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Old 12-14-2011   #281
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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allen 4 ints 14 passes defended

Jackson 1 int 4 passes defended
If that's on 30 passes thrown Allen's way vs 16 thrown Kj's way do those numbers still prove your point?
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Old 12-15-2011   #282
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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If that's on 30 passes thrown Allen's way vs 16 thrown Kj's way do those numbers still prove your point?
don't bother responding. Ellis will forever be a KJ hater. If KJ ever becomes a probowl cb, the hating will still continue on. Stats are on a mere convenience to prove his point. Any stat showing the opposite will just be ignored. There is no rhyme or reason.

KJ will now and forever be "burnt toast".

Ellis would rather KJ suck and bring the Texans down to crap to prove his point than him being a good player and helping the Texans. His hatred for KJ exceeds his love for the Texans.
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Old 12-15-2011   #283
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

Can someone generate a list of all the Rookie Cornerbacks that played the majority of the defensive snaps (starter) as a rookie?

I know T-Newman did, Charles Woodson, who else?
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Old 12-15-2011   #284
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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Originally Posted by foo82 View Post
don't bother responding. Ellis will forever be a KJ hater. If KJ ever becomes a probowl cb, the hating will still continue on. Stats are on a mere convenience to prove his point. Any stat showing the opposite will just be ignored. There is no rhyme or reason.

KJ will now and forever be "burnt toast".

Ellis would rather KJ suck and bring the Texans down to crap to prove his point than him being a good player and helping the Texans. His hatred for KJ exceeds his love for the Texans.
This post is rather presumptive.

Not that I have a dog in this fight. (Mike Vick refrence)
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Old 12-15-2011   #285
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

Regarding the last play in the Falcons game, here's another independent view:
http://www.profootballweekly.com/201...win-over-falco

Although it appeared to the naked eye that Jones dropped what would have been the game-tying score, replays revealed that Jackson was able to reach his hand in and disrupt the play.
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Old 12-15-2011   #286
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

Here's an update ranking on DBs by PFF if you like stats.
(Jason Allen is not on the list.)

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog...s-projections/

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog...-the-findings/
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Old 12-15-2011   #287
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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don't bother responding. Ellis will forever be a KJ hater. If KJ ever becomes a probowl cb, the hating will still continue on. Stats are on a mere convenience to prove his point. Any stat showing the opposite will just be ignored. There is no rhyme or reason.

KJ will now and forever be "burnt toast".

Ellis would rather KJ suck and bring the Texans down to crap to prove his point than him being a good player and helping the Texans. His hatred for KJ exceeds his love for the Texans.
Haha no i say what i see, when and if KJ starts playing at a pro bowl calibur i will love it, i dont see you responding to how 76 or TK are so far up KJs ass they couldnt see the 50 yard line if they were standing on the 50. No need to attack Allen to make KJ look good. I have not started a Thread bashing KJ in a long time, on the other hand 76 has started threads bashing allen.

Read all the threads and posts and you wont look so stupid with such a biased response.

much appreciated ELLIS
and KJ still sucks
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Old 12-15-2011   #288
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

I'll just be glad one way or another the KJ threads will stop, either he's traded or playing good enough that people just let it go.
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Old 12-15-2011   #289
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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Haha no i say what i see, when and if KJ starts playing at a pro bowl calibur i will love it, i dont see you responding to how 76 or TK are so far up KJs ass they couldnt see the 50 yard line if they were standing on the 50. No need to attack Allen to make KJ look good. I have not started a Thread bashing KJ in a long time, on the other hand 76 has started threads bashing allen.

Read all the threads and posts and you wont look so stupid with such a biased response.

much appreciated ELLIS
and KJ still sucks
The reason people say things like that about you is exemplefied in the last little jab you made. Your little smiley says it all.

You're not hoping KJ does better. Your happy he's not playing at a probowl caliber. In fact, you're apparently ecstatic that, in your mind, he sucks, simply because that means you get to continue to believe you're justified in the way you assessed him previously.

Most people believe that KJ didn't perform as well has we needed him to last year (sure, there are some exceptions). But, most people also recognize his improvement without making backhanded snipes at him.

And it's really going to take probowl play from him to stop your crying about him? Apparently we're only going to have about one probowler this year, you should be spouting nonsense about the other 52 players on our team too.
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Old 12-16-2011   #290
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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The reason people say things like that about you is exemplefied in the last little jab you made. Your little smiley says it all.

You're not hoping KJ does better. Your happy he's not playing at a probowl caliber. In fact, you're apparently ecstatic that, in your mind, he sucks, simply because that means you get to continue to believe you're justified in the way you assessed him previously.

Most people believe that KJ didn't perform as well has we needed him to last year (sure, there are some exceptions). But, most people also recognize his improvement without making backhanded snipes at him.

