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Old 10-20-2008   #21
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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Certainly the talent level on the defense needs to improve.

But what in Richard Smith's background makes you think that he would be good at choosing that talent and developing it?

It's not like the offensive side of the ball has a ton of probowlers on it. Or any more first round picks than the defense. The wide receivers/tight ends are Andre Johnson and a bunch of guys that nobody else wanted. Owen Daniels is currently the most productive TE in the league--4th round pick.

Teams need to incorporate young players and free agents quickly into what they are doing on the field--having easily teachable schemes is crucial in the modern salary cap era.

There is no amount of time that the offense can keep the ball, and it doesn't matter how good the field position is. If you can't stop Detroit from scoring, your defense can't stop anyone.

You get situations where every body tries too hard because they can't trust that normal football play will result in normal football results.
I tried to give Smith the benefit of the doubt after seeing improvement in the defense the past 3 weeks. And, I'm still encouraged by some of what I see on the defense.

However, any D.C. that leaves Petey Faggins one on one on Calvin Johnson, the only playmaker on that team, up 18 points in the 4th quarter needs to be replaced!!
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Old 10-20-2008   #22
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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Certainly the talent level on the defense needs to improve.

But what in Richard Smith's background makes you think that he would be good at choosing that talent and developing it?

It's not like the offensive side of the ball has a ton of probowlers on it. Or any more first round picks than the defense. The wide receivers/tight ends are Andre Johnson and a bunch of guys that nobody else wanted. Owen Daniels is currently the most productive TE in the league--4th round pick.

Teams need to incorporate young players and free agents quickly into what they are doing on the field--having easily teachable schemes is crucial in the modern salary cap era.

There is no amount of time that the offense can keep the ball, and it doesn't matter how good the field position is. If you can't stop Detroit from scoring, your defense can't stop anyone.

You get situations where every body tries too hard because they can't trust that normal football play will result in normal football results.
Oh, trust me...it did occur to me that we have real issues if we can't stop the juggernaut known as Orlovsky. But I have been wondering if Richard Smith and his coaches reverted back to the bend-but-don't-break style at the half, going back to a semi-prevent defense of some sorts. We were giving up chunks and chunks of yards, and it's not like the Lions made any huge adjustments at half.

Or, did the Lions just start hitting their stride in the second half? That's something that I shared yesterday: We might have caught the Lions in the best possible moment--Still reeling from Kitna and Roy Williams situations. I think the Lions are going to be better in their next game, and we caught them in their low spot.

Regardless, I am not saying that Richard Smith is in the clear. But...Dunta is just now back. It seems they finally admitted that Weaver is not working out, so Bulman is deservedly getting those reps that were once Weaver's. Faggins is NOT a cover corner for an offense's WR1 or even its WR2, for that matter.

There's just some funky stuff going on, on the defense, with coaches AND players. I used to not buy into the "we don't enough talent, so quit banging on the d-coord..." bit. But I do have to say that the players on the field, minus Mario, DeMeco, and Diles (and maybe Dunta) are not exactly world beaters. That's three players on an 11-man defense that you can confidently say are doing a pretty good job game-in and game-out. And I know you had said that the defensive coaching/teaching sessions are way too complicated, as if the players are being asked to overthink and overprocess, etc., instead of just getting in there and playing football (for lack of a better description)...but I can see how not having enough talent is part of the problem. It's half of it, I think that's a rational assessment.

We have 8 defensive guys that are just average. And "just average" is not good enough, even against a winless team like Detroit. Or Cincy, for that matter. We have no "gimmee" games at all. And that's due to our defense. No lead is safe with our current defense.

Plus, I'm still unclear on whether it was the Dcoaches, or Faggins, at fault on the long bomb to CJ. Some are saying that Faggins didn't play what was called or that there was supposed to be help from elsewhere or that Petey misunderstood and was supposed to be the help from elsewhere, others are saying that Richard Smith had him on an island with CJ. I just don't know that we can parse Kubiak's quote on this. It could be that the coaches DID call the right coverage but that it got garbles somehow when it was called into the huddle, or some such thing.

