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Old 03-10-2005   #301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTim5125
he said he would restructure i say we keep him
It almost surely isn't that simple.
His idea of restructuring may be way out of line with his actual value to the team. He may be looking for a lot longer contract than the team thinks reasonable and may also want guaranteed money which is a step in the direction of cap hell...
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Old 03-10-2005   #302
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bckey
How about the outside? Surely you aren't implying that Sharper was the weakest link of the 4 starters.
I don't know how you figure I am implying that. Right now the only two sure starters are Babin and Greenwood. Everything else is up in the air. I've already stated before this trade was announced that I thought Sharper's play wasn't as good as his previous years and he may be in decline. They may feel he is not worth what he is asking and just want to get younger and faster at this position. It's not like our linebackers have made game changing plays very often here in the first three years. Seems to me the Texans feel that this group has gotten as good as it is going to get and they may not feel like that is good enough.
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Old 03-10-2005   #303
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I personally think so much instability cannot be the best way to address our LB issues.
I mostly agree with you, but Capers' 3-4 has always been about speed and athleticism, two things that are largely adressed with this kind of re-vamp of the LBs.
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Old 03-10-2005   #304
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Originally Posted by Honoring Earl 34
:woot If BJ Symmons came in and showed more than Carr I'd say trade Carr . Carr is the face of the franchise but thats only for today.
Ragone has a far better chance at doing that than Symens. Symens was the product of a system that produces 4k passers every year with the Dink'N'Dunk style at TT.
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Old 03-10-2005   #305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny
.... Right now the only two sure starters are Babin and Greenwood. Everything else is up in the air.....
Vinny, you don't consider Wong a sure starter?
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Old 03-10-2005   #306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny
I don't know how you figure I am implying that. Right now the only two sure starters are Babin and Greenwood. Everything else is up in the air. I've already stated before this trade was announced that I thought Sharper's play wasn't as good as his previous years and he may be in decline. They may feel he is not worth what he is asking and just want to get younger and faster at this position. It's not like our linebackers have made game changing plays very often here in the first three years. Seems to me the Texans feel that this group has gotten as good as it is going to get and they may not feel like that is good enough.

I agree with most of what you are saying Vinny but I think most people felt the DL was our weakest link and hampered some of our LB play. We do need a shake up on defense though.
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Old 03-10-2005   #307
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Originally Posted by DOCTOR24
Vinny, you don't consider Wong a sure starter?
No, I think he is a good but not above average ROLB and I think that he may not be a good fit inside. I've even seen some astute Texans observers speculate that Wong may not even be on the squad next season. Just remember that this defensive unit has never been better than average. Perhaps the Texans feel that their linebacker play is the culprit moreso than most of us do.

bckey - I think injuries played a role in their play last year and hopefully they will add a youngster and the vets all get past their nagging injuries. It’s my perception that Walker should bounce back because he has a long history of high caliber play and he had problems with some critical leg/thigh area muscles last year that robbed his explosion. Two gap linemen play at a high level deep into their careers so I am not as concerned as most of you guys. I'm more concerned that RoSmith was overrated and not as good as either Payne or Walker. Last year it took him more than half a year to start to make a few plays. Payne had a slow start and got better as he got back into playing shape and RoSmith and Payne never really had many of their best games together. If all 3 are healthy and RoSmith isn't a bust, I think our line will be fine for years as they are currently situated. That goes against the common sentiment here, but that’s what I see.
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Old 03-10-2005   #308
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infantrycak
You have to deduct the dead money to get the cap space the team saves so the Texans would have about $4.75 extra cap space if they release Sharper. Releasing Foreman gives about $200k in cap space but also clears $2.2 and $3.1 off in later years.
Okay for some reason I thought his base was around 6.5 and he had a bonus on top of that. I'm aware of how the base and bonus numbers function, but I just don't keep track of how they are broken down for individuals.
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Old 03-10-2005   #309
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Here is an article from the Chronicle via prosports daily. Maybe some of you are interested.
I apologize if it is already posted.

Sharper and Forman article

I believe that too many people are thinking that we are not taking a step down by losing Sharper. I think we will; however, I think it is a neccessary step to progress two steps forward in the overall scheme. We need the cap space for other reasons.
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Old 03-10-2005   #310
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From bengals.com:
Link to Article

Quote:
Reunion interests Sharper

One of Marvin Lewis’ high-profile Super Bowl defenders is interested in re-joining him in Cincinnati, but a few things have to happen first.

