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Old 12-26-2012   #41
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

Alex Smith is about the same as Matt Schaub.

Said no football analyst ever.
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Old 12-26-2012   #42
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
If you like Smith, you can make a case for him.
Some of the Niners fans want him back because they don't believe Kaepernick can be all that. He already has a nickname "Krapernicker".

Those who support CK point out that he's still young; that Smith can never carry a team.

So even if you don't like Schaub, you also ought to know that Smith is not an upgrade.

It's all good and well trying to find a solution, but that solution has to make a lot of sense to be considered as viable; otherwise, we will just go round and round with a QB carousel.
I never suggested we go after Smith. Not this year or next. Just asked a simple question. Who's better Schaub or Smith? I would love to here a reasonable answer from one of the Schaub supporters why. What makes him so much better than Smith. So far not one has been able to do that. Just smart ass attempts at humor or insults as if its a rediculous question.

In other words they can't come up with legit reason why they think Schaub is so much better.
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Old 12-26-2012   #43
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by ThaShark316 View Post
Alex Smith ain't no MFin clutch.

Because the Saints left Vernon Davis wide open in the playoffs don't make you clutch.
And Schaub is?
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Old 12-26-2012   #44
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by mussop View Post
I never suggested we go after Smith. Not this year or next. Just asked a simple question. Who's better Schaub or Smith? I would love to here a reasonable answer from one of the Schaub supporters why. What makes him so much better than Smith. So far not one has been able to do that. Just smart ass attempts at humor or insults as if its a rediculous question.

In other words they can't come up with legit reason why they think Schaub is so much better.
You're so delusional its not even funny...there have been no less than 3-4 reasons in this thread alone....you just refuse to acknowledge.....pathetic really.
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Old 12-26-2012   #45
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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The Texans passing game wasn't any good when our running game stunk a few years ago? Did you forget that Schaub led the league in passing yards?? What about the defense being the worst in the league where we constantly had to pass and other teams knew it?? That is not having a perfect environment at all. That is having a lot of things against you is what that is and Schaub did pretty well considering those circumstances.

Alex Smith has never been a good QB in his entire career. They aren't even close.
This right here is the ONLY reason why he led the league in yards. Our run game was terrible so we had no choice but to throw it. This doesn't mean Schaub was great it means he padded stats.
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Old 12-26-2012   #46
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

I want an upgrade to Matt Schaub not a replacement for replacements sake. I think Alex Smith could do some things better than Schaub and other things not nearly as good. It would be a wash once all the upheaval was over and that result wouldn't be worth making the change to begin with.

Now, Alex has one thing going for him that I don't see in Schaub and that's not necessarily a bad thing. Smith has bounced from one system to another since he got in the league and come out the other side of it still capable of playing at this level. Matt's been lucky in that for the duration of his career as a starter he's had one coach, one system, and stability like most guys never get to enjoy. I'd love to know what Alex Smith turns out like if he goes to some place like Green Bay where Rogers went and gets that kind of coaching.

I guess what I mean by this last point is that I think Matt is the best he can be. We've seen him develop in a stable system that is tailored to his abilities and avoids his shortcomings. Alex Smith didn't have that and I think he kind of gets the benefit of the doubt right now because in Harbaugh's system he's been really solid. It doesn't make any difference to us here today in 2012 though. It's more speculation and wondering whether Smith would have turned out differently.
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Old 12-26-2012   #47
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
I want an upgrade to Matt Schaub not a replacement for replacements sake. I think Alex Smith could do some things better than Schaub and other things not nearly as good. It would be a wash once all the upheaval was over and that result wouldn't be worth making the change to begin with.

Now, Alex has one thing going for him that I don't see in Schaub and that's not necessarily a bad thing. Smith has bounced from one system to another since he got in the league and come out the other side of it still capable of playing at this level. Matt's been lucky in that for the duration of his career as a starter he's had one coach, one system, and stability like most guys never get to enjoy. I'd love to know what Alex Smith turns out like if he goes to some place like Green Bay where Rogers went and gets that kind of coaching.

