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Old 12-28-2011   #161
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
Our "elite" #2 defense lost it in the two minute warning to Dan freakin' Orlavsky.

That should be a concern for anyone thinking that our defense can carry this team to the Super Bowl.
Yes, absolutely.

If this is the source of your anger, I can see your point.

Complaining about the offense... not so much. I see it as a stepping stone for the offense, something to build on.

Definitely expected the defense to get the job done in that situation.
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Old 12-28-2011   #162
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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The point of this thread, though - "Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak" - is valid. 5 seasons of perpetual mediocre results finally changed once Wade was coaching half the team.
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Old 12-28-2011   #163
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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I'm disappointed in you. It's a cop-out to blame the refs. The players and coaches don't do it, so why should we?
I doubt the team is as critical of Coach Kubes, but that don't stop us now does it?

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Old 12-28-2011   #164
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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Yes, absolutely.

If this is the source of your anger, I can see your point.

Complaining about the offense... not so much. I see it as a stepping stone for the offense, something to build on.

Definitely expected the defense to get the job done in that situation.
yeah, that Colts game blew my mind in a way. I fully expected the Texans to win it, and that's the first time that I've gone into a game actually expecting something. I can actually say that's the first time that I've went into a game expecting anything since 35-3. That's 18 years between expectations.

The offense is just in trouble right now. Not having a vet QB in this system will ultimately cost us. I can't blame that on anyone, and I give props to Kubiak for winning any games - much less a division title - without Schaub.

Our defense, though, should be more than just stats. I expected them to rise to the occasion of beating a 1 win team. The Colts suck this year. That performance by our D was inexcusable, IMHO.

The fact that we were winning with 2 minutes left is not on the offense. They did what they could under the circumstances. The D should have focused and taken care of business instead of what we saw.
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Old 12-28-2011   #165
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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I'm disappointed in you. It's a cop-out to blame the refs. The players and coaches don't do it, so why should we?

I've seen those plays many times since then, and only one (Watt) that I would consider egregious. The rest of them were just sloppy play and if they were incorrect, the league would advise accordingly.

I guess you think "the fix" is in, too? Both teams had the same refs, so either they had it in for the Texans, or the Texans just played undisciplined ball.

I do not subscribe to referee bias for one team over the other. yeah, they were officiating tight, but the Texans dug their own hole, not the refs.
I guess you can be disappointed if you wish and I am not alleging any conspiracy or bias. But that was crappy officiating plain and simple. I said the Texans played like crap as well. But even playing crappy they would have won but for incredibly bad officiating.

And yes the officiating being incredibly bad has been commented on even though league rules prevent players and coaches from commenting on it.
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Old 12-28-2011   #166
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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I guess you can be disappointed if you wish and I am not alleging any conspiracy or bias. But that was crappy officiating plain and simple. I said the Texans played like crap as well. But even playing crappy they would have won but for incredibly bad officiating.

And yes the officiating being incredibly bad has been commented on even though league rules prevent players and coaches from commenting on it.
Both teams had the same officials, though.

So logically, both teams had to deal with crappy officiating, just like both teams have to deal with the same weather, same playing surface, etc.

The penalties in the Texans/Colts game were tighter (which is usually considered 'bad' by fans), but they were not unwarranted. The rules they are based upon suck, but the calls themselves were valid.

Bob Allen broke down almost all the penalties, and with the exception of Watt getting blocked into the back of the QB, they were all legit.

The officials did not call single coverage on Reggie Wayne by Kareem Jackson. That's on the players and coaches for failing to execute. Why was Jackson on the Colts’ best receiver?

You know my 'disappointment' is cerebral only, right? You know I've got mad respect for your perspective. I was just taken back a little to see you using the ref card for the loss. It's out-of-character.
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Old 12-28-2011   #167
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

What did y'all do? Go ahead and run Nitrofish out of here??

************************

DB, I agree with Cak here.

I'm generally one that won't criticize the officiating and generally thinks work out to be even. That said, th Thursday night game was like trying to ride "see-saw" by yourself.
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Old 12-28-2011   #168
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

The officiating was pretty bad, but imo, the entire game was bad. Offense, defense and coaching. I was more miffed about the 3 straight running plays our last REAL possession. Yes, I wanted to run, run and run some more in this game, but a TD puts the game away. At least get a little creative when opting to run it on 3rd and 5.

