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I think Chronicles Solomon has nailed it here: Schaub remain a huge question mark ?

N

nunusguy

Hall of Fame
Every time Schaub has to sit, his growth as an NFL quarterback slows. Every time Schaub gets hurt, the Texans’ growth as a franchise takes a hit.
**
It is not fair — right now, anyway — to say he is injury-prone, but he is getting close to earning that tag. The results of that MRI will have much to do with how he is perceived.
**
Yeah, the team has Sage Rosenfels. But like a mini spare tire, Rosenfels should come with a warning: for short-term, emergency use only.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/6091403.html
 
nunusguy said:
Every time Schaub has to sit, his growth as an NFL quarterback slows. Every time Schaub gets hurt, the Texans’ growth as a franchise takes a hit.
**
It is not fair - right now, anyway - to say he is injury-prone, but he is getting close to earning that tag. The results of that MRI will have much to do with how he is perceived.
**
Yeah, the team has Sage Rosenfels. But like a mini spare tire, Rosenfels should come with a warning: for short-term, emergency use only.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/6091403.html
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Injury prone no, but he deals VERY BAD with getting hit. Hes got the deer-in-the-headlights look whenever he is pressured and hit. He needs to talk to Favre about how to deal with this stuff.

Just to avoid any confusion, that is, not talking controversy here, but I have never seen Sage lose his calm after getting hit. Thats a vital ability for a QB, to stay calm and focussed, not only for his own play, but his level of focus and, call it mental health, is rubbing off on the rest of the team, good or bad.

Learn Schaub to stay cool and calm, Sage-style, and we have an awesome QB.
 
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Sage is determined not to be hurt, because he wants to stay out there and win that starting job.

Schaub is constantly worried about getting hit, becuase he doesn't want to be injured and lose the starting job.

Just a theory or two.
 
In any case, the inconsistency at the QB position is really holding the Texans back. This is a big problem and there is no easy way to fix it.
 
The conversation with the guys on the sidelines wearing headsets should have been, "it looks like Matt's knee got buckled pretty bad, have Sage start warming up, call a timeout and assess the situation."

When he threw the interception it should have been perfectly clear he was not able to give us 100% and was a liability. Kubiak and staff failed the team in this instance.
 
Kaiser Toro said:
When he threw the interception it should have been perfectly clear he was not able to give us 100% and was a liability. Kubiak and staff failed the team in this instance.
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I should add that it is not only Schaub that has the deer-in-the-headlights look, our coaching staff seems... slow(?) at times. You are right, it was a no-brainer, I kept yelling at the screen at home. Good thing the gf wasn't home :)
 
Malloy said:
I should add that it is not only Schaub that has the deer-in-the-headlights look, our coaching staff seems... slow(?) at times. You are right, it was a no-brainer, I kept yelling at the screen at home. Good thing the gf wasn't home :)
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That is one thing I put in the fire Kubiak thread. The staff is always slow. Slow to get plays in on 3rd and short. Confusion. Wasted timeouts. No challenges on obvious plays and challenges on plays where you are throwing away a timeout. They are just as lost.
 
Kaiser Toro said:
When he threw the interception it should have been perfectly clear he was not able to give us 100% and was a liability. Kubiak and staff failed the team in this instance.
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Right. We know Schaub doesn't have a gun and has underthrown some balls
in the past, but he's really been throwing the ball very well in the last few weeks. Therefor I think its reasonable to assume he didn't underthrow that ball to the wide-open FB Leach but couldn't get it there because of his knee injury. It's like K-T and some others are saying, Kubiak & assistants just don't snap like they should to make the decisions game-day.
I've mentioned this before but I will again. What does it tell you about a HC who won't watch FG attemps or goal-line plays in critical situations ? Too much drama, too much tension for the coach to handle ? I dunno, but that just strikes me as real odd ? And not too reassuring from the standpoint of inspiring confidance in the person who is the teams leader on the sidelines gameday ?
 
