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Old 04-10-2011   #81
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Default Re: Cam Newton

Once again, I do not endorse anybody as a number one draft pick 'cause I don't have all the resources to learn enough about the players.

But these points, I want to make:

1. Newton made a lot more multi-read decisions than Gabbert. This I can guarantee because I did pay attention to each of their passes in at least 8 games that I watched from them. I saw Newton made 3-reads often, gabbert, rarely. I have not seen Gabbert made 4 or 5 reads, something that Newton did at least a half dozen times.

2. The Panthers have some good looking young receivers:
Gettys from Baylor is 6'3 with 4.43 speed
Brandon lafell (LSU) doesn't have the speed, but I saw him being very solid and steady in college. Armanti Edwards , once he gets used to the new position can be a dangerous threat .
Mike Goodson has excellent speed out of the backfield.
I don't know much about their TE; but with that solid core of young receivers (in addition to Steve Smith), the Panthers can be very productive with a good QB in tow.
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Old 04-10-2011   #82
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Default Re: Cam Newton

I don't think Blaine Gabbert would be a good pick #1 overall either. But that doesn't really change my opinion about how ready I think Cameron Newton is for the NFL. Every year just about we see a QB who is a great scrambler, has a questionable throwing game, and is over-hyped beyond belief because his whole team around him was also fairly talented.

Nothing on the Panthers looked anything close to good last year. Armanti Edwards was a joke of a pick that cost them their 2nd this year, and Lafell has yet to do anything either. That team is going to get beat up on by the Bucs, Falcons, and Saints for probably a few years if not more. There is no way in the world if I were the panthers that I would not take Patrick Peterson (Or Marcel Dareus) over Cameron Newton and just hope that I get close enough to trade up for Luck next year. If they have to have a QB, I think they'll probably end up with similar results no matter who they take be it Newton, Gabbert, or random QB #3 (Mallett, Locker, Ponder, Kapaernick).

I have read an article out of the Charlotte Observer talking about trading with Washington so that the 'Skins can draft Newton. That, I think, would be the best case scenario for the Panthers and I have no idea how that would end up for Newton but the first word that pops into my mind is "bad".
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Old 04-20-2011   #83
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Default Re: Cam Newton

Red flag in the interview with Chuckie when Cam was unable to give an example of an Auburn play call ..... that can be an issue, imo.
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Old 04-21-2011   #84
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Default Re: Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by asleep View Post
Red flag in the interview with Chuckie when Cam was unable to give an example of an Auburn play call ..... that can be an issue, imo.
What happened!? Gabbert is apparently making some front offices drool with his mind... he might be a Jedi. NFL places a premium on a QBs ability to remember plays and Gabbert has been impressing teams with his memory of Mizzou plays as well as pro-style plays teams are testing him with.

This draft is so interesting. Will Newton or will Gabbert go #1 overall!!??
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Old 04-21-2011   #85
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Default Re: Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by Ole Miss Texan View Post
What happened!? Gabbert is apparently making some front offices drool with his mind... he might be a Jedi. NFL places a premium on a QBs ability to remember plays and Gabbert has been impressing teams with his memory of Mizzou plays as well as pro-style plays teams are testing him with.

This draft is so interesting. Will Newton or will Gabbert go #1 overall!!??
Gruden gave Newton an example of a NFL play, with 10 words or so. He asked Newton what kind of terminology they used at Auburn and Cam was speechless.

Eventually he said they didn't call plays. They just looked to the sideline because they would hold up signs with numbers on them. The numbers are the play calls. If a sign says 36, that's the name of the play.

Then Gruden asks, "Do you think they do that in the NFL?"
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Old 04-21-2011   #86
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Default Re: Cam Newton

Quote:
Originally Posted by bah007 View Post
Gruden gave Newton an example of a NFL play, with 10 words or so. He asked Newton what kind of terminology they used at Auburn and Cam was speechless.

Eventually he said they didn't call plays. They just looked to the sideline because they would hold up signs with numbers on them. The numbers are the play calls. If a sign says 36, that's the name of the play.

Then Gruden asks, "Do you think they do that in the NFL?"
That part was sort of funny actually. Yeah, Newton seemed way out of his element when he was asked that.
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Old 04-21-2011   #87
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Default Re: Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by Texecutioner View Post
That part was sort of funny actually. Yeah, Newton seemed way out of his element when he was asked that.
I thought it was funny. And it's a perfect example of why I think Cam will be a bust in the NFL. He has the ability, nobody doubts that. But imo, he does not have the head to be a NFL QB.
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Old 04-21-2011   #88
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Default Re: Cam Newton

Jon Gruden conducted a series for ESPN where he interviews each QB in this draft and puts them through a workout (separately).
It's an interesting series; I learned a lot from it.

