Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQDonate Automatic Monthly Contribution Members List Mark Forums Read


Texans Talk Football talk only please. Keep it to the game, the players, the coaches and management.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-17-2005   #21
PapaL
Loose Screw
 
PapaL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Maryland
Age: 34
Posts: 12,004
Rep Power: 133685 PapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus
he said "in our style, we want the down linemen to tie up the offensive line, and we want the linebackers the find the ball and cover. Not just the ones on the edge, all four of them". He added, "in other styles, you might have the front 3 making a more direct input, but in ours, the linebackers will find the ball and cover".

My translation: They are fat dumb, and happy with the defensive line, but they are NOT happy with the linebacker play. And it fits perfectly with the moves that are being made this offseason.
Normally don't post just read, but I find those statements strange. Gary Walker - over $7M the next 2 years, Seth Payne - over $8M the next 2 years, Robaire Smith - $7M, seems like a lot of money for 3 guys to "tie" up the O-Line. For $22M I think they could have gotten over a tons worth of guys to "tie" up the line. Not bashing anyone, Love my Texans, but something isn't right about those statements.
PapaL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #22
nunusguy
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Houston
Posts: 8,991
Rep Power: 185 nunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

"in our style, we want the down linemen to tie up the offensive line, and we want the linebackers the find the ball and cover. Not just the ones on the edge, all four of them". He added, "in other styles, you might have the front 3 making a more direct input, but in ours, the linebackers will find the ball and cover".
**********************************
This is not even a slight deviation from what I've heard and read the standard
strategy of the 3-4 to be: large, bulky, strong "tackle type" lineman who tie up interference and quick, fast LBs who pursue and tackle from sideline to sideline. So I guess I'm confused by what he means by "other styles" vs. "ours".
nunusguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #23
PapaL
Loose Screw
 
PapaL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Maryland
Age: 34
Posts: 12,004
Rep Power: 133685 PapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

I think he means that in other 3-4's they expect the dl to make plays and in ours they're just a buffer so that the LB's can make the plays. Thats how I read it.
PapaL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #24
TheOgre
Hall of Fame
 
TheOgre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Back in the cellar again
Posts: 3,739
Rep Power: 17 TheOgre was voted MVPTheOgre was voted MVPTheOgre was voted MVPTheOgre was voted MVP
Default

Look at a guy like Richard Seymour for the Patriots is involved in more plays (than Texan linemen). Look at his stats:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/player...s?statsId=5453

Aaron Smith for the Steelers gets more involved as well:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/player...s?statsId=4759
TheOgre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #25
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,845
Rep Power: 161784 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOgre
Look at a guy like Richard Seymour for the Patriots is involved in more plays (than Texan linemen). Look at his stats:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/player...s?statsId=5453

Aaron Smith for the Steelers gets more involved as well:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/player...s?statsId=4759
Also, if you look at Tedy Bruschi and Ted Johnson (Patriot inside linebackers) you will not see the huge tackle totals that Sharper and Foreman have. We funnel more of our tackles to the inside guys than they do.
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #26
ledzeppelin229
Hall of Fame
 
ledzeppelin229's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Spring / San Marcos, TX
Age: 29
Posts: 6,829
Rep Power: 712 ledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respectedledzeppelin229 is a quality contributor and well respected
Send a message via AIM to ledzeppelin229
Default

Looking at our system, ideally wouldn't we have multiple NT two-gap guys? The more they can tie up the better. I think Smith would fit that description but I'm not sure Walker really fits it completely. But if he makes up for it in production (see 2002, 6.5 sacks) then I guess he still works.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thorn
godzmn young fomkss are slow. they can all kissmy ass.

ledzeppelin229 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #27
PapaL
Loose Screw
 
PapaL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Maryland
Age: 34
Posts: 12,004
Rep Power: 133685 PapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respectedPapaL is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Ballpark stats:
Seymour and Smith avergae about 50 total tkls a year. Last year our starting front 3, injuries aside, Walker 30, Payne 51, Smith 52. Seems like one of these 3 that played the vast majority of the year isn't up to par.
PapaL is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
Old 03-17-2005   #28
beerlover
Site Contributor
 
beerlover's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 12,445
Rep Power: 56780 beerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respectedbeerlover is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

great pick-up Marcus

these are the little tid bits of information that perhaps tip the Texans cap in one way or another, although reading too much into these things is probably unwise. having said that-

the d-line is set (will use maybe a 3rd round pick to develop)

offensive line LT & LG set (also RT set with Wade) all other positions open for discussion.