I posted in another thread, and I'll repeat here. I am beginning to agree with Haynesworth re: Schaub.
 
If Schaub had not gotten hurt, the Texans likely win this game and improve to 4-4. There were plays there to be made, but he couldn’t make them. (Solomon quote)
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I disagree with this statement for two reasons:

1. If we've learned anything, it's that Schaub WILL get hurt. So this statement by Solomon is sort of like an oxymoron.

2. He was getting shaky way before he was hurt. Matt wasn't doing anything special as the game wore on, and he was getting pressured harder as the first half continued.

I know ya'll think I was probably giddy when I saw Sage taking the 2nd half snaps. I wasn't. I flirted with the idea of thinking maybe Sage could turn it around, but then I showed self-restraint. I went ahead and basically hit the "fast-forward x 2" button on my DirecTV controller because I needed to get to the last few minutes of the game where I knew Sage would blow it somehow. No need in watching it in regular time when I already knew what was going to happen. It was just a matter of "where" it was going to happen.

Richard Smith's defensive philosophy, coupled with a lack of a clutch QB, is straining this team when it counts. We win the easy ones (Cincy), we eek out the marginal ones (Miami), and we crater the ones where it looks like we can take a step forward for once (Minnesota).

THIS was the year to gain a step on Indy and Jax. I mean, they are ripe for the pickin' if you ask me. This could have been a wild card year for us, especially after seeing how the AFC is shaking down. Tenn and Pitt are at the top, and there's a lot of freaking opportunities after that.

But...alas, and so on and so forth. :specnatz:
 
HoustonFrog said:
That is one thing I put in the fire Kubiak thread. The staff is always slow. Slow to get plays in on 3rd and short. Confusion. Wasted timeouts. No challenges on obvious plays and challenges on plays where you are throwing away a timeout. They are just as lost.
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Bingo...I think as much blame should be placed on the coaches as the QB. First, turnovers are and have been our achilles heal for the past several seasons. The failure of this team to clean this up...especially in the red zone...falls directly on the head coach. If we are in a game, and you know this team has a tendency to turn the ball over, curb the play calls a bit so we can get points on the board. If you can't get a play call in during a critical situation, call a timeout.

I think Schaub has had more bad luck than anything. I don't see us having a controversy...Sage seems to be more concerned with making the sexy play for himself, than to make the smart decision for this team.
 
Yea, so far to me it looks like we got two guys who shouldn't be starters. Everytime I think Schaub is starting to show why he's a starter he takes 2 steps back AND gets injured.
 
eriadoc said:
I posted in another thread, and I'll repeat here. I am beginning to agree with Haynesworth re: Schaub.
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He plays great in spurts. Might we have Rob Johnson v2.0?

I look at him and Sage and, as much as I really, really want Matt to pan out, I'm beginning to think that maybe we have two really good backup QB's. Now, I think that we're in much better shape than a lot of teams but we still don't have "the guy" under center.

I could be wrong. I'm not a talent evaluator. But I go back to Kubiak in the offseason talking about Matt being "1" and Rosencopter being "1a." Methinks "2 and 2a" might actually be the case.
 
And does it occur to anyone that Matt looks a heckuva' lot better when he's had to sit and watch Sage...then he comes out firing away and has his wits about him all of a sudden?

I mean, is the guy so used to being dogged that he relishes the chance to come back and prove people wrong? But then it seems to fade away, and he gets complacent and his footwork is sluggish again and he's on his back again.

This just seems like a sick cycle of repetitive happenstance to me.

Just thinking out loud. Feel free to wear ear muffs. LOL.
 
Kaiser Toro said:
The conversation with the guys on the sidelines wearing headsets should have been, "it looks like Matt's knee got buckled pretty bad, have Sage start warming up, call a timeout and assess the situation."

When he threw the interception it should have been perfectly clear he was not able to give us 100% and was a liability. Kubiak and staff failed the team in this instance.
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Exactly what I have been saying.
 