I just don't see a really clear picture on this, which might be one of those things that Kubiak would prefer for opposing teams to not know about.

I just know that I thought we were headed to a clear-cut blowout, and once again the opposing team is within striking distance of stealing the game.
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Old 10-20-2008   #23
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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Was fun to see the Lions coach doing his version of Kubiak's "challenge flag meltdown" whereby you pray and hope that you are given a gift from the refs because you're not getting it done on the field. If y ou laughed at the Liona coach for doing that...just remember that THAT was Kubiak for the first three games.
Off the topic of this thread, but GP's snippet interested me:
I thought the Lions got screwed out of a timeout on that challenge. The replay ruled (don't ask me how) that the ball needed to be respotted. To me, that is a successful challenge--it corrected the original spot--so the timeout should not have been charged. Now, the new spot still resulted in a first down, but that is extraneous to the call that was challenged. Of course, maybe the ***** Lion coach phrased his challenge in terms of "was it a first down" rather than "did you spot it correctly". If that is the difference, coaches need to know they need to be extremely careful in how they phrase their challenges. That Lions really needed that lost timeout on our final quasi-drive.

Back on topic:
I'm not one to call for canning anyone easily (bad karma), but if ever a situation justified a hot seat for a coach, it would be when:
(a) Your team is leading 28-10
(b) Your punter just pinned the opponent inside their 5
(c) About 12 minutes left in the game
(d) The opposing offense has one, ONE legitimate downfield threat
(e) Opposite that player, you line up the sorriest of your sorry CBs, who, among other things, gives up at least 6 inches to said deep threat
(f) . . . while giving said cornerback no discernible safety help
(g) and you watch what happens.
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Old 10-20-2008   #24
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
However, any D.C. that leaves Petey Faggins one on one on Calvin Johnson, the only playmaker on that team, up 18 points in the 4th quarter needs to be replaced!!
I expected 1-2 HUGE plays by the Detroit Offense in my final score prediction, but Faggins mano-a-mano w/ Calvin Johnson is a mismatch of EPIC proportions. Petey is still fine as a nickel/dime coverage guy, he is NOT (never was/will be) a #1 or #2 CB. Expecting him to be and putting him in those kind of situations is outright silly.

To be honest, I've got no problem w/ using a PRESS coverage, but you usually leave a safety over the top. The time to press is when you bring pressure...that play still took some time to develop and the "front seven" never got to the QB.
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Old 10-20-2008   #25
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

Richard Smith & every other DC rolls the dice weighting risk vs reward ratio. Marinelli has been so damn conservative in his playcalling & use of Calvin Johnson so this time he caught coverage with its pants down. hey it happens, but still only two catches in a game for Calvin Johnson, I can live with, having time to throw the deep ball thats another when you press the box.

The Texans lack, have lacked & always lacked since inception speed W/coverage skills over the top with their safeties which should directly point the curser @ the biggest hole on this team, FS. blame Smith all day & his coaching staff but until Rick Smith can address this position with some speed in the draft plays like this will happen unless Texans use cover 2 or soft zone prevent & nobody wants that do they?
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Old 10-20-2008   #26
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

It was yet another failure in a Richard Smith defense to let Faggins get burned deep. It's not like we haven't see it before, and I'm afraid that we will see it again as long as RS is our DC.
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Old 10-20-2008   #27
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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It was yet another failure in a Richard Smith defense to let Faggins get burned deep. It's not like we haven't see it before, and I'm afraid that we will see it again as long as RS is our DC.
I'm pretty sure we'll see Petey getting burned deep as long as he's a starting corner regardless who the co-ordiantor is...
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Old 10-20-2008   #28
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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I'm pretty sure we'll see Petey getting burned deep as long as he's a starting corner regardless who the co-ordiantor is...
You're probably right, but maybe it's a Richard Smith thing to have Faggins as our starting CB.
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Old 10-20-2008   #29
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

I wonder what happens at practice. How in the world do they stop the offense besides from Mario getting pressure. Schaub probably has a field day w/ the LB's and DB's trying to cover. LOL
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Old 10-20-2008   #30
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

The Faggins 97 yd TD just brings to light another problem with Smith's scheme: your best CB should be on the opposition's best WR wherever he's at. In his scheme, the CB's play their side of the field & that's it. I have to believe that Orlovsky only throws that ball b/c he (or the coaching staff) saw that mismatch from jump & finally caught us with no safety help over the top.