TE Bennie Joppru hopefull of being set

QB set

RB position, we all know Ronnie Brown will be long gone by the time the Texans pick, so it comes down to Cedric & Cadillac. my preference would be towards Cadillac (love his total game & attitiude) since he is similar to Dominack Davis in style, just quicker & more of a long yardage threat. but what is the one knock of Dominack? Durability. the fact that Casserly said Cedric Benson is a durable, workhorse like back leads me to believe that if available @ #13 the Texans might select Benson as the future franchise RB of the Texans.

oh yeah and the LB projected thing was great, meaning that a lot of teams will be doing just that projecting DE's to play OLB's, Merriman for example who plays in a 3-4 @ Maryland. I'd almost bet money on that 2nd pick actually being a 3-4 OLB who does not project but actually plays OLB in a 3-4 system at Virginia, named Darryl Blackstock. find the ball & cover

Last edited by beerlover; 03-17-2005 at 12:56 PM.
beerlover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #29
nunusguy
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Houston
Posts: 8,991
Rep Power: 185 nunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respectednunusguy is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOgre
Look at a guy like Richard Seymour for the Patriots is involved in more plays (than Texan linemen). Look at his stats:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/player...s?statsId=5453
Aaron Smith for the Steelers gets more involved as well:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/player...s?statsId=4759
I'd be inclined to think that the guys on the other teams had more impressive
stats because they were better players than our lineman, rather than it being
a matter of the design of one 3-4 vs. any kind of variation of that design with another team.
nunusguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #30
fball
Rookie
 
fball's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Pearland
Age: 37
Posts: 62
Rep Power: 11 fball is ridin' the pine
Default

One thing I don't understand is why are we always focusing on getting linebackers in the draft every year, if we keep this up we will have a logjam at this position and have alot of unhappy players, I would like them to focus on other positions that we may need.
fball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #31
F-minus67
Hall of Fame
 
F-minus67's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Middletown,CT
Age: 28
Posts: 1,070
Rep Power: 12 F-minus67 is ridin' the pine
Default

I think that the team goes after LBs since our passrush is so weak, in the history of this team no one player has ever had over 8 sacks. Not to mention the LBs are the lifeblood of the 3-4 defense.
__________________
"Democracy is not for the people." - Judge Dredd
F-minus67 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #32
D-ReK
RAWWWRR!
 
D-ReK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Avalon
Age: 29
Posts: 3,406
Rep Power: 685 D-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respectedD-ReK is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

You can expect us to take at least one LB project every year...If you look at the draft histories of prominant 3-4 teams (Steelers, Patriots, Ravens), they all take at least one tweener every year, because without a pass rush, the 3-4 is a futile defense...
__________________
Smoke 'em if you got 'em...
D-ReK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #33
ArlingtonTexan
Moderator
 
ArlingtonTexan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Age: 47
Posts: 6,041
Rep Power: 73193 ArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respectedArlingtonTexan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nunusguy
I'd be inclined to think that the guys on the other teams had more impressive
stats because they were better players than our lineman, rather than it being
a matter of the design of one 3-4 vs. any kind of variation of that design with another team.
I have thought the same thing too about the talent of our lineman, but there is probably a little more to that then we (well maybe just I) want to admit. The Texans ILB have consistently had higher tackle totals than othe 3-4 for based teams, while the DLman have consistently had lower sack and tackle totals.

