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Old 04-18-2013   #21
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

I'm trying to figure out why Braman hasn't seen that many snaps at OLB. The only plausible answer I can think of is that he may not be disciplined enough to stop the run game, but as a pass rusher he has a lot to be excited about. His bull-rush is nasty!
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Old 04-18-2013   #22
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
I am well aware of stats inc. but sorry I do not believe only 52% of the balls thrown to Martin were catchable. Seriously, catchable? We're talking about a QB who COMPLETES 65+% and for whatever reason he can't throw catchable balls to Martin. The guy has bad hands. I'm not saying give up on him but he sure as hell needs to be working with the Juggs machine.
This. I don't know if Martin had rookie fever but other than a few bright spots was an epic fail imo. Side note to other posters on Jean, I need to see more than training camp potential. If he can't get going, give his reps to someone else. AJ will get his usual (if not even more as MS knows what he has) TEs and at least one draftee.
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Old 04-18-2013   #23
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

LeStar Jean isnt getting cut
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Old 04-18-2013   #24
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Originally Posted by ThaJokaa View Post
LeStar Jean isnt getting cut
Support your position or admit is simply your opinion based on nothing. He is a low pay UDFA that has shown minimal in actual games. Potential in UDFA all over the place this year.
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Old 04-18-2013   #25
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Support your position or admit is simply your opinion based on nothing. He is a low pay UDFA that has shown minimal in actual games. Potential in UDFA all over the place this year.
His low pay might be the key for him sticking, at least until Posey can demonstrate that he can make a successful come back from injury.

At least Jean has had a couple of years in the system.
He should have most of the offensive concept down, and we don't have enough "veterans" at WR on the squad.
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Old 04-18-2013   #26
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Support your position or admit is simply your opinion based on nothing. He is a low pay UDFA that has shown minimal in actual games. Potential in UDFA all over the place this year.
Thats the problem. Jean barely saw the field. He really didn't have a chance to show much.
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Old 04-18-2013   #27
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
His low pay might be the key for him sticking, at least until Posey can demonstrate that he can make a successful come back from injury.

At least Jean has had a couple of years in the system.
He should have most of the offensive concept down, and we don't have enough "veterans" at WR on the squad.
Your post and bcky: low pay players are eveywhere and don't see as a factor in keepin him. Now if he was a middle pick like Martin, maybe. Listen guys, I want Jean to work as I like his size but like all low round or undrafteds, he needs to produce every play and he has not. We are in Super Bowl mode and cannot waste much more time on Jean who is in third year regardless of how little fied time he has seen.
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Old 04-18-2013   #28
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
Your post and bcky: low pay players are eveywhere and don't see as a factor in keepin him. Now if he was a middle pick like Martin, maybe. Listen guys, I want Jean to work as I like his size but like all low round or undrafteds, he needs to produce every play and he has not. We are in Super Bowl mode and cannot waste much more time on Jean who is in third year regardless of how little fied time he has seen.
Potential UDFAs are most likely more ineffective than Jean.
It's extremely doubtful that an UDFA can see many offensive snaps in their first year under Kubiak.
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Old 04-18-2013   #29
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Potential UDFAs are most likely more ineffective than Jean.
It's extremely doubtful that an UDFA can see many offensive snaps in their first year under Kubiak.
I would flood TC with UDFAs regardless. We
know what we have or do not with Jean and if he does not step up what are we expecting? Two seasons in system and basically nothing, let someone like Maehl get a chance. I am hoping we draft 2 WR. Jean got 6 receptions and that should not be too hard to replace.
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Old 04-18-2013   #30
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
I would flood TC with UDFAs regardless. We
know what we have or do not with Jean and if he does not step up what are we expecting? Two seasons in system and basically nothing, let someone like Maehl get a chance. I am hoping we draft 2 WR. Jean got 6 receptions and that should not be too hard to replace.
I don't mind us drafting a couple of receivers either.
But you know I prefer to trade our first for a future pick so that we can package it with ours to move up to get a real number one receiver.
You know I've already identified 3-4 prospects in the college football forum.
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Old 04-18-2013   #31
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
I don't mind us drafting a couple of receivers either.
But you know I prefer to trade our first for a future pick so that we can package it with ours to move up to get a real number one receiver.
You know I've already identified 3-4 prospects in the college football forum.
Well hopefully our draft will pull in a sure starter whether or not he can be an eventual #1 or not. I was not a Posey fan but am optimitic he will return in time to get some work in and be a stud in 2014. If he is and we strike gold with one '13 pick we have three solid guys. Martin and Jean could be gravy. I do believe that seond round guys & even some third rounders like Dobson and Bailey and perhaps Hamilton could become solid WRs so get them now rather than hope you can trade up next year.
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Old 04-20-2013   #32
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

You know, I've been hyper critical of the Earl Mitchell pick since day 1, since I had Geno Atkins on my board in the 3rd round of the 2010 draft. The Texans take Mitchell in the 3rd at pick #81. Atkins gets drafted in the 4th at pick #120.

