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Old 03-07-2013   #41
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

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Originally Posted by Wolf6151 View Post
I'd take Eric Winston back if he came cheap, but lets remember his faults for a bit here. He has short arms and slow feet, he doesn't do well against speed rushers, thus giving up way to many sacks. I'd leave Newton at RT where I think he'll improve with experience, and move Winston to RG where I think his size, strength, and experience would benifit the Texans and Newton. His toughness and attitude would benifit the youngsters as well.
You're right.... I'll recant a little.

He won't be starting at tackle at the end of 2013.
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Old 03-07-2013   #42
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

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Originally Posted by Scooter View Post
i understand defending a texan or deriding what could be a bad idea, but newton was bad last year. his poor play and inconsistency very much contributed to our problems late in the year offensively.

one player is being supported as "he's not THAT bad", while the other is a probowler and graded among the tops at his position being ridden down as "not THAT good".
Don't forget, Newton didn't play much at all his rookie season, this is pretty much the first extended action he got. Down the stretch, he was not 100% & we really don't know how bad the knee was.

Inconsistency is something we should expect from all our young players. With time, we hope that works out.

Again, I'm not tooting the Texans' horn, I'm not defending the Texans' decisions. I don't know that Newton is the long term answer, but RT has been the weakest spot (imo & I've said so many times before 2012) on our OL for years.
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Old 03-07-2013   #43
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

Even if they wanted to bring back Winston, the Texans still have the same issue as last offseason. Lack of cap room.
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Old 03-07-2013   #44
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

The Chiefs thought last year they were contenders for the AFC West title and a playoff berth before the season began and needed just a couple more pieces to make their team complete, including an upgrade at RT so they reached when Winston became available. Anyway, as we know their season turned out to be a disaster (they got the first overall pick next month, right?), and now they've got a new regime which wants to pass alot more than the previous one that signed Winston primarily for his rush-blocking abilities, and consequently Winston is on the street this morning. But he's 9 M richer (before expenses) after just one year with the Chiefs and he already got one sweet contract with the Texans so maybe he'll just retire ? On the other hand I'm pretty sure he still lives in Houston and if he'd take the minimum to be a reserve and/or perhaps compete for a starting guard position which would allow him to stay at home with wife and child, maybe he and Rick Smith could work something out ?
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Old 03-07-2013   #45
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

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Originally Posted by paycheck71 View Post
Interesting. PFF had him with 3. Don't know where they get their info.
As someone else stated, PFF doesn't just take numbers and go with that. That is what those official NFL stats provides. PFF is about a deeper evaluation about the plays and gives credit as should be assigned to the player. It's why some actual GM's utilize PFF and gathers information/reports from them. And if actual GM's roll with it then I'm cool with it too, heh.

As for Winston he is still too one dimensional. He is better than Newton at run blocking but he still has too many issues pass blocking for the type of salary he commands. He would have to take a heck of a paycut to come back here and chances are that won't be necessary since someone will give him a salary closer to what he is use to then we can.

As for Newton...we really need to stop making him more than he was as well. He was not good last year. Simple as that. All we can do is hope that he improves. There is no guarantee he will and there is no guarantee he won't. So we need to sign someone who can at least challenge him at an affordable price.

Newton was up and down all season. Only contender he played halfway decent had a lousy defense (Packers). Just like the Pats playoff game. Couldn't run to the right side til he was taken out and Ryan Harris put in (who isn't all that great himself). That should not have to happen and Kubiak stated early before the season he had no intentions of players sharing the position. But play on the field proved otherwise and it had to happen. We're trying to contend for the Bowl, not just AFC South titles so yes, we need more out of the spot. Hopefully Newton is ready to step it up a notch and develop.

So if we wish to bring up the continuity of the offensive line we can only blame the players/coaches themselves. It was their shaky play that made Kubes and Dennison go that direction. Not just injuries which are part of the game in any case.
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Old 03-07-2013   #46
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

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Originally Posted by Scooter View Post
whoever our right tackle is will have jones and/or brooks beside them, both an upgrade over brisiel IMO.
What are you basing this opinion on? When mike brisiel played, the right side of the line was fine. When he was out, not so much. Plus guard>tackle in run blocking.
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Old 03-07-2013   #47
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

Seems the Texans have possibly already contacted Winston on a reunion. I think he will have to play for less then his $5M per yr, but he may be willing to comeback w/ hopes of winning. I think Newton has room to grow & could get better, but the Texans are built to win now & it would be one less excuse for Schaub if he can't get the job done.

Eric Winston - T - Free Agent
According to the Philadelphia Daily News, the Eagles and Texans were the first two teams to reach out to free agent RT Eric Winston.
Winston certainly won't hurt for work after grading out as the league's No. 9 right tackle last season. In Philadelphia, he could slide right in as a starter and allow Todd Herremans to solidify the problematic right guard spot. He's also very familiar with the Texans' zone-blocking scheme after spending the first six years of his career there.
Related: Texans, Eagles
Source: Philadelphia Daily News Mar 7 - 11:13 AM
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Old 03-07-2013   #48
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

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Originally Posted by JamesBill View Post
What are you basing this opinion on? When mike brisiel played, the right side of the line was fine. When he was out, not so much. Plus guard>tackle in run blocking.
They were more then "fine". The o-line w/ Briesel & Winston were considered one of the best in the NFL. Those 2 leave & o-line takes a step back in both pass protection & run blocking & yet we have some who foolishly insist that somehow one of the best o-lines improved despite the production saying otherwise. Just another classic example of "bash the ex-Texan because they moved on" silliness. The current o-line has potential, but havent proven much just yet. The former o-line proved they were one of the best to many.
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Old 03-07-2013   #49
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

First of all, I haven't heard a single person who ever said that the line has improved this year.

