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View Poll Results: The People v. Kubiak and Smith - you decide
Gary Kubiak is Guilty 4 6.35%
Richard Smith is Guilty 47 74.60%
Messrs. Kubiak and Smith are both Guilty 12 19.05%
Voters: 63. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-03-2008   #1
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Default The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Case 01-2008, The Fans of the Houston Texans v. Gary Kubiak and Richard Smith.

Ladies and Gentlemen of the Jury,

Today we begin the trial of the People (TexansTalk members) versus Gary Kubiak and Richard Smith. Messrs. Kubiak and Smith have been indicted for a serious crime against professional football and its fans -- 2nd Degree Murder of Defense. They are charged with grossly negligent and incompetent defensive scheming, coaching and execution. If convicted, Kubiak and Smith face a shameful offseason firing, a reputation as an abject failure, and will endure the everlasting wrath of the People.

I, Toxicbutt (anyone with a baby will understand the moniker), am lead counsel for the People. I will present evidence and argument to support the conviction of both Messrs. Kubiak and Smith.

Ladies and Gentlemen of the Jury, in this unique internet trial, you are to consider the somewhat flimsy evidence presented, speculate based on internet rumor and innuendo, theorize and hypothesize. After you review the evidence below, you are instructed to begin deliberations.

ThreeToedPete is the designated foreman for this jury (for reasons identified below) and is charged with helping lead the deliberations. You are instructed to interject your own wild ass theories, circumstantial evidence, and arguments. You are instructed to post arguments and evidence to sway the other jurors. After deliberations and posting is complete, please fill out the jury verdict form that is this poll.
You are to decide - Kubiak and Smith. Who gets the axe?

(A comment made by ThreeToedPete made me think this subject warrants a separate thread. Forgive me/lock if this has been covered, but I haven't seen a thread specifically on this.)

Opening Statement:
Ladies and Gentlemen of the Jury. Over span of 10 weeks, and in truth nearly 3 full seasons, the Defense of the Houston Texans is an unmitigated disaster. It is undisputable fact that this defense is among the worst of our generation. Bloggers like Texans Chick have regaled us with statistical proof gathered by freaks and geeks to show that our defense is probably the worst in the NFL in the last 3 years. This Defense has lost countless games, caused countless hours of angst and argument among fans, and frankly serves as a daily reminder as the exercise in futility that is our “professional” football team.

However, this abomination of a Defense has mutated in the last 2 weeks. Oddly, it is beginning to bear some resemblance to what other NFL teams do –blitz; QB pressure; players flying to the ball; CB's making plays; interceptions; and forced fumbles. This metamorphosis is somewhat attributable to the crappy competition. However, it is clear that the scheme is different.

The People’s approval of the improvement comes with the natural question – what the hell has been going on before? These questions have led to the indictment of Gary Kubiak and Richard Smith for 2nd Degree Murder of Defense, punishable by firing and eternal shame.

The case against Richard Smith
This atrocity is the baby of Richard Smith. We are not required to believe that Gary Kubiak bears no responsibility, but Mr. Smith is the “Defensive Coordinator” and was running things in week 1 - 10. Now, he's been told to change the scheme or responsibility has been given to Frank Bush or someone else. That's the mutation we have seen. Powerful comments from Texans players lend significant weight to this view.

Dunta Robinson, the heart and soul of the wretched defense and pound-for-pound the toughest Texan, offered this gem following a Texans loss to Baltimore -- “Kubiak man, he wants to win and he wants to win bad. Kubiak is doing his job. Maybe you guys look at some things around him, but you can’t look at him. There is not a player in the locker room that doesn’t wanna win for him."

In contrast, when specifically asked about Richard Smith, Mr. Robinson kicked Mr. Smith between the legs -- “It is what it is. As players, we’re going to go back and we’re going to go out and work hard and practice hard and get the job done.” It is what it is -- indeed.

Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury, you may also recall Jerome Solomon's column saying that players were wondering why it took so long to change a failing scheme. Mr. Solomon wrote -- “A Texans defender told me he has walked out of dozens of defensive team meetings over the past couple of seasons shaking his head .… He says he left with the thought that, as committed as he was to making it happen, he doubted the team’s plan would work. Most of the time he has been right. (Another problem is many of his teammates went into games thinking the same thing).”

