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Old 01-18-2005   #1
SESupergenius
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Post Texans Draft History - Grades

It's been said that we can be able to grade a draft after 3 years. Well its been 3 since the 2002 draft and we can now start to hand out grades.



2002
1st round
pick
01 QB Carr, Carr Fresno St

2nd round

01 WR Gaffney, Jabar Florida
18 OT Pitts, Chester San Diego State - Houston Supplemental Selection

3rd round
01 OG Weary, Fred Tennessee
18 DT Hill, Charles Maryland - Houston Supplemental Selection

4th round
01 RB Wells, Jonathan Ohio State
18 (Traded to Atlanta for 3 round pick in 2003) - Houston Supplemental Selection

5th round
01 RB Baxter, Jarrod New Mexico
18 SS Walker, Ramon Pittsburgh

6th round
01 CB Faggins, Demarcus Kansas State
19 DE Green, Howard Louisiana State - Houston Supplemental Selection

7th round
18 DE White, Greg Minnesota - Houston Supplemental Selection
50 DT Miller, Ahmad Nevada-Las Vegas - Houston Supplemental Selection


-------------------------------
2003
1st Round
03 WR Andre Johnson Miami

2nd Round
04 (Traded this and 4th round pick to NE for 2nd round pick 9th and a 3rd round #11 pick)
09 TE Bennie Joppru Michigan( from NE)


3rd Round
03 LB Antwan Peek Cincinnati
11 OT Seth Wand N.W. Missouri (from NE 2nd round trade)
19 (traded this and 7th round pick to OAK for 2004 2nd round pick) - Houston Supplemental Selection
24 QB Dave Ragone Louisville - (from Atl 2002 4th round 19th pick trade) -

4th Rounds
04 RB Domanick Davis Louisiana State
20 (traded to NE in 2nd round trade) - Houston Supplemental Selection


5th Rounds
3 (Traded to IND for 2004 4th round pick)
19 (traded to NE in 3/03 for OT Greg Robinson - Houston Supplemental Selection traded to NE

6th Round
04 OG Milford Brown - Florida State - (used in 2002 supplemental draft
19 QB Drew Henson Michigan - Houston Supplemental Selection
41 DT Keith Wright - Compensatory selection for Expansion

7th round
03 DB Curry Burns Louisville
19 C Chance Pearce Texas A&M - Houston Supplemental Selection
48 (traded to Oak in 3rd round trade) - Compensatory selection for Expansion


2004
1st round
10 CB Robinson, Dunta South Carolina
27 DE Babin, Jason Western Michigan (from TEN for this & 5th rnd for 2nd, 3rd and 5th picks

2nd round
01 RB Tony Hollings Georgia Tech (used in supplemental draft)
09 (traded to TEN for 1st round pick)

3rd round
08 (traded to TEN for 1st round pick)

4th round
07 (traded to TEN for 1st round pick)
26 SS Earl, Glenn Notre Dame (from Indy 2003 trade of 5th round 3rd pick)

5th round
06 (traded to TEN for 1st round pick)
27 (from Ten in 1st round trade then traded to JAC for 6th & 7th round picks)

6th round
05 CB Duff, Vontez Notre Dame
10 FS Lord, Jammal Nebraska - (from JAC trade in 5th round)
35 LB Anderson, Charlie Mississippi - Compensatory Selection


7th round
10 LB Orr, Raheem Rutgers - (from JAC trade in 5th round)
11 WR Thomas, Sloan Texas
47 QB Symons, B.J Texas Tech - Compensatory pick


2005

Houston has Dallas' 3rd round pick (Compensation for QB Drew Henson deal in 2004)
Houston has a conditional 7th Round pick from Kansas City ****(Compensation for P Steve Cheek deal in 20004)