Sure, Reeves isn't much better but he's usually in position & at least makes it a bit tougher on Johnson to catch the ball & makes Orlovsky question whether he wants to throw it...With Faggins, both of those questions were considerably easier to answer when your toasted by 5 yards from the LOS.
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Old 10-20-2008   #31
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

that play wasn't all petey's fault. to not have any safety help against CJ is asking for trouble. smith just fails week after week to not give up big plays. when you watch a smith coordinated defense, watch how many times players are covering the same area and covering no one at all. then watch a competent coach's defense. its just so obvious sometimes.
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Old 10-20-2008   #32
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

A lot of good points on this thread. I don't know whether it was Faggins failure, but even if he did make a mistake - he should have never been out there alone.

It is not just about one play - it is about understanding the team and the situation in the game. Start of the fourth quarter and coming off a touchdown - we didn't need to get a sack in the endzone, we needed to just keep them in front of us and make them march 95 plus yards and score on us. The 1 thing the coaching staff had to prevent was allowing them to make a quick score - and they completely failed.
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Old 10-20-2008   #33
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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However, any D.C. that leaves Petey Faggins on the field needs to be replaced!!
There, fixed it for you.
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Old 10-20-2008   #34
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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Oh, trust me...it did occur to me that we have real issues if we can't stop the juggernaut known as Orlovsky. But I have been wondering if Richard Smith and his coaches reverted back to the bend-but-don't-break style at the half, going back to a semi-prevent defense of some sorts. We were giving up chunks and chunks of yards, and it's not like the Lions made any huge adjustments at half.

Or, did the Lions just start hitting their stride in the second half? That's something that I shared yesterday: We might have caught the Lions in the best possible moment--Still reeling from Kitna and Roy Williams situations. I think the Lions are going to be better in their next game, and we caught them in their low spot.

The Lions have had very slow offensive starts to a number of their games and have gotten in big holes.

The Lions saw something that they liked in coverage and exploited it. Don't have a link but here's the quote from Marinelli:

Quote:
(on if it is discussed at halftime to get WR Calvin Johnson the football more) Not necessarily. We knew we wanted to take advantage of some looks; that touchdown was one of them. Its much bigger than CJ (WR Calvin Johnson). Its the team. Were trying to do things to help us win, but I need to do a better job of getting him (WR Calvin Johnson) the ball.
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Old 10-20-2008   #35
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

The defense came out flat after playing on fire in the first half. That's on the coaches.

Since Kubiak and Smith have been here, the personnel on defense has (almost) totally turned over and the guys that are there were brought in by Kubiak and Smith.

After 3 years, there's no excuse for their guys not to be productive after they had all this time to pick and develop them.

I was under the impression that Richard Smith was a stop-gap until someone better came along anyway. By now, better coaches have come along and some are even on his staff.

The bottom line is that the guy hasn't produced.
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Old 10-20-2008   #36
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

Every offense exploits things that defenses give them....

Too bad they didn't throw CJ the ball more, because we covered him one on one quite often...

Guess their coaches were too dumb to take full advantage of our dumb coaches...
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Old 10-20-2008   #37
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

Seriously, why hasn't Kubiak fired or demoted Richard Smith yet? Its not as if we do not have capable replacements who can take his place. Frank Bush is on the staff and was his first choice to be DC for God's sake. Not to mention, Ray Rhodes who has tons of experience and was a successful DC for years in the league is on the staff as well.

Our long, looping blitzes suck ass. I am not at all enamored with this coaching staff. If we could get Cowher or Schottenheimer in here next year we shouldn't blink for one second. Kubiak has shown me nothing that would lead me to believe that he is or will be a top flight coach in this league. If I were to rank NFL coaches in this league, he would be in my bottom third no doubt.

