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Old 03-23-2011   #121
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

I really couldn't care less about what other owners have done or haven't done.

I know that our situation has sucked and until proven otherwise, sucks.
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Old 03-23-2011   #122
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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I know you aren't saying what Kubiak has done is commendable or that he should still be here but 5 years of no playoffs and 1 regression from .500 type ball is not the same as winning records that bottom out at .500. At least not to me. They are different situations but I have a hard time believing that any other owner would have kept what the Texans have considering that it has only happened once in the modern era(corrected that from before)

I'll move along from that. Wish the CBA would get signed.
I hear you. Like not knowing who we talk to or what we offer on free agents (whenever that happens) we will never know what McNair would have done if there was a CBA in place either. The lack of one is a confounding factor in all this.

I do think Kraft's patience is being under appreciated. Yeah Carroll bottomed out at .500 but when you hand somebody the keys to a Ferrari you don't expect their lap times to get slower and slower such that Camaros are passing them. Carroll had no good years relative to when he took the team over. Clearly Kubiak's improvement has underwhelmed but until this year (actually even this year - they regressed but not to the prior level) it has been a decided improvement over what was turned over to him.
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Old 03-23-2011   #123
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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Yup and it makes a difference.



Never said you did. I was adding detail.



Well I would say you are the one spinning here if you try to act like you know what Kraft would have done with Kubiak. We agree Carroll and Kubiak came into totally dissimilar situations. But somehow you want to project that an owner who put up with three progressively worse years of results would have been quicker on the draw when this is Kubiak's first year of regression. Look at that again 3 progressively worse years v. 1 year of regression. That's not an argument for Kubiak not being fired so don't confuse that.

Dale can speak to the fortunate events stuff.
Based upon Kraft's modus operandi, I think it is fair to say that he would not have lived with five years of mediocre results from Kubiak.

Carroll won the division and won the first playoff game in his first year.

They went to the playoffs and lost his second season.

He was fired after 8-8 in his third season.

Based upon this history, to act like Kraft would have kept Kubiak after five years of mediocrity is just being obtuse.

Nobody knows exactly what he would have done, and I did not make that claim. But deductive reasoning from history can lead a person to believe one scenario is simply more plausible than the other. Do YOU honestly think Kraft would tolerate five years of 37-43 Kubiak?
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Old 03-23-2011   #124
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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Based upon Kraft's modus operandi, I think it is fair to say that he would not have lived with five years of mediocre results from Kubiak.

Carroll won the division and won the first playoff game in his first year.

They went to the playoffs and lost his second season.

He was fired after 8-8 in his third season.

Based upon this history, to act like Kraft would have kept Kubiak after five years of mediocrity is just being obtuse.

Nobody knows exactly what he would have done, and I did not make that claim. But deductive reasoning from history can lead a person to believe one scenario is simply more plausible than the other. Do YOU honestly think Kraft would tolerate five years of 37-43 Kubiak?

This season marks the first time in McNair's tenure that he has not removed a coach after the team took a step backwards in W-L record. And, had it not been for the CBA situation, I don't think he would have kept Kubiak... For those of you wanting a better coach, realize that all the top names remained on the sideline this off-season despite a number of job openings.

Do you think Kraft would've fired a coach who took over a 2-14 team and did the following: 6-10, 8-8, 8-8, 9-7? Maybe... but, I'm not sure.
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Old 03-23-2011   #125
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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This season marks the first time in McNair's tenure that he has not removed a coach after the team took a step backwards in W-L record. And, had it not been for the CBA situation, I don't think he would have kept Kubiak... For those of you wanting a better coach, realize that all the top names remained on the sideline this off-season despite a number of job openings.