Gruden had done his homework beforehand and he always tries to put the QBs in a spot at some point in the interview. The guy is really tricky, I'll tell ya'.

Remember that Gruden called Newton the best player in the country after this interview/workout.

I think people put too much into this, as usual.

Here's part of the interview:

http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/cam-ne...-gruden-video/

And here are some interesting reads concerning play callings, methods, and signals:

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_293445.html

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/footbal...n=ncaaf-193416

http://www.thestate.com/2011/03/31/1...y-calling.html
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Old 04-21-2011   #89
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Default Re: Cam Newton

I found it most disturbing how he froze up -- cognitive/decision-making problems?

Secondly, think about it: You're a first round QB prospect who is about to sit across the table from Chuckie(!) on national television -- you know it'll be a chalkboard session -- and you show up apparently unprepared?

May be nit-picky, but ... MLB pitchers can recount games pitch-by-pitch; PGA Tour pros recount rounds shot-distance-result; NBA players can bore you with play-by-play recollections -- and I'm talking about years old games, tournaments. (Ask Nicklaus about 1986 Masters and he'll give you every single shot.)

For a first pick & "$50 million" that would give me pause.
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Old 04-21-2011   #90
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Default Re: Cam Newton

I love those bits with Chuckie.

He is great on TV. I really don't want him to get a coaching gig because I like him on TV too much.
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Old 04-21-2011   #91
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Default Re: Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by bah007 View Post
I thought it was funny. And it's a perfect example of why I think Cam will be a bust in the NFL. He has the ability, nobody doubts that. But imo, he does not have the head to be a NFL QB.
I don't think he has the ability either. He has the athleticism to be a running QB, but not a great passer.
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Old 04-21-2011   #92
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Default Re: Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by kiwitexansfan View Post
I love those bits with Chuckie.

He is great on TV. I really don't want him to get a coaching gig because I like him on TV too much.
I hear ya'.
He's a little wacko sometimes, but overall, he's good for TV!
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Old 04-21-2011   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asleep View Post
I found it most disturbing how he froze up -- cognitive/decision-making problems?

Secondly, think about it: You're a first round QB prospect who is about to sit across the table from Chuckie(!) on national television -- you know it'll be a chalkboard session -- and you show up apparently unprepared?

May be nit-picky, but ... MLB pitchers can recount games pitch-by-pitch; PGA Tour pros recount rounds shot-distance-result; NBA players can bore you with play-by-play recollections -- and I'm talking about years old games, tournaments. (Ask Nicklaus about 1986 Masters and he'll give you every single shot.)

For a first pick & "$50 million" that would give me pause.
Let's compare two QBs a little bit here:

On the one hand, you have Gabbert who ran a pure spread offense at Mizzou.
He either was in one back shotgun set or no back spread.
He had no TE. The guy who was listed as TE only had the title; he lined up as a receiver.
He doesn't know what kind of routes a TE in the NFL run.
He doesn't know how to utilize a FB or an H-back in the passing game because he never played with one.
With 4 or 5 receivers, there are only so many formations you can line up in and only so many plays you can run.

On the other hand, you have Newton who saw action under Center about 3.5 times a game (remember you have to practice). He's seen the play action fake, the roll out off the two-back set.
Even when he's in the shotgun, he played with 2 backs or 3 backs in the backfield; something you don't even see in the NFL.
Imagine how many different formations he had to get comfortable with.
Out of each formation, they can run a bunch of plays, with variations and options.
His playbook can be at least 2 times as thick as Gabbert's and thicker than quite a few NFL QBs, probably thicker than most (if not all).
A guy has to have football intelligence to be able to digest such a system.
On top of that, the Tigers ran a lot of up-tempo or no huddle.
The QB has to be smart to be able to run a series of play with very little communication from the side line.

It is totally illogical to think that he doesn't have a brain between his ears when he was able to perform all those tasks at a very high level.

This is a guy who can make all the throws (to RB, FB, H-back, TE, WR) in game situation. It takes more than a good passer to do that.
His brain has got to function at a high level to shift gears between so many different personnel groupings/formations like that.
To think otherwise is totally illogical.
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Old 04-21-2011   #94
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Default Re: Cam Newton

Tennessee coach Lane Kiffin quoted his colorful dad/defensive coordinator, Monte, that defending Malzahn's offense was "like trying to read a book with someone waving their hand in front of the book -- trying to look at it, what's going on, but you can't really see it.

......

Now, does that sound like an offense that a QB with no brain can run?
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Old 04-22-2011   #95
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Default Re: Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Now, does that sound like an offense that a QB with no brain can run?
It sounds like a gimmick offense that doesn't translate to the NFL. Not that Newton is alone in that regard. Most of the college QBs coming into the league have to make the adjustments to NFL style offenses. It's a process, and has as more to do with the coaching the young QB will receive in the NFL than anything.