Main areas of responsibility for a head coach, clock management and challenges, he absolutely sucks at. We have looked uprepared several times and have come out flat and that is squarely on coaching. His mistakes in judgment personnel wise with first Carr then overpaying for Schaub are fire worthy offenses in their own right. He needs to feel some heat and make a change that can be done right now. FIRE RICHARD SMITH!!!
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Old 10-20-2008   #38
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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Richard Smith & every other DC rolls the dice weighting risk vs reward ratio. Marinelli has been so damn conservative in his playcalling & use of Calvin Johnson so this time he caught coverage with its pants down. hey it happens, but still only two catches in a game for Calvin Johnson, I can live with, having time to throw the deep ball thats another when you press the box.
When you are up by 18 points with 12 minutes to go and you have the opponent pinned inside their 5, I see only risk in that type of coverage. The only way you lose a game like that is by allowing quick scores (be they big plays by the opposing offense or via turnovers).

Worst case is you force Orlovsky to engineer a long drive while trading yards for time off the clock. Heck, to that point, Orlovsky had yet to show he could lead such a march--the previous TD drive was 3 plays featuring two long runs (I'm not counting the throw-away drive with the meaningless hail mary as a sustained drive). Instead, we gave the Lions a huge play, momentum and eight points off the lead at the cost of only the amount of time it took Johnson to sprint 96 basically-uncontested yards.

I know "prevent" and "bend but don't break" are not popular terms for fans, but there was absolutely no reason at that moment to put Petey on an island against the one and only big-play threat the Lions had. That's a high-risk, low-reward endeavor.
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Old 10-20-2008   #39
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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that play wasn't all petey's fault. to not have any safety help against CJ is asking for trouble. smith just fails week after week to not give up big plays. when you watch a smith coordinated defense, watch how many times players are covering the same area and covering no one at all. then watch a competent coach's defense. its just so obvious sometimes.
Or dropping Bulman back into coverage and he's 20 yards from the nearest Lions WR...and he's going to cover one of them? I hate this playcall the most. It makes NO sense because the only benefit it could serve is if a WR or RB is cutting right into that area and the ball is traveling right into Bulman/Weaver's face. Cuz there's no way Bulman or Weaver will be staying on top of a RB/WR/TE who can make a simple cut and cause Bulman or Weaver to fall down like a fool.

I also noticed a lot of zone in both the LB and DBs, where the WRs/RBs/TEs are just running to open areas of the field and catching everything thrown their way.

Shouldn't a defense be usingt the zone in such a way as that it's used after showing blitz, or actually blitzing...to lull the QB into thinking he can get the ball past the blitzing defenders, yet they've dropped back into the open areas that the QB expected?

We seemed to be running a zone a lot in the second half, which was my comment earlier in this thread about it appearing that we had a bend-but-not-break defense out there in the second half.
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Old 10-20-2008   #40
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Default Re: Did Kubiak just call out Richard Smith?

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
Richard Smith & every other DC rolls the dice weighting risk vs reward ratio. Marinelli has been so damn conservative in his playcalling & use of Calvin Johnson so this time he caught coverage with its pants down. hey it happens, but still only two catches in a game for Calvin Johnson, I can live with, having time to throw the deep ball thats another when you press the box.

The Texans lack, have lacked & always lacked since inception speed W/coverage skills over the top with their safeties which should directly point the curser @ the biggest hole on this team, FS. blame Smith all day & his coaching staff but until Rick Smith can address this position with some speed in the draft plays like this will happen unless Texans use cover 2 or soft zone prevent & nobody wants that do they?


Am I the only person who believes that Smith, as DC,must have some input into the drafting process. And, I'm sure that he also, must be getting talent evaluation from scouts. So, If there is a lack of talent on this team, can that not also be traced back in part to Smith also? I know Kubiak and Smith the GM are the primary people who pick the players in the draft and free agency, but there is no way that anyone camn make me believe that the DC does not have at least some influence on those decisions.
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