Kaiser Toro said:
The conversation with the guys on the sidelines wearing headsets should have been, "it looks like Matt's knee got buckled pretty bad, have Sage start warming up, call a timeout and assess the situation."

When he threw the interception it should have been perfectly clear he was not able to give us 100% and was a liability. Kubiak and staff failed the team in this instance.
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Yep, I had a guy dogging me in the gameday thread yesterday for saying the same thing. If you looked at Schaub's pick in the endzone AND the fumble deep in Vikes territory, they both came about as a direct result of Schaub being "less than 100%".

One was a poor underthrow, the other was Schaub not stepping forward into the pocket. Both were caused by pain / bad wheels.
 
Deer in the headlights does not describe Schaubs ability to play. I would like those of you who think he is fragile to take a direct hit to the side of your knee from an NFL defensive lineman.

Do you remember David Carr? Yeah, he was never hurt with all his sacks - you know why? Because any sense of pressure Carr felt, he immediately got into fetal position and fell down.

Why does Schaub get hurt on his sacks? Because he isnt scared of them and he is trying to still make a play. It is his line that is letting him down on those plays. You will get injured as an NFL QB if you still try to look down field and throw when a player is about to his your knees.

I prefer he trys to make a play rather than Carr Coddle. Its the line you should be blaming - not Schaub. We have all seen how he plays when he isnt taking constant shots to the knee.

So, back off.
 
rockabilly said:
I prefer he trys to make a play rather than Carr Coddle. Its the line you should be blaming - not Schaub. We have all seen how he plays when he isnt taking constant shots to the knee.

So, back off.
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I understand what you're saying, but...

The OL didn't underthrow the ball or fail to step up into the pocket. The "injured" QB did.

If he can't perform the way he needs to, then he needs to be taken off the field. Either the coaches need to see it, or he needs to "take himself out".

Turnovers within chip-shot FG range have to stop for this team to get to the next level.
 
rockabilly said:
Deer in the headlights does not describe Schaubs ability to play. I would like those of you who think he is fragile to take a direct hit to the side of your knee from an NFL defensive lineman.

Do you remember David Carr? Yeah, he was never hurt with all his sacks - you know why? Because any sense of pressure Carr felt, he immediately got into fetal position and fell down.

Why does Schaub get hurt on his sacks? Because he isnt scared of them and he is trying to still make a play. It is his line that is letting him down on those plays. You will get injured as an NFL QB if you still try to look down field and throw when a player is about to his your knees.

I prefer he trys to make a play rather than Carr Coddle. Its the line you should be blaming - not Schaub. We have all seen how he plays when he isnt taking constant shots to the knee.

So, back off.
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Wow. Pretty strong words. I mean, all our opinions (added up and multiplied by 300) equal less than 1 penny when you get right down to it.

I'm not so stubborn as to believe that Schaub must have a 360-degree 4-yard halo around him at all times in order for him to work his magic.

Any team that faces a stout defense is going to see their QB get harassed. It's just part of the game. I think it's kinda' silly to believe that an oline has to be perfect all the time, or even a majority of the time. They have the worst job in football because it's like when your electricity goes out: It happens once or twice a year, and we call and gritch about it without realizing that it was on the other 363 days without fail. An olineman makes a handful of spotty blocks, and it's as if he just royally blew it.

QBs and O-coordinators need to take advantage of that. Turn it back onto the defense and adjust the play calls and formations to exploit it. But nooooo...that'd be asking too much of our highly-trained coaching staff.

Nope. The oline is the goat. Always has been and always will be.

Funny how drastically the sacks went down when David Carr left town.
 
I think that people are overthinking.

Schaub got busted in the side of the knee. Stuff happens....Orton, Brady, etc.

The offensive line isn't good enough to be expected to pass block all but 16 plays.

Kubiak should have pulled him given how gimpy he was after that.

I don't think the Texans would have won anyway, because the defense was ridiculous.
 
Texans_Chick said:
I think that people are overthinking.

