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Old 11-17-2009   #1
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Default 5 million down with 5 million to go...

...and Dunta Robinson doesn't have a pick, a sack, only 5 deflections and a forced fumble that I can't seem to remember. 27 tackles don't bother me so much because you don't really want your corners making 75 tackles a year but no picks? He's got more pass interferences than plays on the ball. He's also got more money than proof, more talk than walk and 7 regular seasons games left to prove he's even half the player we took in 2004: 3 sacks, 6 picks, 19 (!) pass deflections, forced a fumble and had 74 tackles. Where is THAT player?


http://www.pro-football-reference.co...R/RobiDu20.htm
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Old 11-17-2009   #2
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

I wonder if he has been thrown to less? Or just plain underachieving
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Old 11-17-2009   #3
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

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Originally Posted by stevn8r View Post
I wonder if he has been thrown to less? Or just plain underachieving
That's my guess. He seems to be giving a big cushion on the receivers and then being forced to make early contact to stop the pass. I'm not seeing him play the ball very much this season. I really liked him, but I'd only like to see him stay if he can return to close to original form. My biggest concern is if we let him walk, what does that do for the mentality of our locker room? We don't have a lot of veteran players on this team and I remember well what happened after we let a group of veterans leave in the past. If we can let him go and maintain our swagger on D, I'm for that. Having said that, he didn't play in the preseason and is returning after a major injury, so I really need to see how he finishes the season off before I make up my mind. As of this moment though, I don't think he's earning the paycheck he's getting.
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Old 11-17-2009   #4
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

Dunta is a damn good run support corner, one of the best. He is a locker room leader as well as an on field leader. Is he the player he once was? Probably not. Hell his leg is being held together with bailing wire, some bubble gum and rubber bands, but he is still above average taking everything into consideration. And I think he is improving and might still be close to what he was with another year under his belt.

I understand your point, but I think we need to try and sign this guy, if possible, in the offseason. If he is being unreasonable again, then jettison him, but we need to make every effort to resign him. This D without Dunta is a step backwards.
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Old 11-17-2009   #5
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

Dunta Robinson's rookie season wasn't as great as many of y'all seem to make out. His '07 season was better. Stats don't tell the story for corners.

That said, he isn't half the player he was in 2005 or 2006, and damn sure not worth $10 million.
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Old 11-17-2009   #6
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

Aside from his rookie season he's never been a ballhawk type. Very good in run support and usually covers his WR well. But if the WR gets open and the QB throws it to him then it usually means he's out of position and will not be making a play on the ball.
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Old 11-17-2009   #7
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

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Originally Posted by Cjeremy635 View Post
That's my guess. He seems to be giving a big cushion on the receivers and then being forced to make early contact to stop the pass. I'm not seeing him play the ball very much this season. I really liked him, but I'd only like to see him stay if he can return to close to original form. My biggest concern is if we let him walk, what does that do for the mentality of our locker room? We don't have a lot of veteran players on this team and I remember well what happened after we let a group of veterans leave in the past. If we can let him go and maintain our swagger on D, I'm for that. Having said that, he didn't play in the preseason and is returning after a major injury, so I really need to see how he finishes the season off before I make up my mind. As of this moment though, I don't think he's earning the paycheck he's getting.
I think that's where Bernard Pollard steps in. Dude has made plays and has become the vocal leader. Go back and read his quotes, all things that said the team just needs to stick with it and things will get better. Well, they have and his play has proved it.
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Old 11-17-2009   #8
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

I understand that after Cushing, Quin is the most impressive and arguably MV
rookie on the team ? I know he's already a regular in our nickel package and wonder if he appears to be on schedule to start at CB next fall if Dunta departs ?
I know a big issue for him as a full-time CB is his top-end speed, but he's turned out to probably be the best value in this years Draft for us.
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Old 11-17-2009   #9
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

