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Old 03-16-2011   #1
TEXANJAK
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Default Evaluating Matt Schaub

Matt Schaub
Year ATT COMP PCT YDS YDS/ALONG TD INT SACK
2007 289 192 66.4 2241 7.75 77 9 9 16
2008 380 251 66.1 3043 8.01 65 15 10 23
2009 583 396 67.9 4770 8.18 72 29 15 25
2010 574 365 63.6 4370 7.61 60 24 12 32

Arian Foster
2010 327 1616 4.9 74 16

Yes Schaub's numbers dropped in 2010, with Fosters help. Do you see him as average? Gaining on being an elite quarterback? Or nothing matters until playoff birth or Superbowl appearance?
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Old 03-16-2011   #2
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

Quote:
Originally Posted by TEXANJAK View Post
Matt Schaub
Year ATT COMP PCT YDS YDS/ALONG TD INT SACK
2007 289 192 66.4 2241 7.75 77 9 9 16
2008 380 251 66.1 3043 8.01 65 15 10 23
2009 583 396 67.9 4770 8.18 72 29 15 25
2010 574 365 63.6 4370 7.61 60 24 12 32

Arian Foster
2010 327 1616 4.9 74 16

Yes Schaub's numbers dropped in 2010, with Fosters help. Do you see him as average? Gaining on being an elite quarterback? Or nothing matters until playoff birth or Superbowl appearance?
I don't think he will ever be truly elite due to the following limitations:

athleticly limited so can not extend plays often
moderate NFL arm
slightly elongated delivery


There are, clearly 7 elite QBs in the NFL right now:
TBrady
ARodgers
Manning
Rivers
Big Ben
Drew Brees
and maybe Mike Vick


He belongs in the conversation regarding the next group of QBs. Also, he has shown to be consistent, and, related to the number of QB starts, is just entering his prime years... So, if healthy, he should continue to be a fringe probowl player if surrounded by qualtiy offensive talent for the forseeable future.
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Old 03-16-2011   #3
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

I don't think he'll ever be an Elite Quarterback in the talks of Tom Brady and Peyton Manning. But I do think he's a very efficient QB. Is able to play conservative when needed and is able to get down the field quickly when needed. I think he can easily be the QB of this team that takes us to the playoffs and ultimately the superbowl. But he's not an elite QB that can do it by himself. He's a huge reason why this offense clicks, I'm not worried about him and don't want to replace him.
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Old 03-16-2011   #4
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

He does not have to be elite and I think that word gets thrown around too much to be quite often. Shaub just has to win football games and with the right coach and players he would win the Superbowl JMO.
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Old 03-16-2011   #5
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

Quote:
Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
I don't think he will ever be truly elite due to the following limitations:

athleticly limited so can not extend plays often
moderate NFL arm
slightly elongated delivery


There are, clearly 7 elite QBs in the NFL right now:
TBrady
ARodgers
Manning
Rivers
Big Ben
Drew Brees
and maybe Mike Vick


He belongs in the conversation regarding the next group of QBs. Also, he has shown to be consistent, and, related to the number of QB starts, is just entering his prime years... So, if healthy, he should continue to be a fringe probowl player if surrounded by qualtiy offensive talent for the forseeable future.

How can you say there are currently 7 elite QBs. 21% of the starting QBs are elite? I don't buy it. There are currently TWO elite QBs. Manning and Brady. There are 2 or 3QB's who are in "elite discussion" but not all 4 of them get in. Brees, Rodgers and Big Ben. Rivers and Schaub are in the same category. They are in the next class below that group along with 4 or 5 other QBs that are close. Vick might enter a discussion but I'm not putting anyone in either discussion based on a few games. He's always been exciting and he's even won before. Has he really learned how to pass or do DCs just need a reminder of how to turn him into average.

Schaub may never be elite. I don't think you can put 20-30% of starting QBs in the league as "elite", I think that's limited to 5-10% at most and usually 1 or 2.

