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Old 08-30-2012   #41
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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Originally Posted by Fiddler View Post
You look at that and the obvious conclusion you come up with is that Eli is "better" than Peyton... or even in the same league? What does that say about Warren Moon, Dan Foust (sp), & Marino??

The Giants have a better team than the Colts... that's all I take from that. As far as MVP goes.. which is an individual award, call me when Eli gets a league MVP. Not as prestigious, I know, but it includes all players... even those that did not qualify for the Super Bowl MVP.
Hell no , Eli isnt as good as Peyton .... I honestly think Peyton Manning is the best QB this league has ever seen. He's taken QB play to a whole nother level .... Man do I hate that guy, only because he doesnt play for my team.

But with two SB-MVP's and two rings .... I'll plug him in with the next tier of QB's which includes Brady , Brees and Rodgers.


My point was more that he gets overshadowed by Peyton more because his name is Manning .... If he was anyone else we wouldnt get near as many comparisons.
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Old 08-30-2012   #42
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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Originally Posted by kwayshauntay View Post
Cortland Finnegan, Josh Wilson, Michael Huff, Jabari Greer. Do these names ring a bell?
Didn't the all say that if you hit Schaub once, he pretty much gives up?

I know Albert Fatworth has said that many times.

Never really seen anyone but blind Cowboys haters put Schaub over Romo.
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Old 08-30-2012   #43
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

IMO, Schaub is the most likely candidate to cost us a SB appearance. I'm not saying much here, but it is what it is.
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Old 08-30-2012   #44
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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Originally Posted by Texecutioner View Post
I've been calling Schaub TOP 10 for the last few years. I'd say that if you made a list though, you could argue that other guys belong over him in the top 10. It's all about perspective really. No way he is out of the top 15 though.

I'm only concerned with RIGHT NOW as far as Schaub goes though, and RIGHT NOW Schaub is looking damn good going into the season. Schaub looks crisp, focused, and as sharp as I have ever seen Schaub look. I'm proud that he our QB.
Very well said. I agree 100%.

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Old 08-30-2012   #45
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

ProFootballFocus has it's own QB Rating (Signature Stats) that takes into account dropped passes, throw aways, spikes, and yards in the air and further adjusts the old formula so it makes more sense and is a more accurate measure. These are based on regular season only.

2008, at least 50% of snaps
Quote:
1 Aaron Rodgers 97.11
2 Philip Rivers 95.98
3 Peyton Manning 95.00
4 Matt Ryan 92.95
5 Chad Pennington 92.65
6 Jeff Garcia 91.29
7 Kurt Warner 90.87
8 Matt Schaub 90.25

10 Drew Brees 88.94
11 Jay Cutler 88.51
12 Eli Manning 88.41

14 Tony Romo 86.55

19 Ben Roethlisberger 84.50
2009, at least 50% of snaps
Quote:
1 Drew Brees 96.89
2 Ben Roethlisberger 95.69
3 Philip Rivers 94.87
4 Brett Favre 94.77
5 Aaron Rodgers 94.62
6 Matt Schaub 92.23
7 Peyton Manning 91.10
8 Eli Manning 88.21
9 Tom Brady 87.95

11 Tony Romo 87.41
2010, at least 50% of snaps
Quote:
1 Tom Brady 99.17
2 Aaron Rodgers 95.91
3 Michael Vick 93.57
4 Ben Roethlisberger 92.73
5 Philip Rivers 92.13
6 Peyton Manning 91.11
7 Joe Flacco 90.57
8 Drew Brees 90.41
9 Josh Freeman 90.22
10 Matt Schaub 89.31
11 Matt Ryan 88.13

13 Eli Manning 87.58
2011, at least 25%* of snaps
Quote:
1 Aaron Rodgers 108.77
2 Drew Brees 98.26
3 Tom Brady 93.45
4 Matt Ryan 92.45
5 Matthew Stafford 92.32
6 Tony Romo 92.30
7 Eli Manning 91.82
8 Matt Moore 91.75
9 Matt Schaub 90.65
10 Alex D. Smith 90.07
11 Philip Rivers 89.49
12 Michael Vick 88.03

14 Ben Roethlisberger 85.19
15 Jay Cutler 84.90

22 Cam Newton 81.21
23 Joe Flacco 80.63
*had to drop down to 25% total snaps in 2011 so that Schaub could be included
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Old 08-30-2012   #46
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

Doesn't mean anything. Your point?
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Old 08-30-2012   #47
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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Originally Posted by Fiddler View Post
Take that defense away.... better yet, swap Carolina's defense with New Yorks. We'd all have a different view of these QBs.

