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Old 08-21-2008   #21
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
TC, your first post was dead on....

But, do you think having Ray Rhodes is going to help/change anything?? I know he's just the secondary coach, but if you've got him, wouldn't you pick his brain in other aspects of the defensive scheme??

I mean, I would.
Weaver when he was on 1560 am said that Rhodes has simplied the defensive line calls. That what they are doing is similar, but he cleaned it up and made it easier to do. What this entails, I have no idea. I'd put the link here because I only heard it in passing, but 1560 podcast stuff isn't working well right now.

Given that, I am guessing that Rhodes has an influence beyond "assistant DB coach." I've been told by a number of people that titles for the Texans are very loose--that the coaches are very collaborative.

I've been on the look out for Rhodes' influence--either in a good way or in a too many cooks spoil the soup way. To early to say.

Generally speaking though, I am worried any time the solution to a situation is "well we are going to coach him up." Whether it is Rhodes having a big impact on the defense, or coaching up Reeves, or whatever. Gibbs has the resume of being able to coach up people, even when they aren't necessarily great fits (i.e. Atlanta).
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Old 08-21-2008   #22
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
I don't know. To me, it's like asking me whether I'd rather be shot or stabbed.
Since there are three of them to pick from don't rule out being struck in the head with a blunt object.
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Old 08-21-2008   #23
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

I would keep Thompson because he's still young and could possibly be here when the young guys really hit there stride .

The pass rush is kinda like the OL of a couple of years ago . It seems that no matter who we draft or pickup ... it does'nt work so well . So does this mean our guys are overated or is it a bad scheme .
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Old 08-21-2008   #24
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
I like the rusher we will have in 2009.

The pass rush issue is a part of a larger issue. Why should we expect it to be any better than last year when most of the parts of the team are the same?

Everybody that the Texans have on the other side of Mario haven't shown that they can do it or that they still have it. And the Texans still have the issues in the secondary. And other than Ryans, the linebacking group isn't anything to write home about.

Our defense is a couple of really good guys mixed with some promising young guys and a bunch of make do. But you might say, "Hey, there are all sorts of teams that depend on young players to make a difference." But those would be teams with defensive coordinators who have a track record of knowing what they are doing.

Do you ever see how the Texans defense is lining up before the snap and say WTH? And not in a good way. "Let's all crowd the middle of the line, play slapfest with offensive linemen, and then watch the ball bounce outside where nobody is."

To think that the Texans are going to have much more pass rush, you have to bet on a huge improvement of Okoye, that a healthy Weaver actually means something, that a collection of old guys and never wuzes can manufacture a pass rush and that the secondary can mature very quickly.

The more plausible scenario is that the Texans offense just has to get so much better to keep the defense off of the field. Kubiak sort of acknowledges the presser this week (I don't think the whole quote found the newspaper article):
Sorry TC, I think I will have to disagree with you to a certain degree here.

So far in pre-season, I've already seen good things from the whole rotation of the front four. At least one of these guys will contribute besides the players we had from last year: Okam, Colvin, and perhaps Bulman or Robinson or Nadings.

And the LB corp should be vastly improved with Diles, Bentley, Thompson, Adibi, and perhaps Coley or Moffitt.

Safety play is adequate.

The DBs will most likely drag us down in the early part of the season.

It will be a diffcult cut to 53, that's for sure!
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Old 08-21-2008   #25
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Sorry TC, I think I will have to disagree with you to a certain degree here.

So far in pre-season, I've already seen good things from the whole rotation of the front four. At least one of these guys will contribute besides the players we had from last year: Okam, Colvin, and perhaps Bulman or Robinson or Nadings.

And the LB corp should be vastly improved with Diles, Bentley, Thompson, Adibi, and perhaps Coley or Moffitt.

Safety play is adequate.

The DBs will most likely drag us down in the early part of the season.

It will be a diffcult cut to 53, that's for sure!

