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Old 08-31-2012   #101
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

carring 3 qbs to me is like not having faith that Matt can stay healthy and kinda like playing it safe and taking a risk to have a huge gain in having a extra spot for someone who could acctuallly see the field

like a

O line

D line

or Linebacker guy
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Old 08-31-2012   #102
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

I'd actually agree with that Norg. If I were the Texans I'd go into the season with 2 QB's again. Beck isn't going anywhere and there are always guys you can pick up if you actually get down to your 3rd QB. I'd go with Schaub, Yates, and OD doing his emergency QB bit. If Matt goes down our year is over anyway. You can bet the farm on that. If it happens you put a call in to Beck and if he's not available you hit he FA little black book and play out your games. There's always someone you can sign at that point and it really doesn't much matter who that guy is as long as he can manage a game, throw an occaisonal pass, and take the pounding that goes with the territory.
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Old 08-31-2012   #103
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by Norg View Post
carring 3 qbs to me is like not having faith that Matt can stay healthy and kinda like playing it safe and taking a risk to have a huge gain in having a extra spot for someone who could acctuallly see the field

like a

O line

D line

or Linebacker guy
We've carried 3 QBs the past couple of years. Expecting Kubes to suddenly go back to 2 QBs like he did his first couple of years after the health concerns we have with Schaub and after the nightmare of having Sage Rosenfels get injured and having to go with Carr and Bradlee Van Pelt is some kinda delusional. You don't make decisions like this based on your faith in the player, you make the decision to minimize the catastrophe if it strikes.

Carrying 2 QBs is a gamble that there's no need for.
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Old 08-31-2012   #104
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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OK, I just went over to coogfans.com. Good Lord there are some blind homers over there that have no concept of NFL football. But still as bad as they are, they can not hold a candle to the VY fans.
Haha, yeah... there's a lot of funny stuff going on over there. I work with a few UoH guys, and the one told me last week (not jokingly) that if Keenum was given the starting job over Schaub that "Andre would be a lock for the Hall of Fame." I just said "OK!" and rolled my eyes... I don't know how people get this crazy about stuff this early.
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Old 08-31-2012   #105
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
We've carried 3 QBs the past couple of years. Expecting Kubes to suddenly go back to 2 QBs like he did his first couple of years after the health concerns we have with Schaub and after the nightmare of having Sage Rosenfels get injured and having to go with Carr and Bradlee Van Pelt is some kinda delusional. You don't make decisions like this based on your faith in the player, you make the decision to minimize the catastrophe if it strikes.

Carrying 2 QBs is a gamble that there's no need for.
Our roster has never been so widely stocked. Don't get me wrong, we're shallow in spots but we could actually put that roster spot to use now as opposed to a few years ago. I wouldn't carry two because it said anything about Schaub. I'd carry two because we can use that spot in a much better way.
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Old 08-31-2012   #106
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
We've carried 3 QBs the past couple of years. Expecting Kubes to suddenly go back to 2 QBs like he did his first couple of years after the health concerns we have with Schaub and after the nightmare of having Sage Rosenfels get injured and having to go with Carr and Bradlee Van Pelt is some kinda delusional. You don't make decisions like this based on your faith in the player, you make the decision to minimize the catastrophe if it strikes.

Carrying 2 QBs is a gamble that there's no need for.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't kubiak only carry two QB's into the Jags road game last year?

I realize that's a different situation and he only had a week to make that decision, but I'm just asking a question...
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Old 08-31-2012   #107
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
I'd actually agree with that Norg. If I were the Texans I'd go into the season with 2 QB's again. Beck isn't going anywhere and there are always guys you can pick up if you actually get down to your 3rd QB. I'd go with Schaub, Yates, and OD doing his emergency QB bit. If Matt goes down our year is over anyway. You can bet the farm on that. If it happens you put a call in to Beck and if he's not available you hit he FA little black book and play out your games. There's always someone you can sign at that point and it really doesn't much matter who that guy is as long as he can manage a game, throw an occaisonal pass, and take the pounding that goes with the territory.
You have to make 7 guys inactive every game, injured or not. Most likely, we will have only 2 active QBs on gameday, and the third will be there so that he can continue to practice with the team during the week. John Beck can't go on the practice squad, so the only way to keep him around is by putting him on the 53. It allows him to practice fully with the team and keep up with the offense, but he will only be active if something happens to Matt or TJ. It is drastically more difficult to pick up a FA QB and teach him to be the backup than it is for any other position, which is why we need three QBs on the 53.

