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Old 03-13-2012   #41
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
Exactly. Winston $4.2m, Leinert $3m base and Vickers + Foster 2011 should equal Foster. AJ's $5.2 m has not been spent yet. Nor has Mario's $18-20m (depending whom you believe.) Does not mean Texans will spend it or ever give the true figures on cap. I'm pretty good at adding and subtraction and what we know ain't adding up to no money to spend. Let's see how it turns out.
I'm with you two guys.

These media talking heads don't know anything more than we do. Hell, just 20 minutes ago they were interrupting one another to talk about how awesome it will be to see Manning, Wayne, Clark, Saturday, and Tony Dungy and Jeff George and the Colts former equipment manager all in Miami. Then, BOOM! they quietly use one of their female anchors to break the news that Wayne re-signs with the Colts. Yet they all drooled over the idea of a super team in Miami just 20 minutes prior. LMAO!

My money is on us re-signing the vast majority of our guys, maybe even Myers once he finds out he cannot get the cash he and his agent are expecting.
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Old 03-13-2012   #42
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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What a shocker! All the TOP free agents are being signed first and foremost. Who would have thunk it?!?!

Every team is going to dump most of its cash onto the top names on the list...then they'll use what's leftover to sign the second tier guys.

I think Mario decides tonight or tomorrow. I think Manning decides tomorrow or within this week at the latest--He might take longer than others, to see the lay of the land before deciding on a team.

NFLN just ran the audio of Bob McNair talking about Peyton, the segment from 610 radio this morning. From what Bob said...I mean, it doesn't sound like we're opposed to signing him to our team. Bob said very nice things but he never came right out and said we wouldn't sign him. He was coy, in a way.
I thought same. I guess any talk with Texans in it is good advertising but wished he'd just say "Good luck and good health to Peyton but we are not interested."Too much talking like a politician".
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Old 03-13-2012   #43
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

And btw, nobody has signed Vickers yet. Nobody has signed Leinart. Nobody has signed Winston.

So it's not like we lost one of those guys today. Apparently, they're not the big time schit that they might think they are. Yeah, they'll likely sign somewhere...but the Texans must not want them back even at a reduced price.

Saying "We didn't want to insult you by asking you to re-structure" is the nice way of telling a guy like Winston that they don't want him back and that we might can do better than him. IMO.

EDIT: Bob and Rick and Gary and Wade have had a lot of time so far, since the end of our playoff run, to crunch the numbers and make a board of priorities and contingency plans for free agency. I bet they have a ton of options, in their mind, about how to solve what many of us are thinking are suddenly HUGE problems. They got this. I believe it.
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Old 03-13-2012   #44
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Originally Posted by The Cush View Post
On the NFL Network around 1 pm today La Confora echoed that we were currently sitting at 650,000 under the cap.
I hear you, I just don't buy it as of yet.

I started from scratch and added up the base salary + amortized bonuses + incentives + anything else that counts against the cap for the current (as of today) roster. For the 46 guys, I get $94.8M of cap hit. Add to that some amount of dead money and we should still have a good amount of room to re-sign some guys and pay for our upcoming draft picks.

I've been through the entire CBA and understand pretty darn well how various contract structures affect the cap hits.

For example, Kareem has a cap hit of about $2M this year. Because of unamortized signing bonus that gets accelerated if we cut him, our cap hit would be $3.9M plus any eligible guaranteed money left on his contract. So, the Texans are highly unlikely to cut him for that reason alone.
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Old 03-13-2012   #45
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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I'm with you two guys.

These media talking heads don't know anything more than we do. Hell, just 20 minutes ago they were interrupting one another to talk about how awesome it will be to see Manning, Wayne, Clark, Saturday, and Tony Dungy and Jeff George and the Colts former equipment manager all in Miami. Then, BOOM! they quietly use one of their female anchors to break the news that Wayne re-signs with the Colts. Yet they all drooled over the idea of a super team in Miami just 20 minutes prior. LMAO!