Schaub got busted in the side of the knee. Stuff happens....Orton, Brady, etc.

The offensive line isn't good enough to be expected to pass block all but 16 plays.

Kubiak should have pulled him given how gimpy he was after that.

I don't think the Texans would have won anyway, because the defense was ridiculous.
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Dang you and your cool head! Quit making sense - you're making it very difficult to overreact in the wake of a loss.
 
rockabilly said:
Deer in the headlights does not describe Schaubs ability to play. I would like those of you who think he is fragile to take a direct hit to the side of your knee from an NFL defensive lineman.

Do you remember David Carr? Yeah, he was never hurt with all his sacks - you know why? Because any sense of pressure Carr felt, he immediately got into fetal position and fell down.

Why does Schaub get hurt on his sacks? Because he isnt scared of them and he is trying to still make a play. It is his line that is letting him down on those plays. You will get injured as an NFL QB if you still try to look down field and throw when a player is about to his your knees.

I prefer he trys to make a play rather than Carr Coddle. Its the line you should be blaming - not Schaub. We have all seen how he plays when he isnt taking constant shots to the knee.

So, back off.
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:spit: This is hilarious. Shaub is not a tough QB at all, and one thing he could learn from David Carr is how to handle pain and take hits. Carr could do that, but that is about all he could do.

Shaub drops the ball the moment he gets touched. I don't know what it is. He fumbles about as bad as Kurt Warner does. Shaub is just not a good QB when it comes to game where he is getting pressured.
 
For all the people on the Schaub bandwagon saying he's been looking good these past weeks, just remember it was when we were playing WINLESS teams!

Rosenfels and Schaub suck! Plain and simple.

Chase Daniel, Tim Tebow, Colt McCoy, Graham Harrell, Zac Robinson, or Sam Bradford.

^ Lets please give one of these guys a look in the draft! Obviously some won't be available, but I bet we could get one of these guys in the future.
 
The hits on his knee were pretty brutal. I thought they were going to call a timeout and check him on the sideline but they continued to let him play. You could tell he wasn't the same because they ran a couple of running plays and Matt looked slow handing the ball off to Steve. All in all, it blows that he will be out for a month.
 
Mari-OWNED! said:
For all the people on the Schaub bandwagon saying he's been looking good these past weeks, just remember it was when we were playing WINLESS teams!

Rosenfels and Schaub suck! Plain and simple.

Chase Daniel, Tim Tebow, Colt McCoy, Graham Harrell, Zac Robinson, or Sam Bradford.

^ Lets please give one of these guys a look in the draft! Obviously some won't be available, but I bet we could get one of these guys in the future.
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Miami Dolphins have beat the Patriots, Chargers and @Denver. They were not winless.
 
GP said:
2. He was getting shaky way before he was hurt. Matt wasn't doing anything special as the game wore on, and he was getting pressured harder as the first half continued.

:
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Actually Matt was hurt on the very first drive, it was a third down completion to Daniels when Allen rolled into Matt's knee. That might not have been the hit that got his MCL but it was the hit that started it.
 
ReliantTexan said:
Actually Matt was hurt on the very first drive, it was a third down completion to Daniels when Allen rolled into Matt's knee. That might not have been the hit that got his MCL but it was the hit that started it.
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Good grief!

I love how there's all these technicalities for Schaub.

This is bordering upon David Carr II for crying out loud.

Matt Schaub, for whatever reason (genetics, bad luck, whatever), cannot stay on the field. two years in a row that the guy can't play.

I don't care WHAT caused the injury or WHEN it happened. It continues to happen. Bad oline has been mentioned today. Every oline is going to allow a sack, or allow the QB to get touched at some point. Every oline, OK?

That's where the Anointed Matt Schaub Is QB King crowd goes next: It's the oline's fault. Bank on it. That's where this is headed.

We have to find a QB who can get the ball out of his hand without getting it picked off, without getting hurt, and that means even if the drive stalls due to throwing it away. At some point, a Texans QB has got to realize this.
 
