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Old 04-08-2009   #21
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

Am I the only who gets the feeling that DeMeco is going to end up like AJ? Signing a long term extension that is cap friendly? Just get him and OD signed.

Far as Dunta is concerned, I don't think it's a hunch when you balk at 23 Million. He wants out and that's fine. I'm preprared for the Texans w/o him. If Jenkins falls to 15 and we run to the podium with the pick it would not suprise me to see Dunta on the trade block while his value is the highest.
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Old 04-08-2009   #22
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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You think Lofa Tatupu is a better player? If you're arguing that the number is high for Tatupu as well, then I can agree to that, but that ship sailed long ago. Dollar figures are simply FUBAR in sports.
I think $42 million is steep. Don't care which LB it is.

DeMeco is getting a lot of hype here, and I have to wonder if it's because he's on a quasi-good team (ours) and not because he can really command that kind of coin. Teams' fans tend to live in a bit of a bubble, and this feels like one of those instances.

Outside of Pro Bowls, what are we really judging players' "worth" upon? I don't know where I am going with this, but I just know that I (as a Texans fan) am not comfortable with us giving DeMeco a fat contract yet.

I want him to have not a Hot one, and not a Cold one....but a juuuust right one. Think "Goldilocks & The Three Bears" analogy. Nothing big, noting small, but something halfway.

If he's wanting top 5 money....well, I don't think he's there yet. Just my .02
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Old 04-08-2009   #23
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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I think $42 million is steep. Don't care which LB it is.

DeMeco is getting a lot of hype here, and I have to wonder if it's because he's on a quasi-good team (ours) and not because he can really command that kind of coin. Teams' fans tend to live in a bit of a bubble, and this feels like one of those instances.

Outside of Pro Bowls, what are we really judging players' "worth" upon? I don't know where I am going with this, but I just know that I (as a Texans fan) am not comfortable with us giving DeMeco a fat contract yet.

I want him to have not a Hot one, and not a Cold one....but a juuuust right one. Think "Goldilocks & The Three Bears" analogy. Nothing big, noting small, but something halfway.

If he's wanting top 5 money....well, I don't think he's there yet. Just my .02
Agreed. He had an outstanding rookie season, a very good 2nd season, and just a good 3rd season. So his production has slowly dropped off each season. I don't think it will continue to drop off, but you see where I'm going with this? He deserves a nice contract but if he is trying to get some crazy deal that is going to hurt us for a long time, then WO, WAIT a minute Demeco. What have you done for us lately? How about having another outstanding season like you did your rookie season or show that you're a tpo 5 LB in the league and then command that kind of pay day. I want Demeco for a long time just as much as the next guy, but he hasn't done enough in the last two seasons to be asking to be paid like a top 5 ELITE LB.
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Old 04-08-2009   #24
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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Originally Posted by GP View Post
I think $42 million is steep. Don't care which LB it is.

DeMeco is getting a lot of hype here, and I have to wonder if it's because he's on a quasi-good team (ours) and not because he can really command that kind of coin. Teams' fans tend to live in a bit of a bubble, and this feels like one of those instances.

Outside of Pro Bowls, what are we really judging players' "worth" upon? I don't know where I am going with this, but I just know that I (as a Texans fan) am not comfortable with us giving DeMeco a fat contract yet.

I want him to have not a Hot one, and not a Cold one....but a juuuust right one. Think "Goldilocks & The Three Bears" analogy. Nothing big, noting small, but something halfway.

If he's wanting top 5 money....well, I don't think he's there yet. Just my .02
name 5 mlb's better than Meco. you can name a few but by the time your down to 5, your struggling. add on his leadership, communication & durability (playing through injuries) value & 7m is no way an overpayment
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Old 04-08-2009   #25
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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Originally Posted by Texecutioner View Post
Agreed. He had an outstanding rookie season, a very good 2nd season, and just a good 3rd season. So his production has slowly dropped off each season. I don't think it will continue to drop off, but you see where I'm going with this? He deserves a nice contract but if he is trying to get some crazy deal that is going to hurt us for a long time, then WO, WAIT a minute Demeco. What have you done for us lately? How about having another outstanding season like you did your rookie season or show that you're a tpo 5 LB in the league and then command that kind of pay day. I want Demeco for a long time just as much as the next guy, but he hasn't done enough in the last two seasons to be asking to be paid like a top 5 ELITE LB.

A rookie contract is based on the direction that the player was going in college and a hope of where the he will be going in the NFL. A veteran contract is based on the direction that he was going in previous years and where he is most likely to be going in his upcoming years. A smart GM will be weary of a player heading the wrong direction, placing more of the responsibility on the player to prove himself, with a shorter and smaller contract. Rookies commonly hit jackpots on a hope and a prayer. Veterans usually only hit the jackpot with an earned consistent, and usually increasing trend of production.