Do you think Kraft would've fired a coach who took over a 2-14 team and did the following: 6-10, 8-8, 8-8, 9-7? Maybe... but, I'm not sure.
I bet he would have but that is not 100 percent certain no one can be that certain about firing someone.
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Old 03-23-2011   #126
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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Do YOU honestly think Kraft would tolerate five years of 37-43 Kubiak?
You know me. I am willing to say "I don't know" and on this one I really don't think there is a sound prediction. I could easily see Kraft going either way particularly because of the CBA situation. Different time, place and circumstance.
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Old 03-23-2011   #127
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Old 03-23-2011   #128
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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.........Definitely nothing crazy...........

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Old 03-23-2011   #129
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

The Texans doing something they think is crazy might actually be interesting.

I've been watching them do things they think make sense for nine years and that's been enough to convince me that they're either intentionally trying to suck for some reason or are run by blindfolded imbeciles taking instructions from a Ouija board in a dark room.

Go ahead Bob, try some crazy shit. What's the worst thing that could happen?
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Old 03-23-2011   #130
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Old 03-23-2011   #131
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

Trading for P Burnt #We're not going to do something we think is crazy
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Old 03-24-2011   #132
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

............tony Hollins!
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Old 03-24-2011   #133
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

What the New England Patriots do is trade players when they still have value and they can still get draft picks etc that will improve the team. We could do the same by trading Mario maybe? I say maybe because he may not have a lot of value, I am not sure. Correct me if I am wrong but I think this is his last year under contract. He may or may not perform well this year under the new scheme. I think he will be motivated this year because it is a contract year. If he is able physically is an ongoing question. Whatever happens this year I think now is the time to trade him IF he has value. If he does great this year are you willing to sign him to a HUGE contract and hope he has the motivation once he has more money. If he gets hurt again what is his value? If he is not suited to this defense what is his value to the Texans? Don't know the details on what we could expect to get for him if we do not resign him at the end of the season, but I would guess he is more valuble in a trade now. Just too many questions surrounding Mario. Just my opinion.
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Old 03-24-2011   #134
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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What the New England Patriots do is trade players when they still have value and they can still get draft picks etc that will improve the team. We could do the same by trading Mario maybe? I say maybe because he may not have a lot of value, I am not sure. Correct me if I am wrong but I think this is his last year under contract. He may or may not perform well this year under the new scheme. I think he will be motivated this year because it is a contract year. If he is able physically is an ongoing question. Whatever happens this year I think now is the time to trade him IF he has value. If he does great this year are you willing to sign him to a HUGE contract and hope he has the motivation once he has more money. If he gets hurt again what is his value? If he is not suited to this defense what is his value to the Texans? Don't know the details on what we could expect to get for him if we do not resign him at the end of the season, but I would guess he is more valuble in a trade now. Just too many questions surrounding Mario. Just my opinion.
I'm with ya 100%, man.

Mario is Mario, and I won't sit here and say "he stinks" or anything foolish like that. He's been on a consistently bad defense his whole career here. I think we should get value for him NOW, unlike what we have done in the past--Which is to stick with a guy too long and then you get jack squat for them.

I do think that the Texans organization has fallen in love with the person, and not the player though. They fell in love with David Carr and kept him one more season than necessary. They fell in love with Dunta and kept him here one more season than necessary. And they're gonna' do the same thing with Mario Williams, except he's likely to get a big fat payday instead of exiting the doors of Reliant.

Why?

My theory is that it's a marketing decision. McNair has his "chosen ones" that he thinks adds credibility and marketability to his team. In place of good old fashioned WINNING, we have a LOSING team that needs its guys who stand out and serve as beacons of light in an otherwise dark and stormy night.

Plus, McNair has shown just an over-the-top preference for Do-Goody behavior. Let's all be one big, happy family and get through this together! He can't let go of what's not working, either out of arrogance/pride or plain old sentimentalism. Or both.