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Originally Posted by TimeKiller View Post
...and Dunta Robinson doesn't have a pick, a sack, only 5 deflections and a forced fumble that I can't seem to remember. 27 tackles don't bother me so much because you don't really want your corners making 75 tackles a year but no picks? He's got more pass interferences than plays on the ball. He's also got more money than proof, more talk than walk and 7 regular seasons games left to prove he's even half the player we took in 2004: 3 sacks, 6 picks, 19 (!) pass deflections, forced a fumble and had 74 tackles. Where is THAT player?


http://www.pro-football-reference.co...R/RobiDu20.htm
He earns $10 million simply for keeping Fred Bennett off the field. Money well spent!!
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Old 11-17-2009   #10
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

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He earns $10 million simply for keeping Fred Bennett off the field. Money well spent!!
Great....winner by default. That's gonna get us farrrrrrrrrrr!
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Old 11-17-2009   #11
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

Thank god the Texans never gave in to his demands while he was holding out. He hasn't impressed me one bit this season, and he's not really going to get much better from here if he does at all. I'd be perfectly happy to let him walk after this season and try to sign possibly another CB on the market if there is a good one around.
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Old 11-17-2009   #12
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

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Originally Posted by Cjeremy635 View Post
My biggest concern is if we let him walk, what does that do for the mentality of our locker room? We don't have a lot of veteran players on this team and I remember well what happened after we let a group of veterans leave in the past. If we can let him go and maintain our swagger on D, I'm for that.
Fair point but as far as swagger goes, I'd point to guys who talk and play TOUGH (I didn't say good, I said TOUGH) football like Smith, Cushing and Pollard long before I point to someone who's last trip through the media was to cry about his huge contract.

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I understand your point, but I think we need to try and sign this guy, if possible, in the offseason. If he is being unreasonable again, then jettison him, but we need to make every effort to resign him. This D without Dunta is a step backwards.
If he points to an improved defense as a reason to pay him while his play looks like crap, produces extremely little and isn't clearly deserving of a huge contract again then resigning him is the only step going backwards. Locker room influence or not you have to make plays to get paid. Stupid type money anyway, we all see DanO with the big 9 mil in the bank for some reason.

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Dunta Robinson's rookie season wasn't as great as many of y'all seem to make out. His '07 season was better. Stats don't tell the story for corners.

That said, he isn't half the player he was in 2005 or 2006, and damn sure not worth $10 million.
I didn't watch the Texans with the same set of eyes then...but I'm telling you right now I'd damn sure have the kind of INT/PD numbers from '04 than what he's doing now which is holding on to receivers because he can't keep up with them.
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I understand that after Cushing, Quin is the most impressive and arguably MV
rookie on the team ? I know he's already a regular in our nickel package and wonder if he appears to be on schedule to start at CB next fall if Dunta departs ?
I know a big issue for him as a full-time CB is his top-end speed, but he's turned out to probably be the best value in this years Draft for us.
He doesn't have that burner gear but his instincts are sharp and puts himself in good position. I haven't seen him whiff a tackle yet either which really makes me want to line him up as the FS next to the big hammer Pollard. He's definitely the best value so far. Cushing is great but you spend a 1st, you expect something like this. Barwin, Caldwell, Hill and McCain pretty much fit in with what you expect from mid rounds but Quin has excelled and James Casey is about to get his shot. Really want to see this class in 3 years. When we win a superbowl for the 3rd year in a row!!!!!!!!!
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Old 11-17-2009   #13
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

D-Rob is still a good player, but 10 mil a year in a salery-capped league, not so much...
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Old 11-17-2009   #14
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

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D-Rob is still a good player, but 10 mil a year in a salery-capped league, not so much...
Pretty much how I feel, he's just decent, not great but serviceable. The reported contract offer was a good offer for the guy.
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Old 11-17-2009   #15
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

So this is what it's come down to now?

We're paying some guy 10 million a year to be better than Fred Bennett?