HJam72 said:
Sage is determined not to be hurt, because he wants to stay out there and win that starting job.

Schaub is constantly worried about getting hit, becuase he doesn't want to be injured and lose the starting job.
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This is right as far as it goes. Truth is, Matt will never be the starting QB for long. Sage--well, when he's good he's very very good, and when he's bad he's . . . awful. He's one step from being a top notch QB, but I don't know if he can take that step. Seems he's been at it a long time and maybe ought to have more . . . restraint-when-necessary. Trouble is, the reason he's terrific when he's on is that he has no restraint, he always thinks he's going to win with this throw. The intercept in/near the end zone yesterday a good example--why throw that ball?
 
Texans_Chick said:
I think that people are overthinking.

Schaub got busted in the side of the knee. Stuff happens....Orton, Brady, etc.
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True, the injury is real, I dont want him to keep on fighting while limping around the field.

That being said (in reference to other posts, not yours TC), the 'deer in the headlights' comment were in reference to other hits Schaub has taken during his time here, not specifically the hit(s) that caused the injury.
 
GP said:
Good grief!

I love how there's all these technicalities for Schaub.

This is bordering upon David Carr II for crying out loud.

Matt Schaub, for whatever reason (genetics, bad luck, whatever), cannot stay on the field. two years in a row that the guy can't play.

I don't care WHAT caused the injury or WHEN it happened. It continues to happen. Bad oline has been mentioned today. Every oline is going to allow a sack, or allow the QB to get touched at some point. Every oline, OK?

That's where the Anointed Matt Schaub Is QB King crowd goes next: It's the oline's fault. Bank on it. That's where this is headed.

We have to find a QB who can get the ball out of his hand without getting it picked off, without getting hurt, and that means even if the drive stalls due to throwing it away. At some point, a Texans QB has got to realize this.
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Just saying that you don't need to bend the truth just to prove your point. You said that that he was shaky way before he was hurt, I just pointed out that you were false because he was hurt on the very first drive, Ok? I'm not going to say that it's all the O-line fault, but anyone who thinks they shouldn't share some of the blame clearly didn't watch the game. We've got bigger problems than just QB,and yes one of those areas is the O-line.

I understand every QB is going to take hits, but he's getting absolutely hammered back there whenever we play a good defense; Pitt, Tenn, Mia, Minn, you name it. Against each of those teams we allowed over 3 sacks. So let's see, you expect Schaub to play consistently well against good teams , but you don't hold the O-line to the same accountability?
 
Malloy said:
True, the injury is real, I dont want him to keep on fighting while limping around the field.

That being said (in reference to other posts, not yours TC), the 'deer in the headlights' comment were in reference to other hits Schaub has taken during his time here, not specifically the hit(s) that caused the injury.
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Yes, the past hit(s) were described as being hits that would cripple even Superman himself.

There's just always excuses for Matt Schaub. It's this stat and that (He didn't have AJ like Sage did), and he got hit here and there, and the oline, and the running game isn't working.

The guy called all the Texans players on the roster when he first got into town, he holds team BBQs, and he squashes the Bengals. Neat-o!
 
A suggestion of protective wear if Schaub is to revive his career and remain in tact.


3s_bubble_narrowweb__200x335.jpg
 
Mari-OWNED! said:
You know I was talking about Detroit and Cincy. And if you're calling a win over Miami a huge success, then you have low expectations my friend.
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The Miami Dolphins defeated New England, San Diego, Buffalo and Denver. Not an easy task. The Fins are no pushover...yet the Texans offense lit them up DESPITE the pressure and hits on Schaub.

The Detroit Lions almost beat the Redskins and the Bears in Chi-town. The Texans handled the Lions easily until the defense had a brain fart but were never in danger of losing the game.

The Cincy Bengals almost beat the Redskins, took the Giants to OT and held Tony Romo to 179 yards passing and two turnovers. And the tough Jags were supposed to beat the Bungles...and didn't. Matt Schaub and the Texans were super efficient against Cincinnati.