"We're not going to do anything crazy" is becoming a meme on this thread. I've enjoyed the images you guys have created thus far, btw. Very entertaining. But be careful...there are those who think you can't laugh at the Texans. Continue onward anyways, that's my advice. I'd be joining you, but my Macbook Pro laptop is down and I have a thread in the Graphics and Tech Talk forum if anybody has a Mac laptop and can help me sort it out.
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Old 03-24-2011   #135
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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What the New England Patriots do is trade players when they still have value and they can still get draft picks etc that will improve the team. We could do the same by trading Mario maybe? I say maybe because he may not have a lot of value, I am not sure. Correct me if I am wrong but I think this is his last year under contract. He may or may not perform well this year under the new scheme. I think he will be motivated this year because it is a contract year. If he is able physically is an ongoing question. Whatever happens this year I think now is the time to trade him IF he has value. If he does great this year are you willing to sign him to a HUGE contract and hope he has the motivation once he has more money. If he gets hurt again what is his value? If he is not suited to this defense what is his value to the Texans? Don't know the details on what we could expect to get for him if we do not resign him at the end of the season, but I would guess he is more valuble in a trade now. Just too many questions surrounding Mario. Just my opinion.

All the things I've stated before but get laughed at for saying. I like Mario, but maybe trading him would help this team be better. Of course it will not happen because Mcnair knew he would sink or swim with Mario and because Wade said he could try some Bruce Smith things with Mario which means Mcnair will want to see if Mario can be better.
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Old 03-24-2011   #136
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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You know me. I am willing to say "I don't know" and on this one I really don't think there is a sound prediction. I could easily see Kraft going either way particularly because of the CBA situation. Different time, place and circumstance.
Yeah, like I said, nobody knows with 100% certainty.

But, we are always free to 'form a theory or conjecture about a subject without firm evidence',
you know - speculate.
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Old 03-24-2011   #137
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Old 03-24-2011   #138
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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Old 03-24-2011   #139
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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They were in the AFC Championship Game. I'm pretty sure they would have continued their next seasons as a top team with top management, coaches and players and probably had SB success.
But we know what happened to Bledsoe after he left New England. There is no reason to believe he would have done any different in New England.

dalemurphy is saying had Bledsoe not got hurt, and they found Brady, who knows what could have happened.

They were successful with Bledsoe, but Bledsoe was never going to win the SB at that time (I believe he got pretty injury prone & shell shocked).

Brady may have disappeared into obscurity (I believe he was third on the depth chart) and maybe out of the league.

We don't know one way or the other. What we do know, is that two QBs got hurt before Brady took the field.

That wasn't an example of a well managed, hiring the best people kind of thing.

Same with Belichick..... I can't remember the specifics, but wasn't he supposed to go to the Jets????? but decided to go to New England instead?

Not because Kraft was the guy he wanted to work for, or because he offered more money, but because Belichick was upset about something or other?
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Old 03-24-2011   #140
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Default Re: McNair: "We're not going to do something we think is crazy"

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But we know what happened to Bledsoe after he left New England. There is no reason to believe he would have done any different in New England.

dalemurphy is saying had Bledsoe not got hurt, and they found Brady, who knows what could have happened.

They were successful with Bledsoe, but Bledsoe was never going to win the SB at that time (I believe he got pretty injury prone & shell shocked).

Brady may have disappeared into obscurity (I believe he was third on the depth chart) and maybe out of the league.

We don't know one way or the other. What we do know, is that two QBs got hurt before Brady took the field.

That wasn't an example of a well managed, hiring the best people kind of thing.

Same with Belichick..... I can't remember the specifics, but wasn't he supposed to go to the Jets????? but decided to go to New England instead?

Not because Kraft was the guy he wanted to work for, or because he offered more money, but because Belichick was upset about something or other?
That is a jacked up number of what ifs. Schaub may not be playing if it weren't for the Rosencopter. I mean this happens every season. The following seasons of Patriot success was not due to all of those things. Kraft was successful before that season. Those things happening were fortunate but EVERY year stuff happens where guys get hurt and other guys step up. Kraft has the right people in place and manages the team better than the McNair does the Texans. This isn't 9 degrees of Kevin Bacon where one team is lucky and has X,Y,Z happen to have their future set and the other is run the same but has bad luck. Brady was there because they drafted him.

This is just tiring.
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