We've had more than enough examples of veteran players being paid unreasonable contracts given to them when past performance trends were, at best, questionable, and many times predictable of future poor performance. The GM should be taking all of this into consideration when constructing contracts for Demeco and Dunta. Will Demeco return to the Demeco we remember? Will Dunta ever return to a level that he is somehow blindly credited with but never truly achieved yet......for that matter even return to that energetic yet underachieving status demonstrated prior to his injury? Indeed, hard choices for all those involved.
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Old 04-08-2009   #26
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

I can't wait until all three of them get signed and get it over with. This is driving me crazy.
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Old 04-09-2009   #27
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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Originally Posted by Goldensilence View Post
Am I the only who gets the feeling that DeMeco is going to end up like AJ? Signing a long term extension that is cap friendly? Just get him and OD signed.

Far as Dunta is concerned, I don't think it's a hunch when you balk at 23 Million. He wants out and that's fine. I'm preprared for the Texans w/o him. If Jenkins falls to 15 and we run to the podium with the pick it would not suprise me to see Dunta on the trade block while his value is the highest.
If he's truly looking to get out of houston, what u think we could be back in return.. nfl teams normally trade there good player's to bad teams, for something good in return.. If he want's to act like a lil then he can peace out.. i value his talent and think we really do need him, but I don't want player's who don't want to play for us
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Old 04-09-2009   #28
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

Dunta for Michael Bush. I don't want Dunta to go but you have to think that sounds good.
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Old 04-09-2009   #29
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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Originally Posted by El Tejano View Post
Dunta for Michael Bush. I don't want Dunta to go but you have to think that sounds good.
That sounds awful. We can acquire better RBs for our system with one of our 4th round picks. The worst case scenario for the Dunta situation is that we keep him this year and we feel that we can't franchise him next season and we let him walk. Even if that happens, we still will end up with a 3rd round compensatory draft pick. So, there is no way I trade Dunta this year without some high end compensation. Keeping him this year gives us the chance to evaluate Molden and give him some live game action. I'd trade Dunta for something like a 2nd and 3rd this year. Or, a 3rd this year and a 2nd next year that could conditionally become a first. Anything less than that, and I'm keeping him. Also, Dunta really wants to win. If the Texans have a great season, he may be more inclined to take a deal similar to what we offered him. And, remember, the compensatory pick backstop is always there. If you look at the great organizations: New England, Phillie, Indy, Pittsbugh... they often let contracts expire and then scoop of the compensatory picks. It works!
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Old 04-09-2009   #30
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
That sounds awful. We can acquire better RBs for our system with one of our 4th round picks. The worst case scenario for the Dunta situation is that we keep him this year and we feel that we can't franchise him next season and we let him walk. Even if that happens, we still will end up with a 3rd round compensatory draft pick. So, there is no way I trade Dunta this year without some high end compensation. Keeping him this year gives us the chance to evaluate Molden and give him some live game action. I'd trade Dunta for something like a 2nd and 3rd this year. Or, a 3rd this year and a 2nd next year that could conditionally become a first. Anything less than that, and I'm keeping him. Also, Dunta really wants to win. If the Texans have a great season, he may be more inclined to take a deal similar to what we offered him. And, remember, the compensatory pick backstop is always there. If you look at the great organizations: New England, Phillie, Indy, Pittsbugh... they often let contracts expire and then scoop of the compensatory picks. It works!
I think you're selling Michael Bush short......he could've been the top back taken if he didn't break his leg. The guy has major talent, he's just stuck on a team that is stacked at that position, but when given a chance he's produced. I think he's the next Michael Turner and if McFadden doesn't rebound next season he could even push to take that job in the long run.

I don't think Oakland would trade for Dunta though, because didn't they just sign Nnamdi Asomugha to a record breaking contract? If they trade for Dunta, they'll only do it if they can reach some kind of long term deal with him and he's going to want to be paid too....

I think for the right player/draft pick you can get Bush, but I don't think they want Dunta and the contract that he's going to demand.
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Old 04-09-2009   #31
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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Originally Posted by Carr Bombed View Post
I think you're selling Michael Bush short......he could've been the top back taken if he didn't break his leg. The guy has major talent, he's just stuck on a team that is stacked at that position, but when given a chance he's produced. I think he's the next Michael Turner and if McFadden doesn't rebound next season he could even push to take that job in the long run.

I don't think Oakland would trade for Dunta though, because didn't they just sign Nnamdi Asomugha to a record breaking contract? If they trade for Dunta, they'll only do it if they can reach some kind of long term deal with him and he's going to want to be paid too....

I think for the right player/draft pick you can get Bush, but I don't think they want Dunta and the contract that he's going to demand.