Personally, I am not sold on Eli Manning. I don't agree with the MVPs... but who am I?

I also think he's about right on Matt, so far.... give or take.
We can play "what if" games until we are old and gray. None of it means anything. Heck, we can play that game going back decades. What if Bud Adams hadn't been stuck at a Houston airport and we had the Houston Cowboys? What if? What if? What if? It's all meaningless imaginary nonsense.

I look at reality. And the reality is that Eli has 2 championship MVPs, one of only 5 QBs in NFL history to accomplish this feat. That fact does not make him the best, but since the NFL is not in the habit of handing out those awards like Halloween candy, I'd say that he certainly deserves more respect than many folks are willing to give him.

And freakin' A this doofus writer is making himself look like a fool to put Newton above him. It reeks of an agenda and lacks any logical objectivity.
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Old 08-30-2012   #48
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

What? He doesn't look like a guy that really knows football?

He ain't any different than these other self proclaimed analysts that peruse stat lines to come up with worthless ratings and blogs

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Old 08-30-2012   #49
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

The bottom line: Schaub versus Romo?

Who is the better quarterback? Don't be bias.
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Old 08-30-2012   #50
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulls on Parade View Post
The bottom line: Schaub versus Romo?

Who is the better quarterback? Don't be bias.
Same
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Old 08-30-2012   #51
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulls on Parade View Post
The bottom line: Schaub versus Romo?

Who is the better quarterback? Don't be bias.
Romo is capable of winning and losing more games. I'll take a more consistent Schaub I'd trust as a coach. Sure, i'm biased ,but i've seen Romo do a lot of incredibly bone headed things over the years.
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Old 08-30-2012   #52
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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Originally Posted by Showtime100 View Post
Doesn't mean anything. Your point?
Seems to indicate that Schaub should be considered in the top 10.
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Old 08-30-2012   #53
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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Originally Posted by powda View Post
Romo is capable of winning and losing more games. I'll take a more consistent Schaub I'd trust as a coach. Sure, i'm biased ,but i've seen Romo do a lot of incredibly bone headed things over the years.
Romo is the better talent, Schaub fits a system better.

They are two different types of QBs. Romo is a Favre-style gunslinger, high-risk, high-reward. Schaub is your classic West-Coast offense QB
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Old 08-30-2012   #54
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulls on Parade View Post
The bottom line: Schaub versus Romo?

Who is the better quarterback? Don't be bias.
Schaub.

Romo does a lot of things really well, but he also Rosencopters his way into losses that should have been locked up. The guy has no feel for the situation he's in and plays just as risky when he's up by 17 as when he's down by 17. His gunslinger mentality has flat out lost games that were already decided and in the record book.
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Old 08-30-2012   #55
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
Seems to indicate that Schaub should be considered in the top 10.
I think he's in the conversation for top 10 at the very least.


Quote:
Originally Posted by The1ApplePie View Post
Romo is the better talent, Schaub fits a system better.

They are two different types of QBs. Romo is a Favre-style gunslinger, high-risk, high-reward. Schaub is your classic West-Coast offense QB
Romo has the better arm , Schaub has the better brain ....
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Old 08-30-2012   #56
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Originally Posted by Bulls on Parade View Post
The bottom line: Schaub versus Romo?

Who is the better quarterback? Don't be bias.
In this offense with kubiak working with him I'd take romo.
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Old 08-30-2012   #57
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
In this offense with kubiak working with him I'd take romo.
Man , I know Romo is the better athlete .... just better physically , much better arm and mobility.


But I dont know if you can take the "risk taker" out of him ..... and this offense is all about removing risk and maximizing return. (this may be a factor in their redzone struggles).


