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Old 09-14-2009   #61
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by Texan_Bill View Post
With the bolded.... The late '70's Oilers were not that talented (save Earl and a couple of others), but they were tough sumbitches and eventually won.
Gotcha...I just saw it after mine and wondered!
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Old 09-14-2009   #62
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by Jackie Chiles View Post
I would have absolutely given them extra credit for looking tough and losing yesterday.
I agree. Loosing is one thing, getting youre ass stomped into the ground is another thing all together. Good teams loose soemtimes it just happens but its not very often a GOOD team gets road graded.

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My point is toughness is overrated and all that matters is W/L
Toughnes is important in all physical sports no matter how talented or good you are. Thats just the reality of it. You dont have to be a team of total baddasses but youre not going to win many games if you get pushed around like we did yesterday.
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Old 09-14-2009   #63
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by Texan_Bill View Post
With the bolded.... The late '70's Oilers were not that talented (save Earl and a couple of others), but they were tough sumbitches and eventually won.

There's something to that whole "Will not be denied" approach where football is concerned. Really sports in general. Those Oiler teams didn't know they couldn't do something. It just never seemed to enter their minds that they didn't even come close to matching up with the Steelers of that era and so they were some of the toughest games Pittsburgh had back then. Many people said that at that time for a couple of years the best two teams in the NFL played in the AFC Central. Pittsburgh was extremely talented and the Oilers were extremely tough and determined.

And they had Earl Who was talented AND tough AND determined.
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Old 09-14-2009   #64
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

So Rex Ryan huh? I havent seen so many people on these forums with a man crush of this magnitude since Vince Young entered the draft.
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Old 09-14-2009   #65
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by m5kwatts View Post
My point is toughness is overrated and all that matters is W/L
Alright, name the last soft team that won a Super Bowl.
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Old 09-14-2009   #66
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
Alright, name the last soft team that won a Super Bowl.
St. Louis Rams and to a lesser extent but more recent on the finesse scale Indianapolis Colts.
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Old 09-14-2009   #67
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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St. Louis Rams and to a lesser extent but more recent on the finesse scale Indianapolis Colts.
I guess it helps when you have 3 maybe 4 HOF players on one side of the ball .
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Old 09-14-2009   #68
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
There's something to that whole "Will not be denied" approach where football is concerned. Really sports in general. Those Oiler teams didn't know they couldn't do something. It just never seemed to enter their minds that they didn't even come close to matching up with the Steelers of that era and so they were some of the toughest games Pittsburgh had back then. Many people said that at that time for a couple of years the best two teams in the NFL played in the AFC Central. Pittsburgh was extremely talented and the Oilers were extremely tough and determined.

And they had Earl Who was talented AND tough AND determined.
Yup!

Re: the 1979 Divisional Playoffs without Earl or Pastorini. Enter Giff, Rob Carpenter, Tim Wilson, Boobie Clark and the real hero, Vernon Perry. No one gave the Oilers a chance to go into San Diego and win.

The Oilers simply refused to lose that game.


During a game with the Steelers, I remember Mean Joe Green saying after Earl left hurt, [paraphrasing] "we never wished for players to get hurt, but we were glad to see Earl leave the game" (or something to that effect).
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Old 09-14-2009   #69
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/...Post-4962.html

“Attitude is the whole thing in football. Every team has the talent and the coaching. Motivation makes the difference. The teams that win stay healthy and interested.” -- Sid Gillman, Hall of Fame coach with the San Diego Chargers, Los Angeles Rams and Houston Oilers
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Old 09-14-2009   #70
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by ArlingtonTexan View Post
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/...Post-4962.html

“Attitude is the whole thing in football. Every team has the talent and the coaching. Motivation makes the difference. The teams that win stay healthy and interested.” -- Sid Gillman, Hall of Fame coach with the San Diego Chargers, Los Angeles Rams and Houston Oilers
I see your Gillman and raise you a Vince .

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Old 09-14-2009   #71
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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What do you think is the difference between Tennessee, Pittsburgh, NYJets, Baltimore, Philadelphia... and teams like Houston. It's not talent!
Um, they all have great defenses, we don't?
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Old 09-14-2009   #72
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by Second Honeymoon View Post
you couldn't be more wrong. you can't win without being tough in this league. people point to successful 'finesse' teams but forget that they showed toughness by taking another team's best shot and still competing or showing their teeth on defense.

