Let's Talk About the ATL Falcons

[eriadoc]

Starting lineups:

QB: Ryan (drafted in 1st rd. '08)
WR: White (drft 1st rd. '05), Jenkins (drft 1st rd. '04)
RB: Turner (FA '08)
FB: Mughelli (FA '07)
LT: Baker (drft 1st rd. '08)
LG: Blalock (drft 2nd rd. '07)
C: McClure (drft. 7th rd. '99)
RG: Dahl (FA '07)
RT: Clabo (FA '06)
TE: Gonzales (trade '09)

DE: Abraham (trade '06), Biermann (drft 5th rd. '08)
DT: Peters (drft 3rd rd. '10), Babineaux (drft 2nd rd. '05)
OLB: Weatherspoon (drft 1st rd. '10), Peterson (FA '08)
MLB: Lofton (drft 2nd rd. '08)
CB: Robinson (FA '10), Grimes (FA '07)
SS: Moore (drft 2nd rd. '09)
FS: DeCoud (drft 3rd rd. '08)

Compare and contrast to our team.

[beerlover]

I've considered them the Texans best comp going back to 06. I think the combination of Mike Smith & Thomas Dimitroff have fared better than Rick Smith & Gary Kubiak.

[houstonspartan]

I mean, what is there to talk about, really?

The only relevant fact is that they hired their coach in 2008, yes, 2008, and yet they are being talked about as serious Super Bowl contenders.

Two years.

[DexmanC]

Originally Posted by houstonspartan

I mean, what is there to talk about, really?

The only relevant fact is that they hired their coach in 2008, yes, 2008, and yet they are being talked about as serious Super Bowl contenders.

Two years.

According to the TK's model, 2008 was a fluke when they won the
division, and they are just lucky. It takes 5+ years to build a team
capable of making the postseason.

[Blake]

They are as talented as the Texans. Only difference is that their coaches do a better job of putting them in position to win. End of story.

[Rey]

Originally Posted by eriadoc

Starting lineups:

QB: Ryan (drafted in 1st rd. '08)
WR: White (drft 1st rd. '05), Jenkins (drft 1st rd. '04)
RB: Turner (FA '08)
FB: Mughelli (FA '07)
LT: Baker (drft 1st rd. '08)
LG: Blalock (drft 2nd rd. '07)
C: McClure (drft. 7th rd. '99)
RG: Dahl (FA '07)
RT: Clabo (FA '06)
TE: Gonzales (trade '09)

DE: Abraham (trade '06), Biermann (drft 5th rd. '08)
DT: Peters (drft 3rd rd. '10), Babineaux (drft 2nd rd. '05)
OLB: Weatherspoon (drft 1st rd. '10), Peterson (FA '08)
MLB: Lofton (drft 2nd rd. '08)
CB: Robinson (FA '10), Grimes (FA '07)
SS: Moore (drft 2nd rd. '09)
FS: DeCoud (drft 3rd rd. '08)

Compare and contrast to our team.

The thing that stands out to me the most is that it appears that they have been more aggressive in acquiring big time talent.

I say that because of the key players they brought in via trade (Gonzalez and Abraham) and also some of the key players that they acquired in Free Agency.

Also, it looks like they have a bit more experienced players than us.


But there are lots of differences as I'm sure that there are many differences between every NFL team. There are vast differences in how the two super bowl teams from last year were assembled from the top down.

No disrespect, but what is the purpose of this exercise? Serious question...

[houstonspartan]

Originally Posted by DexmanC

According to the TK's model, 2008 was a fluke when they won the
division, and they are just lucky. It takes 5+ years to build a team
capable of making the postseason.

Yeah, well, TK also thinks that Rod Marinelli should have kept his job after going 0-16. That says all you need to know about his "theories."

And let's not forget that the Falcons were a total diaster: Mike Vick, dog scandals, no decent qb, a coach quitting on them, little talent...that team was a MESS.

And now, they're being talked about as a potential Super Bowl team.

In two years.

[eriadoc]

Originally Posted by Rey

No disrespect, but what is the purpose of this exercise? Serious question...

I'm just genuinely curious what people's thoughts were on the subject, given the state of the Falcons when the Vick thing went down, their acquisition of the Texans' 2nd round picks in '07 and '08, how quickly they appear to have built a serious contender, and a comparison of talent vs. draft position for the two teams. Oh, and what kind of player turnover they've had.

[Rey]

Originally Posted by eriadoc

I'm just genuinely curious what people's thoughts were on the subject, given the state of the Falcons when the Vick thing went down, their acquisition of the Texans' 2nd round picks in '07 and '08, how quickly they appear to have built a serious contender, and a comparison of talent vs. draft position for the two teams. Oh, and what kind of player turnover they've had.

Ok...Yeah that's what I figured..


It does seem that they gotten better faster, hit on more FA acquisitions, been more aggressive in acquiring talent and probably have helped more players progress their skills than we have...

So yeah...I guess those little things would be the main differences between the franchises...

[Goatcheese]

It's not like the Falcons were rebuilding from nothing. They had 1 horrible year of Petreno following the Vick indecent. They were a middle of the pack team before that. All they needed to get back to .500 was a quality QB.