Mr. Solomon, who might not know a damn thing, seems to think that Smith has been in charge of the defense - “One wonders if defensive coordinator Richard Smith decided not to take many chances or was told not to do so. Kubiak has been pretty hands-off with the defense, especially on game days, so the poor in-game strategy grade falls mostly on Smith. Smith figured the best chance to win games with his scrubby defense was to sit back and let offenses push them around. Low risk, low reward. . . . . Finally, it seems Kubiak has stepped in and spiced up his defense a bit

The evidence against Mr. Smith is harsh, but you must look at the rotting corpse that is this defunct defense. You are to consider the above, and supply your own speculation and argument.

The case against Gary Kubiak
A honored member of the People and designated foreman of this Jury, ThreeToedPete, presented a summary of the case against Mr. Kubiak that is worthy of quotation and may echo in eternity. In prose that the great Justices of the U.S. Supreme Court would envy, TTP wrote:

“And...what we know for a fact is that Kubes runs this ship like a pirate. He's the captain. No one does interviews without going through Kubiak. What you guys don't know is what is being said behind the doors. What I know is what the Denver defense has done for forty years. Rush four-cover seven. If things have mysteriously changed the last three weeks....up to you to figure out who is saying what to who. They aren't good enough yet with your tons of talent to just rush the four. That's what the HC wants. Said it in the summer. The DBs aren't athletic enough to cover for more than three seconds and just rush four. And......when they send five or six no one gets there. Been that way before Smith got here. So either your high end talent isn't getting it done. Or the HC is one stubborn SOB. Smith is merely employing the plan the HC wants. There is no way on this ship that Richard Smith enjoys complete autonomy with the defense. This has been Kubes' baby. Either way the gloves or off now. Tallent or not, they're giving you what you said you wanted....more pressure. They live and die with the blitz the rest of the season.”

May we now always envision Gary Kubiak with a patch over his eye. The historical approach of Denver cannot be denied and must be given great weight. TTP will lead arguments in favor of the conviction of Mr. Kubiak.


Ladies and Gentlemen of the Jury, you may begin deliberations.

Kubiak or Smith. You decide.
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Old 12-03-2008   #2
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

I think I needed sparks notes to get through that post.....but I think the best way to put it is


FIRE RICHARD SMITH
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Old 12-03-2008   #3
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

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Originally Posted by spurstexanstros View Post


FIRE RICHARD SMITH
Well said!
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Old 12-03-2008   #4
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Richard Smith is guilty, beyond a shadow of doubt.

As to Kubiak, who here knows if Kubiak has wanted to get rid of Smith but higher ups in the organization said wait until the off season. I would suspect if Kubiak was vocal enough about it, he could fire Smith right now if he wanted to. Although I do strongly suspect Kubiak is guilty also, I can't vote guilty for Kubiak because his guilt can't be proven beyond a shadow of doubt.

I can't believe I'm taking this seriously! LOL But hey, interesting post there ToxicButt. A nice diversion for mid-week.
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Old 12-03-2008   #5
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

As a member of the jury, I have made my delibrations.

I hereby vote to find Richard Smith guilty of 2nd Degree Murder of Defense. Send him to the stocks as soon as full judgement is passed.

I hereby acquit Gary Kubiak by reason of Texsanity. I do not find Mr. ThreetoedPete's lively indictment of Mr. Kubiak to have any supporting evidence. I will not convict with no supporting evidence. Furthermore, his yoman's work with the offense is a mitigating circumstance, and even if he were to be found guilty, I would argue for a one year probationary period at which time we can revisit said evidence.

Thank you your honor for allowing me to serve in this most important matter.
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Old 12-03-2008   #6
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Quote:
Originally Posted by Porky View Post
As a member of the jury, I have made my delibrations.

I hereby vote to find Richard Smith guilty of 2nd Degree Murder of Defense. Send him to the stocks as soon as full judgement is passed.

I hereby acquit Gary Kubiak by reason of Texsanity. I do not find Mr. ThreetoedPete's lively indictment of Mr. Kubiak to have any supporting evidence. I will not convict with no supporting evidence. Furthermore, his yoman's work with the offense is a mitigating circumstance, and even if he were to be found guilty, I would argue for a one year probationary period at which time we can revisit said evidence.