Grades
2002 draft - Grade C+
The selection of Carr was almost a given, but if we chose, we had our chance at Julius Peppers, to say whether one is better than the other at this stage in their game would not be fair. I maintain that they are both equal. Our second rounders do not seem to be breaking away from the competition. Gaffney as a couple of good games as does Pitts, but niether are establishing themselves as solid starters, something you need from your 2nd round picks. Especially when you look that we passed over Foster, Reed, Fonoti, Pearson, and Williams, Tank.. 3rd rounder Hill and Weary are almost considered complete busts. Hill is not on the team and Weary is just not the guy to handle the position, seems like a career backup that barely makes teams. The 4th round pick of Wells seems to be decent considering that he had no line his 1st year and Mack was brought in the 2nd. We did a nice move in trading up to get a third round for the 2003 draft, but could have done our homework and drafted Davey, Rohan or FB Davenport, Najeh with those picks. 5th round picks of Walker and Baxter were decent, but both have not contriubuted much. Several players in this round are still with their teams and contribute. The 6th round pick of Faggins is enough to make up for the poo poo in the 5th round. Thee were only a couple of guys in the 7th round that play significantly for any team, but none are on ours.

Overall I would grade this draft as a C+, its a little better than average. But missed opportunities kept it from being a good draft.
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Old 01-18-2005   #2
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Interesting post. Here's how I see it.

1. Carr A
2. Gaffney B-
Pitts B-
3. Weary C- (injuries)
Hill D-
4. Wells B-
Trade B
5. Baxter B
Walker C
6. Faggins B
7. & 8. - ****-shoot

I guess I was a little more generous, I give it a B-.
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Old 01-18-2005   #3
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i can live with your grade genius, good post. everything I've read over a 3 year period has the Texans grade in the C category
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Old 01-18-2005   #4
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Quote:
2002
1st round
01 QB Carr, Carr Fresno St
Trying to develop a QB makes sense IMO as they typically take several years to hit their stride. Harrington and Ramsey, the other 1st rounders haven't done anything to show they would have been better choices. Big question, was there anyone better than Banks to pull in as a vet and groom Carr more? Carr has plenty of things to work on still, but has shown steady progress each year--solid pick.

Quote:
2nd round
01 WR Gaffney, Jabar Florida
18 OT Pitts, Chester San Diego State - Houston Supplemental Selection
Pitts was bad in 2002, but showed dramatic improvement in 2003 and while still inconsistant in his new position in 2004 is a road grader on the left hand side--needs to cut down the penalties and improve pass protection, although doesn't get the help from C he should. Barring injury, IMO he will be LG for years. Not going to get into the Portis thing, been done too many times before.

Gaffney has done better than other 2nd round WR's on more established teams--Josh Reed, Tim Carter, Reche Caldwell & Andre Davis. He has dropped one ball each of the last two years--seems like a solid but underutilized player (Carr work on those progressions please). Foster has shown flashes, but when you get down to it his production hasn't been greater than DD's, behind a far superior OL and he has even more injury problems.

Quote:
3rd round
01 OG Weary, Fred Tennessee
18 DT Hill, Charles Maryland - Houston Supplemental Selection
This round really didn't turn out well. Hill--bust. Weary--wish he could push McKinney/Brown, but so far he evidently isn't showing anything in practice. Certainly not a success story.

Quote:
4th round
01 RB Wells, Jonathan Ohio State
18 (Traded to Atlanta for 3 round pick in 2003) - Houston Supplemental Selection
Wells--OL aside, who would have thought a RB that big could run that soft and hesitant?--but in his 3rd year he is a stand-out on special teams and seemed to be getting his running together. At least a solid backup, which is what happens in the 4th, some backups, some DD's. Lot's of picks, trading some for future higher picks is a good idea.

Quote:
5th round
01 RB Baxter, Jarrod New Mexico
18 SS Walker, Ramon Pittsburgh
Walker IMO was a very good pick that we haven't received the full benefit of because of injury. Absent Walker last year, noone is talking about how close we came to beating the Patriots--he blocked both the punt and field goal--special teams standout that may develop at SS. Baxter seems like another solid value pick--once again obscured by injury.

Quote:
6th round
01 CB Faggins, Demarcus Kansas State
19 DE Green, Howard Louisiana State - Houston Supplemental Selection
Faggins, great value pick. Easily outweighs the Green pick.

Quote:
7th round
18 DE White, Greg Minnesota - Houston Supplemental Selection
50 DT Miller, Ahmad Nevada-Las Vegas - Houston Supplemental Selection
Nothing worked here, but can you ever call a 7th round pick a bust?

