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Old 08-21-2011   #1
BattleRedToro
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Default Helmet to helmet penalty

I believe it was Glover Quin that was called for the penalty. The replays I saw seemed to show the hit to be a legal shoulder tackle. Did anyone see any other replays that showed it was an actual helmet to helmet hit?
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Old 08-21-2011   #2
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

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Originally Posted by BattleRedToro View Post
I believe it was Glover Quin that was called for the penalty. The replays I saw seemed to show the hit to be a legal shoulder tackle. Did anyone see any other replays that showed it was an actual helmet to helmet hit?
All the replays I saw showed that he leveled his shoulder into the Back. It was a bad call.
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Old 08-21-2011   #3
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

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Originally Posted by BattleRedToro View Post
I believe it was Glover Quin that was called for the penalty. The replays I saw seemed to show the hit to be a legal shoulder tackle. Did anyone see any other replays that showed it was an actual helmet to helmet hit?
Periera (sp) the ex head of referees said that the call was good because Glover hit the guy's head with his shoulder pad. To me, it looked like a bogus call and the hit looked good. Even the Solomon Wilcots calling the game on the Saints broadcast said it was a bad call.

I really, really hate the new rules about when you can and cannot hit a receiver. I've already seen some refs calling things differently.
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Old 08-21-2011   #4
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

NFL is going to fine the ref that blew this call $20K.
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Old 08-21-2011   #5
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

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Originally Posted by Jackie Chiles View Post
NFL is going to fine the ref that blew this call $20K.
They should , it was a legal hit. He hit with the shoulder pad .... nice play by Quin. I like him at S , really looking forward to seeing the Texans secondary with J Jo back there next week against the 49ers.
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Old 08-21-2011   #6
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
Periera (sp) the ex head of referees said that the call was good because Glover hit the guy's head with his shoulder pad. To me, it looked like a bogus call and the hit looked good. Even the Solomon Wilcots calling the game on the Saints broadcast said it was a bad call.

I really, really hate the new rules about when you can and cannot hit a receiver. I've already seen some refs calling things differently.
His name is spelled Pereira, if you wanted to know. I don't know how he pronounces it, but in Spanish it is pronounced like this: pay-ray-e-rah. Knowing that might help you to remember the spelling.
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Old 08-21-2011   #7
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The receiver lowered his head like a battering ram. Very dumb in his part. He could have been seriously injured.
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Old 08-21-2011   #8
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

The new rule:

Quote:
Defenseless players cannot be hit in the head or neck area with the helmet, facemask, forearm or shoulder, and the definition of such players now includes those throwing a pass; attempting or completing a catch without having time to ward off or avoid contact; a runner whose forward progress has been stopped by a tackler; kickoff or punt returners while the ball is in the air; kickers or punters during a kick or a return; a quarterback during a change of possession; a player who receives a blindside block from a blocker moving toward his own end zone.
When this first was announced, I said their would be too much open for interpretation by the zebras........this is a fine example. And, even if his shoulder ticked the helmet, as Rey pointed out, the receiver definitely lowered his head into Quinn. The rules as written don't allow for taking into account such manipulation of the protective rules. Too much open for interpretation.........misinterpretation.
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Old 08-21-2011   #9
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackie Chiles View Post
NFL is going to fine the ref that blew this call $20K.
I don't know where you get that from, but just for the sake of argument, who cares. The damage from the bad call is already done. What if it's a real game, and not a preseason game, and that happens.

