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Old 05-07-2012   #1
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Default Texan organization solidifying

I think it is coming together & that should benefit the fans. Wade agreeing to stay was huge after the 2011 draft being so strong and his defensive scheme moving the stats so positively. Hopefully Texans have a next man up.

While I was not as pleased with the 2012 draft, they are our guys and the coaches will have a full off season to perform magic. Also, first draft where we did not draft a guaranteed starter (just signed a FA kicker to challenge Bullock) and the over all fan base did not melt down. UDFA was best class ever signed by us.

Kubiak's extention will probably be next major piece of business & that too is a mark of a solid organization.

I am not as concerned that rash of injuries would derail the season. Orgainization/roster wise, my main concern is 2013 free agents & hopefully backups now in place will allow us flexibility if certain starters (Barwin & Schaub come to mind) & supposedly roster moves freed up money to at least offer D Brown a new deal.

Players have to play & it is all about the Ws but for me the organization is starting to look like what I think Robert McNair envisioned years ago.
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Old 05-07-2012   #2
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

From the beginning, McNair said he wanted to build an organization that resembled the Steelers. I'm almost positive that's why he stuck by Smithiak when most owners would have canned him. McNair wants to have that continuity in the front office and in the head coach.

There are a lot of people on this board (I'm not one of them) who don't like Kubiak, don't think he's head coach material, thinks he makes too many gameday mistakes, etc. They don't think he should still be here. Hell, after the 2010 season, I would have fired him.

I think Kubiak and Smith have improved at their jobs every year. Their weakness is in choosing defensive coordinators and then sticking with them through thick and thin. If this organization has a fault, it's sticking with people instead of cutting loose. But that's a virtue as well.

I expect a great season this season. I'll be crushed if we backslide. And if we do, I think McNair will pull the trigger.
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Old 05-07-2012   #3
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

I want to believe all of that, but in order for me to be secure I need to see it at least one mroe year.

I'm not yet comfortable enough to expect wins on Sunday. What has changed for me as a fan is that I believe we CAN (should in some instances) win on any given Sunday whereas in years before I went into games expecting it to be a rough go.
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Old 05-07-2012   #4
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
From the beginning, McNair said he wanted to build an organization that resembled the Steelers. I'm almost positive that's why he stuck by Smithiak when most owners would have canned him. McNair wants to have that continuity in the front office and in the head coach.

There are a lot of people on this board (I'm not one of them) who don't like Kubiak, don't think he's head coach material, thinks he makes too many gameday mistakes, etc. They don't think he should still be here. Hell, after the 2010 season, I would have fired him.

I think Kubiak and Smith have improved at their jobs every year. Their weakness is in choosing defensive coordinators and then sticking with them through thick and thin. If this organization has a fault, it's sticking with people instead of cutting loose. But that's a virtue as well.

I expect a great season this season. I'll be crushed if we backslide. And if we do, I think McNair will pull the trigger.
Only if McNair thinks that he's lost the team. He won't fire him in any other circumstance.

After all, like you said, he wants to resemble the Steelers.
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Old 05-07-2012   #5
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

AMERICA'S NEW AMERICA'S TEAM
I have been saying that I think Bob McNair is trying to slowly position the Texans as the old Cowboys of the glory years...the reliably efficient team that Texas football fans want to embrace as their favorite team. Jerry Jones has gone Looney Tunes. He's lost the plot. Bob knows that fans in Texas want a perennial winner and not a lot of change across the landscape of the roster and coaching staff.

He has almost an insurmountable task ahead of him, due to how much the Cowboys are entrenched into the minds of most Texas-based NFL fans. It's been a generational thing that dads hand down to their sons, and that's hard to supplant.

However, it seems he thinks he has his Tom Landry in Gary Kubiak. Gary is the quiet brooding HC on the sidelines...always looking at his menu and sometime staring and not saying a thing to anybody (not even to himself!). The hiring of Wade Phillips was also another move to accomplish two things--Improve the defense AND establish even more Houston Texas roots into the team culture.