Defensively, we gave up two 3rd and longs on their TD drive. A Watt hands to the face penalty (legit), a Watt roughing the QB penalty (crappy call) and a Quin pass interference (legit) topped their game winning drive.
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Old 12-28-2011   #169
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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I guess you can be disappointed if you wish and I am not alleging any conspiracy or bias. But that was crappy officiating plain and simple. I said the Texans played like crap as well. But even playing crappy they would have won but for incredibly bad officiating.

And yes the officiating being incredibly bad has been commented on even though league rules prevent players and coaches from commenting on it.
Questionable calls helped the Colts at key moments for sure, but that was certainly not "why we lost." It played a factor, but what played a factor the most was not allowing enough time for Yates on certain pass plays, Kubiak not opening up the offense a little more and especially on 3rd down, and our defense not holding their offense at the end of the game. The defense had a difficult task on their hands in that game though by being on the field as much as they were.
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Old 12-28-2011   #170
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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Questionable calls helped the Colts at key moments for sure, but that was certainly not "why we lost." It played a factor, but what played a factor the most was not allowing enough time for Yates on certain pass plays, Kubiak not opening up the offense a little more and especially on 3rd down, and our defense not holding their offense at the end of the game. The defense had a difficult task on their hands in that game though by being on the field as much as they were.
I refuse to blame the refs when this team failed to get a 3rd down conversion until the fourth quarter, and that was on one of those loony NFL Films bouncing ball mishaps.

I certainly understand the ref argument, so I'm not being obtuse. I'm just not going to say that is the reason why the Texans lost. A factor...perhaps, but there is clear evidence that supports the penalties. The NFL is not afraid to admit that they were wrong in a call, and I have yet to read their admittance for that game.

Just a difference of opinion, though. As always, respectfully agree to disagree in the end.
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Old 12-28-2011   #171
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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Bill Parcells career regular season record as a Head coach without Bill Belichick on his staff is 55-57. His record with him is 117-73. His post-season record without him is 0-3. With him, it's 11-5 and includes two Super Bowl victories, a third Super Bowl appearance, and another appearance in the AFC Championship Game.

I'm not concerned with who you like, or what you (and I) think should have happened after last season or after 2009. If the partnership is working, enjoy it and relax. Someday - for whatever reason - it will either stop working, or cease to exist. Worry about that when the time comes.

Folks have been saying this in one way or another since the second page of this thread.

Can we quit this now?
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Old 12-28-2011   #172
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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& the bolded is why this thread was silly to begin with & should've been closed 3 days ago. When all things are taken into account, neither of these guys is any more valuable than the other. The sum of the parts is greater than the individual parts themselves.

Offensive minded individuals could look at 3 of our losses and put most of the blame on the defense.

Defensive minded individuals could look at 3 of our losses and put most of the blame on the offense.

If you can't be objective, then it really just comes down to your perspective.
That's it in a nutshell.
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Old 12-28-2011   #173
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That's it in a nutshell.
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Old 12-28-2011   #174
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

SWEET!!! This thread is still alive!!



AND, I agree with ObsiWan (and I quote):

Quote:
The sum of the parts is greater than the individual parts themselves.
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Old 12-28-2011   #175
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

bottom line

the offense sucked and the defense ran out of gas being the offense couldn't stay on the field and the defense was on a long time (we knew that in the 2nd quarter)


this is a high motor defense and they have to have their rest.. they were still getting after Dan O but he was just stepping up and avoiding them


but also.. it freaking hurts when a defense has a 3rd down and then with a penalty , it gives the offense a first down... I don't know how many times that happened against the colts but they were game changing calls there

hell Kubiak sent in 6-7 penalties to the league office.. I am waiting to hear what became of that (besides the ole...."they made a mistake...sorry")
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Old 12-28-2011   #176
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

In hindsihght i was done with gary two years ago. So what gives?
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Old 12-28-2011   #177
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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DB has been a strong member of this site for years and anyone in here would vouch for him as far as how dedicated he's been as a fan here, so knock it off with the "You need to support this team" rhetoric. If you don't like to hear DB or other folks giving their opinions on this board, than leave.