Thank you your honor for allowing me to serve in this most important matter.
Porky weren't you going to add the Smith's sentencing of Obstruction of Justice? or was there a plea bargain somewhere in there?
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Old 12-03-2008   #7
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Quote:
Originally Posted by Porky View Post
As a member of the jury, I have made my delibrations.

I hereby vote to find Richard Smith guilty of 2nd Degree Murder of Defense. Send him to the stocks as soon as full judgement is passed.

I hereby acquit Gary Kubiak by reason of Texsanity. I do not find Mr. ThreetoedPete's lively indictment of Mr. Kubiak to have any supporting evidence. I will not convict with no supporting evidence. Furthermore, his yoman's work with the offense is a mitigating circumstance, and even if he were to be found guilty, I would argue for a one year probationary period at which time we can revisit said evidence.

Thank you your honor for allowing me to serve in this most important matter.
Very nice, Porky. +Rep for ingenuity.

*edit: Have to spread the Rep first. Can someone hit'em up for me?
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Old 12-03-2008   #8
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

I vote both guilty. Sentencing should be capital punishment for Smith and one season of probation for Kubiak.
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Old 12-03-2008   #9
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf View Post
Porky weren't you going to add the Smith's sentencing of Obstruction of Justice? or was there a plea bargain somewhere in there?
Obstructing Richard Justice is a good thing, not something to be convicted of.
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Old 12-03-2008   #10
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
I vote both guilty. Sentencing should be capital punishment for Smith and one season of probation for Kubiak.
how about some community service of


for Kubiak
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Old 12-03-2008   #11
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

just a question for everybody: IF the D continues to play really well for the rest of the season and it turns out smith was the reason behind it (ie control hadnt been turned over to bush etc), is he still gone?

im not a richard smith fan or anything and id gladly send him packing (esp after dunta's comments) if it turned out frank bush had assumed control lately but i was talking to a jags fan i know and he said that jags fans didnt really like Mike Smith eventhough their D usually ranked pretty well because he was 'too conservative' so once he leaves for atlanta they bring in super-duper defensive coordinator Gregg Williams and the D goes to crap this yr

my point is that sometimes a big name d-coordinator isnt the solution. players need time to get to know schemes etc... so even if richard smith has the D playing very well by the end of the season, was the delay in the change of attitude criminal enough to send him packing? (assuming the reasoning behind that delay was the return of dunta allowed them to become aggressive and man up on wrs in the backend)
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Old 12-03-2008   #12
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Um, they both keep their jobs one more year.

EDIT: I thought it said Rick Smith. Kubiak keeps his job for one more years. Richard Smith should be gone

Last edited by TexanSam; 12-03-2008 at 04:22 PM.
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Old 12-03-2008   #13
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

i vote kubiak b/c he's the coach with absolute power to change richard smith's philosophy. Instead, he's let smith play this passive defense for 3 years which tells me that it was likely his to begin with. Furthermore, if he had a more established D-coordinator...say a monte kiffin, he probably wouldn't even have a hand in the defense b/c they know what their doing....unlike smith.
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Old 12-03-2008   #14
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Technically Richard Smith is only guilty of assault and attempted murder of a defense.
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Old 12-03-2008   #15
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maddict5 View Post
just a question for everybody: IF the D continues to play really well for the rest of the season and it turns out smith was the reason behind it (ie control hadnt been turned over to bush etc), is he still gone?

im not a richard smith fan or anything and id gladly send him packing (esp after dunta's comments) if it turned out frank bush had assumed control lately but i was talking to a jags fan i know and he said that jags fans didnt really like Mike Smith eventhough their D usually ranked pretty well because he was 'too conservative' so once he leaves for atlanta they bring in super-duper defensive coordinator Gregg Williams and the D goes to crap this yr

my point is that sometimes a big name d-coordinator isnt the solution. players need time to get to know schemes etc... so even if richard smith has the D playing very well by the end of the season, was the delay in the change of attitude criminal enough to send him packing? (assuming the reasoning behind that delay was the return of dunta allowed them to become aggressive and man up on wrs in the backend)

The Jags also traded away Marcus Stroud and I think that had a bigger impact then they thought it would.

Maddcit I continue to see this sorry trend of once we get out of playoff position the RS seems to rev the defense up to save his job. It's not like either squad we have played the past two weeks have lit it up this year.

