Texan organization solidifying

[badboy]

dinkatoid what is your thoughts on Smith not drafting ILB to eventually replace Demeco Ryans? Is Brady James going to be replaced at end of his one year deal by current roster player, 2013 draft pick, another cheap vet cast off or just maybe will he re-sign?

[Vinny]

beat the Bengals in the playoffs and we've arrived. excellent

[Double Barrel]

Originally Posted by GP

However, it seems he thinks he has his Tom Landry in Gary Kubiak.

I have no idea if this is true or not.

But honestly, I really hope that McNair does not put Kubiak on the same level as Tom Landry. One was a career backup QB who experienced great success as a coach for two Hall of Fame QBs, and the other a football genius that changed the game on fundamental levels and is widely considered to be one of the greatest football coaches in history along with Vince Lombardi.

Originally Posted by dinkatoid

People seem to love Bill Cowher now, but remember, he only won 1 superbowl and I believe he coached 14 years and only won 1 Superbowl, and that was late in his run.

Cowher's record as a head coach is 149–90–1 (161–99–1 including playoff games).

Through the Super Bowl, Cowher's team had compiled a record of 108–1–1 in games in which they built a lead of at least eleven points.

In 1995, at age 38, he became the youngest coach to lead his team to a Super Bowl. Cowher is only the second coach in NFL history to lead his team to the playoffs in each of his first six seasons as head coach, joining Pro Football Hall of Fame member Paul Brown.

In Cowher’s 15 seasons, the Steelers captured eight division titles, earned ten postseason playoff berths, played in 21 playoff games, advanced to six AFC Championship games and made two Super Bowl appearances. He is one of only six coaches in NFL history to claim at least seven division titles.

Meanwhile, Gary Kubiak went the playoffs in his 6th year as a head coach.

Originally Posted by Vinny

beat the Bengals in the playoffs and we've arrived. excellent

And I got the souvenir cup!

[Thorn]

Well, if nothing else, when the conversation starts up about playoff teams the Texans will be included in anyones conversation. That's an improvement. Took a long time to get there though.

[Goldensilence]

Originally Posted by badboy

dinkatoid what is your thoughts on Smith not drafting ILB to eventually replace Demeco Ryans? Is Brady James going to be replaced at end of his one year deal by current roster player, 2013 draft pick, another cheap vet cast off or just maybe will he re-sign?

I know not directed at me, but I would think its a one year rental. If he performs well, he might get a small extension, like another year or two. I don't think atm we have anyone that's going to replace him, but I'd look for a FA pick up after cuts or likely, 2013 draft. That's just me.

Far as even mentioning Kubiak in comparison to Landry...

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck

I think Kubiak and Smith have improved at their jobs every year. Their weakness is in choosing defensive coordinators and then sticking with them through thick and thin. If this organization has a fault, it's sticking with people instead of cutting loose. But that's a virtue as well.

We make it sound like it should be easy to get a competent defensive coordinator. Greg Williams is available? Sign him up.. But, we know the man was after some serious jack after Washington over-paid him & over-inflated his ego. Then Washington's defense wasn't all that. & after we found out about the Bounty program, maybe Smithiak new before hand that he wasn't a fit.

As much as we don't like to think this is an expansion team, a failed one at that, you have to take into account that maybe, nobody wants to come here. Yeah, I know Cowher was lick'n his chops, just dying to come to Houston.. & I've got a bridge I could sell you if you're interested.

I'm not a Smithiak lover (at the moment), but you listen to some of these Armchair owners & you wonder why they aren't running multi-million dollar organizations. Then these are the same guys who'll throw out the, "That only works in Madden" line.

I am, however, loving me some Bob McNair. Right now, this city needs people like Kubiak & Wade. The city of Houston mean more to them than "winning" they have pride & ownership in what they're doing, trying to build something the city of Houston can be proud of.

Winning is a by-product.

[GP]

Originally Posted by Double Barrel

I have no idea if this is true or not.

But honestly, I really hope that McNair does not put Kubiak on the same level as Tom Landry. One was a career backup QB who experienced great success as a coach for two Hall of Fame QBs, and the other a football genius that changed the game on fundamental levels and is widely considered to be one of the greatest football coaches in history along with Vince Lombardi.

Oh I don't think anybody is fooling themselves into a 100% comparison of the two.

I just meant that Kubiak fits the Texans persona like Landry did the Cowboys. The man and the logo get intertwined with one another.

