Burge:Is Matt Schaub underappreciated?

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by EllisUnit

Dude in 2009 we had no running game, in 2010 we had no defense. I take 2011 matt schaub any day of the week. Cause that means we have a running game and a good defense.

I'd like for that play-making Matt Schaub to be on the team with that running game.

I'm talking about instead of throwing the ball away on third down, extending the play & making something happen. Stay on the field & score.

Doesn't matter that we don't "need" him to do it, that's not stopping Aaron Rodgers...

I'm talking about staying on the field vs New Orleans & not letting Drew Brees score twice to win the game.

I'm talking about winning the game at home vs Oakland.

I'm talking about being 9-1 right now with a clear lead in the AFC.

[EllisUnit]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I'd like for that play-making Matt Schaub to be on the team with that running game.

I'm talking about instead of throwing the ball away on third down, extending the play & making something happen. Stay on the field & score.

Doesn't matter that we don't "need" him to do it, that's not stopping Aaron Rodgers...

I'm talking about staying on the field vs New Orleans & not letting Drew Brees score twice to win the game.

I'm talking about winning the game at home vs Oakland.

I'm talking about being 9-1 right now with a clear lead in the AFC.

Man we are 7-3. That is somewhere we have never been, i will take what schaub has done so far this season.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by EllisUnit

Man we are 7-3. That is somewhere we have never been, i will take what schaub has done so far this season.

So will I. But if another QB has to take snaps, I'll hope he plays as well or better.

[Texecutioner]

Originally Posted by EllisUnit

Man we are 7-3. That is somewhere we have never been, i will take what schaub has done so far this season.

Well remember a few weeks ago half of this board wanted him out of here, so yeah I'd definitely say he's under appreciated. People didn't want to take notice at all the last two seasons at how close he kept us in so many games where our defense was atrocious. I think Matt can be clutch, but I just don't think you can expect him to be all of the time like you can with Brees, Brady, Rodgers, Ben, and Manning. He has had some clutch type drives though. It's like I kept saying when everyone wanted him sent packing, Schaub is a top 10 QB and that's not to shabby when you have 32 teams in the NFL. I'll take a top 10 guy any day of the week. A lot of people forget what it was like when we had Carr around here.

[Playoffs]

Schaub is woefully under-appreciated here, imo.

One point, though: I didn't see too many bench Schaub, start Leinart/Leinart is the better Matt threads/articles this year until the injury.

[Thorn]

It doesn't really matter now. What we have is Leinart for the rest of the season. The only thing we can do is hope that Kubiak does what he is supposed to be able to do, coach up a QB and make the offense work.

[HJam72]

Originally Posted by Texans_Chick

NFL Inside the Numbers

Folks at stats looked at most clutch QBs. Schaub comes in at 5th this year. FWIW.

Interestingly same link says Texans D is by far the best in the league against the play action pass. /no surprise given who they've practiced against.

Bengals worst against play action. File that away in your brain pan.

Notice that Houston is #1 with results of 1 TD and 4 Ints?

[PapaL]

Originally Posted by Thorn

It doesn't really matter now. What we have is Leinart for the rest of the season. The only thing we can do is hope that Kubiak does what he is supposed to be able to do, coach up a QB and make the offense work.

Truer words have not been spoken.

On the bright side, we have the coolest QB in the league under center now. #Fact

[80tothezone]

Originally Posted by Hervoyel

I wanted to add something. He's good. He's good enough. He could be upgraded and if you look around the league with only a handful of exceptions almost everyone takings snaps either could be upgraded or is there as a result of someone who got upgraded. No NFL team is ever "done". They add and subtract players every year. You all know this.

The thing I hear most with regard to Schaub is that he's far from the biggest issue on our team. I've always felt that way too but lately I've started to wonder.

Is the biggest issue our top ranked defense? Maybe it's our incredible running game? I know, it's our widely regarded as the best line in football offensive line. I'm being sarcastic here but the QB position isn't as far from being "fair game" for an upgrade as many of us have thought in the past. It's starting to look like we might see signs of life out of KJ and we'll get Manning back eventually. The secondary isn't in as dire need as it once was. Our WR's could use some help. That's true. We could beef up the DL. If a QB is there when we pick in the first or second round though why not look at him (assuming Leinart doesn't live up to all of our hopes)?

of course u pick a qb if one is available, right now the Texans are at the point where we are Taking the best player available at whatever draft pick we get. If it is a Qb then u draft him and sit him behind schaub and hope he develops into a person that can. take the reigns from him. Same thing at the WR position and all positions. We got a solid starting linup and some pretty good backups.