THE TORTOISE IS IN THE LEAD!
Bob has his staff slow to make caustic moves. In fact, the Texans don't make brash moves very often. The past offseason of 2011 was like a comet streaking through the fan base...you could see it, but it was a blur and you don't see a comet very often do you? Bob is not going to throw money at some flashy but highly troubled CB (like Jerry did with PacMan Jones) nor will he dole out for some diva WR (like Jerry has, repeatedly with guys like T.O. and Roy Williams). Overall, Bob has been trying to pace the organization and bring it up slowly. He could have fired Kubiak after the 2010 season but he didn't. He is the anti-Jerry Jones in many regards.

WHICH CAME FIRST: THE KUBIAK OR THE WADE?
I think there is definitely going to be a dynamic involved, regarding the arrival of Wade Phillips and the subsequent FA signings and draft haul that Wade had in 2011, that will be forever discussed among football fans. Which guy is the key to the organization? Was it that Gary steadies the ship and makes everyone, even Wade Phillips, better all the way around? Or is it that Wade has never been in a culture like the Texans and HE possibly could take the HC position and be more successful than Kubiak? You cannot tell me that Wade Phillips, who says he still has aspirations of being a HC one day, does not sit and envision himself as being Houston's HC some day. He surely does. He's sitting a few doors down from that desk. In the same city that his father was HC way back when.

Can the dynamic of Kubiak and Phillips be harnessed on an annual basis? Can it be used for good or will the dynamic cause a rift one day? I think this is the key to the future here for both of those men. Personally, I sit on the fence on this one. Wade has a knack for doing well with a new team, as HC, and then slowly losing the locker room and the coaching staff over time. Gary, on the other hand, seems to only grow in stature and leadership (in the minds of his players) as time goes on.

Wade did more with one shortened FA period and one draft, all in the same year!, than any Texans head coach has ever done. Was this an anomaly or a signal that Wade--if given the latitude--can do things faster and stronger than Kubiak? My main quibble with the idea of toying with Wade as HC is the history of Wade HC'd teams, plus the fact that Gary built the current team upon his own vision of what it should be. If anything, I think I'm leaning towards Wade being a great d-coord and always having the full-fledged reins of the defense and can do whatever he wants. Once he has full power, though, I don't think he knows how to manage everything and keep both sides of the ball operating in harmony. He's maxed out his management skills, in short.

HOLDING ONTO A GOOD THING
I hope Bob McNair pays Wade Phillips so much money that Wade never wants to take a pay cut to go be a HC somewhere again. They need to make that guy feel like he IS the head coach...of the defense, which I think they already have. They need to keep him no matter what it takes until he begins to lose his players and coaches. Dick LeBeau is the type of d-coord who is forever ensconced in Pittsburgh as being The Man behind the steel curtain. Wade is every bit of that, as well, and I hope he stays here as long as it's working out for all involved. We waited 9+ years for the day when we didn't have to see a Texans defense shredded by even the most mediocre teams in the NFL.
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Old 05-07-2012   #6
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
I want to believe all of that, but in order for me to be secure I need to see it at least one mroe year.

I'm not yet comfortable enough to expect wins on Sunday. What has changed for me as a fan is that I believe we CAN (should in some instances) win on any given Sunday whereas in years before I went into games expecting it to be a rough go.
QFT. Nine straight years of losing will do that. If we have another good season like last year though, then I'll be confident week in and week out that we're going to win.
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Old 05-07-2012   #7
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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QFT. Nine straight years of losing will do that. If we have another good season like last year though, then I'll be confident week in and week out that we're going to win.
I think that is fair. Show me two very good seasons where you're looking like a top contender, and maybe at that point there isn't really any major reasons for questioning this regime at that point. We'll see if they can come back strong next season. We're going to need Schaub though, or we'll just look like a great defensive team with a sub par offense like the Titans from a few years ago or some of those Ravens teams.
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Old 05-07-2012   #8
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

Well as much as people will always question, naysay and hate everything but it seems like that noise gets a little more quiet every year. They're learning from mistakes, in my opinion. There are a million mistakes to be made lol and they've finally done damn near every one of them. They have a guy who takes care of the books, a guy that takes care of the offense, a guy that takes care of the defense and a guy with a bajillion bucks.