McNair is a man of image. Kubiak and the players we have, they all fit an image. To the point that were just now comfortable taking on some UDFA guys who have some personal baggage. It signals they all think they're at a point where they can break with their cultural norms a bit. The hyperactivity of our off-season last year is another product of that. The ability to flat-out CUT a guy like Winston is another example. Trading a HUGE fan favorite like DeMeco Ryans. There was a time when none of these things were done...we were begging people like Ahman Green to come play for us.

The team is doing things it normally doesn't do, and I think it's because McNair feels that everyone is buying into Gary Ball. Prior to 2011, Gary Ball was on the ropes. 2011 put Gary Ball into the center of the ring again. You watched the Tom Landry special on NFLN where Landry broke down and cried in front of his players after they underachieved...the players really didn't even like him that much (cold, distant, perfectionist, scathing, etc.) but they rallied around him in that locker room and the rest is history. Granted, I think the Cowboys at that time were loads more further into the playoffs and maybe even had just lost a SB, but still. Same picture: And with Gary, the players genuinely LOVE the guy as their HC. So he's got Landry beat on that front. LOL.

And in that sense, McNair thinks he's got his own long-term HC in Kubiak. I use the Landry example because Cowboys football was so genuinely iconic from the 60s to the early 80s. It lost its luster and then came Jerry Jones who put some fake shine on the star there...but let's face it, McNair would LOVE to create the Texans in such a way that it drew nostalgic Cowboys fans away from the Cowboys and unto the Texans. Sort of like gene replacement surgery.

[Goldensilence]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

We make it sound like it should be easy to get a competent defensive coordinator. Greg Williams is available? Sign him up.. But, we know the man was after some serious jack after Washington over-paid him & over-inflated his ego. Then Washington's defense wasn't all that. & after we found out about the Bounty program, maybe Smithiak new before hand that he wasn't a fit.

As much as we don't like to think this is an expansion team, a failed one at that, you have to take into account that maybe, nobody wants to come here. Yeah, I know Cowher was lick'n his chops, just dying to come to Houston.. & I've got a bridge I could sell you if you're interested.

I'm not a Smithiak lover (at the moment), but you listen to some of these Armchair owners & you wonder why they aren't running multi-million dollar organizations. Then these are the same guys who'll throw out the, "That only works in Madden" line.

I am, however, loving me some Bob McNair. Right now, this city needs people like Kubiak & Wade. The city of Houston mean more to them than "winning" they have pride & ownership in what they're doing, trying to build something the city of Houston can be proud of.

Winning is a by-product.

Competent would have been a major upgrade over Dick Smith and Frank Bush.

Look, that's really what most of us were asking for with Gary after Smith. Get a DC with a track record of success or if you're going to go after a young assistant coach at least pick one from a team that has a track record of fielding good defenses.

I think more than anything what Wade did last year, was prove without a doubt that it doesn't take 3-4 years to get things headed in the right direction and make moves at a glacial pace. Manning and J- Jo came here not just because they got paid, but likely because of the appeal of working under/with a defensive coordinator who has a damn good track record. I do think that rolling out the red carpet and getting Wade Phillips to come here was the game changer this organization needed.

[Insideop]

Originally Posted by GP

Oh I don't think anybody is fooling themselves into a 100% comparison of the two.

I just meant that Kubiak fits the Texans persona like Landry did the Cowboys. The man and the logo get intertwined with one another.

McNair is a man of image. Kubiak and the players we have, they all fit an image. To the point that were just now comfortable taking on some UDFA guys who have some personal baggage. It signals they all think they're at a point where they can break with their cultural norms a bit. The hyperactivity of our off-season last year is another product of that. The ability to flat-out CUT a guy like Winston is another example. Trading a HUGE fan favorite like DeMeco Ryans. There was a time when none of these things were done...we were begging people like Ahman Green to come play for us.

The team is doing things it normally doesn't do, and I think it's because McNair feels that everyone is buying into Gary Ball. Prior to 2011, Gary Ball was on the ropes. 2011 put Gary Ball into the center of the ring again. You watched the Tom Landry special on NFLN where Landry broke down and cried in front of his players after they underachieved...the players really didn't even like him that much (cold, distant, perfectionist, scathing, etc.) but they rallied around him in that locker room and the rest is history. Granted, I think the Cowboys at that time were loads more further into the playoffs and maybe even had just lost a SB, but still. Same picture: And with Gary, the players genuinely LOVE the guy as their HC. So he's got Landry beat on that front. LOL.