No draft ever hits on all picks and after a year or two every draft could be improved by cherry picking other players with the benefit of hindsight. Grade: B- so far with the potential still to go higher.
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Old 01-18-2005   #5
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I'd give them a B++ myself. Starting a franchise from ground zero, you have to draft for needs regardless of talent in some places in the first year. I think we did well and formed a team with no glaring holes like the expansion 2.0 Browns formed.

Only one first day player pick is not on the team in the history of the franchise. If you look back to the 2002 draft it was a weak year for talent. Just look at the draft after round 3. Not too many names that pop out at you. Grades should be in the context of talent available also. In years two and three we didn't have to draft for need as much and have developed a full roster that isn't an offense-only unit or mostly just a defensive team with a pitiful offense. We have a well rounded unit on offense, defense and special teams and can match up to any team in the league and are still developing on many levels. Many teams cannot say this.
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Old 01-18-2005   #6
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That amounts to 33 picks.I count 10 contributors.Out of the 10 I think 5 or 6 could be really good .C+ is a good grade
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Old 01-19-2005   #7
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Yes I am looking more at facts than potential. Injuries are part of not playing and not contributing, so really so far we have not reached a better grade than C+. Sure a few of them have some potential to be outstanding, but more than a few have the potential to be complete busts.
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Old 01-19-2005   #8
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and exactly which ones do you think have the potential to be big busts, lol ?????????
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Old 01-19-2005   #9
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Ever seen Joppru play.......and i wasn't even thinking.

Last edited by SESupergenius; 01-19-2005 at 03:07 PM.
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Old 01-19-2005   #10
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CC has done a great job finding talent for this team, show me a team in the last 3 years who has drafted better than the Texans, and i'll show ya 31 who havent !
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Old 01-19-2005   #11
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you should also consider the free agent signings & their effect on the draft picks down the road. seems to me that Casserly was forced to over pay to get quality free agents to sign with the expansion Texans to try & put the best possible competitive team on the field from the start. now we have several big contracts that don't neccessarily reflect their market value. the time will come & sooner than later when the Texans will need to lock up some of our better players like Carr, AJ, Dunta, Dominack and faced with some tough decisions of who to let go, hence who to draft.

to give the Texans a B++ when the Texans have had excellent draft position for three consecutive years & selected
  • #33 Houston Gaffney, Jabar WR Florida (2002)
  • #50 Houston Pitts, Chester T San Diego State (2002)
  • Tony Hollings (would have been #33 overall) 2003
  • #41 Houston Bennie Joppru TE Michigan (2003)

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Old 01-19-2005   #12
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Casserly and Co. have done an adequate job, but not a great one, don't fool yourself. We all love the Texans, but let's be a little rational.

Here I'll give you 2 that have had better drafts than us and I haven't even explored the other 29. Now it's your turn to give me 29 more that were worse.

Partiots

2002
Rd Sel# Player Pos. School
1 21 Graham, Daniel TE Colorado Still on the team
2 65 Branch, Deion WR Louisville Still on the team
4 117 Davey, Rohan QB Louisiana State
4 126 Green, Jarvis DE Louisiana State
7 237 Womack, Antwoine RB Virginia
7 253 Givens, David WR Notre Dame

2003
Rd Sel# Player Pos. School
1 13 Ty Warren DE Texas A&M
2 36 Eugene Wilson CB Illinois
2 45 Bethel Johnson WR Texas A&M
4 117 Dan Klecko NT Temple
4 120 Asante Samuel CB Central Florida
5 164 Dan Koppen C Boston College
6 201 Kliff Kingsbury QB Texas Tech
7 234 Spencer Nead FB Brigham Young
7 239 Tully Banta-Cain LB California
7 243 Ethan Kelley NT Baylor

2004
1 21 Wilfork, Vince DT 6-1 344 Miami (Fla.)
1 32 Watson, Ben TE 6-3 253 Georgia
2 63 Hill, Marquise DE 6-6 297 Louisiana State
3 95 Scott, Guss SS 5-10 198 Florida
4 113 Reid, Dexter FS 5-11 187 North Carolina
4 128 Cobbs, Cedric RB 6-0 221 Arkansas
5 164 Sam, P.K. WR 6-1 196 Florida State
7 233 Morton, Christian CB 6-0 188 Illinois