I've seen the same ol same ol. The only thing worse than the pass rush is the run defense. Greenwood has been Greenwood. The younguns at LB looked interesting but enough to make a big difference? And even if the pass rush was stellar, it doesn't look like they are going to have much help from the secondary unless there is a miracle in development.

Jacoby Jones is thankful that the defense was so bad so that he couldn't goof up any more punts, because the other team didn't have to punt.

It's the preseason. But so far the defense looks like blurgh.
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Old 08-21-2008   #26
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
Since there are three of them to pick from don't rule out being struck in the head with a blunt object.
Well, there IS that.

Sigh.
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Old 08-21-2008   #27
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Jacoby Jones is thankful that the defense was so bad so that he couldn't goof up any more punts, because the other team didn't have to punt.
Well ... that explains it . Jacoby knows a New Orleans voodoo priestess and she hexed the defense until Jacoby can hang on to the ball .
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Old 08-21-2008   #28
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

With Colvin, I think we have to remember part of his success was a result of playing on a Super Bowl team....good players everywhere--and, too, some of the best coaches in the NFL. To me, they are at their best schemming and 'during' game adjustments.

IMO, our success this year is going to depend upon something Kubiak preaches about every year and that is putting each player in his 'strength' comfort zone. Right now, we have a handful of proven players and a lot of players with degreeing amounts of potential. This is where we'll find out how good our coaches are...
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Old 08-21-2008   #29
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
I've seen the same ol same ol. The only thing worse than the pass rush is the run defense. Greenwood has been Greenwood. The younguns at LB looked interesting but enough to make a big difference? And even if the pass rush was stellar, it doesn't look like they are going to have much help from the secondary unless there is a miracle in development.

Jacoby Jones is thankful that the defense was so bad so that he couldn't goof up any more punts, because the other team didn't have to punt.

It's the preseason. But so far the defense looks like blurgh.
We allowed 123 yds rushing to the Broncos and 87 yds to the Saints.

In the Broncos game, if you subtract 24 yd from 2 laterals, and 19 yd from an outside zone run by Alridge (a CB's responsibility in this case, I won't name names), that would be like 78 yd rushing.
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Old 08-21-2008   #30
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

To be fair, yes, I didn't see all of the NO game but what I did see, I liked the run defense. The outside contain was a little shaky against Bush but we held our ground pretty well.

I'm scared of other teams passing against us, though. That's for sure.
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Old 08-21-2008   #31
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
I've seen the same ol same ol. The only thing worse than the pass rush is the run defense.
Huh? Take away Cutlers TD scramble (it was a passing play), and the Texans starting defense has allowed 52 yards on 15 carries (3.5 ypc). They haven't been challenged by a great runner, yet. But, I don't see how they can be depicted as bad from these performances.

Just as Mario took a lot of unnecessary shots in last year's "0 0 0 0" thread, the defense (particularly certain players) are taking some unfair criticism. For those who are concerned about the pass rush, notice Matt Schaub isn't seeing much pressure, as well. Sure, the O-line has improved over the years. But, I don't see Matt completing over 85% of his passes with a 140+ QB rating over the course of the season. The Texans starters have gotten away with a little bit more offensive holding than they probably will in the regular season.

So have the opponents' offensive lines. I saw the Saints tackle two Texans pass rushers...on a 5 yard out. No flags. I'm not saying Roger Goodell has asked referees to protect starting QBs in the preseason. Directly. I'm just saying we may be making too much out of what we're seeing from a couple of practice games.
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Old 08-21-2008   #32
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

[quote=Lucky;978464]Huh? Take away Cutlers TD scramble (it was a passing play), and the Texans starting defense has allowed 52 yards on 15 carries (3.5 ypc). They haven't been challenged by a great runner, yet. But, I don't see how they can be depicted as bad from these performances.

QUOTE]Yeah, I was about to get to that one, too!

Colvin went wide and deep on the LT.
Okoye went inside the LG.
That left a huge hole for Cutler to scramble toward.
Greenwood was left in no-man land, he surely did hesitate.