And in that sense, McNair thinks he's got his own long-term HC in Kubiak. I use the Landry example because Cowboys football was so genuinely iconic from the 60s to the early 80s. It lost its luster and then came Jerry Jones who put some fake shine on the star there...but let's face it, McNair would LOVE to create the Texans in such a way that it drew nostalgic Cowboys fans away from the Cowboys and unto the Texans. Sort of like gene replacement surgery.

The only organization that I've heard McNair say publicly that he would like to model his organization after is the Steeler organization. I think he wants the stability, tough image, and respect that they have built through the years. I think he knows his mistakes (Casserly/Capers) and believes he has the "ship" righted with Smith/Kubes. Is he right? I don't know, but I think he plans on sticking with Smith and Kubes for awhile to try and build that stability and respect that the Steelers organization has. As for the tough image, he'll leave that to Wade and the !!!!

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Double Barrel

Cowher's record as a head coach is 149–90–1 (161–99–1 including playoff games).

Through the Super Bowl, Cowher's team had compiled a record of 108–1–1 in games in which they built a lead of at least eleven points.

In 1995, at age 38, he became the youngest coach to lead his team to a Super Bowl. Cowher is only the second coach in NFL history to lead his team to the playoffs in each of his first six seasons as head coach, joining Pro Football Hall of Fame member Paul Brown.

In Cowher’s 15 seasons, the Steelers captured eight division titles, earned ten postseason playoff berths, played in 21 playoff games, advanced to six AFC Championship games and made two Super Bowl appearances. He is one of only six coaches in NFL history to claim at least seven division titles.

Meanwhile, Gary Kubiak went the playoffs in his 6th year as a head coach.

Ouch, damn good post.

But if their situations were reversed, do you think Cowher would have done much better than Kubes, taking over a failed expansion project? How much worse would Kubiak done taking over a championship club with a championship organization behind it?

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Goldensilence

I think more than anything what Wade did last year, was prove without a doubt that it doesn't take 3-4 years to get things headed in the right direction and make moves at a glacial pace.

Still a little oversimplifying. Take Mario, Demeco (even though they didn't play too much), Connor, Antonio, Cushing, even McCain, & Nolan out of the picture & we probably don't go from 30 to 2. We had some pretty crappy players when Kubiak got here & that's just the starters. We had crappy coaches (most of them he brought with him) crappy scouts, front office execs, & medical staff.

Just about every aspect of this team was a joke when he got here.


Don't take this as me saying that 6 years is right, or should be acceptable, I'm just saying getting Wade as DC was not the single biggest reason for success that everyone tries to make it out to be. He had a defense in Dallas that was just as talented & they were ranked 23rd in 2010, not looking much better in 2011.

Originally Posted by Goldensilence

Manning and J- Jo came here not just because they got paid, but likely because of the appeal of working under/with a defensive coordinator who has a damn good track record. I do think that rolling out the red carpet and getting Wade Phillips to come here was the game changer this organization needed.

I'm happy that Wade is here. But I don't know what kind of red carpet we rolled out for him. Making some back-room deal with his daddy is probably what got him here.

[dinkatoid]

Originally Posted by badboy

dinkatoid what is your thoughts on Smith not drafting ILB to eventually replace Demeco Ryans? Is Brady James going to be replaced at end of his one year deal by current roster player, 2013 draft pick, another cheap vet cast off or just maybe will he re-sign?

I think that will be determined by how he plays. I would assume that Smith now feels we have 3 solid OLBs to rotate, and Cush in the middle. It does not make much sense to pay a high price for a guy who will basically be a 2 down thumper for us. James knew the system and I assume came fairly cheap (Rotoworld says 890k).

If James comes in and shows he has more left in the tank than they thought, then I am sure they would consider bringing him back. However, I assume the main reason he is here is to push Sharpton, as Smith (rightfully so) does not like just handing jobs to people.

From what I remember hearing, he was also a big locker room leader for the Cowboys, so that might have something to do with it. If he plays well enough but nothing great, which I think is how this will play out, then I figure he is basically a one year rental/veteran leadership.

I also assume that due to James, an ILB was not near the top of their draft list. If they had one lying around they liked when it was their turn, I am sure he would have been taken, but they had others rated higher, so they drafted them. My guess is that we will see a mid round ILB being drafted next year, and the competition will be between the new guy and Sharpton.