I get being nervous about next season but it feels like some people are just parroting old criticisms because there isn't really much to say these days, especially when things are going smoothly. Problems always draw more wordage than good f/a moves and good drafts and letting the right ones walk, etc....


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Old 05-07-2012   #9
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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I think it is coming together...
I agree. I'm hoping for stability, continued high level performance, truly getting to the place where we're a BPA drafting franchise. Fingers crossed.
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Old 05-07-2012   #10
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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Originally Posted by GP View Post
AMERICA'S NEW AMERICA'S TEAM
I have been saying that I think Bob McNair is trying to slowly position the Texans as the old Cowboys of the glory years...the reliably efficient team that Texas football fans want to embrace as their favorite team. Jerry Jones has gone Looney Tunes. He's lost the plot. Bob knows that fans in Texas want a perennial winner and not a lot of change across the landscape of the roster and coaching staff.

He has almost an insurmountable task ahead of him, due to how much the Cowboys are entrenched into the minds of most Texas-based NFL fans. It's been a generational thing that dads hand down to their sons, and that's hard to supplant.

However, it seems he thinks he has his Tom Landry in Gary Kubiak. Gary is the quiet brooding HC on the sidelines...always looking at his menu and sometime staring and not saying a thing to anybody (not even to himself!). The hiring of Wade Phillips was also another move to accomplish two things--Improve the defense AND establish even more Houston Texas roots into the team culture.

THE TORTOISE IS IN THE LEAD!
Bob has his staff slow to make caustic moves. In fact, the Texans don't make brash moves very often. The past offseason of 2011 was like a comet streaking through the fan base...you could see it, but it was a blur and you don't see a comet very often do you? Bob is not going to throw money at some flashy but highly troubled CB (like Jerry did with PacMan Jones) nor will he dole out for some diva WR (like Jerry has, repeatedly with guys like T.O. and Roy Williams). Overall, Bob has been trying to pace the organization and bring it up slowly. He could have fired Kubiak after the 2010 season but he didn't. He is the anti-Jerry Jones in many regards.

WHICH CAME FIRST: THE KUBIAK OR THE WADE?
I think there is definitely going to be a dynamic involved, regarding the arrival of Wade Phillips and the subsequent FA signings and draft haul that Wade had in 2011, that will be forever discussed among football fans. Which guy is the key to the organization? Was it that Gary steadies the ship and makes everyone, even Wade Phillips, better all the way around? Or is it that Wade has never been in a culture like the Texans and HE possibly could take the HC position and be more successful than Kubiak? You cannot tell me that Wade Phillips, who says he still has aspirations of being a HC one day, does not sit and envision himself as being Houston's HC some day. He surely does. He's sitting a few doors down from that desk. In the same city that his father was HC way back when.

Can the dynamic of Kubiak and Phillips be harnessed on an annual basis? Can it be used for good or will the dynamic cause a rift one day? I think this is the key to the future here for both of those men. Personally, I sit on the fence on this one. Wade has a knack for doing well with a new team, as HC, and then slowly losing the locker room and the coaching staff over time. Gary, on the other hand, seems to only grow in stature and leadership (in the minds of his players) as time goes on.

Wade did more with one shortened FA period and one draft, all in the same year!, than any Texans head coach has ever done. Was this an anomaly or a signal that Wade--if given the latitude--can do things faster and stronger than Kubiak? My main quibble with the idea of toying with Wade as HC is the history of Wade HC'd teams, plus the fact that Gary built the current team upon his own vision of what it should be. If anything, I think I'm leaning towards Wade being a great d-coord and always having the full-fledged reins of the defense and can do whatever he wants. Once he has full power, though, I don't think he knows how to manage everything and keep both sides of the ball operating in harmony. He's maxed out his management skills, in short.

