Super Bowl Champions to fringe playoff team, and it's no big deal. The Texans build a young team from nothing that is in every game right down the the wire, and they suck because they haven't been able to make that one play a game to get over the hump.

You would be the knee jerk fan I'm talking about that can't see anything beyond the win-loss column.

This year they have one(1, single, uno) loss by double digits. Every other game they were competing into the 4th quarter.

Last year they got pooped on by Pittsburgh 38-17, dumped on by Tennessee 31-12, embarrassed by Baltimore 41-13, and choked against Oakland 27-16.

They are scoring more points than they've allowed for the first time in franchise history. They have gone from one of the worst defenses in the NFL to average. They've built the passing offense into one of the leagues best.

Those are huge improvements over last year. The record may turn out the same, but they are not even close to being the same team.
 
GNTLEWOLF said:
The funny thing is.... at the end of the season, there will be people who will try to make the argument that this year's mediocre is better than the previous two year's mediocre, even though this year's schedule was easier and more Texan's friendly than the previous two years. But Somehow, we will have proven to have improved.
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You won't even have to wait until the end of the season.
Goatcheese said:
They are scoring more points than they've allowed for the first time in franchise history. They have gone from one of the worst defenses in the NFL to average. They've built the passing offense into one of the leagues best.

Those are huge improvements over last year. The record may turn out the same, but they are not even close to being the same team.
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These are quality losses, people.
Goatcheese said:
The Texans build a young team from nothing that is in every game right down the the wire, and they suck because they haven't been able to make that one play a game to get over the hump.
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Yes. That's why they suck this year. Last year they sucked because of a hurricane. The year before was because of injuries. The year before was David Carr. Next year it will be due to McNair forcing Kubiak to coach on a lame duck contract year. I guess if he gives Coach Teflon an extension for all of these outstanding .500 seasons, that excuse will go away.
 
Lucky said:
You won't even have to wait until the end of the season.

These are quality losses, people.

Yes. That's why they suck this year. Last year they sucked because of a hurricane. The year before was because of injuries. The year before was David Carr. Next year it will be due to McNair forcing Kubiak to coach on a lame duck contract year. I guess if he gives Coach Teflon an extension for all of these outstanding .500 seasons, that excuse will go away.
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Hey, man! Don't be stealing my ideas! LOL.

No joke, I was just talking about this to someone yesterday. I was wondering that the 2009 excuse would be.

2008 excuse was Hurricane Ike.
2007 excuse was AJ being injured.
2006 excuse was Kubes first year.

It's kind of sad, when you think about it. I mean, we all went through the hurricane and it was crazy, but this team was using the Ike excuse last December when most of us had already cleaned up our yards and moved on.
 
Goatcheese said:
It's a jab at the knee jerk folks around here who constantly say such inspiring things as "you are what your record says you are." As if nothing matters but the win-loss columns.

We are one game behind Pitt on a similar 3 game slide. They are talking about unleashing hell, and fighting hard to make the playoffs. We are talking about who will be the Texans coach next year.
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Excellent point on the bolded part. My guess is it's what we have become accustomed to for this team.
 
Goatcheese said:
So the Steelers take a giant step backward from Super Bowl Champions to fringe playoff team, and it's no big deal. The Texans build a young team from nothing that is in every game right down the the wire, and they suck because they haven't been able to make that one play a game to get over the hump.

You would be the knee jerk fan I'm talking about that can't see anything beyond the win-loss column.

This year they have one(1, single, uno) loss by double digits. Every other game they were competing into the 4th quarter.

Last year they got pooped on by Pittsburgh 38-17, dumped on by Tennessee 31-12, embarrassed by Baltimore 41-13, and choked against Oakland 27-16.

They are scoring more points than they've allowed for the first time in franchise history. They have gone from one of the worst defenses in the NFL to average. They've built the passing offense into one of the leagues best.

Those are huge improvements over last year. The record may turn out the same, but they are not even close to being the same team.
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Okay, great the Texans were a

C- in 2007
C in 2008
C+ in 2009

At the end of the day they are still a C team and 8-8.
 
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