[Texan_Bill]

Start Sage!!

[beerlover]

no offence to Alan, but can we just let Mattie Hot Tub get a game or two under his belt then compare the two, when it matters, to see just how under or over appreciated QB play actually is in Kubiak/Texan system?

[ObsiWan]

Originally Posted by Texan_Bill

Start Sage!!

Bill....

[drunkcookie]

He's both underappreciated and overappreciated IMO... He's like most Tier 2-3 QBs, very polarizing in their respected NFL cities... He can never be "just good enough"...


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[Cerberus]

Originally Posted by EllisUnit

i by no means think that Schaub is an above elite QB, but i do feel that Matt Leinart is a less than average QB. Just funny to me how some think that Leinart will come in and do better than Schaub, i hope they are right, but i fear that is very very unlikely

Bingo! If Leinart were as good or better than Schaub, he would have been the starter. Fact is, the playbook will have to be pared down in some places to fit Leinart, just like some plays can be added because of what Leinart can do. However, you don't want to tinker with the system too much. All the same, I think many of those that don't like Schaub will come around once they get a look at things with Leinart. I'll be most curious to see if he can throw an out pattern with enough zing not to be throwing pick-6's. I still questions his arm strength.

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

None of the arguments for Leinart are based on any amazing ability he has shown in the NFL so far. It's all about hope... why people can't see that, I don't know.

Funny how you weren't able to recognize "hope" when the Raiders made their trade for Carson Palmer; which by the way is working out rather well if I must say so myself.

Originally Posted by Texans_Chick

NFL Inside the Numbers

Folks at stats looked at most clutch QBs. Schaub comes in at 5th this year. FWIW.

Interestingly same link says Texans D is by far the best in the league against the play action pass. /no surprise given who they've practiced against.

Bengals worst against play action. File that away in your brain pan.

Schaub is a good QB, and is indeed under-appreciated. I'd put him in the same group as a Philip Rivers, Matt Ryan, Jay Cutler and Eli Manning.

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I'd like for that play-making Matt Schaub to be on the team with that running game.

I'm talking about instead of throwing the ball away on third down, extending the play & making something happen. Stay on the field & score.

Doesn't matter that we don't "need" him to do it, that's not stopping Aaron Rodgers...

I'm talking about staying on the field vs New Orleans & not letting Drew Brees score twice to win the game.

I'm talking about winning the game at home vs Oakland.

I'm talking about being 9-1 right now with a clear lead in the AFC.

Uh, a lot of teams can look back and say "what if", I mean just look at my Raiders. If they wouldn't have let Buffalo come back on them, if Campbell didn't go down and the Raiders didn't have to play Boller or Palmer off the couch they would have beaten the Donks and Chiefs, and they too would have been 9-1. They lost to the Patriots, no if's, and's or but's. Point being, you are what your record says you are, and the Texans currently are 7-3.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Cerberus

Funny how you weren't able to recognize "hope" when the Raiders made their trade for Carson Palmer; which by the way is working out rather well if I must say so myself.

Being this is a Texans board, I felt my time would be better spent pissing in your cheerios

Originally Posted by Cerberus

Uh, a lot of teams can look back and say "what if", I mean just look at my Raiders. If they wouldn't have let Buffalo come back on them, if Campbell didn't go down and the Raiders didn't have to play Boller or Palmer off the couch they would have beaten the Donks and Chiefs, and they too would have been 9-1. They lost to the Patriots, no if's, and's or but's. Point being, you are what your record says you are, and the Texans currently are 7-3.

You missed the point entirely. It was not about us being 9-1, it was about the Matt Schaub we've seen this year is not the Matt Schaub who is near elite. Maybe he didn't have to be. But how is he supposed to know that?

I want a guy, a QB, who will fight to win every single play. That doesn't mean he needs to force throws, but if the probability of Matt throwing the ball away when he leaves the pocket is substantially greater than the probability that he will "make a play" then we've got the wrong guy in there.

[Double Barrel]

This seems like a straw man debate. Set up "Schaub is under appreciated" in order to knock it down.