And it's really going to take probowl play from him to stop your crying about him? Apparently we're only going to have about one probowler this year, you should be spouting nonsense about the other 52 players on our team too.
buddy boy please show me the last thread i made about KJ, i comment in other threads that other people make when they talk bad about J.Allen. Yes it is apparent that i dont like KJ, that is obvious. I only say what i say because of threads like this, cause now KJ is SOOOO good that he never needs safety help and Allen ALWAYS needs it haha. Last season KJ sucked because the safties didnt help him enough or they sucked (according to 76 and TK) but, now all the sudden he succeeds with no safety help. Give me a break.

Oh and KJ really really really sucks still
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Old 12-16-2011   #291
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

LOL.

I see the Crimson Tide is rolling again.

I have never seen a few people work so HARD to prop up a guy, and then try to minimize a stat like EllisUnit pointed out.

BUT...Kareem Jackson is "the starter" so the argument is over, so I'm told.

Yet the guy is playing roughly half the snaps and doing a Time Share with Jason Allen. Hey, if Jason Allen sucks as bad as you guys think...why isn't Kareem Jackson the full time starter by now? My theory is KJ is so behind the curve, that Jason Allen is splitting time with him so that KJ can absorb the game and watch a little bit more than playing every snap.

I don't see any big leap in KJ this year, in terms of his reaction to deep passes and just a huge stiffness in how he reacts to things. He really doesn't look like NFL caliber to me. And besides, Saban was silent when asked about KJ leaving early for the draft...IIRC, he felt the guy needed another year and wasn't ready. People think Saban is a dyck, I don't care, he just wins at the college level and knows who's up in college ball. I trust the guy's reaction to KJ leaving early. He flat out felt the guy was still rough around the edges.

I think we even had a 'Bama fan come on here and say that the other CB on that team was the real star and KJ was...well, a CB2 and nothing more. I'm sorry, but we don't draft CBs in the first round to be a career CB2, do we? And he was drafted BEFORE we got Joseph and Manning in free agency--KJ was here one full year before we acquired a CB1--so we wanted/needed a potential CB1. THAT is the grade standard I hold KJ to. Shit, we got a pretty competent QB in the 5th round folks. KJ can't control where he gets drafted on draft day, but still...he and two others were graded as 1st round material. Oops.

I just don't get how the Jackson Three (TK, BB, and 76) ignore that. The guy is in a job share out there, for crying out loud. Yeah, he's burnin' it up in 2011....

:shakeweightmotion:
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Old 12-16-2011   #292
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

this thread ==


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Old 12-16-2011   #293
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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this thread ==


LOL. Slow news week.

Tired of Tebow.

Tired of "We don't get no love from the media!"

Tired of "Why did Wade Phillips have to say that crap?!?!? Dammit!!!! :smilie palm: "

It was only going to get dredged up again, it's nature. Ecosystem and all that jazz.
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Old 12-16-2011   #294
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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I have never seen a few people work so HARD to prop up a guy, and then try to minimize a stat like EllisUnit pointed out.

BUT...Kareem Jackson is "the starter" so the argument is over, so I'm told.

Yet the guy is playing roughly half the snaps and doing a Time Share with Jason Allen. Hey, if Jason Allen sucks as bad as you guys think...why isn't Kareem Jackson the full time starter by now? My theory is KJ is so behind the curve, that Jason Allen is splitting time with him so that KJ can absorb the game and watch a little bit more than playing every snap.
Jason Allen has bounced from corner to safety to street free agent for a reason. He's a better corner now than when he came here.

I expected Kareem to get better, that's what 2nd year players do. Didn't expect Allen to get better, 6-7 year vets usually don't, but he proved me wrong.

So, I never said Allen sucks, only that I'd invest more time in Kareem than Allen if it were me making the decisions. Luckily for us, the Texans don't see it that way & have the time to develop both players. I'd imagine Brandon Harris is getting more & more NFL ready as well.

Quote:
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I don't see any big leap in KJ this year, in terms of his reaction to deep passes and just a huge stiffness in how he reacts to things. He really doesn't look like NFL caliber to me.
& that's fine, we're all wrong every once in a while.

Quote:
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And besides, Saban was silent when asked about KJ leaving early for the draft...IIRC, he felt the guy needed another year and wasn't ready. People think Saban is a dyck, I don't care, he just wins at the college level and knows who's up in college ball. I trust the guy's reaction to KJ leaving early. He flat out felt the guy was still rough around the edges.
Saban has a history of his guys going the full 4 years. It's rare when they don't. I'd imagine he'd say the same about any of his players.
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I think we even had a 'Bama fan come on here and say that the other CB on that team was the real star and KJ was...well, a CB2 and nothing more. I'm sorry, but we don't draft CBs in the first round to be a career CB2, do we? And he was drafted BEFORE we got Joseph and Manning in free agency--KJ was here one full year before we acquired a CB1--so we wanted/needed a potential CB1. THAT is the grade standard I hold KJ to. Shit, we got a pretty competent QB in the 5th round folks. KJ can't control where he gets drafted on draft day, but still...he and two others were graded as 1st round material. Oops.
We drafted Kj and continued to pursue FA corners. We didn't find any that were better than what we had. Leigh Bodden may have been the exception, but he didn't want to come here.