I like Michael Bush. That's not what I'm saying. However, he's a little slow for our system and he's only one year away from becoming a FA. So, I wouldn't give Dunta up for that. We can get someone like Rashod Jennings, Andre Brown, Shonn Greene for our 3rd this year and still have Dunta on the roster. Those RBs will be ours for cheap for 4 years. And, we'd still have Dunta's services through this season with an opportunity to still re-sign him or trade him next off-season. And, my point is, even if we don't re-sign or trade him, we still get a 3rd round pick when he signs with another team. If Oakland wants to give us a 2nd round pick and M.Bush, then I'd be interested.
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Old 04-09-2009   #32
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
I like Michael Bush. That's not what I'm saying. However, he's a little slow for our system and he's only one year away from becoming a FA. So, I wouldn't give Dunta up for that. We can get someone like Rashod Jennings, Andre Brown, Shonn Greene for our 3rd this year and still have Dunta on the roster. Those RBs will be ours for cheap for 4 years. And, we'd still have Dunta's services through this season with an opportunity to still re-sign him or trade him next off-season. And, my point is, even if we don't re-sign or trade him, we still get a 3rd round pick when he signs with another team. If Oakland wants to give us a 2nd round pick and M.Bush, then I'd be interested.
This trade wouldn't go down unless both teams could reach contract extensions with both players...that's usually how this kinda trade works. This is pretty much why I said this trade has no chance, because after the Raiders signed the contract they did with Nnamdi Asomugha, they aren't going to be willing to reach a extension with Dunta....atleast not for the money that he thinks he's worth.
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Old 04-09-2009   #33
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bombed View Post
I think you're selling Michael Bush short......he could've been the top back taken if he didn't break his leg. The guy has major talent, he's just stuck on a team that is stacked at that position, but when given a chance he's produced. I think he's the next Michael Turner and if McFadden doesn't rebound next season he could even push to take that job in the long run.

I don't think Oakland would trade for Dunta though, because didn't they just sign Nnamdi Asomugha to a record breaking contract? If they trade for Dunta, they'll only do it if they can reach some kind of long term deal with him and he's going to want to be paid too....

I think for the right player/draft pick you can get Bush, but I don't think they want Dunta and the contract that he's going to demand.
Thats assuming Oakland uses logic to make decisions. They're nuts.
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Old 04-09-2009   #34
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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Originally Posted by jshabang View Post
The team's official website confirms that the Texans are in negotiations with DeMeco Ryans about a contract extension.
Ryans is skipping voluntary workouts to expedite a deal. The 24-year-old is probably using Lofa Tatupu's six-year, $42M extension as a benchmark. Source: houstontexans.com

hope all this stuff works out for the best
I see that Rotoworld picked this up first.

I've looked over the HT website and haven't seen anything.

It would be unusual for HT.com to report on anything of the kind, and if Ryans has just fired his representation, I thought it takes 5 days before he is allowed to hire someone new.
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Old 04-09-2009   #35
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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I see that Rotoworld picked this up first.

I've looked over the HT website and haven't seen anything.

It would be unusual for HT.com to report on anything of the kind, and if Ryans has just fired his representation, I thought it takes 5 days before he is allowed to hire someone new.
This is the article that Rotoworld links to.

It says nothing about how the Texans are currently talking to Ryans. It mentions they were in talks with Ryans before.

And Ryans eventually got to the point that he was not optimistic that something would work out.

The interview with 790 is the only one that got Ryans' version.
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Old 04-09-2009   #36
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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That sounds awful. We can acquire better RBs for our system with one of our 4th round picks. The worst case scenario for the Dunta situation is that we keep him this year and we feel that we can't franchise him next season and we let him walk. Even if that happens, we still will end up with a 3rd round compensatory draft pick. So, there is no way I trade Dunta this year without some high end compensation. Keeping him this year gives us the chance to evaluate Molden and give him some live game action. I'd trade Dunta for something like a 2nd and 3rd this year. Or, a 3rd this year and a 2nd next year that could conditionally become a first. Anything less than that, and I'm keeping him. Also, Dunta really wants to win. If the Texans have a great season, he may be more inclined to take a deal similar to what we offered him. And, remember, the compensatory pick backstop is always there. If you look at the great organizations: New England, Phillie, Indy, Pittsbugh... they often let contracts expire and then scoop of the compensatory picks. It works!
I think you're right.

My post was made at like 12am so I didn't put much thought to it and thought about adding some flavor to the thread.
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Old 04-09-2009   #37
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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This is the article that Rotoworld links to.

It says nothing about how the Texans are currently talking to Ryans. It mentions they were in talks with Ryans before.

And Ryans eventually got to the point that he was not optimistic that something would work out.

The interview with 790 is the only one that got Ryans' version.
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Old 04-10-2009   #38
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

Demeco is the clear cut leader of the defense. Pay the man!!!!
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Old 04-10-2009   #39
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

I would suspect that the obstacle (Demeco's contract) is not the base salary, but more the length of contract ................short vs. long-term........and, accordingly, the proportional differential that would be involved in the guaranteed portion.
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Old 04-10-2009   #40
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Default Re: Ryans and Texans in negotiation phase

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Originally Posted by Hoth-Boy View Post
Betwwen this and Ryans firing his agent, one gets the feeling that the agent may have been more of the issue then Ryans.
This reminds me of what the Rockets went through with Carl Landry this summer. Most of the problems were beacause of his agent.
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