I guess what I mean by this last point is that I think Matt is the best he can be. We've seen him develop in a stable system that is tailored to his abilities and avoids his shortcomings. Alex Smith didn't have that and I think he kind of gets the benefit of the doubt right now because in Harbaugh's system he's been really solid. It doesn't make any difference to us here today in 2012 though. It's more speculation and wondering whether Smith would have turned out differently.

The bolded is actually a good point in his favor but people need to put things in perspective. He doesn't throw a ton of ints partly b/c coaches...even harbaugh, haven't trusted him to the throw the ball. 3 ints in 445 attempts sounds nice but its still not all that impressive when you consider that there are at least 2 rookie qbs this year who have or will have thrown the ball more times than he did all of last season....& that's excluding Andrew Luck (599 att).......i'm talking guys like Tannehill and Weeden. The average total attempts for the league is probably somewhere around 500-515 attempts. Reagardless of the regime that's been in place, noone trusts him to air it out.


& again, what it comes back to with him is that this guy was still benched by his coach a season after an NFC championship appearance. That imo says more than any stat or any particular fan's feeling are towards him. & if you've watched the 49ers offense since Kap has been at the helm and compare it to how it was last year under Smith, the difference is stark...they are way more explosive with kap..much more so than they've ever been under Smith.
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Old 12-26-2012   #48
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by Mr teX View Post
The bolded is actually a good point in his favor but people need to put things in perspective. He doesn't throw a ton of ints partly b/c coaches...even harbaugh, haven't trusted him to the throw the ball. 3 ints in 445 attempts sounds nice but its still not all that impressive when you consider that there are at least 2 rookie qbs this year who have or will have thrown the ball more times than he did all of last season....& that's excluding Andrew Luck (599 att).......i'm talking guys like Tannehill and Weeden. The average total attempts for the league is probably somewhere around 500-515 attempts. Reagardless of the regime that's been in place, noone trusts him to air it out.
Attempts have more to do with the style of offense and whether or not you are ahead or behind a bunch....Unless you're saying half the league trust their QB's more than Schaub.

Matt Schaub is in the bottom half of the league in attempts this year.

In 2010 Rodgers had 475 attempts. Schaub had 100 more. Do you think that had more to do with Green Bay being ahead a bunch or do you think we trusted our QB throwing more than Rodgers?

And btw, last year Schaub threw the ball about 1 whole more times per game than Alex Smith did.

But maybe you're right. Maybe it does have to do with trust. Hell, Kubiak doesn't even trust his QB to throw the ball on third and long and instead opts for the draw almost every time.
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Old 12-26-2012   #49
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
I want an upgrade to Matt Schaub not a replacement for replacements sake. I think Alex Smith could do some things better than Schaub and other things not nearly as good. It would be a wash once all the upheaval was over and that result wouldn't be worth making the change to begin with.

Now, Alex has one thing going for him that I don't see in Schaub and that's not necessarily a bad thing. Smith has bounced from one system to another since he got in the league and come out the other side of it still capable of playing at this level. Matt's been lucky in that for the duration of his career as a starter he's had one coach, one system, and stability like most guys never get to enjoy. I'd love to know what Alex Smith turns out like if he goes to some place like Green Bay where Rogers went and gets that kind of coaching.

I guess what I mean by this last point is that I think Matt is the best he can be. We've seen him develop in a stable system that is tailored to his abilities and avoids his shortcomings. Alex Smith didn't have that and I think he kind of gets the benefit of the doubt right now because in Harbaugh's system he's been really solid. It doesn't make any difference to us here today in 2012 though. It's more speculation and wondering whether Smith would have turned out differently.
You make some good points. Alex Smith's athleticism could add something to our game. But does he have it between the ears, or do you think his athleticism alone will make up for it?

I haven't seen anything from Alex Smith to make me think the net result would be better.

Think about it this way....... Alex Smith is less "talented" than David Carr. David put up good stats in this system, but we weren't going to win anything with David Carr.
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Old 12-26-2012   #50
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
Attempts have more to do with the style of offense and whether or not you are ahead or behind a bunch....Unless you're saying half the league trust their QB's more than Schaub.