Kj was not drafted & expected to start right away. We failed to secure a veteran fA & had to play the hand we were dealt.

It is still too early to say that Kj will never be a number one. But he is improving, even though you don't see it. With Jjo here, sorry, he won't be CB1, but that doesn't mean he won't be a very good CB.
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I just don't get how the Jackson Three (TK, BB, and 76) ignore that. The guy is in a job share out there, for crying out loud. Yeah, he's burnin' it up in 2011....

:shakeweightmotion:
I didn't think any less of Caldwell or Duane Brown when they were working out very similar situations. If you've got players that you believe they deserve to be on the field, you find a way to do it.

Look, I'm watching the kid play & I think (my opinion) that he plays well for a 2nd year corner, (I thought he played well for a rookie as well on a historically bad defense).

I do not expect a CB to come out of college & make it to the probowl as a rookie. Though it has happened (McCourty) it's rare. There have been some to come out & play well as rookies (TNewman, Charles Woodson come to mind) but it is still more the case that they play like rookies, look at all the other CBs from his draft class.... take a look at McCourty this year.

Look at the Corners that have come out in the last 4 years & start naming the ones that look hands down better than Kareem Jackson, then try to remember or find tape from their rookie years. Most of them do not play the number of snaps Kareem did. & it's for a reason, because they'll look like Kareem did.

All I'm saying, & all I've ever said, is that I'm not writing him off.
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Old 12-16-2011   #295
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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LOL. Slow news week.

Tired of Tebow.

Tired of "We don't get no love from the media!"

Tired of "Why did Wade Phillips have to say that crap?!?!? Dammit!!!! :smilie palm: "

It was only going to get dredged up again, it's nature. Ecosystem and all that jazz.
I'm into recycling as much as the next guy but geez...
oh well, carry on.
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Old 12-17-2011   #296
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

i always say i will try to avoid these type of threads, and i never do. but this time i mean it
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Old 12-17-2011   #297
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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If that's on 30 passes thrown Allen's way vs 16 thrown Kj's way do those numbers still prove your point?
oh one last thing T yes they do prove my point you do the math here i will do it for you

KJ 1 int 4 passes defended in 16 passes his way

now

allen 4 int and 14 passes defended on 30 passes his way

ok half of 30 is 15 right. that means allen defends the pass just under 50% of the time. while half of 16 is 8 this means KJ defends the pass 25% of the time.

Allen 4 Ints on 30 pass attempts and KJ 1 Int on 16 pass attemps. again half of 30 is 15. This means allen intercepts the ball 1 out of every 7.2 pass attempts. and then half of 16 is 8 this means KJ intercepts the ball 1 out of every 16 pass attempts. well the math on KJs last part was dumb

See so breaking down the numbers actually proves my point, thanks
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Old 12-17-2011   #298
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

Well "In Wade I Trust" is usually the way I look at it but idk how many changes will be made while Wade is gone...
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Old 12-17-2011   #299
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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oh one last thing T yes they do prove my point you do the math here i will do it for you

KJ 1 int 4 passes defended in 16 passes his way

now

allen 4 int and 14 passes defended on 30 passes his way

ok half of 30 is 15 right. that means allen defends the pass just under 50% of the time. while half of 16 is 8 this means KJ defends the pass 25% of the time.

Allen 4 Ints on 30 pass attempts and KJ 1 Int on 16 pass attemps. again half of 30 is 15. This means allen intercepts the ball 1 out of every 7.2 pass attempts. and then half of 16 is 8 this means KJ intercepts the ball 1 out of every 16 pass attempts. well the math on KJs last part was dumb

See so breaking down the numbers actually proves my point, thanks
Well that's true....

depending on how you look at it. If Kareem is getting more snaps (& I don't know that is true or not) why are more balls going Allen's way than Kareem's..... that would have to factor .

How many completions were made? If Kj gave up 4 in 16 targets & Allen gives up 14 in his 30 that changes things don't it? If Kj gave up 1 touchdown with those stats & Allen gave up 3..... etc...

I love stats, don't get me wrong. But they aren't the end all be all.
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Old 12-17-2011   #300
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Default Re: When do we end the Kareem experiment?

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
Well that's true....

depending on how you look at it. If Kareem is getting more snaps (& I don't know that is true or not) why are more balls going Allen's way than Kareem's..... that would have to factor .

How many completions were made? If Kj gave up 4 in 16 targets & Allen gives up 14 in his 30 that changes things don't it? If Kj gave up 1 touchdown with those stats & Allen gave up 3..... etc...

I love stats, don't get me wrong. But they aren't the end all be all.
i fully agree that stats dont always tell the whole story. I will say this, i do think KJ has improved from last season, not just his play but the CB opposite him and both safety positions have been upgraded, and i think it is making everyone look better, not to mention Our D-Line dont like to give QBs very much time to set up and throw.

We all know i like J. Allen and that yall like KJ. I stopped all the KJ Bashing threads, just wish 76 would stop all the allen bashing threads. Hell i would never talk bad about KJ if that could happen.
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