Holy Cr*p... Refs screwed us!

[dalemurphy]

Okay, so I'm not exactly going to blame this loss on the Refs. But, after rewatching the end of the game, I have less of a beef with the playcall... because...

On 3rd and goal, the ball was well inside the one yard line. We needed about 1ft for a TD. When the refs replaced the ball for 4th down the ball was outside the 1 yard line. The respot cost us an entire yard. When you're inches away, that playcall makes more sense. And, there's no way a coach on the sideline, stuck between the 20s, can see the poor spot.

that was a pretty big gaffe by the Refs. Though, I still dislike the call and I really dislike Schaub's errant throw on the play before.

[Scooter]

i actually have a couple questions about the rules in this one. how much pushing is allowed from a receiver? i hadnt noticed before, but fitz runs his routes with a series of stiffarms. i'm getting a bit fuzzy but one of his touchdowns was a good example of that pushoff, and he had a couple others in the first half. the other is removing your helmet on the field ... i thought that was illegal, but warner when frustrasted had the helmet off between the hash marks several times.

i'm not really concerned about their game impact, just looking for some clarification.

[utahmark]

i couldnt figure out why that 4th down play was from the 1. i was going to rewatch it tomorrow. arizona got the ball back on about the 3 inch line, so we made nine inches. if the ball was marked correctly we win. i'm just going to pretend like we won. it will be a nicer week and i wont owe anyone a diet coke.

[TexanBacker93]

Originally Posted by markbeth

i couldnt figure out why that 4th down play was from the 1. i was going to rewatch it tomorrow. arizona got the ball back on about the 3 inch line, so we made nine inches. if the ball was marked correctly we win. i'm just going to pretend like we won. it will be a nicer week and i wont owe anyone a diet coke.

If the ball was spotted correctly we would have gone in for the tie. We'd still have to win in OT.

[BattleRedToro]

Originally Posted by TexanBacker93

If the ball was spotted correctly we would have gone in for the tie. We'd still have to win in OT.

Not necessarily. After scoring a TD on 4th Down the Texans could have decided to attempt a 2 point conversion, and if succesful they would have won in regulation time.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by BattleRedToro

Not necessarily. After scoring a TD on 4th Down the Texans could have decided to attempt a 2 point conversion, and if succesful they would have won in regulation time.

Except a 2 point conversion is from the 2 or 3 yardline, not the 6 inch line. So how would we go for 2? A pass out the back of the end zone, or 12 running plays?

[BattleRedToro]

Originally Posted by Fred

Except a 2 point conversion is from the 2 or 3 yardline, not the 6 inch line. So how would we go for 2? A pass out the back of the end zone, or 12 running plays?

Yes, I know the spot for a 2 point conversion attempt is not the 6 inch mark. I would guess that the Texans would run a play-action pass to a TE or something like that for the 2 point conversion. My point was it was possible to go for the win there in regulation time, and not play for OT.

[GuerillaBlack]

We still would have had to stop Arizona from going down the field...

[HoustonFrog]

Another refs thread. (shaking head)

[davemundy]

Originally Posted by dalemurphy

Okay, so I'm not exactly going to blame this loss on the Refs. But, after rewatching the end of the game, I have less of a beef with the playcall... because...

On 3rd and goal, the ball was well inside the one yard line. We needed about 1ft for a TD. When the refs replaced the ball for 4th down the ball was outside the 1 yard line. The respot cost us an entire yard. When you're inches away, that playcall makes more sense. And, there's no way a coach on the sideline, stuck between the 20s, can see the poor spot.

that was a pretty big gaffe by the Refs. Though, I still dislike the call and I really dislike Schaub's errant throw on the play before.

Spots always change like that, and I'm sure if we hear from a ref we'll find out. Nine inches or one yard, though, the point was, Houston didn't get into the end zone, period.

[gtexan02]

Originally Posted by GuerillaBlack

We still would have had to stop Arizona from going down the field...

They scored 0 points in the 3rd/4th quarters offesively

[GuerillaBlack]

Originally Posted by gtexan02

They scored 0 points in the 3rd/4th quarters offesively

What does that matter? We still would have had to stop then regardless though right?

[HoustonFrog]

Originally Posted by davemundy

Spots always change like that, and I'm sure if we hear from a ref we'll find out. Nine inches or one yard, though, the point was, Houston didn't get into the end zone, period.

And you also never know where the knee hit before the ball was extended, etc. I've thought spots were wrong before depending on the ball and then I see where the ball was when the knee actually hit and they are pretty close.

[hookinreds]

Originally Posted by Scooter

i actually have a couple questions about the rules in this one. how much pushing is allowed from a receiver? i hadnt noticed before, but fitz runs his routes with a series of stiffarms. i'm getting a bit fuzzy but one of his touchdowns was a good example of that pushoff, and he had a couple others in the first half. the other is removing your helmet on the field ... i thought that was illegal, but warner when frustrasted had the helmet off between the hash marks several times.

i'm not really concerned about their game impact, just looking for some clarification.