The Texans are soft, their coach is soft, and we will never win squat until that changes. Look at the Titans. They play tough because their coach demands it. You don't see Fisher being Billy Bad A$$ but you know that he demands toughness and uber competitiveness just to even start for his teams. All it takes to start on our teams is to be drafted early.
I agree you can't win without being tough, but this idea that toughness translates directly to winning football games is ridiculous. Plenty of tough division 1-AA college teams get steam rolled by the likes of Florida and Texas every year in college because they aren't as good of a football team and on Sunday the Texans weren't as good as the Jets. Decorate the loss with adjectives all you want, they weren't tough they weren't this and that, the point is we weren't as good.
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Old 09-14-2009   #73
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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St. Louis Rams and to a lesser extent but more recent on the finesse scale Indianapolis Colts.
The Rams' defense led the league in fewest rushing yards allowed (1,189) and fewest rushing touchdowns allowed (4), while giving up just 242 points. Overall, the defense ranked 4th in the league in fewest total yards allowed (5,056).

----------------

Indianapolis' defense ranked second in the NFL in fewest passing yards allowed. Dwight Freeney and Robert Mathis (who recorded 9.5 sacks and forced 4 fumbles) were widely considered to be among the best pass-rushing defensive ends in the NFL. Behind them, linebacker Cato June led the team in tackles (92) and interceptions (3).

----------------

These teams were not soft. "Finesse" offenses - yes. But overall, they were not SOFT.
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Old 09-14-2009   #74
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

I am thinking Tracy McGrady could fit in running the wildcat

hell he might add some toughness, after seeing our offense yesterday

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Old 09-14-2009   #75
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by m5kwatts View Post
I agree you can't win without being tough, but this idea that toughness translates directly to winning football games is ridiculous. Plenty of tough division 1-AA college teams get steam rolled by the likes of Florida and Texas every year in college because they aren't as good of a football team and on Sunday the Texans weren't as good as the Jets. Decorate the loss with adjectives all you want, they weren't tough they weren't this and that, the point is we weren't as good.
Because using college football really helps your argument. College football is completely different. Your talking about a huge difference in speed and overall athletic ability. Every NFL team has major athletes, div I-AA teams do not. If you cannot understand that it is no wonder you can't understand the importance of toughness in football.
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Old 09-14-2009   #76
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Because using college football really helps your argument. College football is completely different. Your talking about a huge difference in speed and overall athletic ability. Every NFL team has major athletes, div I-AA teams do not. If you cannot understand that it is no wonder you can't understand the importance of toughness in football.
I think there's a HUGE difference between Tom Brady or Peyton Manning being your quarterback as opposed to a Byron Leftwich or Jake Delhomme. There's a HUGE difference between James Harrison, Haloti Ngata, Trent Cole, and Ed Reed as opposed to bad teams who rely on bad secondarys (like us) or bad pass rushers. Talent wins in this league, not being able to beat someone up. The difference between bad organizations like the Rams Lions and Chiefs etc. and the winning orgs. like the Patriots Steelers and so on isn't "toughness" or "meanness" or whatever adjective, its TALENT. TALENT wins on Sundays period.
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Old 09-14-2009   #77
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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Originally Posted by TexansSeminole View Post
Because using college football really helps your argument. College football is completely different. Your talking about a huge difference in speed and overall athletic ability. Every NFL team has major athletes, div I-AA teams do not. If you cannot understand that it is no wonder you can't understand the importance of toughness in football.
Maybe defining toughness is the key .
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Old 09-14-2009   #78
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

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I think there's a HUGE difference between Tom Brady or Peyton Manning being your quarterback as opposed to a Byron Leftwich or Jake Delhomme. There's a HUGE difference between James Harrison, Haloti Ngata, Trent Cole, and Ed Reed as opposed to bad teams who rely on bad secondarys (like us) or bad pass rushers. Talent wins in this league, not being able to beat someone up. The difference between bad organizations like the Rams Lions and Chiefs etc. isn't "toughness" or "meanness" or whatever adjective, its TALENT. TALENT wins on Sundays period.
You ever notice how bad coaches always seem to have bad talent ? What if you applied a Bumism here and say he can take your team and beat his or he can take his team and beat yourens .

As much as I hate to say it , the Titans do a great job of finding guys from all over and get them to buy into the system . Look at their roster and see how many guys are from small schools .
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Old 09-14-2009   #79
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

Hell there was a C.C Brown sighting in the Giants game


just saying
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Old 09-14-2009   #80
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Default Re: Article: Texans' toughness questioned

Nobody is going to argue that talent isn't important. That would be a foolish take. But it's just as foolish to think that intangibles such as heart, will, and attitude are not important, as well. 'Toughness' falls under this category.

The run & shoot Oilers used to be the best team in the league as far as talent was concerned, but they lacked the mental fortitude to consistently instill their will on their opponents. That's why they never accomplished much of anything.
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