As for the differences, how about:

WR
Johnson - hurt
White - not hurt

DE
Williams - hurt
Abraham - not hurt

Ryans - hurt(IR)
Lofton - not hurt

TE
Daniels - hurt
Gonzalez - not hurt

LT
Brown - suspended 4 games
Baker - not suspended 4 games

and so on...

All of those make up a difference of 2.5 wins.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by DexmanC

According to the TK's model, 2008 was a fluke when they won the
division, and they are just lucky. It takes 5+ years to build a team
capable of making the postseason.

Really? Is that what I've said?

[Rey]

Originally Posted by Goatcheese

It's not like the Falcons were rebuilding from nothing. They had 1 horrible year of Petreno following the Vick indecent. They were a middle of the pack team before that. All they needed to get back to .500 was a quality QB.

As for the differences, how about:

WR
Johnson - hurt
White - not hurt

DE
Williams - hurt
Abraham - not hurt

Ryans - hurt(IR)
Lofton - not hurt

TE
Daniels - hurt
Gonzalez - not hurt

LT
Brown - suspended 4 games
Baker - not suspended 4 games

and so on...

All of those make up a difference of 2.5 wins.

Andre has gotten hurt a lot in the past few seasons. Far as I can tell Mario has been hurt since he's gotten here...He always has some nagging injury...

That said, I'm pretty sure they have had their own injury issues to deal with just like every NFL team...

[playa465]

Originally Posted by houstonspartan

I mean, what is there to talk about, really?

The only relevant fact is that they hired their coach in 2008, yes, 2008, and yet they are being talked about as serious Super Bowl contenders.

Two years.

What is this? Hell even up to 2 weeks ago the Cowgurls were still talked about as having a chance. Back to the Falcons, they have had more talent on their team going all the way back to 2005. Plus they have always hovered around .500 or better except for the year of Harrington. They also had 2 coaching changes since then and now it seems they have the right coach. It can be argued that now we can match them for talent so the only other tangible thing besides injuries is coaching.

[Texecutioner]

Originally Posted by Goatcheese

It's not like the Falcons were rebuilding from nothing.

If you think that, then you've pretty delusional to the state of what the Falcons franchise was before their new HC came in. They were terrible. The only decent thing they had on offense was Roddy White and at that time Roddy White had only one good season to where they didn't know how he'd play the next season. The rest of that team was in total disarray and a ton of those players wanted out of there.

Originally Posted by Goatcheese

They had 1 horrible year of Petreno following the Vick indecent. They were a middle of the pack team before that. All they needed to get back to .500 was a quality QB.

As for the differences, how about:

WR
Johnson - hurt
White - not hurt

DE
Williams - hurt
Abraham - not hurt

Ryans - hurt(IR)
Lofton - not hurt

TE
Daniels - hurt
Gonzalez - not hurt

LT
Brown - suspended 4 games
Baker - not suspended 4 games

and so on...

All of those make up a difference of 2.5 wins.

The rest of this is just a spin to make it seem like the Texans haven't under achieved as much as they have.

[Texecutioner]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

Really? Is that what I've said?

Pretty much. And you also did say the Rod Marinelli thing which =

[eriadoc]

Originally Posted by Goatcheese

It's not like the Falcons were rebuilding from nothing. They had 1 horrible year of Petreno following the Vick indecent. They were a middle of the pack team before that. All they needed to get back to .500 was a quality QB.

Really? Because if all they needed was a quality QB, why did they bother to change out most of their roster? There are a few, but not too many players that were around before '06.

[Mailman]

Sorry to interject and derail the direction this topic has taken, but I'm curious as to the consensus of the controversial Roddy White TD last night.

Legit or offensive PI? I thought it was borderline legit myself. The defender flopped like Brandon Flowers imo.

[beerlover]

Originally Posted by Rey

The thing that stands out to me the most is that it appears that they have been more aggressive in acquiring big time talent.

I say that because of the key players they brought in via trade (Gonzalez and Abraham) and also some of the key players that they acquired in Free Agency.

Also, it looks like they have a bit more experienced players than us.


But there are lots of differences as I'm sure that there are many differences between every NFL team. There are vast differences in how the two super bowl teams from last year were assembled from the top down.

No disrespect, but what is the purpose of this exercise? Serious question...

back to my statement they have a similar tandem of GM & HC yet have out performed they're Texan counterpoints to date, so question is why? what adjustements if any need to be made to match the model organization we were sold in the beginning.

[Goatcheese]

Originally Posted by eriadoc

Really? Because if all they needed was a quality QB, why did they bother to change out most of their roster? There are a few, but not too many players that were around before '06.

Welcome to the NFL. It's fairly uncommon for teams to go 4+ seasons without a lot of turnover. Players get old and retire or are cut. They get signed by other teams or traded. They suck and get bounced out of the league or end up a backup on some other team.

What is the average NFL career? Three years?

Each team has a staple of 10-15 'name' players and a few backups who hang around for a long time as the foundation of the franchise. Beyond that guys move around a lot.

[steelbtexan]

Their organization from the owner down is better than the Texans organization.

They are willing to sign FA's and take chances the Texans will not take.

These organizations mirror their owners.