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Old 11-17-2009   #16
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

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So this is what it's come down to now?

We're paying some guy 10 million a year to be better than Fred Bennett?

not a year, it's only one year

In retrospect I'm glad we paid him the 10 mil, now we know that he's not worth the big contract, and since the money is already spend we wont have to drag the expenses into next year.
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Old 11-17-2009   #17
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

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Dunta is a damn good run support corner, one of the best.
I don't feel that that is true so much anymore. He's aggressive, but when you compare him to the other 10 guys on the field during a run play, he is the most consistently out of position. He takes bad angles and exhibits poor tackling habits.
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Old 11-17-2009   #18
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

He's better than servicable. DRob is a legit to very good #2 starter on anyone's D right now. Y'all are way underestimating his value imo. Run support is an under appreciated art for a corner, and Drob is in the top handfull in the league for run support. I know everyone wants to credit Pollard and Quinn for the run turnaround and rightly so, but Drob has been a big part of that too. I've also seen him make some plays this year in the pass game that y'all are overlooking. One in Cinci or Buff if I recall pretty much sealed the win.

Also, he is likely to get better over the last half of the season, and significantly better next year than this year. That is the nature of the type of injury he had. The blueprint is these guys aren't usually at their post injury peak until 2 full football seasons after thier injury. That is next year.

Now is he going to be a top ten corner in football like he was pre injury? I doubt he returns to that level. But I do see him returning to being an excellent #2 CB, or a decent #1. So, then it's all about the numbers. If he is willing to be somewhat reasonable, I would sign him in a NY minute. Otherwise, you are going to end up using a high and valuable draft pick on an unknown commodity, OR reach into the FA pool for someone that will cost as much or more - and oh BTW when was the last time this team picked up a true difference maker in FA? Reeves and Smith are the best of a bad lot of FA signings over the years. So, I don't see how swapping our over-priced FA for someone else's overpriced FA makes us any better.
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Old 11-17-2009   #19
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

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I don't feel that that is true so much anymore. He's aggressive, but when you compare him to the other 10 guys on the field during a run play, he is the most consistently out of position. He takes bad angles and exhibits poor tackling habits.
Well Barrett, we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. Maybe he isn't elite anymore, but he is still damn good (speaking in terms of run support)
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Old 11-17-2009   #20
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Default Re: 5 million down with 5 million to go...

Dunta's perfectly good at corner in this league. He's never been a 1 but he's been very good as a 2 when we had a legitimate 1 on the other side. Having said that.....

That was then, this is now. I don't care for Dunta Robinson and haven't for a long time. I think he's stood out because in our short history we didn't have too many guys on our team who were "vocal leader-types" and so he's often been at the center of what little emotional wave our team was riding. He's our miniature Ray Lewis firing up the rest of the players and we all dig that except... how fired up do we usually look? How much energy does this guy generate seriously?

That he's been our favorite defensive player over the years doesn't mean he's some kind of magnificent corner. He's pretty middle of the pack and on a team with good depth in the secondary he's not vital. He's sure as hell not franchise player 9 million a year vital. Reeves is clearly a better corner than Dunta is and he's getting better which is something our corners rarely did under Hoke. Our rookies are playing well all things considered and while it may be too late for Fred Bennett I think Molden just might turn it around. I'm certain we'll be looking at a first day corner in the 2010 draft. There's not a doubt in my mind we'll be doing that because Dunta will be leaving.

I'm still convinced that a small mountain of gold couldn't keep Dunta in Houston past this contract. I remain sure that he wants out of town as soon as possible. Short of grossly overpaying him for a second straight season there's no way of forcing him to stay and why would we?

Grab a rookie in the second or third round to pair with Reeves and see if Quinn or one of the guys we currently have rises up to keep that rookie in the nickel. Let Dunta go get too much money from Dan Snyder or Al Davis or some other dumbshit.
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