I was thinking the same thing during the game and will rewatch it again tonight or tomorrow. I could have sworn the Fitz stiffarmed Dunta in the face and pushed off on the TD and on an earlier play that the did a replay on and couldn't believe it wasn't called back. I was at a bar so couldn't hear the sound so not sure if they talked about it or not, but it was an obvious push off to me....(oh...it was on a comback route that Dunta was pushed off on and where he slipped leaving the WR wide open) and looking like Dunta blew the coverage.

[Hardcore Texan]

Originally Posted by hookinreds

I was thinking the same thing during the game and will rewatch it again tonight or tomorrow. I could have sworn the Fitz stiffarmed Dunta in the face and pushed off on the TD and on an earlier play that the did a replay on and couldn't believe it wasn't called back. I was at a bar so couldn't hear the sound so not sure if they talked about it or not, but it was an obvious push off to me....(oh...it was on a comback route that Dunta was pushed off on and where he slipped leaving the WR wide open) and looking like Dunta blew the coverage.

They didn't talk about it about it all, but Fitz pushed off of Dunta bigtime, then crossed the back of the endzone with Dunta trailing and trying to catch back up. There was a good few seconds from the push off until the pass, he covered a lot of ground so I guess the refs missed it somehow, it looked obvious to me, he extended his arm and that is what the refs are supposed to look for, that easily should have came back.

Originally Posted by dalemurphy

Okay, so I'm not exactly going to blame this loss on the Refs. But, after rewatching the end of the game, I have less of a beef with the playcall... because...

On 3rd and goal, the ball was well inside the one yard line. We needed about 1ft for a TD. When the refs replaced the ball for 4th down the ball was outside the 1 yard line. The respot cost us an entire yard. When you're inches away, that playcall makes more sense. And, there's no way a coach on the sideline, stuck between the 20s, can see the poor spot.

that was a pretty big gaffe by the Refs. Though, I still dislike the call and I really dislike Schaub's errant throw on the play before.

I haven't rewatched it yet, and don't know if I will this week, but didn't we get pushed back about a 1/2 yard on 3rd down, and that's why we had further to go on 4th down.

That's how I remember it just watching it once.

[infantrycak]

Originally Posted by HoustonFrog

And you also never know where the knee hit before the ball was extended, etc. I've thought spots were wrong before depending on the ball and then I see where the ball was when the knee actually hit and they are pretty close.

I thought the spots were conservative to put it kindly all day by this particular reffing crew. Will not say it affected the game although obviously things like that can.

Originally Posted by Scooter

i actually have a couple questions about the rules in this one. how much pushing is allowed from a receiver? i hadnt noticed before, but fitz runs his routes with a series of stiffarms. i'm getting a bit fuzzy but one of his touchdowns was a good example of that pushoff, and he had a couple others in the first half. the other is removing your helmet on the field ... i thought that was illegal, but warner when frustrasted had the helmet off between the hash marks several times.

i'm not really concerned about their game impact, just looking for some clarification.

If you are referring to Fitz' 2nd TD what it looked like to me was Dunta pushed himself backwards off Fitz in the endzone.

You are right on the helmet rule but they are going to let vets get away with that most of the time if they do not do it to yell at someone else.

[HoustonFrog]

Originally Posted by infantrycak

I thought the spots were conservative to put it kindly all day by this particular reffing crew. Will not say it affected the game although obviously things like that can.


If you are referring to Fitz' 2nd TD what it looked like to me was Dunta pushed himself backwards off Fitz in the endzone.

You are right on the helmet rule but they are going to let vets get away with that most of the time if they do not do it to yell at someone else.

Could have been. I didn't see the replay of that particular play. I just see the guys run in sometimes and I'm incredulous until I see it in slo-mo.

[ChampionTexan]

Originally Posted by GuerillaBlack

What does that matter? We still would have had to stop then regardless though right?

You're correct, but given the way our defense played in the second half, and the fact that there would have been about 40 seconds left in regulation when we kicked off, I would have kind of liked our chances of sending it into overtime.

[infantrycak]

Originally Posted by HoustonFrog

Could have been. I didn't see the replay of that particular play. I just see the guys run in sometimes and I'm incredulous until I see it in slo-mo.

I wasn't really referring to the goal line plays. Throughout the game I was seeing balls placed at the knees or hips instead of where the ball had advanced to when the knee touched. I saw it for both teams although it felt like it was more to the Texans, but that may be because OD, SS, Walter and AJ are all good at trying to extend for the last possible yard.

[utahmark]

Originally Posted by Hardcore Texan

They didn't talk about it about it all, but Fitz pushed off of Dunta bigtime, then crossed the back of the endzone with Dunta trailing and trying to catch back up. There was a good few seconds from the push off until the pass, he covered a lot of ground so I guess the refs missed it somehow, it looked obvious to me, he extended his arm and that is what the refs are supposed to look for, that easily should have came back.



I haven't rewatched it yet, and don't know if I will this week, but didn't we get pushed back about a 1/2 yard on 3rd down, and that's why we had further to go on 4th down.

That's how I remember it just watching it once.

3rd down was a incomplete pass. i havent watched it again yet. i just remember thinking it was weird then i saw this post.