Smith needs to go and Kubiak has next year to get the defense playing....at least mediocre.
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Old 12-04-2008   #16
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

I wonder if RS is into the "playing not to lose" instead of "playing to win" mentality and when the Playoff hunt is lost, he goes into reverse mode (like some are saying) to basically save his job
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Old 12-04-2008   #17
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maddict5 View Post
just a question for everybody: IF the D continues to play really well for the rest of the season and it turns out smith was the reason behind it (ie control hadnt been turned over to bush etc), is he still gone?

im not a richard smith fan or anything and id gladly send him packing (esp after dunta's comments) if it turned out frank bush had assumed control lately but i was talking to a jags fan i know and he said that jags fans didnt really like Mike Smith eventhough their D usually ranked pretty well because he was 'too conservative' so once he leaves for atlanta they bring in super-duper defensive coordinator Gregg Williams and the D goes to crap this yr

my point is that sometimes a big name d-coordinator isnt the solution. players need time to get to know schemes etc... so even if richard smith has the D playing very well by the end of the season, was the delay in the change of attitude criminal enough to send him packing? (assuming the reasoning behind that delay was the return of dunta allowed them to become aggressive and man up on wrs in the backend)
this is kind of my thinking as well. my question is similar to yours, if the defense continues to play well throughout the remainder of the season, i wouldn't be surprised if he remains our DC. honestly, i wouldn't be opposed either. all i want is to win football games. if the defense improves and develop some consistency and we stop turning the ball over and win some football games then i'm perfectly happy with smith as the DC. but consistency has to happen. in my eyes he's still on probation. so long as the defense continues to improve. every game since detroit they have looked better except for the Minnisota game and the Indy game. and in those games they looked good for a half. that's progress in my book. i'm not saying keep him. i'm saying i wouldn't be surprised if we do.
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Old 12-04-2008   #18
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Well I think it falls on the defensive staff, but there is something else that happened. The discovery of jokers. In any front, especialy 4 man, u need jokers. Jokers are lbs who can rush the passer enough that they're a threat when zone ressuring qbs. I remember reading a lot of posts about why the texans don't do what the giants or philly do as far as pressure. Well they were trying, but they didn't have lbs who could be pass ruushers tht wouulallowa linemaan to drop. Diles was having a good yr ackling, but that's not his thing. Bentley, who can really run and thompson, who was a 3-4 rush lb and Adibi can do that. So now the dc can zone blitz because those 3 can be sent and beat a side of a lineman and allow a lineman to drop to the hot read of the qb. Eventhough its a blitz, its only a 5 man blitz with 1 dl dropping out. Also D-Rob coming back and wilsn being there tightens windows for the qb.

So if u want to bblamme the dc for not using his personell better, then that's cool. Most head coachhes don't tell the coordinattors whaat to do when that's not the side they're know for. Now he may sit in on gameplan days and ask what the attack is, but he's notgoing to call plays or anything.
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Old 12-04-2008   #19
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

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Originally Posted by barrett View Post
this is kind of my thinking as well. my question is similar to yours, if the defense continues to play well throughout the remainder of the season, i wouldn't be surprised if he remains our DC. honestly, i wouldn't be opposed either. all i want is to win football games. if the defense improves and develop some consistency and we stop turning the ball over and win some football games then i'm perfectly happy with smith as the DC. but consistency has to happen. in my eyes he's still on probation. so long as the defense continues to improve. every game since detroit they have looked better except for the Minnisota game and the Indy game. and in those games they looked good for a half. that's progress in my book. i'm not saying keep him. i'm saying i wouldn't be surprised if we do.
this is what was said last season. and the year before. and if he stays someone will probably be repeating it again next season. we cant play defense for half a season and be satisfied with it. if smith was going to figure that out he would've done so by now and the numbers would start to balance out - instead we've been and still are in the bottom half of the league in every defensive category (and as texans chick has talked about, our index and combined numbers are some of the worst ever). there's not a thing smith can do that would earn my vote to give him yet another probationary period. let him go, bring in (or promote) someone who can aggressively challange the defense and coach up the talent we're bringing to that side of the ball.
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Old 11-20-2009   #20
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Default Re: The People versus Kubiak and Smith - 2nd Degree Murder of Defense

Dang, man. Some threads are created by kneejerkers and die. But, THIS
thread was speakin' the TRUTH!!

I especially like how Dunta went to bat for Kubiak, but pretty much swung
the axe on Richard Smith.
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