Matt Schaub is in the bottom half of the league in attempts this year.
A lot of it also has to do with three & outs as well. Getting forced off the field limits snaps, which limits attempts.
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Old 12-26-2012   #51
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by Fiddler View Post
A lot of it also has to do with three & outs as well. Getting forced off the field limits snaps, which limits attempts.

Is that why Schaub's attmempts have him in the bottom half of the league this year?
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Old 12-26-2012   #52
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
Attempts have more to do with the style of offense and whether or not you are ahead or behind a bunch....Unless you're saying half the league trust their QB's more than Schaub.

Matt Schaub is in the bottom half of the league in attempts this year.

In 2010 Rodgers had 475 attempts. Schaub had 100 more. Do you think that had more to do with Green Bay being ahead a bunch or do you think we trusted our QB throwing more than Rodgers?

And btw, last year Schaub threw the ball about 1 whole more times per game than Alex Smith did.
Strawman argument at it's finest

This is true................ to a point....what you're saying is fine for last year for smith, but how do you explain away the trend throughout his career of throwing the ball no more than 440 times? They just got good last year, so that playing from ahead argument doesn't apply to his previous teams b/c they've been trash offensively pretty much since he's been there. Opponents haven't feared him in the passing game so it doesn't really matter if they've been a run first team or not, they're stacking the box for gore...basically daring Smith to make plays in the pass game......and the coaches still haven't trusted him to sling it around.

& yeah schaub is in the bottom half this year but we've been a good running 1st team for 2 years now, yet schaub was still on pace to throw it 500+ times last year and has already eclipsed 500 attempts this year despite us more often than not playing from ahead and dominating TOP.

You guys try to downplay stats and say that they're only part of the story, which is true... but they mean more than what you guys wants to acknowledge; especially when you know what you're looking at & you combine them with what you're seeing in games.
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Old 12-26-2012   #53
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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You're so delusional its not even funny...there have been no less than 3-4 reasons in this thread alone....you just refuse to acknowledge.....pathetic really.
Really? Then you shouldn't have any problem pointing them out because I haven't seen a legit one yet.
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Old 12-26-2012   #54
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Strawman argument at it's finest

This is true................ to a point....what you're saying is fine for last year for smith, but how do you explain away the trend throughout his career of throwing the ball no more than 440 times?
He's always had coaches that wanted a running team. He missed games due to being benched or injury. His coaches in the past weren't as good as harbaugh.

I don't understand how this is a strawman argument. Your argument is strawman. You're connecting dots that aren't there. Or you're connecting them based on what you want to be true.

I've given several possibilities, you've seen something and definitively said that he hasn't thrown the ball as much because he hasn't been trusted. There is no way in hell you can know that.

You used last year's stats as an example. Not me. I only commented on what you responded to which is the only 3 ints last year...remember that? That's where the conversation started, so why the hell would I talk about his previous years where his coaching obviously was sub par?
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Old 12-26-2012   #55
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Really? Then you shouldn't have any problem pointing them out because I haven't seen a legit one yet.
-His own coach benched him after his marvelous 20-6 record you keep touting

-As #1 overall pick 8 years in, he still hasn't had a 20 TD passing year ...that's basically a prequisite for being at least average

- Despite his big arm and mobility he doesn't throw the ball deep and he doesn't run around a whole lot...he doesn't even move around the pocket very well.

Those are about as legit as you trying to pass your opinion off about schaub as fact.
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Old 12-26-2012   #56
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

Alex Smith has way more TALENT than Schaub, but can't seem to get a break on the Niners. I will say that MAYBE he is not smart enough to grasp the offense thats why they moved on, but he has much physical ability than our boy does, no doubt.


That said, you don't move on from Matt to Alex Smith. Its a lateral move that would be pointless, at that point you allow Yates to try or you draft a qb.
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Old 12-26-2012   #57
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I just showed some of my 9er fan friends this thread and they couldn't stop laughing. All of them would take Schaub over Smith or Kaep in a heartbeat.