Why don't you stop telling other people what to feel like whether it's about a coach, a player, an owner, or so on. Stop telling other fans what to think or feel just because you believe in being a homer at all costs and will support every decision by this franchise unconditionally. And for crying out loud quit telling people to support this team as if they aren't die hard fans already. You come off really stupid by telling die hard fans that when they're obviously highly invested in this team or they wouldn't be in here talking about it. Several members in here have explained this obvious part to you, but you aren't capable of understanding that, because you don't want to. You're so hell bent on trying to tell others what they should feel about Kubiak that you aren't capable of a rationale conversation at this point. Pretty soon you'll find that people won't be responding to near as many of your posts, because they'll have you on ignore honestly. No one cares to continually hear someone spew venom because they're butt hurt over their favorite HC being criticized. We're Texans fans, and we root for this franchise. You come off more like a "Kubiak fan" rather than a Texan fan in my observations thus far.
See now you are putting words in my mouth. Please re read my posts and then quote me here where I say that Kubiak is this great coach. And it is you who is telling people what to think not me.

My whole point is that the Kubiak bashing is not constructive or warranted at this point A. because we are 10-5, AFC South Champion and going to the Playoffs for the first time, and B. because as I stated earlier with the a fore mentioned success, Kubiak is not going anywhere anytime soon so why keep wasting time on that topic and talk about football.

In regards to people putting me on ignore... Hey that is their right and I welcome that if that is what they want. It will not hurt my feelings nor will it cause me to lose any sleep. Clearly you are the one who has the most problem with me, and I suggest that you take your own advice and put me on ignore.

I am not challenging how strong a member or how long DB has been a member here. I can read his stats and do not need anyone pointing that out to me. I respect him as I do all the members on this board. Sadly though based on your comments it does not seem to go both ways though.

I am not the one calling people names like a little Jr. High School kid. I am simply stating my opinion just like the rest of you. I am just really tired of the Kubiak Bashing, and finally said something.

I am far from a homer and believe there is a time for criticism, but just before our first ever playoff run is not that time.
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Old 12-28-2011   #178
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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What did y'all do? Go ahead and run Nitrofish out of here??

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DB, I agree with Cak here.

I'm generally one that won't criticize the officiating and generally thinks work out to be even. That said, th Thursday night game was like trying to ride "see-saw" by yourself.
Sorry Bill but that is not going to happen. I currently live overseas and am half a day ahead of you guys so that is why I am not here when most of you are.

That is why some of my responses are shotgun like that, for which I apologize, but very few are awake when I am replying to break up my posts.

I agree also about the officiating and like you NEVER do that, but in this case it was so glaring that you cannot help but say something. The Texans had the game in the bag, and the refs took it out and handed it to the Colts.
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Old 12-28-2011   #179
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

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In hine sihght i was done with gary two years ago. So what gives?
W-Ls are important. They're most important.

Building a team is very important as well. If you've ever been a team leader, you know this. You can't just throw a bunch of guys in a room, call them a team. In that case, all you have is a bunch of guys who work together.

I mentioned before how amazing I think Gary has done in building a real team here in Houston. They didn't have a lot of wins, but man for man they communicated the same message time & time again. To me, that shows control of the locker room, which a lot of "coaches" simply don't have.

The way the team has never quit & the way they seem to appear to continue to buy what Kubiak is selling are other hints that he is doing something very well that few coaches are able to do.

Still don't equal wins, & wins are most important.

But ever since Kubiak got here, I (for some reason) had illusions of a dynasty.

So far, everything I've seen in the last 5.9 years has me thinking that we have a very, very solid foundation of a dynasty.

Is this a dynasty?

I don't know. But I'm anxious to see how this year turns out & next (we all know he's going to be here). If we go far (which we know by all counts we'll be lucky to get out of the first round) both this year & next (If I were McNair I wouldn't extend Kubiak's contract until we lock up a play-off spot next season) then I think we'll be on our way to a pretty good start.
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Old 12-28-2011   #180
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Default Re: Wade IS More Valuable Than Kubiak

So far it is not a dynasty.
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