Newton needs a good QB coach on whatever team he lands with. The Panthers QB coach, Mike Shula, transitioned David Garrard from a running QB to a drop back passer. The Bills hired an ex-CFL coach, George Cortez, as their QB coach. That tells me that the Bills will be more gimmicky than last year, and either Newton or Gabbert (or Kaepernick in round 2) would be good fits.
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Old 04-24-2011   #96
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Default Re: Cam Newton

Quote:
Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Tennessee coach Lane Kiffin quoted his colorful dad/defensive coordinator, Monte, that defending Malzahn's offense was "like trying to read a book with someone waving their hand in front of the book -- trying to look at it, what's going on, but you can't really see it.

......

Now, does that sound like an offense that a QB with no brain can run?
To me it looks and sounds like an offense that you can run by flying by the seat of your pants, and while you can't say for sure that this will cause him to bustola in the NFL it's obviously one of those "red flags" that you go and research later on to see whether it's malarky or if you might have a serious issue on your hands when he gets to training camp.

To be fair, I don't really like any of the guys in this QB class it's not really just Newton. There is no "guy" or "guys". You don't have a couple of players head and shoulders above the rest of the class. While Newton and Gabbert are both considered to be the best of the bunch I don't think either one of those guys are far enough ahead of Mallet/Locker/Ponder to think that they are just going to be great right out of the box. It kind of reminds me of the '07 draft where you had 2 guys with obvious flaws but some decent talent followed by a bunch of ho-hum prospects (of which Kevin Kolb seems to be doing the best). If I were a team that was badly in need of a QB I would try to pick up one of those guys in the 2nd and hope that I could land a VY in free agency if I needed somebody who could start immediately. In no way would I not have serious reservations about making any of these guys a top 5 or top 10 pick, I would almost rather win the Andrew Luck sweepstakes and have a whole offseason to work with my new toy.
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Old 04-24-2011   #97
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Default Re: Cam Newton

[quote=b0ng;1683731To be fair, I don't really like any of the guys in this QB class it's not really just Newton. There is no "guy" or "guys". You don't have a couple of players head and shoulders above the rest of the class. [/QUOTE]

It is a really bad QB class and yet the projections are for 6 to go first round.

Newton, Gabbert, Locker, Mallet, Ponder and Dalton.

I genuinely think that none of them are genuine first rounders, in that none of them are worthy to get a starting job or close to it as rookies. If I HAD to start one I would probably pick Dalton.

If they all mature into their full potential, I think Mallet might be the best but that is a BIG BIG if for him.

I am also on record as thinking Newton will have NFL success, Dalton will win a lot of games in time and Gabbert will be a HUGE bust.
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Old 04-24-2011   #98
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Default Re: Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by kiwitexansfan View Post
It is a really bad QB class and yet the projections are for 6 to go first round.

Newton, Gabbert, Locker, Mallet, Ponder and Dalton.

I genuinely think that none of them are genuine first rounders, in that none of them are worthy to get a starting job or close to it as rookies. If I HAD to start one I would probably pick Dalton.

If they all mature into their full potential, I think Mallet might be the best but that is a BIG BIG if for him.

I am also on record as thinking Newton will have NFL success, Dalton will win a lot of games in time and Gabbert will be a HUGE bust.
I honestly believe that if you were looking for a QB that could start in 1 or 2 years Dalton, CK, Ponder and probably Locker all make for decent round 2-3 guys and would probably be OK if they got decent coaching and time to learn. 6 of these guys actually going in the first round would make me think that GM's are operating under the presumption that rookie wages are going to be a fraction of what they have been in the previous years and it won't cost as much to grab a guy in the first and let him sit for a few years before seeing him take over at the position. I mean even in what was considered a QB rich draft like 2004 only 4 went in the first round which makes 6 going in the first year seem ridiculous.
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Old 04-24-2011   #99
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Default Re: Cam Newton

I believe the theory is that with no FA and trades, GMs can't assume they can get Kolb or McNabb or Palmer and will reach to get a warm body at QB.
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Old 04-25-2011   #100
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Default Re: Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by bah007 View Post
I thought it was funny. And it's a perfect example of why I think Cam will be a bust in the NFL. He has the ability, nobody doubts that. But imo, he does not have the head to be a NFL QB.
Ive had the same thoughts for awhile. The spot with Gruden just enforces it. Cam got by on his athleticism. He doesn't even know play terminology. 36 is a play? Give me a break. Cam doesn't have the capacity to learn what every player is doing on every play and Gus Malzahn is forced to dumb it down.

I think Gabbert and Mallet did a great job. I feel like the Fins will draft him. Gabbert should go top 5 and someone will reach for Cam top 5.

But hey, at least Cam was the best dressed. On Dez Bryantesqe pre-draft credit I am sure.
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