Anyway, yeah Mitchell needs to step it up, but to be fair, as a NT in a 3-4 he has out performed Cody in every aspect of the game.

Shuan Cody - Career stats - 190 tackles - 3 sacks - 2 FFs. 8 Seasons
Earl Mitchell - Career stats - 86 tackles - 2 sacks - 1FF. 3 Seasons

Mitchell has only had 3 starts his entire career.

2012 - Mitchell 3 starts - 31 tackles, Cody 12 starts - 17 tackles
2011 - Mitchell 0 starts - 27 tackles - 1 sack, Cody 16 starts - 23 tackles - 1 sack

Put in another perspective:

BJ Raji - 44 more starts than Mitchell - 112 tackles, 10.5 sacks
Casey Hampton - 161 more starts than Mitchell - 373 tackles - 9 sacks -HOF?
Vince Wilfork - 125 more starts than Mitchell - 460 tackles - 16 sacks - HOF

Compare others. I'm not saying that Earl Mitchell is a world beater, but since the stat line is pretty telling for a defensive lineman (as opposed to some other positions), let's take the middle ground, and say with a Hampton like career of 12 years, at Mitchell's current pace, that's 344 tackles, 8 sacks, at the very least - and that's not even as a starter - which he will be.

I can't find a backup NT in the whole NFL that has stops like Mitchell. So, yes, he needs to step it up, but no, I would be surprised to see another NT taken very high in this coming draft. A backup to Mitchell, sure. Lower rounds. It would be very nice to have a super dominant NT on the team, but you know, we might just have one in Mitchell. It'll be interesting to see what he does with 16 starts in a season, that's for sure.

I mean, if Mitchell had 55 stops, 3.5 sacks, 3 passes defended (like 2012) and 2 FFs, would you take it? That's on par with Wilfork's best years in 2008 and 2011. In other words, at Mitchell's current pace, per season, that is very doable...maybe more!
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Old 04-20-2013   #33
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

Quote:
Originally Posted by EVOLVIST View Post
You know, I've been hyper critical of the Earl Mitchell pick since day 1, since I had Geno Atkins on my board in the 3rd round of the 2010 draft. The Texans take Mitchell in the 3rd at pick #81. Atkins gets drafted in the 4th at pick #120.

Anyway, yeah Mitchell needs to step it up, but to be fair, as a NT in a 3-4 he has out performed Cody in every aspect of the game.

Shuan Cody - Career stats - 190 tackles - 3 sacks - 2 FFs. 8 Seasons
Earl Mitchell - Career stats - 86 tackles - 2 sacks - 1FF. 3 Seasons

Mitchell has only had 3 starts his entire career.

2012 - Mitchell 3 starts - 31 tackles, Cody 12 starts - 17 tackles
2011 - Mitchell 0 starts - 27 tackles - 1 sack, Cody 16 starts - 23 tackles - 1 sack

Put in another perspective:

BJ Raji - 44 more starts than Mitchell - 112 tackles, 10.5 sacks
Casey Hampton - 161 more starts than Mitchell - 373 tackles - 9 sacks -HOF?
Vince Wilfork - 125 more starts than Mitchell - 460 tackles - 16 sacks - HOF

Compare others. I'm not saying that Earl Mitchell is a world beater, but since the stat line is pretty telling for a defensive lineman (as opposed to some other positions), let's take the middle ground, and say with a Hampton like career of 12 years, at Mitchell's current pace, that's 344 tackles, 8 sacks, at the very least - and that's not even as a starter - which he will be.

I can't find a backup NT in the whole NFL that has stops like Mitchell. So, yes, he needs to step it up, but no, I would be surprised to see another NT taken very high in this coming draft. A backup to Mitchell, sure. Lower rounds. It would be very nice to have a super dominant NT on the team, but you know, we might just have one in Mitchell. It'll be interesting to see what he does with 16 starts in a season, that's for sure.