Marino lacked mobility for much of his career, montana didn't have a rocket of an arm. Schaub has the ability to extend plays better than most give him credit for and heck, Manning does ok as a statue. Time will tell but for all of his limitations Schaub is on a short list of QBs I would give something up to start a franchise with him.

Mike
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Old 03-16-2011   #6
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

Quote:
Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
I don't think he will ever be truly elite due to the following limitations:

athleticly limited so can not extend plays often
moderate NFL arm
slightly elongated delivery


There are, clearly 7 elite QBs in the NFL right now:
TBrady
ARodgers
Manning
Rivers
Big Ben
Drew Brees
and maybe Mike Vick


He belongs in the conversation regarding the next group of QBs. Also, he has shown to be consistent, and, related to the number of QB starts, is just entering his prime years... So, if healthy, he should continue to be a fringe probowl player if surrounded by qualtiy offensive talent for the forseeable future.
I completely agree with this assessment. I never understood all of the crap some people were saying about Schuab last season. I thought he played well considering who his coach is and what a horrible defense he had to work with. Put Schaub on a team where he's not constantly having to score and play from behind and I think Schaub's a lot more efficient and has less mistakes. It's extremely hard to find a QB that can be an elite and very hard to find a QB who can play at the level that schaub has proven he can. I'm fine with Schaub for now and I think he's got several good years left unless he has a bad injury.
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Old 03-16-2011   #7
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

I am not sure how many elite QB's in the NFL there really are everyone knows about Manning and Brady but the rest are really good too.
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Old 03-16-2011   #8
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

above average is what he is, still waiting on ten wins from him
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Old 03-16-2011   #9
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

I'm fine with Matt Schaub as QB.

That said, I don't think he is elite and I don't know exactly what to think of him as a player overall. He has been decent in the clutch...not great, not terrible...

He has physical limitations with both his mobility and his arm.
But overall Matt is efficient, he can get the offense moving downfield and he is pretty accurate.

There are certain games where he just scares me though...Against good defenses Matt sometimes just folds...

Then when the other team looks like they are running off with the game and we go into pass heavy mode and the opposing defense lays off a bit to protect the lead we start lighting them up through the air.

If I had to rate Matt I'd rate him as a 84-88 out of 100
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Old 03-16-2011   #10
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

Notice how Schaub got sacked more in 2010 than any other year, even with the improved running game. It just seemed like last year, Schaub never really had time to sit back in the pocket comfortably and throw.
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Old 03-16-2011   #11
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ole Miss Texan View Post
I don't think he'll ever be an Elite Quarterback in the talks of Tom Brady and Peyton Manning. But I do think he's a very efficient QB. Is able to play conservative when needed and is able to get down the field quickly when needed. I think he can easily be the QB of this team that takes us to the playoffs and ultimately the superbowl. But he's not an elite QB that can do it by himself. He's a huge reason why this offense clicks, I'm not worried about him and don't want to replace him.
I was going to comment on the OP but I read this.... no need for me to say anything. OMT summed it up nicely!
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Old 03-16-2011   #12
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

drafting Julio Jones would help Matt Schaub become a better QB
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Old 03-16-2011   #13
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
drafting Julio Jones would help Matt Schaub become a better QB
Yep, AJ. Julio, OD and Slaton, Whooeee!
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Old 03-16-2011   #14
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

My evaluation: The Texans aren't in need of a starting QB
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Old 03-16-2011   #15
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texanmike View Post
How can you say there are currently 7 elite QBs. 21% of the starting QBs are elite? I don't buy it. There are currently TWO elite QBs. Manning and Brady. There are 2 or 3QB's who are in "elite discussion" but not all 4 of them get in. Brees, Rodgers and Big Ben. Rivers and Schaub are in the same category. They are in the next class below that group along with 4 or 5 other QBs that are close. Vick might enter a discussion but I'm not putting anyone in either discussion based on a few games. He's always been exciting and he's even won before. Has he really learned how to pass or do DCs just need a reminder of how to turn him into average.

Schaub may never be elite. I don't think you can put 20-30% of starting QBs in the league as "elite", I think that's limited to 5-10% at most and usually 1 or 2.