Linebacker Jamie Sharper, who had 20 tackles, two sacks, and two interceptions during the Ravens’ championship postseason for Lewis in 2000, is on the trading block in Houston and he has told his agent he finds playing for Lewis again intriguing.

But Tony Agnone said Wednesday it doesn’t look promising that a trade can be struck with any team.

“We’re looking into a release,” said Agnone, the Baltimore-based agent who has a good relationship with Lewis from his six seasons there as the Ravens defensive coordinator.

“It’s up to the Texans, and obviously we’d like to get Jamie on the market as quickly as possible,” Agnone said. “He loves Marvin. He’s his guy, his mentor, whatever you want to call him. Jamie would love to be able to sit down and talk with Marvin, but he can’t and we can’t. We’ve been given permission to seek a trade, but not permission to talk.”

Agnone wouldn’t comment when asked if he had approached the Bengals about a trade, but he indicated they are one of the teams leading Sharper’s list.

Sharper, who turns 31 late in the season, has never missed an NFL game in the eight years since Lewis helped draft him in the second round out of Virginia in 1997. He is one season removed from leading the NFL in tackles with 195 and in each of three seasons with the Texans he has had at least 137 tackles.

The 6-3, 240-pound Sharper, who works mainly on the inside, is an athletic ball hawk who would also help the Bengals raise themselves from No. 26 in NFL run defense. Although Houston is moving in a different direction at backer, Sharper is coming off a 137-tackle season in which he returned one of his two fumble recoveries for a touchdown. He’s also got 25 career sacks.

Agnone anticipates Sharper playing on the left, or strong side, if he ended up in Cincinnati, but also said he could play the middle because of his experience playing inside in the Texans’ 3-4 alignment.

“I think the thing he wants to do is to be able to sit down with Marvin,” Agnone said. “But that can’t happen yet and we’re hoping things move along.”

What is not clear yet is if the Bengals have been holding off to make a run like this in free agency, or if they simply don’t have the salary cap room to make such a move. There has been some speculation they may be waiting for March 12, when Sharper’s brother, safety Darren, is expected to be released by the Packers.

In a bit of a twist, the Bengals keep talking about a long-term deal with the agent for running back Rudi Johnson, a guy that just happens to be friends with the Sharpers. They grew up in Richmond, Va., not far from Johnson in Ettrick, Va.

Also Wednesday, the situation of Dolphins defensive lineman Bryan Robinson looked to be status quo, with the Bengals, Broncos and Cowboys in the picture.
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Old 03-10-2005   #311
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny
Just remember that this defensive unit has never been better than average. Perhaps the Texans feel that their linebacker play is the culprit moreso than most of us do.
Many of the fans (myself included) have thought that the LB's have underperformed as a result of poor D-line play. The fact that they have re-signed Walker and Payne, yet plan on getting rid of Sharper and Foreman, leads me to believe they think it is the other way around. We absolutely have to good to great LB's to run a 3-4.
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Old 03-10-2005   #312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny
bckey - I think injuries played a role in their play last year and hopefully they will add a youngster and the vets all get past their nagging injuries. It’s my perception that Walker should bounce back because he has a long history of high caliber play and he had problems with some critical leg/thigh area muscles last year that robbed his explosion. Two gap linemen play at a high level deep into their careers so I am not as concerned as most of you guys. I'm more concerned that RoSmith was overrated and not as good as either Payne or Walker. Last year it took him more than half a year to start to make a few plays. Payne had a slow start and got better as he got back into playing shape and RoSmith and Payne never really had many of their best games together. If all 3 are healthy and RoSmith isn't a bust, I think our line will be fine for years as they are currently situated. That goes against the common sentiment here, but that’s what I see.
I hope you are right Vinny. No one really questions how good Payne is when he is 100%. I too wonder about Robaire Smith being overrated. This will be the year that makes or breaks us on the DL. Walker worries me the most because we have so much money and a long term contract invested in him. He may have just had "contract lag" last year after signing. Some players play their best in the last year of their contracts and then the worst the first year after signing it.
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Old 03-10-2005   #313
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I have a question...

If we trade Sharper AND Foreman...exactly how much money do we dump (if we take no players in return)?
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Old 03-10-2005   #314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThaShark316
I have a question...