Living in the SF Bay Area, I watch a lot of 9er games. Trust me, Alex Smith is not the answer for us, and not the answer for the 9ers. You guys blast Kubiak/Schaub for being conservative, Harbaugh/Smith are even more conservative. You guys blast Schaub for having a weak arm, Smith's arm is even weaker. You guys say Schaub has no poise in the pocket when there's pressure, Smith is even worse.

The only edge I give to Smith is his mobility.
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Old 12-26-2012   #58
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
He's always had coaches that wanted a running team. He missed games due to being benched or injury. His coaches in the past weren't as good as harbaugh.

I don't understand how this is a strawman argument. Your argument is strawman. You're connecting dots that aren't there. Or you're connecting them based on what you want to be true.

I've given several possibilities, you've seen something and definitively said that he hasn't thrown the ball as much because he hasn't been trusted. There is no way in hell you can know that.

You used last year's stats as an example. Not me. I only commented on what you responded to which is the only 3 ints last year...remember that? That's where the conversation started, so why the hell would I talk about his previous years where his coaching obviously was sub par?
it's strawman b/c rather than address and retort the obvious things, you pick out a few anomalies and start talking about pass attempts per game. Smith's coaching was subpar but even with all that the guy still hasn't been able to get it done & that's undeniable. As much as people bash Kubiak around here about subpar coaching, Schaub has still been able to look very good over multiple years passing the ball...despite us being a run first team. Sam Bradford has had to deal with alot of the same issues in his career that Smith has over the years...he's still managed to look more adept at passing the ball than Smith has.

& the dots that i'm connecting have been confirmed by just about every freaking talking head imaginable &with the things Harbaugh is doing... His own coach has essentially confirmed it when he continued to keep the guy on the bench even after he recovered from his concussion despite his record the last few years....when he continued to shuttle Kapernick in on wildcat plays..... it was confirmed when Harbaugh tried to go after Manning this past off-season....even if it was just for a split second. His total passing attempts year by year is just icing on the cake as far as i'm concerned.

His past coaches didn't trust in him so they benched him.... his current coach doesn't trust in him as a guy that can sling it....don't see how this is even debateable. You don't do that to players you trust especially a qb......period.

& if you've watched this dude over his career, you can see that they have a very valid reason for not trusting him.

If any of you can address this above with a legit answer then i'd be more open to what you guys are saying..but as of now, you guys just casually step over that reason like it's no big deal...no head coach does the things that harbaugh has done to this dude without there being doubt about whether he's right for the job or not.
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Old 12-26-2012   #59
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by Mr teX View Post
it's strawman b/c rather than address and retort the obvious things, you pick out a few anomalies and start talking about pass attempts per game.
WTH are you talking about? I have laid out possible reasons that he hasn't thrown the ball 500 or 600 times. I have not commented on anything else besides that.

Show me this "obvious" proof that his coach didn't trust him as the reason why his pass attempts are average rather than high .vs than that being a function of the offense he was in and the philosophy of his coach.

Also, what are you complaining about att/gm for? That is what makes up the total amount of attempts during a season and last year Matt Schaub didn't play a whole season so the only thing to go off of is that. Alex Smith hasn't played every game this year, so wouldn't it make sense to look at attempts per game rather than the total?
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Old 12-26-2012   #60
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Default Re: Who's better Schaub or A Smith?

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Originally Posted by Mr teX View Post
& again, what it comes back to with him is that this guy was still benched by his coach a season after an NFC championship appearance. That imo says more than any stat or any particular fan's feeling are towards him. & if you've watched the 49ers offense since Kap has been at the helm and compare it to how it was last year under Smith, the difference is stark...they are way more explosive with kap..much more so than they've ever been under Smith.


Smith was replaced because Harbaugh wasn't content with a game manager. He, like many of the fans here, know the potential his offense have with a more physically gifted QB. He got the opportunity to play one and he did well so he rolled the dice and is sticking with the guy. Don't think for a minute that if he starts doing bad that he won't throw Smith back in there.

There is no reason to think there was a trust issue except that it fits your argument. Throughout the year Harbaugh said time and time again that he had faith in Smith. Google it, there are many many articles on it.


And this nonsense about the offense looking so much better with Kolin this year than it did last year, care to show a shred of evidence to the contrary or should we just take your word for it?
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