Somebody did not get the play correctly here, it looks like Greenwood, but we can't be surely sure!
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Old 08-21-2008   #33
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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For those who are concerned about the pass rush, notice Matt Schaub isn't seeing much pressure, as well. Sure, the O-line has improved over the years. But, I don't see Matt completing over 85% of his passes with a 140+ QB rating over the course of the season.

Also I'm thinking pre-season vanilla. Granted our track record is less that flattering when it comes to rushing the passer, but possible advances in our rush might be somewhat blurred by said vanilla.

I know that our starters 'should' get as much as three quarters against Dallas, but are we going to open up the playbook, or ride the vanilla-train all the way through the pre-season ?
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Old 08-21-2008   #34
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Huh? Take away Cutlers TD scramble (it was a passing play), and the Texans starting defense has allowed 52 yards on 15 carries (3.5 ypc). They haven't been challenged by a great runner, yet. But, I don't see how they can be depicted as bad from these performances.

Just as Mario took a lot of unnecessary shots in last year's "0 0 0 0" thread, the defense (particularly certain players) are taking some unfair criticism. For those who are concerned about the pass rush, notice Matt Schaub isn't seeing much pressure, as well. Sure, the O-line has improved over the years. But, I don't see Matt completing over 85% of his passes with a 140+ QB rating over the course of the season. The Texans starters have gotten away with a little bit more offensive holding than they probably will in the regular season.

So have the opponents' offensive lines. I saw the Saints tackle two Texans pass rushers...on a 5 yard out. No flags. I'm not saying Roger Goodell has asked referees to protect starting QBs in the preseason. Directly. I'm just saying we may be making too much out of what we're seeing from a couple of practice games.
Pretty good post.... you've got some good points in there. But I'm just a dumb fan, and I guess I don't know what I'm looking at.

If you were the coach, surely there are some goods & some bads you take away from this game, watch the film with the team, talk about what was going on, and correct any opportunities for improvement.

What would you point at to say, "There, we're doing the right thing there, and need to continue doing that." about our pass rush??
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Old 08-21-2008   #35
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Saw this little snapshot over at the Texans site -

Kubiak will have Colvin rush the passer from nickel, as well as N.D. Kalu and Chaun Thompson, allowing coaches to compare all three outside speed rushers. link

It got me thinking. All three of these guys can't possibly make it. Do two make it? One? I'm just not sure.

Going in I thought Colvin was a lock, but he hasn't shown me anything at all. Right now, I put him 3rd on my list out of those above.

Thompson has been hurt off and on, and his play seemed spotty when I happened to notice it, but he is fast, young and can contribute on ST and still has upside.

Kalu is older than Methusala, has no upside at all, and can't contribute on ST, but OTOH, he seems to be very motivated and has rushed the passer better than the other two thus far.

Further complicating matters is that they are three totally different players. Kalu being the seasoned end, Thompson the LB coming off the edge on passing downs with many more LB responsibilities, and Colvin trying to make a switch from a 3/4 OLB, to a pass rushing end.

Tomorrow will be absouletely vital to these three guys and should tell the tale on who stays and goes. I'm not really sure how to handicap this race, but my guess right now is that Colvin is cut, and we keep the other two. I think that will shock the casual fan, but that is my thought at the moment.

Opinions?
Had to address the original question from its source. Too many variables which makes it tough, like Kalu & leadership he brings but he will never be much more than he already is with declining skill & injury prone. this may be unfair to Colvin but he might be the OLB of a well used RB (see Ahman Green) just how much laterial movement & healthy games are left in the tank. Thompson is the most intriqueing prospect with upside & low tread life. If the Texans build for the future & know they need to address the edge rush next offseason via the draft or free agency then Thompson might just get the nod, roll the dice & let the chips fall where they may
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Old 08-21-2008   #36
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

Have we gotten better since last yr., personnel wise ?

I'd say yes...

Coach wise?

I'd say yes again...

We managed to have our best season to date last yr. despite all of our teams weaknesses, injuries, and inept coaching...

