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Old 12-07-2009   #1
Jackie Chiles
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Default John Fox?

I've been on record as saying my top two coaching candidates for next year would be Cowher followed by Frazier but what are some opinions on John Fox? The more I think about him the more I think he could be a pretty good fit here if he gets axed in Carolina (a move which could eliminate Cowher from my list).

He has head coaching experience. .548 career winning percentage. Been to a Super Bowl. Been to the playoffs 3 times. I believe he places a much higher value on size and strength on the O-line which is something a lot of people have been pining for. Not only that but he has invested in some real quality RBs and has had some fantastic ground games during his tenure in Carolina. Seems to always have a big, strong and athletic defense.

He obviously has some downfalls, most notably I would point to his teams going from 11-12 wins back to about 7 and then back to 11-12. I really believe a lot of that has to do with Jake Delhomme and how wildly inconsistent he has been. Sometimes hes great, sometimes hes terrible, lately he has been really bad.

Fox obviously isn't a perfect candidate but outside of Cowher, Holmgren and maybe Gruden his resume is equal to or superior to anyone else that might be available. Just some food for thought.
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Old 12-07-2009   #2
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Default Re: John Fox?

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Originally Posted by Jackie Chiles View Post
I've been on record as saying my top two coaching candidates for next year would be Cowher followed by Frazier but what are some opinions on John Fox? The more I think about him the more I think he could be a pretty good fit here if he gets axed in Carolina (a move which could eliminate Cowher from my list).

He has head coaching experience. .548 career winning percentage. Been to a Super Bowl. Been to the playoffs 3 times. I believe he places a much higher value on size and strength on the O-line which is something a lot of people have been pining for. Not only that but he has invested in some real quality RBs and has had some fantastic ground games during his tenure in Carolina. Seems to always have a big, strong and athletic defense.

He obviously has some downfalls, most notably I would point to his teams going from 11-12 wins back to about 7 and then back to 11-12. I really believe a lot of that has to do with Jake Delhomme and how wildly inconsistent he has been. Sometimes hes great, sometimes hes terrible, lately he has been really bad.

Fox obviously isn't a perfect candidate but outside of Cowher, Holmgren and maybe Gruden his resume is equal to or superior to anyone else that might be available. Just some food for thought.
I'm weary of getting an HC who was just fired. Especially after seeing what's happening to the Browns.

Gonna be a tough-sell to claim that a recently fired HC is the answer... but I bet this team's stellar marketing department could pull it off unfortunately
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Old 12-07-2009   #3
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Default Re: John Fox?

If we do make the coaching change I think he'd be a good choice as a DC.
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Old 12-07-2009   #4
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Default Re: John Fox?

Fox is a great candidate.

He has a real rhysical team that doesn't try to get cute.

He has gone as far as he can with Delhomme.

He has a 1st rate asst coaching staff.

McNair is from NC and Fox would be the kind of coach that fits the McNair mold.

I could see this happening and wouldn't be opposed to it.
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Old 12-07-2009   #5
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Default Re: John Fox?

He also runs a ZBS, which wouldn't necessitate the schematic changes that some folks are so adverse to. He's also a defensive minded coach which I think most prefer. But, he's only had 3 winning seasons out of 8.

I'd probably prefer Cowher, Schottenheimer, Gruden, and Holmgren all over him. Though, I'd probably prefer Fox to any assistants, Shanahan, and Billick.
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Old 12-07-2009   #6
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Default Re: John Fox?

McClain brought him up this morning on 610. I wouldn't mind having him. I think he has been handicapped by Delhome but I do wonder why there has been no plan in place to replace Delhome. I hope that is on their gm and not Fox.

I would still prefer Marty or Cowher.
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Old 12-07-2009   #7
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Default Re: John Fox?

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Originally Posted by TheRealJoker View Post
I'm weary of getting an HC who was just fired. Especially after seeing what's happening to the Browns.

Gonna be a tough-sell to claim that a recently fired HC is the answer... but I bet this team's stellar marketing department could pull it off unfortunately
I'm not leary because he's gone as far as he can go with Delhomme. Which is farther than I think anybody could have reasonably expected. Delhomme stinks.

If Cowher replaces Fox at least Fox got replaced by the guy who was the no.1 on most peoples board.
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Old 12-07-2009   #8
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Default Re: John Fox?

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Originally Posted by bckey View Post
McClain brought him up this morning on 610. I wouldn't mind having him. I think he has been handicapped by Delhome but I do wonder why there has been no plan in place to replace Delhome. I hope that is on their gm and not Fox.

I would still prefer Marty or Cowher.
He's chosen to start Delhomme despite having better options behind him. He's definitely succeptible to excessive stuborness/loyalty that's become a trademark of this team. Which means he's probably a likely candidate for us.

To make it worse, envision a scenario where Cowher goes to Carolina and we get sloppy seconds on Fox. Not only do we miss out on that big name coach, we get one that was replaced by what we so desperately need.

The more I think about it, the more John Fox has Houston Texans written all over his forehead.
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Old 12-07-2009   #9
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Default Re: John Fox?

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Originally Posted by nero THE zero View Post
He's chosen to start Delhomme despite having better options behind him. He's definitely succeptible to excessive stuborness/loyalty that's become a trademark of this team. Which means he's probably a likely candidate for us.

To make it worse, envision a scenario where Cowher goes to Carolina and we get sloppy seconds on Fox. Not only do we miss out on that big name coach, we get one that was replaced by what we so desperately need.

The more I think about it, the more John Fox has Houston Texans written all over his forehead.
LOL! What "better options" did Fox have behind Delhomme? David Carr

Hiring John Fox would be a very smart hire for Houston if Cowher wasn't available. His teams have always been defensively sound, he runs the 4-3 so there wouldn't be any personnel problems.