Those were quallity wins by the Texans, doing what they were supposed to do.

Matt Schaub held up despite vicious hits by the Titans, Steelers and the Dolphins. He gets no credit for that? Jared Allen just put a nasty hit on the knees. That's it. Nothing to do with being brittle. Romo and Brady got taken out well before Schaub did. Then there's Kyle Orton. This is just a nasty NFL season for injuries.

The fact is, Schaub isn't as athletic as Favre, Romo, John Elway or even Warren Moon to evade pressure. Schaub doesn't have the super offensive lines that protected less than flight-footed Manning, Marino and Dan Fouts. (But Schaub could use some evasion tactics from Marino.)

The Texans need to get simply get that running game to be even more than it is despite showing improvement over last season. They need to find a way to pound away and get decent yards against the physical teams...keep the pressure off Schaub. If the Texans can get a Chuck Muncie the way the Chargers used him to help keep pressure off Fouts...that WILL BE a GREAT help. As it is, there a need to complement Slaton.


Schaub is very productive and sharp when they protect him from the dogs. And that's why the Texans need to really strengthen the running game in order to alleviate pressure on the potent passing game. We now see that the Texans offensive line is a finesse zone-blocking one that better produce the run more effectively since it is not one for big, burly pass protection.
 
nunusguy said:
Yeah, the team has Sage Rosenfels. But like a mini spare tire, Rosenfels should come with a warning: for short-term, emergency use only.
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From a lot of accounts, we could have traded this guy for a mid-level draft pick last off season. It now seems that would have been a good decision since it appears the Texans are still in building mode and need draft picks.
 
Malloy said:
I kept yelling at the screen at home. Good thing the gf wasn't home :)
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Just out of curiosity Mallory, when you are doing that is it in Danish or English? You write so well in English I just thought you might cuss pretty well in it also.
 
The roach is a retard why do you think he gets moved around from gig to gig at the worst newspaper in the country. I wouldn't believe anything he says.
 
edo783 said:
Just out of curiosity Mallory, when you are doing that is it in Danish or English? You write so well in English I just thought you might cuss pretty well in it also.
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I must admit that most of my cussing is being fired off in english these days. I am not quite sure about the reason for this (really I should just blame the years in the US!), but I have a theory that since physically, Danish and English is pronounced in very different ways (Danish from the tip of the tongue, English more from the back of the throat), I can pronounce english cuss-words 'from the tip of the tongue' for an added effect, a fairly loud, sharp and effectful cuss-word :)
 
MojoMan said:
In any case, the inconsistency at the QB position is really holding the Texans back. This is a big problem and there is no easy way to fix it.
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Amen to this. I mean the defense has played bad at times but nothing to the extent of what the QB position has put them in. Really over the last 6 weeks they played good enough for us to win. The running game hasn't been terrific but very servicable and the receivers have been extraordinary, special teams have been special. QB position has been a TO machine.
 
nunusguy said:
Right. We know Schaub doesn't have a gun and has underthrown some balls
in the past, but he's really been throwing the ball very well in the last few weeks. Therefor I think its reasonable to assume he didn't underthrow that ball to the wide-open FB Leach but couldn't get it there because of his knee injury. It's like K-T and some others are saying, Kubiak & assistants just don't snap like they should to make the decisions game-day.
I've mentioned this before but I will again. What does it tell you about a HC who won't watch FG attemps or goal-line plays in critical situations ? Too much drama, too much tension for the coach to handle ? I dunno, but that just strikes me as real odd ? And not too reassuring from the standpoint of inspiring confidance in the person who is the teams leader on the sidelines gameday ?
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Yeah, because he was throwing some nice looking passes earlier in the game. When he threw it, I knew it was a pick because he did it off of one foot. I like the guts, but when you know you cant put your all into the pass, dump it to Slaton who had about 8 yds of free space in front of him.
 
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