Casserly saying that there are multiple way to running the 3-4 is no different than his saying all team don't run the same plays out of a three WR set. We would never question that assumpton. I think we have only been hearing the Texans version of how to run a 3-4 not the whole story.
ArlingtonTexan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #34
Sarg01
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Age: 38
Posts: 1,152
Rep Power: 13 Sarg01 is a Pro BowlerSarg01 is a Pro Bowler
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fball
One thing I don't understand is why are we always focusing on getting linebackers in the draft every year, if we keep this up we will have a logjam at this position and have alot of unhappy players, I would like them to focus on other positions that we may need.
Both Sharper and Wong are in FA after this year - assuming they make it to the end of the season without being traded. They both have big cap numbers (6.1 and 4.4 mil respectively) and neither is a spring chicken. If you look at our LB core without these two players you have Babin, Peek and Greenwood starting - and who's the 4th? Polk? Anderson? Cheatwood?

Picking a LB that can starter-calibre by the end of the season, especially an ILB, makes a huge amount of sense. Even a depth LB wouldn't be too surprising, since the only guy behind our starters (assuming Sharper or Wong is gone) who has had enough time to prove himself is Polk.
Sarg01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #35
Meloy
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,834
Rep Power: 14 Meloy was voted MVPMeloy was voted MVPMeloy was voted MVP
Default

I don't know how DD would react to having Benson sharing carries but I think mixing the two would be good. Both would be fairly fresh in 4th quarter and that's when we need some 1st downs. I would like a DT or DJ @ 13 but prob not available so I could agree with Benson. WR? depends on who is there. I'm still not sold on Hollings or Wells. Hope I'm going to be convinced because I think both will be on team.
Meloy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #36
Grid
Hall of Fame
 
Grid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 4,299
Rep Power: 2272 Grid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respectedGrid is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

I would jump on benson or brown if they fell to us.. though Cadillac kinda worries me with his size.

DJ is a no brainer.. if he is available at 13 he overrides everything else. we will take him immediatly... Tagliabue might was well not sit down after announcing the 12th pick.


I like that we are looking at LBs though. DAVID POLLACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Pollack is, in my mind.. the #2 LB in the draft (behind DJ). Merriman is a great physical specimen.. but Pollack has all the intangibles. Pollack could come in and make an immediate impact.
Grid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005   #37
southtexan
Veteran
 
southtexan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Age: 53
Posts: 172
Rep Power: 11 southtexan is ridin' the pine
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny
Thanks Marcus. Sums up much of the drivel I have been spewing lately Perhaps people will start believing me about my Joppru comments now.
what's your opinion on Joppru? I really don't know anything about Joppru.

thanx
southtexan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2005   #38
scourge 
Digression King
 
scourge's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: The Liveable Forest
Age: 37
Posts: 1,734
Rep Power: 3215 scourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respectedscourge is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

While I think that Brown is the best back overall in the draft, I feel that Benson would be the back that Capers is looking for. But if any of the 3 were available I'd actually prefer us to trade down for a lower 1st and preferrably a 2nd. I think this draft will have plenty of people we could use in the 2nd, maybe even a high 2nd if we throw in one of our later rounds in the trade. Between Arrington, Fason, or Shelton there should be at least one available in the 2nd for us if we are looking for a rb...

scourge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2005   #39
BornOrange
All Pro
 
Join Date: May 2004
Age: 45
Posts: 556
Rep Power: 15 BornOrange was voted MVPBornOrange was voted MVPBornOrange was voted MVPBornOrange was voted MVPBornOrange was voted MVP
Default

Although I am a Longhorn fan, I hope the Texans don't take Benson if he falls to 13. I don't think he is worth a first round pick. He was a great college back, and maybe the best high school running back EVER, but I don't think he is going to do as well in the NFL as everyone is expecting.
BornOrange is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2005   #40
Texan in Japan
All Pro
 
Texan in Japan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 523
Rep Power: 7197 Texan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan in Japan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BornOrange
Although I am a Longhorn fan, I hope the Texans don't take Benson if he falls to 13. I don't think he is worth a first round pick. He was a great college back, and maybe the best high school running back EVER, but I don't think he is going to do as well in the NFL as everyone is expecting.
Wow! A Texas fan down on Benson. I'm just a tad worried about all of that mileage he's got on his body. He's certainly durable. I can't really pin-point why, but I have to agree he MAY not be an all-star pro player.
Texan in Japan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:57 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ad Management by RedTyger