My money is on us re-signing the vast majority of our guys, maybe even Myers once he finds out he cannot get the cash he and his agent are expecting.
Like Houston weathermen it's all about ratings.
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Old 03-13-2012   #46
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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It seems to me that our braintrust might have miscalculated. I know they were under the gun to win last year or they would possibly/probably get the boot themselves but was the team's long term quest to be a yearly contender put at risk with the moves they made last year? Did we pull a Florida Marlins and shoot for the moon with the knowledge that we would have to blow the team up as soon as the season was over? To be honest it might have worked except for injuries.

I am not sure and would like your opinion. I think the main mistake made was not trading Mario before the season started last year thus allowing us to sign some players before their FA year and allow us to accumulate draft choices.

I have not heard of any FAs coming to Houston for interviews.

You don't think that RS is holding out hope that they can sign Mario and is waiting for him to come back to us before he acts in FA do you?

Just curious what do you think?
How on earth would you compare the Texans picking up a S and CB pulling a Florida Marlins type of off season?? That comparison is so far off and ridiculous man.

And why are you surprised really?? Last off season was the only off season Rick Smith ever really went after some significant free agents on the market because him and Kubiak had to because they were in year 6 of their regime. Now that they've made the playoffs finally and bought themselves probably 5 more years, it just might go right back to the same ole status quo of only building through the draft. I hope that I'm wrong on that, and they continue to try and fill holes with proven players, because it obviously worked despite the nay sayers who act like free agency is terrifying, but we've already had one of the greatest QB's in history get put in front of us with interest in our team and we balked at it, so I won't hold out to much hope that we'll be to aggressive this off season. But please don't compare Rick Smith's two free agent pick ups in the secondary to a team that buys a championship like the Marlins did. Not even close.
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Old 03-13-2012   #47
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

they're probably waiting to see if mario &/or meyers are going to give them a chance to match thier offers or not. No sense in cutting guys & upsetting players if you aren't guaranteed to get said players back.

i think if mario/meyers come back & say "this is what they offered me, can you match" you might see the FO start cutting guys that we all think should be dropped left & right....within reason of course.
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Old 03-13-2012   #48
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
even if they said no? Exactly how do you sign someone who wants to see what others will offer and cannot do that until free agency opens. If you are saying just write a check, that is what gets teams in cap hell. This is Myers, Briesel and Mario's last contract and they should try to get all they can. Fans are good at throwing around "it's just business". Well it's business for the players also.

We just need to keep building our team depth without stupid moves and we will have a dynasty. I think some of us (not saying you) just assumed our guys would jump at the chance to remain a Texan.
I just thought that we would have at least signed Dobbins, Bulman, or just one UFA since we cut various players and Dre restructured. I'm not hitting the panic button or anything of the sort but I am a little pissed that we let every single one of our UFA hit the free market at 3pm. We will be fine just as long as we don't do a Washington Redskins type spending spree and I'm about positive that will not happen.
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Old 03-13-2012   #49
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Originally Posted by The Medic01 View Post
I will reserve judgement until after the draft is over and the Myers Brisiel situation is resolved. If we can resign them both this will be a good offseason.
^^^^
They blew their wad last yr in FA.

Even though I understand Rick/Garys position, they needed all of the defensive difference makers they could get and Rick/Garys butts were on the line.

But G-Top called it before it happened, getting rid of MW and getting a maximum return on their investment was the way to go.

The Texans are starting to pay the price for Rick/Gary/Wades decision. I will be happy if the Texans are able to reup Myers or Briesel and get Barwin/D.Brown/maybe Schaub re-signed. In addition to re-signing Foster.

To answer your question, yes I worry about the Texans offseason every yr. Are we going to get the 2006/2009 draft or are we going to get the 2007/2010 drafts?
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Old 03-13-2012   #50
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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C'mon. The Patriots got incredibly lucky in getting their future hall of fame QB in the 6th. They also got incredibly lucky Miami had no clue how to use Welker. They got incredibly lucky Moss decided to run for a couple years. They have made their share of missteps as well such as Adalious Thomas. Their defense was putrid last year and yeah if the Texans had Schaub available odds are they sail past New England. Plus off the field they have a great strategist in Belichick.
Other than Brady, none of that stuff was luck. You can sell that stuff to some newb fan to the NFL all you want Cak, but to say that the Pats got lucky to get Welker and Moss is complete BS. They got really aggressive in improving their offense that season and also went after Stallworth that off season as well after having a big season with the Eagles. They were improving their weapons is what they were doing, and there was no "luck" involved in that. But go ahead and spin it that way to make it seem like free agency is such a crap shoot when we're dealing with players we've actually seen for years instead of draft picks from players on a combine.