HOLDING ONTO A GOOD THING
I hope Bob McNair pays Wade Phillips so much money that Wade never wants to take a pay cut to go be a HC somewhere again. They need to make that guy feel like he IS the head coach...of the defense, which I think they already have. They need to keep him no matter what it takes until he begins to lose his players and coaches. Dick LeBeau is the type of d-coord who is forever ensconced in Pittsburgh as being The Man behind the steel curtain. Wade is every bit of that, as well, and I hope he stays here as long as it's working out for all involved. We waited 9+ years for the day when we didn't have to see a Texans defense shredded by even the most mediocre teams in the NFL.
I like so much of what you say. I agree that McNair wants to be Dallas of years gone by. This last season's Next Man Up reminded me so much of the old Dallas Cowboy's depth. I think comparing Landry & Kubiak needs at minimum one more very good year. I've wanted to unabashedly support Gary; dad gum it, I like the guy. 2010 infuriated me & I too would have been okay if he were fired. The HC is just so important.

Wade would be high on my list for HC [b]if[b] Texans were starting all over as new team or if McNair blew it up. As it is, I hope he is DC as long as he wants. Kubiak is the HC but unfortunately I have to say he will have the spotlight on him. I truly hope it does not do anything but make him greater.

I don't know how Bob will keep Wade but he has to. Together, they are building a dynasty that hopefully Ric SMith can keep stocked.
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Old 05-07-2012   #11
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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Originally Posted by Texecutioner View Post
I think that is fair. Show me two very good seasons where you're looking like a top contender, and maybe at that point there isn't really any major reasons for questioning this regime at that point. We'll see if they can come back strong next season. We're going to need Schaub though, or we'll just look like a great defensive team with a sub par offense like the Titans from a few years ago or some of those Ravens teams.
Do you think it was a mistake or at least a waste for Texans to go with back ups in has been vets without putting a higher draft pick on board to train? I think we should have made a better effort in having a sound #2 QB.

It was a gamble that worked I guess as losing QB & in then having to go with a 5th got team further than any of us could have guessed. It would have been interesting to have seen what would have happened if Leinert could have remained healthy. I was very ok with his play as short as it was. Even if he had done well and led us into playoffs, he would probably gone elsewhere as a FA.
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Old 05-07-2012   #12
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Didn't we cut leinart?
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Old 05-07-2012   #13
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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Didn't we cut leinart?
Yes, he had a year left and we let him go since Yates took over as #2. Plus, it saved cap room.
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Old 05-07-2012   #14
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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Yes, he had a year left and we let him go since Yates took over as #2. Plus, it saved cap room.
yeah my mistake, thanks for catching. I had it in my mind that Leinert was in his 2nd year but was signed originally to a one year deal then re-signed to a two year deal.
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Old 05-08-2012   #15
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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I agree. I'm hoping for stability, continued high level performance, truly getting to the place where we're a BPA drafting franchise. Fingers crossed.
not only that, a team that doesnt tie up salary cap by handing out $100 million contracts to injury prone players.. letting mario walk and the cuts/trades they made lead me to believe this franchise is starting to play smart. if the steelers are mcnairs vision, im with it..
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Old 05-08-2012   #16
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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I think it is coming together & that should benefit the fans. Wade agreeing to stay was huge after the 2011 draft being so strong and his defensive scheme moving the stats so positively. Hopefully Texans have a next man up.

While I was not as pleased with the 2012 draft, they are our guys and the coaches will have a full off season to perform magic. Also, first draft where we did not draft a guaranteed starter (just signed a FA kicker to challenge Bullock) and the over all fan base did not melt down. UDFA was best class ever signed by us.

Kubiak's extention will probably be next major piece of business & that too is a mark of a solid organization.

I am not as concerned that rash of injuries would derail the season. Orgainization/roster wise, my main concern is 2013 free agents & hopefully backups now in place will allow us flexibility if certain starters (Barwin & Schaub come to mind) & supposedly roster moves freed up money to at least offer D Brown a new deal.