[Goldensilence]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

Still a little oversimplifying. Take Mario, Demeco (even though they didn't play too much), Connor, Antonio, Cushing, even McCain, & Nolan out of the picture & we probably don't go from 30 to 2. We had some pretty crappy players when Kubiak got here & that's just the starters. We had crappy coaches (most of them he brought with him) crappy scouts, front office execs, & medical staff.

Just about every aspect of this team was a joke when he got here.


Don't take this as me saying that 6 years is right, or should be acceptable, I'm just saying getting Wade as DC was not the single biggest reason for success that everyone tries to make it out to be. He had a defense in Dallas that was just as talented & they were ranked 23rd in 2010, not looking much better in 2011.

Sorry, I am doing a bit of a double take on your point here. In the first paragraph you're going back to when Kubiak first got here. Then 6 years later we finally get into the playoffs...but then again you're not necessarily ok with the glacial pace that this staff has moved and then bumbled and stumbled its way into a formula that suddenly just works?

Call me skeptical I just find it hard to believe that this is case.

I really believe had there CBA not expired and we had the lockout Kubiak would have been gone last year's 6-10 meltdown.

Far as his defenses in Dallas go, I can't really say one way or another what those struggles were due to. Perhaps one of the cowboys fans can give some insight. If I had to guess though, I don't think Garrett is that great of an offensive play caller and the offense stalled out at times leaving the defense in bad positions at times.




I'm happy that Wade is here. But I don't know what kind of red carpet we rolled out for him. Making some back-room deal with his daddy is probably what got him here.

I am pretty sure he's the highest, if not one of, the high paid coordinators. Looked like he pretty much got carte blanche on last year's draft to me and finally got Bob McNair to make a move in FA last year.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Goldensilence

Sorry, I am doing a bit of a double take on your point here. In the first paragraph you're going back to when Kubiak first got here. Then 6 years later we finally get into the playoffs...but then again you're not necessarily ok with the glacial pace that this staff has moved and then bumbled and stumbled its way into a formula that suddenly just works?

2007 we thought we would have at least had a winning season if not for Aj missing 7 games.

2008 if only Matt would stay healthy.

2009, I remember many a folk here with the idea we would have had made the play-offs if we only had a running game. The defense struggled the first 4 weeks of the season, but after that, Frank Bush & the boys looked every bit as formidable as the group Wade put together.

This team we saw in 2011 did not appear out of thin air, it's been a work in progress, each year building on the year before.

Originally Posted by Goldensilence

Call me skeptical I just find it hard to believe that this is case.

I really believe had there CBA not expired and we had the lockout Kubiak would have been gone last year's 6-10 meltdown.

I think he would have been gone after the 2010 season as well, but I don't understand you're point here.

Originally Posted by Goldensilence

Looked like he pretty much got carte blanche on last year's draft to me and finally got Bob McNair to make a move in FA last year.

I really don't know much about that. To me, it looked like the draft went exactly the way it had gone in the past.


2011 2010 2009 2008 2007 2006
JJWatt KJ Cushing Brown Okoye Mario
Reed Tate Barwin Slaton Jacoby Demeco
Harris Mitchelle Caldwell Adibi Bennette Spencer
Carmichael Sharpton Quin Okam Harrison Winston
Keo Graham Hill Barber Frye OD



Defensive heavy emphasis on pass rush. More defensive heavy than the others, eh.. a little. But we did have the worst pass defense in the history of the NFL.

I also don't think FA was handled any differently. We spent major dollars on Weaver, Antonio Smith, & I would count Franchising Dunta. So I don't think it was a money issue. We went after Bodden in 2010, but couldn't get'r done.

We also failed to get Nnamdi signed, Jjo was the second option & I don't know if there was such a quality second option in 2010, I do know we didn't stop trying to get a veteran FA even after the season started & landed J.Allen that season.

So I guess it's really all in how you look at it. If you think Smithiak is the biggest FUbar since Bud Adams, then yeah.... Wade gets all the credit. If you think Smithiak are competent but are learning on the job, then you'll see this thing was built brick by brick over a very long time. Wade was just the newest brick.

If you think about it, the only difference between the 2011 defense & the 2010 defense is that they never stopped going after the QB in 2011. Try to remember all the times you cursed the field (or TV depending on where you were) wondering why we stopped blitzing.... wondering why Pollard was covering slot receivers & tight-ends, when he didn't do that in 2009. Why were we playing prevent defense with a 3 point lead.