But honestly, I've only heard a couple of nitwit callers on sports talk radio who advocate getting another QB, but I completely disregard their opinions as morons when they don't have basic facts about Schaub and start suggesting idiotic things like "we need Aaron Rogers or Tom Brady". It's just a stupid take and causes an immediate reaction in me to put on a CD in order to make the stupid stop burning my brain.

Schaub is not elite, but he's definitely in the top third of starting QBs in the league. There are many teams in the league that would love to have him on their roster.

I agree with Herv that people are just trying to remain optimistic when talking about Leinart. Nobody knows at this point.

[Rey]

Originally Posted by drunkcookie

He's both underappreciated and overappreciated IMO... He's like most Tier 2-3 QBs, very polarizing in their respected NFL cities... He can never be "just good enough"...


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I think I agree with this. But like Beerlover basically said....you really don't know how much you miss something until it's gone...

We will see how much Schaub is missed. Extremely likely he will be missed, but to what degree we don't know yet.


On another note, I re-watched the first drive of the Steelers game and Schaub made some good throws that I had forgotten about. We had a few penalties on the drive and Shammy made some good throws to keep the chains moving. On 3rd and long he had a really good throw to OD that was kind of in between two Steelers....

[infantrycak]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

You missed the point entirely. It was not about us being 9-1, it was about the Matt Schaub we've seen this year is not the Matt Schaub who is near elite. Maybe he didn't have to be. But how is he supposed to know that?

OK for the anti-stat people yeah he has been down from prior (stellar - wouldn't want to use the elite word) performances. And yet has the 6th highest QB rating in the league. What is elite with 32 teams? - 2, 3, 4? Wide receivers drop balls, even great ones like AJ. Running backs fumble balls, even great ones like Sanders, Smith, Brown. Quarter backs have errant throws, even great ones like Staubach, Montana, Elway. This expectation of perfection is getting irritating.

Originally Posted by Double Barrel

This seems like a straw man debate. Set up "Schaub is under appreciated" in order to knock it down.

But honestly, I've only heard a couple of nitwit callers on sports talk radio who advocate getting another QB, but I completely disregard their opinions as morons when they don't have basic facts about Schaub and start suggesting idiotic things like "we need Aaron Rogers or Tom Brady". It's just a stupid take and causes an immediate reaction in me to put on a CD in order to make the stupid stop burning my brain.

Schaub is not elite, but he's definitely in the top third of starting QBs in the league. There are many teams in the league that would love to have him on their roster.

I agree with Herv that people are just trying to remain optimistic when talking about Leinart. Nobody knows at this point.

Agreed with the exception of there were quite a few people calling in on radio earlier this season acting like Schaub was the problem on the team. And frankly people acting like they know Leinart will be "as good or better" than Schaub are taking a dig at him as well. I hope it is true but there is no reason to believe so.

[Rey]

Originally Posted by infantrycak

Quarter backs have errant throws, even great ones like Staubach, Montana, Elway. This expectation of perfection is getting irritating.

Right, but those QB's were considered great for a reason.

Unless we are going to put Schaub in the same category as those guys I don't understand the point.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by infantrycak

OK for the anti-stat people yeah he has been down from prior (stellar - wouldn't want to use the elite word) performances. And yet has the 6th highest QB rating in the league. What is elite with 32 teams? - 2, 3, 4? Wide receivers drop balls, even great ones like AJ. Running backs fumble balls, even great ones like Sanders, Smith, Brown. Quarter backs have errant throws, even great ones like Staubach, Montana, Elway. This expectation of perfection is getting irritating.

I'm sure there are people unreasonably asking Matt Schaub to be perfect. I'm not one of those. I'm simply asking him to play with the same urgency we saw the past two years, where every possession, every snap was crucial & he went beyond the standard drop back, read the defense & throw the ball.

He extended plays, he made things happen.

We still didn't convert on every third down, we still didn't score on every possession, but he greatly increased our chances of both, by not just taking what the defense gave us, but making things happen.

Originally Posted by infantrycak

Agreed with the exception of there were quite a few people calling in on radio earlier this season acting like Schaub was the problem on the team. And frankly people acting like they know Leinart will be "as good or better" than Schaub are taking a dig at him as well. I hope it is true but there is no reason to believe so.

eh.. I know for Leinart to bring to the table what Schaub has brought to the table he's going to have to play better than he's every played before.