This is my evaluation, which I had mentioned before:

Duane Brown was good for the first two third of the season, but tailed off down the stretch. Overall, he's about the same as the previous year or marginally better.

Wade Smith really had a down year; the difference in play here was quite big in both aspects of the offense, run and pass.

Myers also had a down year. In 2011, he had a great year; last year, it was at best average.

Briesiel was always underated. Caldwell, Jones, and Brooks were all wildly inconsistent. The diminishing in play might be the most pronounced at this spot.

There was also a drop-off at RT as well, but the difference here was not as pronounced as at the two guard spots.
It might be less of a problem than the Center spot as well (if we're talking about the difference between the two years.)
In 2011, Myers' play was great; last year, it was below average.

In 2011, the RT's play was just above average; last year, it was slightly below average or average.

I rewatched 4 games (Titans second game, Vikings - two games in which Foster went nowhere) and the two play-off games using the condensed format from NFL Game Rewind (plays start when the two teams are ready to go, no commercial, no time-out, no huddle) and Newton's play was quite encouraging.
(I also look at the end zone view from one of the All-22 cameras to check out all the runs for fewer than 3 yards and the incompletions + interceptions.)

Winston would have been at best a stalemate in these games as compared to the combo of Newton and Harris.

Harris was an unsung hero of sort. IMO, his overall play for the whole season was slightly better than Winston in 2011; however, we simply don't know if he can hold up if asked to play full-time.
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Old 03-07-2013   #50
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

Get it done! This could be the positive story of the off season. Everyone expects we will either flat-line or get worse with the players lost in FA. This could give our offense the "hype" again.

Out of 80 tackles, Newton was the 76th best run blocker. These grades are on a cumulative basis meaning the more playing time a guy gets the more opportunities he has to rank higher. He was outperformed by a number of low snap fillers.

Netwon was 47 / 80 on pass blocking. That is acceptable for a young player, but Eric was in the top 25 in both categories.
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Old 03-07-2013   #51
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

Bring the caveman back!!!
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Old 03-07-2013   #52
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

If bringing Winston back meant being able to pound the ball like we did in 2010 and 2011, then I'd be all for it. It would also probably mean that we'd have less of a chance at signing Glover Quin though which would leave a huge hole in the secondary.
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Old 03-07-2013   #53
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

I kind of wonder what Winston would be like if we brought him back and made him the right guard. I think he's the kind of bulldozer you want on the inside for runs and he has the athleticism to be a lead blocker on counter plays.
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Old 03-07-2013   #54
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

Well, the Texans are looking at him:

Quote:
Andy Reidís new team said goodbye to right tackle Eric Winston on Wednesday, a move that piqued the interest of Reidís old team.

Les Bowen of the Philadelphia Daily News reports that the Eagles were one of the first two teams to reach out to Winston after his announcement of his departure from the Chiefs hit the wires. Winstonís durability is likely part of the reason for the teamís interest. Winston has started all 96 games over the last six seasons while the Eagles were playing a season-long game of musical chairs in 2012 thanks to a slew of serious injuries to their projected starting offensive linemen.

Bowen reports that the other team to show interest in speaking to Winston was the Texans, who drafted him in 2006 and employed him until his release last March. Derek Newton started at right tackle for Houston in 2012.

When Winston was released last year, he was out of work for less than a week before landing in Kansas City. Given the early interest in his services, it may be another short spell on the unemployment line for Winston again this year.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...nston/related/
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Old 03-07-2013   #55
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

Give us the hometown discount, Eric!

Otherwise, you will probaby be a loser Eagle.
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Old 03-07-2013   #56
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

Can Derek Newton play right guard? I'd love to have Big-E back.
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Old 03-07-2013   #57
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

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Originally Posted by tru80texan View Post
They were more then "fine". The o-line w/ Briesel & Winston were considered one of the best in the NFL. Those 2 leave & o-line takes a step back in both pass protection & run blocking & yet we have some who foolishly insist that somehow one of the best o-lines improved despite the production saying otherwise. Just another classic example of "bash the ex-Texan because they moved on" silliness. The current o-line has potential, but havent proven much just yet. The former o-line proved they were one of the best to many.
Yes they were more than fine WITH Mike Briseil. Without him they collapsed on the right side. When he came back in the playoffs they dominated. Yet for some reason you give all the credit to Winston and none to Mike Briseil. I was just asking why. So, why?
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Old 03-07-2013   #58
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

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Originally Posted by htowntexans1985 View Post
Bring the caveman back!!!
For better or for worse, not gonna happen. There are teams with bucks already standing on his doorstep.

Could be wrong like I usually am but I think not in this case.

I do like the sound of moving him inside with Newton gaining experience I think he's going to surprise some haters. Then, of course, perhaps not.
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Old 03-07-2013   #59
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

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For better or for worse, not gonna happen. There are teams with bucks already standing on his doorstep.

Could be wrong like I usually am but I think not in this case.

I do like the sound of moving him inside with Newton gaining experience I think he's going to surprise some haters. Then, of course, perhaps not.
Something also tells me that if the texans weren't willing to restructure his contract last year, they probably won't be offering anything long-term.
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Old 03-07-2013   #60
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Default Re: Eric Winston released by Chiefs

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Originally Posted by Bulls on Parade View Post
Can Derek Newton play right guard? I'd love to have Big-E back.
I think Newton is a guard. I don't think he has the feet to play Tackle. Not that I'm advocating signing Winston (at least not to anything long term). Just that Newton is not the answer.

BTW, Winston was on the Palillo show on 790 around 6 pm. Did anyone listen to that interview? Just wondering what was said.
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