Keenum will be on the p-squad assuming he clears waivers, it just makes sense for an UDFA rookie. Next year Keenum will probably supplant Beck as the #3 after a full year of practicing with the team and learning the playbook. At that point they will give him a chance to be the #2 and see how he progressed. He will get his chance eventually, he's just gonna have to wait a bit.
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Old 08-31-2012   #108
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by Dutchrudder View Post
You have to make 7 guys inactive every game, injured or not. Most likely, we will have only 2 active QBs on gameday, and the third will be there so that he can continue to practice with the team during the week. John Beck can't go on the practice squad, so the only way to keep him around is by putting him on the 53. It allows him to practice fully with the team and keep up with the offense, but he will only be active if something happens to Matt or TJ. It is drastically more difficult to pick up a FA QB and teach him to be the backup than it is for any other position, which is why we need three QBs on the 53.

Keenum will be on the p-squad assuming he clears waivers, it just makes sense for an UDFA rookie. Next year Keenum will probably supplant Beck as the #3 after a full year of practicing with the team and learning the playbook. At that point they will give him a chance to be the #2 and see how he progressed. He will get his chance eventually, he's just gonna have to wait a bit.
Did we carry 3 QBs at the time Sage was here? I don't remember what was going on there.

I understand that it's prudent to carry 3 QBs, but a guy like Beck can be brought back anytime, can't he?

The Skins cut him and drafted 2 QBs, retaining Grossman as the verteran.

We don't even want Grossman; what's so hot about Beck?
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Old 08-31-2012   #109
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Did we carry 3 QBs at the time Sage was here? I don't remember what was going on there.

I understand that it's prudent to carry 3 QBs, but a guy like Beck can be brought back anytime, can't he?

The Skins cut him and drafted 2 QBs, retaining Grossman as the verteran.

We don't even want Grossman; what's so hot about Beck?
I'm not defending Beck as I don't think he's all that much above a JAG, but 3 QBs makes a lot of sense on the roster. An offense as complex as the Texans takes a lot more than a week to learn, and since you have to have 7 guys inactive every week, why not keep a QB3 ready? Especially with an injury prone QB at the helm, you have to have two QBs ready to step in when necessary. I can guarantee you that it is 10 times easier to bring in a street FA linebacker or safety and get them up to speed, than it is to do the same with a QB. It's much more important IMO to have 3 QBs than to have an extra LB, RB, S or CB.
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Old 08-31-2012   #110
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by Dutchrudder View Post
I'm not defending Beck as I don't think he's all that much above a JAG, but 3 QBs makes a lot of sense on the roster. An offense as complex as the Texans takes a lot more than a week to learn, and since you have to have 7 guys inactive every week, why not keep a QB3 ready? Especially with an injury prone QB at the helm, you have to have two QBs ready to step in when necessary. I can guarantee you that it is 10 times easier to bring in a street FA linebacker or safety and get them up to speed, than it is to do the same with a QB. It's much more important IMO to have 3 QBs than to have an extra LB, RB, S or CB.
I know, but Beck already has a year under Shanahan and OTA and TC with us.

He already knows at least 90% of the playbook.
It shouldn't be hard to bring him back.

Again, I understand that it's not a bad idea to keep 3 QBs on the roster.
I'm just thinking that we may need the flexibility at the beginning of the season to shuffle the roster before settling into a more permanent look.
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Old 08-31-2012   #111
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Did we carry 3 QBs at the time Sage was here? I don't remember what was going on there.

I understand that it's prudent to carry 3 QBs, but a guy like Beck can be brought back anytime, can't he?The Skins cut him and drafted 2 QBs, retaining Grossman as the verteran.

We don't even want Grossman; what's so hot about Beck?
I don't think we kept 3 most of the time Sage was here.

You can bring in a guy like Beck anytime but it takes time to learn the system.
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Old 08-31-2012   #112
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't kubiak only carry two QB's into the Jags road game last year?

I realize that's a different situation and he only had a week to make that decision, but I'm just asking a question...
Yep but they were scouring the streets for someone to bring in to be #3. And then we almost immediately brought in Garcia and Delhomme to fill us back up to 3.

I was actually talking more about rosters to start the season but it's a good point.

I mean, the one time he allows himself to get back down to 2, he loses a guy and he's down to 1. That's the sort of thing that will leave marks on your soul.
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Old 08-31-2012   #113
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Did we carry 3 QBs at the time Sage was here? I don't remember what was going on there.