And if you watched those playoffs carefully, Belicheck was anything but a strategist last season in playoffs. His decisions were anything but great. Hell, his strategy in the SB in the 4th quarter was one of the dumbest strategies I've ever seen. His decisions in the Ravens game almost cost their team that game as well. I talked about it quite a bit at the time. BB has one of the best QB's ever if not the best QB ever, and Brady's been carrying that team the last two seasons big time.
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Old 03-13-2012   #51
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

i'm worried, extremely worried, but all we can do is wait and see exactly how it shakes out. i could find a way to reason the cuts, even if i feel it's a stretch (a young right tackle rated that highly by PFF is probably worth 5mil even if a weaker pass pro), but hearing that we're dumping talent because we're only 600k under the cap is unforgivable. if we lose more than one member of our offensive line - likely the best in football last season, unforgivable.

we are young, talented, cohesive, and coming into our prime. i truly thought that the goal of this offseason was to keep our own, draft well, and get healthy. we were matt schaub away from a very real chance at the superbowl even without key players on both sides - and at the moment it looks like we're blowing that up either due to poor planning (cap) or a change in direction (free agent splash?).
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Old 03-13-2012   #52
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Originally Posted by The Medic01 View Post
I will reserve judgement until after the draft is over...
I'm going to reserve judgement until after the season is over. Doesn't matter how bad (or good) an offseason looks. It's what happens when the teams lineup on the field that counts.

Does it look bad now? Yes. These type of roster losses happen. Usually, to teams that win big, not teams trying to win big. But, it won't necessarily stop the remaining players from rallying together and making another playoff run. If that playoff run doesn't materialize, then I may point to decisions the organization made. But, I'm not going to judge the cooks until I've tasted the meal.
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Old 03-13-2012   #53
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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^^^^
They blew their wad last yr in FA.

Even though I understand Rick/Garys position, they needed all of the defensive difference makers they could get and Rick/Garys butts were on the line.

But G-Top called it before it happened, getting rid of MW and getting a maximum return on their investment was the way to go.

The Texans are starting to pay the price for Rick/Gary/Wades decision. I will be happy if the Texans are able to reup Myers or Briesel and get Barwin/D.Brown/maybe Schaub re-signed. In addition to re-signing Foster.

To answer your question, yes I worry about the Texans offseason every yr. Are we going to get the 2006/2009 draft or are we going to get the 2007/2010 drafts?
Steel... I'm convinced the Texans are currently about $30 million under the cap. I ran the numbers. There were over 500 free agents before this all started. Texans are lying in the weeds and are going to be one of the few teams left with a wad of cash.... I think Here's my numbers
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Old 03-13-2012   #54
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Good teams lose good players and then replace them with other good players. We're about to lose some good players whom we drafted. Time to draft more good players to replace them.
that about sums it up
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Old 03-13-2012   #55
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
Exactly. Winston $4.2m, Leinert $3m base and Vickers + Foster 2011 should equal Foster. AJ's $5.2 m has not been spent yet. Nor has Mario's $18-20m (depending whom you believe.) Does not mean Texans will spend it or ever give the true figures on cap. I'm pretty good at adding and subtraction and what we know ain't adding up to no money to spend. Let's see how it turns out.
Seems like the theme of the day is that a lot of mediocore/bad teams with bunches of money have been extremely active.

see Washington, Buffalo, Tampa, St Louis. There have a couple re-signings by better teams, but inactivity early may not be this awful thing that some posters think.


On Mario, I was talking to an out of state friend and he was laughing at Williams going for the money. He thinks that four or five years from now Mario is going to be a 310lb DT who has lost his crazy athletic ability, and will take even the lowest dollar contract because he is finally trying to win.
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Old 03-13-2012   #56
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Steel... I'm convinced the Texans are currently about $30 million under the cap. I ran the numbers. There were over 500 free agents before this all started. Texans are lying in the weeds and are going to be one of the few teams left with a wad of cash.... I think Here's my numbers
If you're right, then you will be celebrated for years around here. To have nailed the situation would be epic for you.