I mean, if Mitchell had 55 stops, 3.5 sacks, 3 passes defended (like 2012) and 2 FFs, would you take it? That's on par with Wilfork's best years in 2008 and 2011. In other words, at Mitchell's current pace, per season, that is very doable...maybe more!
Great comparison. Rep for the homework.
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Old 04-20-2013   #34
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

Quote:
Originally Posted by EVOLVIST View Post
You know, I've been hyper critical of the Earl Mitchell pick since day 1, since I had Geno Atkins on my board in the 3rd round of the 2010 draft. The Texans take Mitchell in the 3rd at pick #81. Atkins gets drafted in the 4th at pick #120.

Anyway, yeah Mitchell needs to step it up, but to be fair, as a NT in a 3-4 he has out performed Cody in every aspect of the game.

Shuan Cody - Career stats - 190 tackles - 3 sacks - 2 FFs. 8 Seasons
Earl Mitchell - Career stats - 86 tackles - 2 sacks - 1FF. 3 Seasons

Mitchell has only had 3 starts his entire career.

2012 - Mitchell 3 starts - 31 tackles, Cody 12 starts - 17 tackles
2011 - Mitchell 0 starts - 27 tackles - 1 sack, Cody 16 starts - 23 tackles - 1 sack

Put in another perspective:

BJ Raji - 44 more starts than Mitchell - 112 tackles, 10.5 sacks
Casey Hampton - 161 more starts than Mitchell - 373 tackles - 9 sacks -HOF?
Vince Wilfork - 125 more starts than Mitchell - 460 tackles - 16 sacks - HOF

Compare others. I'm not saying that Earl Mitchell is a world beater, but since the stat line is pretty telling for a defensive lineman (as opposed to some other positions), let's take the middle ground, and say with a Hampton like career of 12 years, at Mitchell's current pace, that's 344 tackles, 8 sacks, at the very least - and that's not even as a starter - which he will be.

I can't find a backup NT in the whole NFL that has stops like Mitchell. So, yes, he needs to step it up, but no, I would be surprised to see another NT taken very high in this coming draft. A backup to Mitchell, sure. Lower rounds. It would be very nice to have a super dominant NT on the team, but you know, we might just have one in Mitchell. It'll be interesting to see what he does with 16 starts in a season, that's for sure.

I mean, if Mitchell had 55 stops, 3.5 sacks, 3 passes defended (like 2012) and 2 FFs, would you take it? That's on par with Wilfork's best years in 2008 and 2011. In other words, at Mitchell's current pace, per season, that is very doable...maybe more!


Great post EVOLVIST! Rep coming your way!

Mitchell has turned out to be a pretty good NT, especially since he bulked up some last year. I think he was in the 285 lbs range when the Texans drafted him and now he's something like 300 lbs, which is still a little lite for a 3-4 NT IMO. Problem is, they have only 2 (Terrell McCain and David Hunter) backing him up now. They picked McCain up mid season last year and Hunter was an UDFA Rookie who spent the year on IR. So, don't be surprised if the Texans take a NT in the 1st or 2nd round this year if that's the best player they feel is available at #27 or #57. My guess is they go for someone like Bennie Logan (6'2" 309) in the 2nd or 3rd who has a "high motor," which is what they like.
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Old 04-20-2013   #35
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

Quote:
Originally Posted by EVOLVIST View Post
You know, I've been hyper critical of the Earl Mitchell pick since day 1, since I had Geno Atkins on my board in the 3rd round of the 2010 draft. The Texans take Mitchell in the 3rd at pick #81. Atkins gets drafted in the 4th at pick #120.

Anyway, yeah Mitchell needs to step it up, but to be fair, as a NT in a 3-4 he has out performed Cody in every aspect of the game.

Shuan Cody - Career stats - 190 tackles - 3 sacks - 2 FFs. 8 Seasons
Earl Mitchell - Career stats - 86 tackles - 2 sacks - 1FF. 3 Seasons

Mitchell has only had 3 starts his entire career.