I honestly think Frank Bush was scared to lose his job when he realized he had to start a rookie & two second year corners & he over compensated with a heavy dose of zone coverage. Had he allowed them to play the same aggressive, pressure defense that got us back into games for 4 Qtrs, it would have been a different story all together. 2009, he proved (to me anyway) that he is at least competent enough to do the job. 2010, he proved (to me) that he didn't have the stones for it.

Wade is like a honeybadger. He don't give a ****. He's going after the QB.

[welsh texan]

tk, I agree with your post above, when you say about the quality 2nd option at CB in FA 2010, Dunta and Bodden were the top rated in that class at the position, both got overpaid, Bodden got injured then cut mid-season after coming back from it. Dunta seems to be playing okay but nothing special from what I hear in Atlanta.

Long run, probably a good thing that we waited, and perhaps we'll come to review a number of their decisions over the long, slow 5 year build as being good long run decisions.

How about all the years being regarded as 'finesse chokers'?

Maybe we will look back in 2 or 3 years having done well in the playoffs for say 4 straight seasons and realise that the coaching style they used instilled a good way of working within the franchise, despite not having the talent to pull it off, and was part of the reason why it eventually did come together.

The jury is very much still out for me, they have to sustain last seasons success, but I can see now how a lot of those WTF? decisions made could be leading on to better things.

[badboy]

Originally Posted by welsh texan

tk, I agree with your post above, when you say about the quality 2nd option at CB in FA 2010, Dunta and Bodden were the top rated in that class at the position, both got overpaid, Bodden got injured then cut mid-season after coming back from it. Dunta seems to be playing okay but nothing special from what I hear in Atlanta.

Long run, probably a good thing that we waited, and perhaps we'll come to review a number of their decisions over the long, slow 5 year build as being good long run decisions.

How about all the years being regarded as 'finesse chokers'?

Maybe we will look back in 2 or 3 years having done well in the playoffs for say 4 straight seasons and realise that the coaching style they used instilled a good way of working within the franchise, despite not having the talent to pull it off, and was part of the reason why it eventually did come together.

The jury is very much still out for me, they have to sustain last seasons success, but I can see now how a lot of those WTF? decisions made could be leading on to better things.

Winning does buy time with fans and usually smooth the bumps. A concern I have is many of us assume things like if Andre & Matt had remained healthy we would have been in Super Bowl. Butler will be a very good RT because he did pretty good in like 4 games relieving Brown. Myers will continue to play every game. Matt if healthy will continue to pass for 4,000 yds and not lose a bit due to age. We don't have much choice but I remain concerned and cautiously optimistic.

[Goldensilence]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

2007 we thought we would have at least had a winning season if not for Aj missing 7 games.

2008 if only Matt would stay healthy.

2009, I remember many a folk here with the idea we would have had made the play-offs if we only had a running game. The defense struggled the first 4 weeks of the season, but after that, Frank Bush & the boys looked every bit as formidable as the group Wade put together.

This team we saw in 2011 did not appear out of thin air, it's been a work in progress, each year building on the year before.

Looks to me like a lot of "if only's" and nothing really substantial in your yearly account list. I think every team can make that list that doesn't make the playoffs. Problem is i nthe NFL well if this had gone right we COULD'VE made the playoff just doesn't count. It does for revisionists.

The defense under Smith's tenure looked lost under his "read and react defense" and all too often looked just plain lost and like he had no clue on how to manage personnel.

The defense under Bush, if I had to sum it up in one word, I'd use the one Frank himself used all too often and all too often it failed to be that way: "aggressive". All too often as well, by the time they "got" whatever Frank was doing it was well into the season and after it was too late to make a real playoff run.

I wouldn't even say the looked formidable as what Wade put on the field, they just looked better.

I will give the possibility that Kubiak was pulling the strings behind thins because after bad defensive games and when it came time to turn it up midway through the season after a big losing streak they would "get more aggressive" but only generally after the most realistic chance of making the playoffs is done.

The biggest difference between a Wade Smith defense and the other two, is they always seemed to be guessing or hoping that some aspect of their "scheme" would work or hoped and guessed X player would fit. With Wade he knows what to look for and what player will fit in his scheme.


I think he would have been gone after the 2010 season as well, but I don't understand you're point here.

My point is if we're going with the brick building theory of things, if NFL teams weren't bracing for a lockout. Kubiak's gone, though I think it's likely Smith would've stayed on.