I just don't know that you could have accounted for every single item that might affect the cap number, though. I mean, I'm not knocking your efforts. That was an enjoyable read you linked us to, but I am wondering if there is some math tucked away that the lay person, like yourself, might not know about.

If we have $30 mill available, why not go ahead and sign Chris Myers rather than run the risk that he shops elsewhere and signs elsewhere for what we could have offered him ourselves to begin with?

Are the Texans going to tempt fate to THAT degree? If it's their philosophy, it could backfire really badly, IMO.

All in all, thank you for your efforts to break it down like that!
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Old 03-13-2012   #57
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

I'm starting to get worried. I don't know anything about the cap and how the contracts are structured for our guys, but it's sounding more and more like we're going to lose not only Mario, but Myers as well. Is our salary cap situation that bad?

LZ said on twitter than Schaub, Ryan, AJ, and Cushing all got raises this year (I think performance raises). He also said next year we're going to have to re-sign Duane Brown (a must IMO), Barwin, and Schaub. Yikes. Rick Smith and company better get this figured out fast. The worst place to be is in salary cap hell.
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Old 03-13-2012   #58
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Originally Posted by Texecutioner View Post
How on earth would you compare the Texans picking up a S and CB pulling a Florida Marlins type of off season?? That comparison is so far off and ridiculous man.

And why are you surprised really?? Last off season was the only off season Rick Smith ever really went after some significant free agents on the market because him and Kubiak had to because they were in year 6 of their regime. Now that they've made the playoffs finally and bought themselves probably 5 more years, it just might go right back to the same ole status quo of only building through the draft. I hope that I'm wrong on that, and they continue to try and fill holes with proven players, because it obviously worked despite the nay sayers who act like free agency is terrifying, but we've already had one of the greatest QB's in history get put in front of us with interest in our team and we balked at it, so I won't hold out to much hope that we'll be to aggressive this off season. But please don't compare Rick Smith's two free agent pick ups in the secondary to a team that buys a championship like the Marlins did. Not even close.
Sorry maybe I was not clear. I agree. For Smith this was the world series and now after getting there he is blowing up the team because of the cap. Marlins always come out of nowhere, win and they start over. I am comparing the way the Marlins blow up the team after they win to what Smith is doing now. I have already stated they were under the gun to win to keep their jobs. I just hope it doesn't buy them another 5 years.
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Old 03-13-2012   #59
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Originally Posted by GP View Post
If you're right, then you will be celebrated for years around here. To have nailed the situation would be epic for you.

I just don't know that you could have accounted for every single item that might affect the cap number, though. I mean, I'm not knocking your efforts. That was an enjoyable read you linked us to, but I am wondering if there is some math tucked away that the lay person, like yourself, might not know about.

If we have $30 mill available, why not go ahead and sign Chris Myers rather than run the risk that he shops elsewhere and signs elsewhere for what we could have offered him ourselves to begin with?

Are the Texans going to tempt fate to THAT degree? If it's their philosophy, it could backfire really badly, IMO.

All in all, thank you for your efforts to break it down like that!
Well. So far there are no reports that Meyers has his Mangold money. Bad representation from his agent IMO.
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Old 03-13-2012   #60
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Default Re: Anybody else have concerns about our FO

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Originally Posted by gafftop View Post
It seems to me that our braintrust might have miscalculated. I know they were under the gun to win last year or they would possibly/probably get the boot themselves but was the team's long term quest to be a yearly contender put at risk with the moves they made last year? Did we pull a Florida Marlins and shoot for the moon with the knowledge that we would have to blow the team up as soon as the season was over? To be honest it might have worked except for injuries.

I am not sure and would like your opinion. I think the main mistake made was not trading Mario before the season started last year thus allowing us to sign some players before their FA year and allow us to accumulate draft choices.

I have not heard of any FAs coming to Houston for interviews.

You don't think that RS is holding out hope that they can sign Mario and is waiting for him to come back to us before he acts in FA do you?
Just curious what do you think?
Surely Smith couldn't be waiting for Mario could he???
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