2012 - Mitchell 3 starts - 31 tackles, Cody 12 starts - 17 tackles
2011 - Mitchell 0 starts - 27 tackles - 1 sack, Cody 16 starts - 23 tackles - 1 sack

Put in another perspective:

BJ Raji - 44 more starts than Mitchell - 112 tackles, 10.5 sacks
Casey Hampton - 161 more starts than Mitchell - 373 tackles - 9 sacks -HOF?
Vince Wilfork - 125 more starts than Mitchell - 460 tackles - 16 sacks - HOF

Compare others. I'm not saying that Earl Mitchell is a world beater, but since the stat line is pretty telling for a defensive lineman (as opposed to some other positions), let's take the middle ground, and say with a Hampton like career of 12 years, at Mitchell's current pace, that's 344 tackles, 8 sacks, at the very least - and that's not even as a starter - which he will be.

I can't find a backup NT in the whole NFL that has stops like Mitchell. So, yes, he needs to step it up, but no, I would be surprised to see another NT taken very high in this coming draft. A backup to Mitchell, sure. Lower rounds. It would be very nice to have a super dominant NT on the team, but you know, we might just have one in Mitchell. It'll be interesting to see what he does with 16 starts in a season, that's for sure.

I mean, if Mitchell had 55 stops, 3.5 sacks, 3 passes defended (like 2012) and 2 FFs, would you take it? That's on par with Wilfork's best years in 2008 and 2011. In other words, at Mitchell's current pace, per season, that is very doable...maybe more!
Yes, guarantee me those stats from Mitchell and I move Nose completely off my board. You just cannot project off three starts. He did look better end of season but no way do I put eggs in his basket. I hope he has a great season as it is his final contract year. IMO on that alone we have to draft a significant back up.
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Old 04-20-2013   #36
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Yes, guarantee me those stats from Mitchell and I move Nose completely off my board. You just cannot project off three starts. He did look better end of season but no way do I put eggs in his basket. I hope he has a great season as it is his final contract year. IMO on that alone we have to draft a significant back up.
Yeah, no way would I guarantee those stats for 2013. After all, this is a "step it up" thread, and the OP mentioned Mitchell as one of those to step it up. I agree. He does need to. Nothing will be more telling than this coming season. I just think I had been a bit too critical of Mitchell, even though he hasn't been a slouch since day-one; I had simply been comparing him to Geno Atkins, despite Atkins playing in a 4-3.

About the draft? I like your 2.0 mock better. I have Texans talking Bennie Logan out of LSU in the 5th as depth and grooming.
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Old 04-21-2013   #37
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Yeah, no way would I guarantee those stats for 2013. After all, this is a "step it up" thread, and the OP mentioned Mitchell as one of those to step it up. I agree. He does need to. Nothing will be more telling than this coming season. I just think I had been a bit too critical of Mitchell, even though he hasn't been a slouch since day-one; I had simply been comparing him to Geno Atkins, despite Atkins playing in a 4-3.

About the draft? I like your 2.0 mock better. I have Texans talking Bennie Logan out of LSU in the 5th as depth and grooming.
Logan will never make it to the 5th round. If the Texans want him they might have to get him with their 2nd pick because he probably won't be there for their 3rd round pick. He's projected to be a 2nd to 3rd rounder by Walter Football. I know Draft Scout has him projected in the 5th but I don't think they have updated their DT list in awhile. I can't see him lasting until the Texans pick in the 5th.
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Old 04-21-2013   #38
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

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Originally Posted by Insideop View Post
Logan will never make it to the 5th round. If the Texans want him they might have to get him with their 2nd pick because he probably won't be there for their 3rd round pick. He's projected to be a 2nd to 3rd rounder by Walter Football. I know Draft Scout has him projected in the 5th but I don't think they have updated their DT list in awhile. I can't see him lasting until the Texans pick in the 5th.
Yeah, actually, I meant to pencil in Logan in the 3rd. I was going by my old draft board a week ago and forgot to update it.
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Old 04-22-2013   #39
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

the hole 53 man roster needs to step it up
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Old 04-22-2013   #40
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Default Re: Step it up, Texans

Good post Evolist. It's one reason I don't see NT as high as many. Unless Wade is changing the defense the NT is not on the field for the Texans as much as other 3-4 defenses. On top of that Mitchell did outplay Cody and is good for penetrating which Wade likes.

Though with that said, if one of the top DT's fall (and there is a slight chance of it) to 27 then I think they should grab him and adjust the defense a bit. Have to adjust to your personnel after all. But if they don't grab one til later in the draft I think they will be fine with Mitchell and a developing player. It's just not a position overly utilized by Wade and we didn't have issues against the run like we did against those fun spread teams tossing the ball all over the place. In those situations the NT is generally not even on the field.
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