I understand that it's prudent to carry 3 QBs, but a guy like Beck can be brought back anytime, can't he?

The Skins cut him and drafted 2 QBs, retaining Grossman as the verteran.

We don't even want Grossman; what's so hot about Beck?
Not the first year and maybe the second year, but I think pretty much every year since then, we've gone with three.

What's so hot about Beck? He's not Owen Daniels... who would be our emergency QB if we run through the QBs.
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Old 08-31-2012   #114
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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I don't think we kept 3 most of the time Sage was here.

You can bring in a guy like Beck anytime but it takes time to learn the system.
I think we went 2 QBs Sage's first year. The second year, we might have just gone with Schaub & Sage but when Schaub went down, I think we brought in a 3 and I think we've had 3 ever since.
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Old 08-31-2012   #115
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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I can understand the cutting of Keenum if you think there's a good chance you can PS him.

I don't get the keeping of Beck. If we get to QB3 we're done. I'd rather be tanking games than keeping a guy that's never stuck anywhere.

It's silly to even do it. I'd be loading up on all of the available free agent o-linemen to protect Schaub rather than wasting a spot on a guy that's never performed when the games really mattered..

I'm concerned about the line and believe that's why Yates really look like he took a step back in the last few games..

TJ
I'm of the opinion that if we get to QB #2 we're done. Yates is 3rd string still, IMO. He looked that part last year, which is understandable, but he looked about the same, if not worse this pre-season. Honestly, I'd take Delhomme over both Yates and Beck at this point.
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Old 08-31-2012   #116
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
I know, but Beck already has a year under Shanahan and OTA and TC with us.

He already knows at least 90% of the playbook.
It shouldn't be hard to bring him back.

Again, I understand that it's not a bad idea to keep 3 QBs on the roster.
I'm just thinking that we may need the flexibility at the beginning of the season to shuffle the roster before settling into a more permanent look.
Yeah, he probably wouldn't have a hard time picking it back up, but I don't see the value in keeping CB #6 or RB#4 over QB#3. I mean, that's really the issue here, who exactly gets that 53rd spot over QB3?

To answer your earlier question, I don't think we had 3 QBs on the 2008 roster. I found a couple sites with old rosters and none of them have a QB other than Sage and Matt. They did have 7th round draft pick Alex Brink on the p-squad that year, so maybe he was considered the third QB. In 09 and beyond, we always started the season with 3 QBs (Grossman, Orlovsky, etc).

Apparently in 2007, we had Schaub, Sage and Shane Boyd on the final 53. (Who?)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Ho..._season#Roster
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Old 08-31-2012   #117
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Apparently in 2007, we had Schaub, Sage and Shane Boyd on the final 53. (Who?)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Ho..._season#Roster
Ah, Shane Boyd. The Memories. He looked good when he was with the Cardinals in pre-season... against us. Athletic guy. I thought he was going to have a good shot at developing into a good QB.
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Old 08-31-2012   #118
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

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Yeah, he probably wouldn't have a hard time picking it back up, but I don't see the value in keeping CB #6 or RB#4 over QB#3. I mean, that's really the issue here, who exactly gets that 53rd spot over QB3?

To answer your earlier question, I don't think we had 3 QBs on the 2008 roster. I found a couple sites with old rosters and none of them have a QB other than Sage and Matt. They did have 7th round draft pick Alex Brink on the p-squad that year, so maybe he was considered the third QB. In 09 and beyond, we always started the season with 3 QBs (Grossman, Orlovsky, etc).

Apparently in 2007, we had Schaub, Sage and Shane Boyd on the final 53. (Who?)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Ho..._season#Roster
I'm only thinking in term of right now, early in the season.

There might be a guy or two at other position(s) we might want to give a little more chance to see what they are all about.
There might be a waiver-wire pick-up that we think might match with us and we may need a roster spot for that.

After a few weeks, we can settle down into a more permanent look, like I said.
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Old 08-31-2012   #119
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

But who knows; maybe Kubiak wants Beck on the roster until he can sign Keenum to the PS.

Maybe he will cut Beck at that time.

On the other hand, Kubiak may think that Beck has improved enough to be kept on the permanent roster.
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Old 08-31-2012   #120
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Default Re: REPORT: Keenum vs. Beck, Thur. night, to win the QB3 job

I may have overlooked it, but i don't think anyone has addresed the other possibility; Yates. At least from his limited pre-season work, it did not look like he made true progeression to being a no doubt about back-up in training to be a starter. He looked like a late round draft pick that has some potential.
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