Players have to play & it is all about the Ws but for me the organization is starting to look like what I think Robert McNair envisioned years ago.


Excellent synopsis Steve. Though I'm not as distraught regarding this year's draft class, the remainder I completely agree with and couldn't have said it better myself.
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Old 05-08-2012   #17
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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not only that, a team that doesnt tie up salary cap by handing out $100 million contracts to injury prone players.. letting mario walk and the cuts/trades they made lead me to believe this franchise is starting to play smart. if the steelers are mcnairs vision, im with it..
I am concerned how much of the money allegedly saved by cutting/trading will be used to re-sign our own FA 2013 & how much gets eaten by escalating contracts
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Old 05-09-2012   #18
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
I am concerned how much of the money allegedly saved by cutting/trading will be used to re-sign our own FA 2013 & how much gets eaten by escalating contracts
You are right to be, ask yourself how much we saved by cutting Demeco, then take a look at what the AJ restructuring this season leads to in escalation next season. I'm pretty sure our main saving only serves to cover that one contract.
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Old 05-09-2012   #19
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

Theres no doubt in my head Wade coming in is Finally solidified things here. I think I would have gone over the deep end if Gary pulled another friend to the DC spot. Having a guy like Wade around had to instill some real confidence, especially after he pulled the defense together in one off-season, was crucial. I think if Wade is really interested in being a HC, he's pretty close to being it here IMO.

I hope it also showed the FO that things don't have to and can't after this season, move at a glacial speed. I hope waiting on Mario is the last kind old Texans move we see. Though I do kind of see one brewing if Matt Schaub isn't back from injury on the track they continue to claim.

How the rest of this offseason goes is going to,be very telling going forward on what to expect.
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Old 05-09-2012   #20
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Default Re: Texan organization solidifying

I must say, when we first hired Kubiak, I thought it would be a great move. We knew it would take time to fix the team, and he showed progress fairly early, so I was good with it. I even agreed with keeping him into the 2010 year. However, that is when I (like a lot of you), had enough and would have fired him personally. However, Bob did not do this, and I think it may have been the right call now.

I feel like Kubiak has been growing every year - that is not the problem. The problem was that he was not growing fast enough. However, this becomes the same catch-22 a lot of us have struggled with in our careers - you need experience to get a job, but you need a job to get experience. I think that last season has shown that enough talent and help can over come some coaching mistakes, and if Gary continues to improve, he may just be worth it.

He may never be the best game day coach, but that is not all there is to coaching. He has shown that the players love him and work hard for him, which is more than a lot of coaches ever get out of their players. I was quite impressed how he handled the injuries and kept everything moving forward when a lot of coaches would have just kept ramming their heads into the wall. As long as he can keep the players dialed in and playing hard and keeps the O moving, he will be fine as the head coach with an experienced D coordinator behind him.

People seem to love Bill Cowher now, but remember, he only won 1 superbowl and I believe he coached 14 years and only won 1 Superbowl, and that was late in his run. Sometimes patience pays off, all you can do is field a good team and play hard, then hope a few breaks go your way.

As for the draft, I actually kind of like the direction we are headed. I think when you having a boring draft, things are looking up for you. When you have a bad team, everyone wants to draft a star. They need someone to step up and save the team. However, when your team is starting to really get solid, you need to fill some holes with solid players and get cheap depth. I think we are finally getting to the point where we aren't looking to hit a home run in the draft. We just want to get a solid hit and put the ball in play. We know most of the picks will be solid depth or rotational players, and all have talent. If our coaches do their jobs, these guys will grow and some of them will turn into studs.

A perfect example of this is what the steelers do. How many times have people been confused about some strange linebacker they drafted. I believe their starting 4 last year had 1 first rounder, and a bunch of late round guys. The steelers know if they get a solid player, they can coach them up and fit the system right so these players can excel. This is one thing I will give Kubiak/Wade credit for - they seem very good about finding a way to hide a players weakness and play towards their strength.

Bottom line, I love the direction the team is headed, even if we took the bumpy road to get here. Hopefully we continue to do so.
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