If we trade Sharper AND Foreman...exactly how much money do we dump (if we take no players in return)?
This year's net cap savings would be about $4.95 mil. Foreman's cap hit for the years after that would have been 2.2 and 3.1 mil.
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Old 03-10-2005   #315
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It's hard to identify, specifically, who the weakest links were on offense or defense. I can say, however, offensively that the interior OLine was the problem (whether it was Pitts, Mckinney, Weigert, or some combination of them)... Similarly, defensively, the weakness against the run and pass on the defense was primarily the fault of the interior 5 (Payne, Walker, Smith, Sharper, Foreman)... They were bad against the run, obviously... And, if there had been an interior pass rush, I'd say that Wong and Babin would've combined for close to 20 sacks.

All that is to say that I'm glad to see changes made. Apparently the Texans have identified weaknesses and are in the process of repair them.
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Old 03-10-2005   #316
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have a hard time beleiving that releasing sharper is a good move if we get nothing in return. Maybe im just not thinking outside the box.

The way I see it.. Sharper has been the BEST LB on our roster for the last 3 years. No he hasnt gotten any better, and he may have even gotten SLIGHTLY worse.. but he has still been the best. Releasing him and not getting anything in return just strikes me as a very poor move.

I mean.. If our WRs werent producing and we needed to start over.. would your first move be to release Andre Johnson? No.. you would hold onto your strongest talent and try to bring in some new talent. That way you at least have somewhat of a saftey net in case your new talent bombs. Instead.. we are just taking a leap and hoping everything turns out alright.

Also.. unless we plan on making a slew of signings.. I dont see why the 4.7 million or whatever that we free up by releasing sharper is that important. If im not mistaken.. even after signing our FAs and Greenwood we still have plenty of room left over to sign our draft picks.. so why do we need to release one of our best defensive players to free up cap space?

If we dont trade him and get a draft pick or something.. then the only thing that could save this situation in my mind is if we package him with some picks in order to trade up with the browns or something and grab DJ. I can see how that could be a possibility since the browns would still get a quality LB, and some extra picks. It would sweeten the deal, so to speak.

I dunno.. I trust Casserly.. and im not crying about it yet.. but I dont like the direction this appears to be going.



BTW..

Salary Cap Casualty = Samari Rolle and the other Titan cuts
Veteran being cut for god knows what reason = Sharper, Moss


Cmon Casserly.. if you can get a 3rd rounder for Drew Henson.. you better be able to get us a 3rd or 4th for Sharper.
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Old 03-10-2005   #317
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Again, I hope the coaching staff is trying to fix this weakness without weakening the LB unit as a whole. The 3-4 is a complex defensive scheme to grasp and with all the anticipated position changes I wonder how long it will take for the new group to gel. I have faith in our staff, I would just love to have some indication from Capers or Casserly as to which direction they plan on taking this.
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Old 03-10-2005   #318
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They obviously are trying to improve the defense's speed. Robinson, Babin, and Greenwood help with that. I really think our 1st round pick is likely to be either a pass-rushing ROLB (sorry Peek) or a WR (since we don't have a #2).
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Old 03-10-2005   #319
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I'm with Grid on this one. I think replacing Foreman with Greenwood could upgrade the position, but losing Sharper and getting nothing in return would make no sense unless the staff has already decided how he is going to be replaced. As someone posted earlier, players often play some of their best football in their contract year, knowing they're up for sale, so to speak.
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Old 03-10-2005   #320
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grid
Releasing him and not getting anything in return just strikes me as a very poor move.
This is probably why you have not heard the Texans discussing this as an option. The only place you hear that is from Sharper's camp and from the fans. aj. has pointed out in the near-past that this Texans defense is getting old. 2-gap linemen have long careers and Glenn looks like the kind of guy to play long into his. We may be looking to stay a veteran unit at the line and get younger at linebacker as a two-step Super Bowl run strategy. Many people expect us to push for the playoffs this year but may not consider us Super Bowl contenders. Next year is the year we likely become one of the legit Super Bowl possible teams. This move to inject youth and speed in our linebackers may have its heart aimed at next season. I suspect the Texans are trying to incorporate Sharper into a trade that may be announced at the draft or close to the draft. It may already be in place for all we know. Pure speculation by me of course. I agree with dalemurphy in post 327 also.
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