I really don't know much about that. To me, it looked like the draft went exactly the way it had gone in the past.


2011 2010 2009 2008 2007 2006
JJWatt KJ Cushing Brown Okoye Mario
Reed Tate Barwin Slaton Jacoby Demeco
Harris Mitchelle Caldwell Adibi Bennette Spencer
Carmichael Sharpton Quin Okam Harrison Winston
Keo Graham Hill Barber Frye OD



Defensive heavy emphasis on pass rush. More defensive heavy than the others, eh.. a little. But we did have the worst pass defense in the history of the NFL.

I also don't think FA was handled any differently. We spent major dollars on Weaver, Antonio Smith, & I would count Franchising Dunta. So I don't think it was a money issue. We went after Bodden in 2010, but couldn't get'r done.

Weaver got grossly overpaid and grossly underperformed. Antonio Smith got a big contract, we're lucky for the most part he's played up to it. Sorry, I don't count franchising as making a FA move. Revising again. Failing to sign a mediocre corner in a bad FA market doesn't count either. But, hey at least that was another moral victory in FA?

We also failed to get Nnamdi signed, Jjo was the second option & I don't know if there was such a quality second option in 2010, I do know we didn't stop trying to get a veteran FA even after the season started & landed J.Allen that season.

I guess I am in the opinion that the FO thought about Nnmadi then decided to more aggressively pursue J-Jo. Either way do you think IF Frank Bush was still the coordinator Him or Manning would've come here?

So I guess it's really all in how you look at it. If you think Smithiak is the biggest FUbar since Bud Adams, then yeah.... Wade gets all the credit. If you think Smithiak are competent but are learning on the job, then you'll see this thing was built brick by brick over a very long time. Wade was just the newest brick.

I've never stated that Rick and Gary have been FUBAR'd. What I am saying is suddenly, just suddenly it all falls into place when Wade arrives and the defense moves from 30th overall to 2nd... that you can just call it coincidence and the stars aligning?

I'm saying I don't believe Wade's place in this turnaround and playoff appearance is overstated. I think it should be pretty clear without him, this defense isn't likely to make that kind of lightspeed jump it did. Make no mistake about it, without the defense playing lights out when it did, this team doesn't make the playoffs and Gary's gone.

If you think about it, the only difference between the 2011 defense & the 2010 defense is that they never stopped going after the QB in 2011. Try to remember all the times you cursed the field (or TV depending on where you were) wondering why we stopped blitzing.... wondering why Pollard was covering slot receivers & tight-ends, when he didn't do that in 2009. Why were we playing prevent defense with a 3 point lead.

Occam's Razor: maybe Frank Bush just wasn't a good defensive coordinator?

I honestly think Frank Bush was scared to lose his job when he realized he had to start a rookie & two second year corners & he over compensated with a heavy dose of zone coverage. Had he allowed them to play the same aggressive, pressure defense that got us back into games for 4 Qtrs, it would have been a different story all together. 2009, he proved (to me anyway) that he is at least competent enough to do the job. 2010, he proved (to me) that he didn't have the stones for it.

Wade is like a honeybadger. He don't give a ****. He's going after the QB.

I guess we'll never totally know whose call it was to go young at CB. I would guess he at least had some say in that personnel decision. Is that on Gary or Frank....either way we both know Frank got axed for it.

Nothing convinced me he was competent enough to do the job or we would've had to deal with yet another guy "learning on the job". Sure his defenses looked competent...late in the season when realistic playoff chances were all but dead.

[badboy]

GS not quibbling but it is downtime so let's discuss; I think FO did more than think on Nnamdi as days went by. Joseph was finally made an offer and IIRC signed immediately. IMO ww were in the mix for Asomougha up until Smith thought he was being strung along.

[TexanSam]

I think Gary Kubiak is basically Jeff Fisher. Good head coach at times, average at other times. Hell, look at Fisher's first 6 season's. Almost eerily similar to Kubes.

[The Pencil Neck]

Originally Posted by badboy

GS not quibbling but it is downtime so let's discuss; I think FO did more than think on Nnamdi as days went by. Joseph was finally made an offer and IIRC signed immediately. IMO ww were in the mix for Asomougha up until Smith thought he was being strung along.

That's the impression I got. If I recall the reports at the time, we put more money on the table than any other team. And when Nnamdi hesitated too long, the FO changed directions and went after JJo instead.

I thought it was a great move.