Maybe we'll be o.k ?
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Old 08-22-2008   #37
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

If the Texan's coaching staff is loosely organized and everybody has a say in this coaching by committee, then I see a light at the end of the tunnel.

Damn, I wish Ray Rhodes was our defensive coordinator. He's a proven commodity.
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Old 08-22-2008   #38
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

I haven't watch a lot of other team's preseason games- are they getting a good rush on the quarterback?
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Old 08-22-2008   #39
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Originally Posted by Lucky View Post
Huh? Take away Cutlers TD scramble (it was a passing play), and the Texans starting defense has allowed 52 yards on 15 carries (3.5 ypc). They haven't been challenged by a great runner, yet. But, I don't see how they can be depicted as bad from these performances.

Just as Mario took a lot of unnecessary shots in last year's "0 0 0 0" thread, the defense (particularly certain players) are taking some unfair criticism. For those who are concerned about the pass rush, notice Matt Schaub isn't seeing much pressure, as well. Sure, the O-line has improved over the years. But, I don't see Matt completing over 85% of his passes with a 140+ QB rating over the course of the season. The Texans starters have gotten away with a little bit more offensive holding than they probably will in the regular season.

So have the opponents' offensive lines. I saw the Saints tackle two Texans pass rushers...on a 5 yard out. No flags. I'm not saying Roger Goodell has asked referees to protect starting QBs in the preseason. Directly. I'm just saying we may be making too much out of what we're seeing from a couple of practice games.
It's just preseason.

I'm not basing what I see on just preseason. I'm looking at last year, and look at what I've seen so far this year, and am seeing a team that can't force the other team to punt. That they will do a nice play and then follow it up with someone being stupid and giving up a big play.

But seeing what you have seen and heard so far, do you think that the most inexperienced secondary the Texans have ever run out on the field is going to be even average? Who is going to be the guy on the other side of Mario Williams who will help complement him? Is Greenwood going to all of a sudden be a much better player?

We don't know the answers to those questions, but nothing in the preseason makes me think happy things about those subjects.
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Old 08-22-2008   #40
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Default Re: Pick a rusher...any rusher.

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Originally Posted by Porky View Post
Saw this little snapshot over at the Texans site -

Kubiak will have Colvin rush the passer from nickel, as well as N.D. Kalu and Chaun Thompson, allowing coaches to compare all three outside speed rushers. link

It got me thinking. All three of these guys can't possibly make it. Do two make it? One? I'm just not sure.

Going in I thought Colvin was a lock, but he hasn't shown me anything at all. Right now, I put him 3rd on my list out of those above.

Thompson has been hurt off and on, and his play seemed spotty when I happened to notice it, but he is fast, young and can contribute on ST and still has upside.

Kalu is older than Methusala, has no upside at all, and can't contribute on ST, but OTOH, he seems to be very motivated and has rushed the passer better than the other two thus far.

Further complicating matters is that they are three totally different players. Kalu being the seasoned end, Thompson the LB coming off the edge on passing downs with many more LB responsibilities, and Colvin trying to make a switch from a 3/4 OLB, to a pass rushing end.

Tomorrow will be absouletely vital to these three guys and should tell the tale on who stays and goes. I'm not really sure how to handicap this race, but my guess right now is that Colvin is cut, and we keep the other two. I think that will shock the casual fan, but that is my thought at the moment.

Opinions?
I've posted this suggestion before without much response and I realize that it won't happen, at least this year. But I'd like some response, not on its unlikeliness, but on the physical skills and merits of the player and effectiveness of the ( unlikely ) change.

I'm still intrigued by the notion of moving Okoye to the outside, opposite Williams. As a run stopper, he should be just as effective as he is inside. The real question is whether he could get as effective an outside push as anyone currenting vying for the spot. Inside, he faces a lot of doubleteams , with the OG being plus 300 lbs. Outside it would be more single blockers, less thjan 300 lbs.

This whole scenerio is prefaced with the development of Okam and his ability to assume the NT position, with TJ moving into Okoye's middle spot.

The idea is to simply get our 4 best defensive players on the field at the same time.
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