Marino lacked mobility for much of his career, montana didn't have a rocket of an arm. Schaub has the ability to extend plays better than most give him credit for and heck, Manning does ok as a statue. Time will tell but for all of his limitations Schaub is on a short list of QBs I would give something up to start a franchise with him.

Mike
Mike, over the past two years, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning have not performed better than: A.Rodgers, P.Rivers, or Drew Brees... Roethlisburger and Vick are special athletes that do things nobody else can do... Would you prefer: "top tier"? From my perspective, I wouldn't put Vick in that group, but people that I respect do put him there after his season, so I included him as well. Regardless, those group of QBs play at a level, consistently, that is above any other QBs in the NFL.
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Old 03-16-2011   #16
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

Quote:
Originally Posted by CretorFrigg View Post
Notice how Schaub got sacked more in 2010 than any other year, even with the improved running game. It just seemed like last year, Schaub never really had time to sit back in the pocket comfortably and throw.
Others can speak better to this... but, my understanding is that when the offensive line gets its pre-snap splits, the splits are wider in the zone game than in other offenses. The downside of that is it creates more pass rushing opportunities. I would guess that the dominant run game led to more zone looks, even in the passing game, and that contributed to a few more sacks. Remember, in 2009, the run game was non-existent. So, I'm guess the o-line was more often setup pre-snap to maximize pass protection.
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Old 03-16-2011   #17
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

Any QB who throws for the 6th most yards in NFL history should be in the running. But only having 1 or 2 good seasons isn't enough to get there. And that's all Schaub has at this point.

I consider the Elite (first tier) guys to be: Brady and Manning.

The Sub-Elite (second tier) guys are: Brees, Rivers, and Rogers.

I consider Schaub a third tier QB. He's a guy that with more years and more success could move up into the Sub-Elite category but he doesn't have the body of work. He needs to continue to put up statistics but more importantly, he needs more team success to help propel him into that category. To get to Elite, he needs to put up 7+ 4000 yard season, appear in at least 1 Super Bowl, and lead his team to the playoffs at least 6-7 times.

I consider Vick, Roethlisburger and Eli Manning to be in that third tier as well.
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Old 03-16-2011   #18
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

For me, it's this simple: The Texans can win a Super Bowl with Matt Schaub at quarterback.
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Old 03-16-2011   #19
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

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To get to Elite, he needs to put up 7+ 4000 yard season, appear in at least 1 Super Bowl, and lead his team to the playoffs at least 6-7 times.
Have to pick a nit here. Brady only has 3 4000+ yard seasons. But overall I liked your analysis. Maybe a slight alteration to the above sentence of "or some similarly impressive combination thereof." Manning has plenty of 4000+ yard seasons and 1 ring while Brady has 3 of each.
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Old 03-16-2011   #20
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Default Re: Evaluating Matt Schaub

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
Any QB who throws for the 6th most yards in NFL history should be in the running. But only having 1 or 2 good seasons isn't enough to get there. And that's all Schaub has at this point.

I consider the Elite (first tier) guys to be: Brady and Manning.

The Sub-Elite (second tier) guys are: Brees, Rivers, and Rogers.

I consider Schaub a third tier QB. He's a guy that with more years and more success could move up into the Sub-Elite category but he doesn't have the body of work. He needs to continue to put up statistics but more importantly, he needs more team success to help propel him into that category. To get to Elite, he needs to put up 7+ 4000 yard season, appear in at least 1 Super Bowl, and lead his team to the playoffs at least 6-7 times.

I consider Vick, Roethlisburger and Eli Manning to be in that third tier as well.
That's an interesting way to look at it.

I'm not really a numbers guy, so I would probably disagree with some of your groupings.

I simply look at it like this: If I were starting a team today, which QB's would I take and in what order. Lots of things to consider beyond the numbers they have put up...

Like Manning could be an elite QB for most of his career, but when he reaches a certain age he may not be the same as he had been...Therefore I would no longer consider him an elite QB in the game at that time. All time great...sure...
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