Tough call ..... but it isnt a silly thought process by any stretch of the imagination. It could be the perfect marriage .... would be interesting to see.
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Old 08-30-2012   #58
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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Originally Posted by The1ApplePie View Post
Romo is the better talent, Schaub fits a system better.
How do we know this? Have we ever seen Romo in such a QB friendly system as we have here? Or have we seen Schaub in a system where they expect the QB to be a playmaker?


Quote:
Originally Posted by The1ApplePie View Post
They are two different types of QBs. Romo is a Favre-style gunslinger, high-risk, high-reward. Schaub is your classic West-Coast offense QB
I'd love to see Romo in a system like ours, with a Kubiak (a guy that doesn't expect the QB to do everything) behind him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goatcheese View Post
Schaub.

Romo does a lot of things really well, but he also Rosencopters his way into losses that should have been locked up. The guy has no feel for the situation he's in and plays just as risky when he's up by 17 as when he's down by 17. His gunslinger mentality has flat out lost games that were already decided and in the record book.
& by the same token Schaub lacks a sense of urgency unless we're down by 17. On 3rd & 3 he'd throw the ball away if we're down by three with 1 minute left in the game.

I'm not going to say Romo is better than Schaub, but I'm not going to pretend Schaub is better than Romo. & as far as Romo throwing away games that were in the bag... if you're talking about last season, they were never in the bag with the way that defense played & their lack of a run game (for the most part). We've seen Schaub throw some doozies in similar situations.
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Old 08-31-2012   #59
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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The Texans are not built around Matt Schaub. They’re quarterbacked by Schaub, but he doesn’t have the type of tools you build around. Schaub is the consummate “good” quarterback. He’s accurate, smart and moderately athletic. But he doesn’t have a cannon arm (not close) or an innate playmaking prowess when things break down. The longer Schaub holds the ball in the pocket, the less effective he becomes. That’s always a telltale sign of a limited quarterback.

This dose of blunt truth always prompts Texan fans to bring up Schaub’s stats: 4,770 yards and 98.6 passer rating in 2009; 4,370 yards and 92.0 rating in 2010; a rating of 96.8 in 2011. Impressive numbers. But they’re proof that Schaub is a good fit in Gary Kubiak’s system.

Kubiak’s system does not demand a lot of in terms of sheer physical talent. It’s a system that naturally allows the quarterback to be managed. (This is why the Texans were able to survive when fifth-round rookie T.J. Yates took over for the final month and a half last year.) It’s also a system that requires patient decision-making and consistent accuracy, which is why Schaub excels in it.

What the Texans must decide after this season is whether their system is strong enough to ultimately carry them to a Super Bowl. If they feel that it is and they believe Schaub can stay healthy, they’ll re-sign him. If there’s an inkling of doubt, they could find themselves searching for a franchise quarterback.

If any system is good enough to disprove the theory that you need a superstar quarterback to reach the Super Bowl, it’s Kubiak’s. Unlike Jim Harbaugh, who nearly led the 49ers and their “system quarterback” Alex Smith to the Super Bowl last season, Kubiak isn’t trying to go against the grain by orchestrating an old-fashioned power run offense. His scheme is perfectly designed for the increasingly finesse nature of today’s N.F.L.

Yet, it’s a scheme built around the run. Not just the run game itself, but also the threat of the run. Houston’s passing attack stems largely from run elements like play-action, bootlegs and rollouts. This is why so much of the Texans’ passing game takes place out of base personnel (whether it’s two backs and a tight end, two tight ends and a back or an H-back, running back and tight end). The Texans do a marvelous job using presnap motion and tight formation wrinkles to disguise their run/pass intentions and create favorable one-on-one matchups (in blocking and receiving) for fullbacks, H-backs and tight ends.
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Old 08-31-2012   #60
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Default Re: Schaub labeled "middle of the pack" (16-20 range)

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The longer Schaub holds the ball in the pocket, the less effective he becomes. That’s always a telltale sign of a limited quarterback.
I'd say Schaub aside these are ignorant statements. What is one of the most common criticisms of QB's? - he hold's the ball too long. That's because the OL can't protect forever and plays aren't designed for them to do so so QB's become less effective as more time passes. Conversely one of Peyton's most complimented traits is getting the ball out fast. When was the last time you heard a commentator talk about how long a QB held onto the ball for so long in the pocket and it wasn't a compliment to the OL rather than the QB?
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