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Old 03-01-2012   #21
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

Duane Brown is MORE valuable to the Texans than Mario ! 'Nuff said.
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Old 03-01-2012   #22
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

Brown and Barwin are two guys who need to be extended before they blow up and make probowls or ask for millions upon millions to do the same thing they were doing before.
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Old 03-01-2012   #23
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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no way you let Brown hit the open market next year...you have to lock him up if possible. It took way too long to find a credible LT to just let one walk.
Yep. LT is one of the most important positions in the NFL, and when you have a guy who could be in the argument for best in the leauge, you don't let it get close. Then he has you by the balls.
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Old 03-01-2012   #24
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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Yep. LT is one of the most important positions in the NFL, and when you have a guy who could be in the argument for best in the leauge, you don't let it get close. Then he has you by the balls.
yeah, if you want one of the best LT's in the league, you gotta pay. I donno how many Victor Rileys, or Ephraim Salaams you have to go through before any bad karma of letting a Pro Bowl caliber guy walk wears off....but I've had enough of them in any case. thankyouverymuch.
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Old 03-01-2012   #25
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

A blast from the past - thank you Alex Gibbs, without you there's surely no Duane Brown on the Texans' roster.
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Old 03-01-2012   #26
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
yeah, if you want one of the best LT's in the league, you gotta pay. I donno how many Victor Rileys, or Ephraim Salaams you have to go through before any bad karma of letting a Pro Bowl caliber guy walk wears off....but I've had enough of them in any case. thankyouverymuch.
Thanks for the Victor Riley flashback. Damn he was awful.
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Old 03-01-2012   #27
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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Originally Posted by amazing80 View Post
You would seriously pick Mario over Barwin?
I would too and it's not even a question.
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Old 03-01-2012   #28
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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You would seriously pick Mario over Barwin?
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Originally Posted by b0ng View Post
I would too and it's not even a question.
Small sample for Barwin but last year was as good or better than most of Mario's years and just a smidgen off of Mario's best seasons if you just look at raw numbers. Mario looks better in shorts though.

Mario Williams - 44 solo tackles was his career high and his best sack year was 14. Mario has been a double digit sack guy for only 2 of his 6 years starting.

Connor Barwin - 38 solo tackles and 11.5 sacks in his only starting season.
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Old 03-01-2012   #29
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

Duane Brown is NOT replaceable. Lock 'im up. 'nough said.
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Old 03-01-2012   #30
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
Small sample for Barwin but last year was as good or better than most of Mario's years and just a smidgen off of Mario's best seasons if you just look at raw numbers. Mario looks better in shorts though.

Mario Williams - 44 solo tackles was his career high and his best sack year was 14. Mario has been a double digit sack guy for only 2 of his 6 years starting.

Connor Barwin - 38 solo tackles and 11.5 sacks in his only starting season.
Not a really fair comparison imo. Barwin plays in a scheme that's designed to rack up stats for a OLB whereas Mario in the 4-3 was pretty much thrown out there and asked go get it. Put Barwin in Mario's position and i don't think he comes close to his production the past 5 seasons.
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Old 03-01-2012   #31
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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Originally Posted by Naiirb View Post
Not a really fair comparison imo. Barwin plays in a scheme that's designed to rack up stats for a OLB whereas Mario in the 4-3 was pretty much thrown out there and asked go get it. Put Barwin in Mario's position and i don't think he comes close to his production the past 5 seasons.
It's fair and I don't agree with your assertion. Edge rushers are edge rushers regardless of an odd or even front. All defenses regardless of odd or even, play a base 7 man front and have 4 in the secondary. I could list dozens of 4-3 ends with double digit sacks every year. I'd bet the top sack masters in the league most years are mostly 4-3 ends (ie. Freeny, Strahan, Peppers...etc.)

for the record - I'd like to keep Mario
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Old 03-01-2012   #32
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The yearly sack leader is almost always an olb. Ill look it up in a few.

OLB/DE distribution in top 10 sack leaders
2011 - 4 DE, 6 OLB - Jared Allen was leader.
2010 - 8 DE, 6 OLB - 4 tied at 10 - Top 4 leaders were OLB
2009 - 6 DE, 4 OLB - Dumerville leader (OLB)
2008 - 6 DE, 4 OLB - Top 2 were OLB
2007 - 6 DE, 4 OLB - Top 2 were DE
2006 - 7 DE, 3 OLB - Merriman top.
2005 - all de.

More DE's than expected, but consider less than half use a 3-4.

That being said, I think that lends more credence to the Barwin is really good theory.

Last edited by noxiousdog; 03-01-2012 at 01:22 PM. Reason: Now with sourcing!
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Old 03-02-2012   #33
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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Originally Posted by noxiousdog View Post
The yearly sack leader is almost always an olb. Ill look it up in a few.

OLB/DE distribution in top 10 sack leaders
2011 - 4 DE, 6 OLB - Jared Allen was leader.
2010 - 8 DE, 6 OLB - 4 tied at 10 - Top 4 leaders were OLB
2009 - 6 DE, 4 OLB - Dumerville leader (OLB)
2008 - 6 DE, 4 OLB - Top 2 were OLB
2007 - 6 DE, 4 OLB - Top 2 were DE
2006 - 7 DE, 3 OLB - Merriman top.
2005 - all de.

More DE's than expected, but consider less than half use a 3-4.

That being said, I think that lends more credence to the Barwin is really good theory.
pretty equal distribution sums up my point that it really doesn't matter if you use an odd or even front. The primary edge rusher is going to get his regardless.
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Old 03-03-2012   #34
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

The more I think about it, the more I see Foster being the odd man out.

I just don't see value at the RB spot, compared to LT, C and OLB.
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Old 03-03-2012   #35
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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Originally Posted by kiwitexansfan View Post
The more I think about it, the more I see Foster being the odd man out.

I just don't see value at the RB spot, compared to LT, C and OLB.
You know, I think there is more than an outside chance of that being the case. Just look at Kubiak's history with RB's, when has he ever kept one around for more than 3 or 4 years?

I'm talking about his Denver days too, it was a constant train of low draftees and UDFA's turning in one or two good seasons before moving on to the next in line.

I think Foster is something very special in that he's absolutely perfect for the system AND elite in his own right too, but if it comes to tieing themselves down to 8 mill a year for 6 years on a RB when they have Ben Tate sat there and feel confident of getting what they need on day 3 of the draft I can see Kubes reverting to type.

That said, as big a MW fan as I am, I'd see him walk before I'd see Foster walk.
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Old 03-03-2012   #36
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Default Re: Texans want to lock up OT Brown

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You know, I think there is more than an outside chance of that being the case. Just look at Kubiak's history with RB's, when has he ever kept one around for more than 3 or 4 years?

I'm talking about his Denver days too, it was a constant train of low draftees and UDFA's turning in one or two good seasons before moving on to the next in line.

I think Foster is something very special in that he's absolutely perfect for the system AND elite in his own right too, but if it comes to tieing themselves down to 8 mill a year for 6 years on a RB when they have Ben Tate sat there and feel confident of getting what they need on day 3 of the draft I can see Kubes reverting to type.

That said, as big a MW fan as I am, I'd see him walk before I'd see Foster walk.
First, when have we had a RB, prior to Foster, that was worth keeping around for more than 3 or 4 yrs? I can't think of one. Slaton might have been the guy had he not had the neck issue that resulted in his fumblitis. Green had injury issues and not a lot left in the tank. The rest were just whodats.

In Denver, it was Shanny Sr. making the moves and not Kubiak. I do find it interesting that Shanny Sr. hasn't really had a successful season since Kubes left his side.
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