....and the best thing of all, THE GUY USUALLY HAS BIG PHYSICAL OFFENSIVE LINES AND A POWER RUNNING GAME!

John Fox would be a excellent hire here.

Last edited by Carr Bombed; 12-07-2009 at 08:04 PM.
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Old 12-07-2009   #10
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Default Re: John Fox?

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Originally Posted by Carr Bombed View Post
LOL! What "better options" did Fox have behind Delhomme? David Carr

Hiring John Fox would be a very smart hire for Houston if Cowher wasn't available. His teams have always been defensively sound, he runs the 4-3 so there wouldn't be any personnel problems.

....and the best thing of all, THE GUY HAS ALWAYS HAD BIG PHYSICAL OFFENSIVE LINES AND A POWER RUNNING GAME!


John Fox would be a excellent hire here.
Wouldn't that necessitate a gutting of the O-Line? Sounds like personnel issues, to me.

I agree with you that we need fat men up front. But I have doubts about hiring someone who was recently fired.
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Old 12-07-2009   #11
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Default Re: John Fox?

A defensive minded Head Coach that coached Carolina and went to the playoffs, and got fired.


Uuummmm, I think we tried that one already.
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Old 12-07-2009   #12
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Default Re: John Fox?

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A defensive minded Head Coach that coached Carolina and went to the playoffs, and got fired.


Uuummmm, I think we tried that one already.
Beat me to it.
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Old 12-07-2009   #13
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Default Re: John Fox?

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Originally Posted by houstonspartan View Post
Wouldn't that necessitate a gutting of the O-Line? Sounds like personnel issues, to me.

I agree with you that we need fat men up front. But I have doubts about hiring someone who was recently fired.
The oline doesn't count as personnel issues, because it doesn't matter who we hire, we have to get stronger upfront. Newsflash, the oline sucks.

As far as hiring somebody who was recently fired... You know how some people are trying to excuse Kubiak, because of multiple player mistakes? Well John Fox is going to get fired, because of one player. When you don't have a QB in this league it's tough, but players have always played tough for Fox and he's taken that team to places they never should have gone to. He's a good football coach, I wouldn't be upset at all if we hired him.
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Old 12-07-2009   #14
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Default Re: John Fox?

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Originally Posted by Big Lou View Post
A defensive minded Head Coach that coached Carolina and went to the playoffs, and got fired.


Uuummmm, I think we tried that one already.
That's not a reason not to hire somebody. The only thing Capers and Fox have in common is the fact that they were head coaches in Carolina. Two completely different coaching trees, coaching two completely different systems, and Fox has actually had a track record of success at the head coaching position.

Scratching Fox off a list just because he happened to coach the same team Capers did a decade earlier is rediculous and I hope the FO wouldn't have that kind of mindset when searching for coaching candidates.
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Old 12-07-2009   #15
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Default Re: John Fox?

2006 = ABC (Anybody but Carr)
2009 = ABK (Anybody but Kubiak)

John Fox? Really?

Kind of getting desperate here aren't we?
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Old 12-07-2009   #16
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Default Re: John Fox?

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Originally Posted by Carr Bombed View Post
The oline doesn't count as personnel issues, because it doesn't matter who we hire, we have to get stronger upfront. Newsflash, the oline sucks.

As far as hiring somebody who was recently fired... You know how some people are trying to excuse Kubiak, because of multiple player mistakes? Well John Fox is going to get fired, because of one player. When you don't have a QB in this league it's tough, but players have always played tough for Fox and he's taken that team to places they never should have gone to. He's a good football coach, I wouldn't be upset at all if we hired him.
Hmm. You bring up good points. Word on the street was that Fox was going to get fired like three years ago. And yet he keeps motivating his players enough to grind it out and get it done.

When I heard about the Delhomee contract extension, I was driving in my car and listening to the radio. I couldn't believe what I heard. That was a mistake.

So, maybe it's possible Fox just needs a better GM?
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Old 12-07-2009   #17
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Default Re: John Fox?

If John Fox was in a bigger market, he would get a whole lot more publicity than he does. He is an excellent coach who has taken his team to the playoffs and to the superbowl. I think after Cowher he would be my second choice.
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Old 12-07-2009   #18
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Default Re: John Fox?

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Originally Posted by Pantherstang84 View Post
2006 = ABC (Anybody but Carr)
2009 = ABK (Anybody but Kubiak)

John Fox? Really?

Kind of getting desperate here aren't we?
ABC worked out pretty well.

I don't see how John fox is getting desperate. Bill Belichick coaches don't grow on trees. We can't all have Super Bowl winning perennially fantastic coaches. Like I said earlier, give me some names of other previous head coaches or even coordinators outside of the Cowher/Holmgren types (who may not come here due to reasons beyond our control) and lets see how their resumes stack up.
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Old 12-07-2009   #19
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Default Re: John Fox?

NO. He hangs on to crappy quarterbacks too long. And he signed David Carr. Bad signs.
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Old 12-07-2009   #20
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Default Re: John Fox?

John fox is not terrible, but not sure that he is a true next level coach. His offenses have been very unimaginitive, and even with a top 5-10 WR terrible as a pass offense. Also, he tends to stick by veteran players too long. Sorry, no reason that Jake D. and M. Muhhammed should still be starting. Better of defense, but is still reluntant to rotate players and from year to year that organization is pretty inconsistent. Playoffs one year, not close the next. Probably would bring more of a power zone style and more emphasis on defense, so he is good combination of defense/ and not going too far from teh Texans current style. Honestly, this is the type of hire I could see mcNair making.
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