If you are going to have these kinds of penalties, then they should fall under the instant replay rules, and verified that helmet to helmet contact had actually taken place. As a matter of fact, all helmet to helmet penalties should all automatically be reviewed. This is definitely an area where instant replay wouldn't have any "inconclusive" issues.
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Old 08-21-2011   #10
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
The receiver lowered his head like a battering ram. Very dumb in his part.
But, instinctive. It's only natural to lower your center of gravity before a collision. It was a bang-bang play in which clearly Quin had no intention of fouling Sproles. The NFL can't legislate this play from occurring. They can only penalize and fine it. This game is too fast for the officials to determine intent, so the NFL decides to fine everything and let God (I mean Goodell) sort it out.
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Old 08-21-2011   #11
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
I don't know where you get that from, but just for the sake of argument, who cares. The damage from the bad call is already done. What if it's a real game, and not a preseason game, and that happens.
Lol, it was a joke in reference to all the 20K fines players get for helmet to helmet, lighten up dude.
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Old 08-21-2011   #12
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

So basically, all a receiver needs to do is drop his head into an oncoming DB and presto, 15 yard penalty.
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Old 08-21-2011   #13
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

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Originally Posted by prostock101 View Post
So basically, all a receiver needs to do is drop his head into an oncoming DB and presto, 15 yard penalty.
According to the rules (and I posted a thread a week or so ago to a video from the NFL that explained the rules changes), if you HIT the guy while he's in the process of catching the ball, they can pretty much throw the flag for hitting a defenseless receiver.

It's insane.
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Old 08-21-2011   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky View Post
But, instinctive. It's only natural to lower your center of gravity before a collision. It was a bang-bang play in which clearly Quin had no intention of fouling Sproles. The NFL can't legislate this play from occurring. They can only penalize and fine it. This game is too fast for the officials to determine intent, so the NFL decides to fine everything and let God (I mean Goodell) sort it out.
I agree.

And the funny thing about it is that i saw a similar play from another game and no flag was thrown.

Biggest difference between the two plays is what the receiver did. one ducked his head and the other wasn't expecting the hit so he was more straight up and down.

Looks like offensive players can lower their heads but defensive guys can't. Vonta lowered his head and ran through Siler and I can't help but think that if the roles were reversed a flag would have been thrown.
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Old 08-22-2011   #15
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

Here's a hit by Broncos rookie safety Rahim Moore on Bills WR Donald Jones that drew the defenseless receiver flag. In this instance, I think the refs got it right. Moore was leading with his helmet and aiming high, for Jones' head. I could tell on the replay, but watching live it was difficult to say. That's why this will be such a tough rule to get right.
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Old 08-22-2011   #16
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
According to the rules (and I posted a thread a week or so ago to a video from the NFL that explained the rules changes), if you HIT the guy while he's in the process of catching the ball, they can pretty much throw the flag for hitting a defenseless receiver.

It's insane.
Agreed. With these new rules, DBs no longer have the option to bust up a completion with a perfectly timed hit.

I think it's time the NFL put little tutus on the WRs just like the ones they've given the QBs.
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Old 08-22-2011   #17
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

Quin looked like a strong safety that's the good news. Bad news is playing a new position where this type of hit use to be legal/common he must evolve with new rules too.
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Old 08-22-2011   #18
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

This call was BS. I was screaming at the ref's from my couch. WR's are being coddled and the rules bent to allow it. I hate it. If a defender hits a WR to try and separate him from the ball during a catch, it could possibly be flagged as hitting a defenseless receiver according to the ref Saturday night.
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Old 08-22-2011   #19
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

Yeah, we boo-ed the call pretty loudly. I couldn't even hear Hack-uli's explanation. GQ didn't lead with his helmet and wasn't aiming high. He gave his man time to catch and turn and that. was. it. Didn't launch himself, had no intention and DIDN'T cause injury. Frankly, he could've knocked Sproles onto IR and he didn't.
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Old 08-22-2011   #20
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Default Re: Helmet to helmet penalty

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Originally Posted by TimeKiller View Post
Yeah, we boo-ed the call pretty loudly. I couldn't even hear Hack-uli's explanation. GQ didn't lead with his helmet and wasn't aiming high. He gave his man time to catch and turn and that. was. it. Didn't launch himself, had no intention and DIDN'T cause injury. Frankly, he could've knocked Sproles onto IR and he didn't.
They say low man wins, but the NFL wants the hitter to keep his head straight up while being low man? Sounds like a good way to get your own head knocked off.
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