Steelers

2002
Rd Sel# Player Pos. School
1 30 Simmons, Kendall G Auburn
2 62 Randle El, Antwaan WR Indiana
3 94 Hope, Chris SS Florida State
4 128 Foote, Larry ILB Michigan
5 166 Haynes, Verron FB Georgia
6 202 Mays, Lee WR Texas-El Paso
7 212 Glover, Lavar DB Cincinnati
7 242 Keisel, Brett DE Brigham Young

2003
Rd Sel# Player Pos. School
1 16 Troy Polamalu SS Southern California
2 59 Alonzo Jackson OLB Florida State
4 125 Ivan Taylor CB Louisiana-Lafayette
5 163 Brian St. Pierre QB Boston College
7 242 J.T. Wall RB Georgia


2004
Pittsburgh
Rd Sel# Player Pos. Ht. Wt. School
1 11 Roethlisberger, Ben QB 6-4 242 Miami (Ohio)
2 38 Colclough, Ricardo CB 5-10 186 Tusculum
3 75 Starks, Max OT 6-7 359 Florida
5 145 Adibi, Nathaniel DE 6-3 255 Virginia Tech
6 177 Lacy, Bo OT 6-4 294 Arkansas
6 194 Kranchick, Matt TE 6-6 258 Penn State
6 197 Caylor, Drew C 6-5 288 Stanford
7 212 Taylor, Eric DT 6-2 302 Memphis
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Old 01-19-2005   #13
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oh ok well i was beign sarcastic, but that was a bad selection of teams there buddy, how ya gonna choose 2 division winners to compare the texans against. HAHA
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Old 01-19-2005   #14
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OK, You wanna start with the "A"s and go alphabetically. I bet the Cardinals probably have had better drafts the last 3 years than we have. But still you are the one touting that there are 31 other teams. I just named 2 off the top on my head. Seriously, stop now, you are wounded.
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Old 01-19-2005   #15
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haha the cardinals, hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm your right i'm wounded cause all your talking has proved absolutely nothing. And the patriots have won 2 SB in 3 years, and the steelers have only lost 1 game this season, so i can see why those were the teams off the top of your head. but i'm sure your right cause your the big bad SESupergenius, haha ok ok i'm sorry for sticking up for the Texans cause i'm a fan on the houston texans message board ! MAybe ya should leave since ya dont really like what the texans organization has done and is doing !
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Old 01-19-2005   #16
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Nah its just fun wipping the film of some homers' rose colored glasses. You said you were gonna give me 31 other teams that were worse, so you got some backing up to do. I named 2, not just one. But anyways, so go ahead and let me know how the Cardinals draft is worse than the Texans. We'll take it from there. Who knows, maybe we can go from A-Z by the time fo the draft.
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Old 01-19-2005   #17
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I can see his point. The patriots are one of the top teams in the league, and their getting a lot of contributions from these young players. Daniel Graham, Deion Branch, David Givens, Jarvis Green, Ty Warren, Bethel Johnson, Eugene Wilson, Asante Samuel, and Vince Wilfork are all starting or making significant contributions for them. That's a sbunch of solid young players and good drafting, especially since 2 of those years they were coming off of the Super Bowl with bad draft positioning.
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Old 01-19-2005   #18
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haha na i dont have that much time on my hands. I like to have high hopes it makes the off season go by faster, plus kinda like if ya have kids, They could be the ugliest children in the world but to you they are the prettiest kids on earth. Same with me and the texans, haha weird example but what can i say ?
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Old 01-19-2005   #19
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i thought we were just focusing on the 2002 draft. (no joppru talk yet)

and from that draft alone i would have to give a B

we drafted:
  1. a franchise qb
  2. great possession receiver
  3. great offensive lineman who proved to be EXTREMELY durable and solid
  4. an excelent backup RB and special teams player in wells
  5. a corner who comes in for nickle packages who is doing good there
anyone feel the same way or agree?

but of course you have the 3rd rounder blunders. 7th rounders who you dont necessarly expect to make an impact. in the 5th round, baxter and walker need more time to show their true value and effectiveness. (baxter competing with norris while walker has injuries)
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Old 01-19-2005   #20
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Do you mean like Donald Driver, Isaac Bruce, Drew Bennet and Hines Ward great? Because those are great 2nd recievers. So Pitts is a great offensive lineman? Wells is an excellent backup?

What has the world come to.
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