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Old 08-18-2008   #41
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

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Originally Posted by aj. View Post
I'm guessing the protective angel is in-part the org's unwillingness to already declare failure on the guy after spending millions of the bosses money on him - which is balanced with the devil on the other shoulder that's yet another 4 million of the bosses money waiting to be guaranteeed to him in two weeks if he makes the 53. If I'm McNair, I'm not sure I want to just give away any more money to a guy that can't play one play in pre-season without taking himself out of the game after falling down untouched.

Unfortunately all we see or hear from Ahman is him scoffing at fan's comments on radio interviews about him no longer able to stay healthy, or those smirky, smarmy little video comments ranging from 'it's (the groin injury) nothing' to I don't know when I'll be ready to play' or 'that's football.' It's not football. It's an old vet whose at the end of his career that's caught in a place between his lost fire and desire to play football - and another guaranteed 4 million if he makes the 53. His agent was overheard at dinner the other night saying "just make the 53 baby." (humor)

This wouldn't be such a big deal if it wasn't the flippin' RB1 roster spot. I think comments like 'he's a vet and knows his body better than anyone' or 'he's just saving himself for the regular season' are bullshit. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm tired of being strung along. I saw comments from Kubiak recently where he said AG was having serious doubts about his future last year during his knee thing. If those doubts were there last year, you can be assured that they are back this year, despite his great summer workout sessions and training camp (all with no or limited contact I might add). If I'm McNair, I'm putting a lot of pressure on Rick Smith to assure me that Ahman can come back healthy and add some value to the team this year before I throw another 4 mill at him. I'm highly skeptical and thoroughly disgusted with the whole situation. Prove me wrong Ahman.
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Old 08-18-2008   #42
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

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This wouldn't be such a big deal if it wasn't the flippin' RB1 roster spot.
I think we gotta be past the point of looking at Ahman as the #1 back...
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Old 08-18-2008   #43
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

Back to football 101 for me. I've never heard of the guy. BUT, I don't watch much Cardinal football either.
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Old 08-18-2008   #44
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

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Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
Must spread the rep...........
Took care of it. I'm actually pretty interested in Shipp. Has he ever been in a cut-n-go system before?
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Old 08-18-2008   #45
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

I don't think there's a huge difference between reasonable expectations for Marcel Shipp, and those we had for Mike Bell. Sure, he could surprise to the upside, but more likely, he's another available body, and isn't going to cost any current Texans RB their roster spot.

I think our best hope may be after the cuts to 75 that will occur after preseason game 3, or even after final cuts. LZ's most recent blog talked about those possibilities, and while I still think it's a little bit of a longshot, there's some possibilities there that I think are better than Shipp, or any other currently available RB

From LZ's blog:
Quote:
Adrian Peterson - Bears, Thomas Brown - Falcons, Kenton Keith - Colts, DeShawn Wynn - Packers, DeDe Dorsey - Bengals, Chris Perry - Bengals, Reuben Droughns - Giants, Musa Smith -Jets, Gary Russell - Steelers, T.J. Duckett - Seahawks.

It is worth noting that T.J. Duckett played for Alex Gibbs in Atlanta and Droughns played for Kubiak in Denver. Gary Russell has a background in the zone scheme from his college days at Minnesota (but he has character issues in his background) and DeDe Dorsey and Kenton Keith both played for the Colts who run plenty of zone.
However, bottom line is that anybody who becomes available is available for a reason, and even if someone currently not on the roster is on the 53 man roster, it's simply not realistic to expect them to be a difference maker. Stranger things have happened - just not very often.
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Last edited by ChampionTexan; 08-18-2008 at 09:10 AM.
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Old 08-18-2008   #46
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

From Scouts Inc. :

Shipp is a valuable backup running back who can step in for an injured starter and not hold the team back. He is a powerful runner who is most effective when running inside, between the tackles. He has a decent burst through the hole and runs with authority and good leg drive. He does not appear to have great vision once he gets past the first level and will get blindsided after he gets through the hole. He runs with a strong base and can break arm tackles, but is not a great pile-mover on the goal line or in short-yardage situations. He is not a real elusive runner once he is in the open field and will generally just put his head down and get what he can in a straight line. He is a willing blocker when he stays in for pass pro, but is also an effective receiver out of the backfield with soft, natural hands that can pluck the ball away from his body. He has been a core special teams member and has the kind of speed and competitiveness to produce in coverage. He is the kind of player most coaches like to have around, but you can't have too many of them.

I think we have too many of them...
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Old 08-18-2008   #47
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

From LZ's list i'd take Droughns or Duckett.

Droughns had success in Denver and is a capable short yardage back. Duckett has shown flashes that he's a capable short yardage back as well and already has logged time with Gibbs.

As for Green...

All I can hope for with Green is that he can give us 5 hard games before he takes his money and goes to the retirement home. The starting 5 games are brutal and we need a true feature back in those games. If he can be that guy then we wont really need him that much after that stretch if the line is up to snuff and Slaton is ready to start.

But if he can just give us 5 games I wont be happy but i'll be semi-content. I cant even dream a scenario where he'd give us 16 games
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Old 08-18-2008   #48
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

I don't understand bringing this guy in. It don't hurt anything and I guess we needed an extra body because of the injury situation with Green. I would like to bring somebody in a little younger and with a little more upside. That being said I will root for Shipp like any other Texan and I trust Smith&Kubes on this decision.
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Old 08-18-2008   #49
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

From LZ's list I would take

Keith
Duckett compliments Slaton well
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Old 08-18-2008   #50
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

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Originally Posted by Brando View Post
I don't understand bringing this guy in. It don't hurt anything and I guess we needed an extra body because of the injury situation with Green. I would like to bring somebody in a little younger and with a little more upside. That being said I will root for Shipp like any other Texan and I trust Smith&Kubes on this decision.
I understand bringing this guy in, but I also don't like what it may portend: that the zone blocking scheme isn't a "plug and play" system here in Houston the way it was in Denver. Or at least not yet.

Kubes and Co. seem to be at a "throw a RB in there and see who sticks" state, and I'm not a huge fan of not allowing RBs to build momentum. I've never been a huge proponent of the RBBC approach, even though I know it works, but I don't know if we have a great committee. I think Kubes realizes that half of our committee is held together by duct tape and chicken wire and the other half is a little inexperienced.

I definately agree that we need to cut bait with Green. I don't like the trend of holding onto guys that aren't producing, and their sticking with Green reminds me a bit of sticking with Carr. This can set a team back a year or two, and RB is too important a position to load roster spots with guys that go down with injuries prior to being touched by anyone on the field...EVER. C.Brown has more upside right now than Green just because he's made of tougher tissue paper than Green...and that freakin' scares me. He's like 2 ply, and Green is 1 ply.

(insert me here grumbling about passing on Mendenhall, then insert someone's comments about our new rookie OT Brown looking pretty good, then insert me grumbling about a catch-22)
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Old 08-18-2008   #51
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

I think we're all overthinking this. He's nothing more than a minimal cost warm body for training camp, so the other backs don't get overworked. That's it. He's not going to make the roster, he's not going to move up the depth chart. He's just a guy to fill out practice time. All this wondering about how he can help the team and if he fits the system - none of that matters.

If they wanted a guy who could be a threat to make the team - they would have gone after one of the bigger, younger names out there.
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Old 08-18-2008   #52
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

I didn't like our RB situation before this signing and I still don't. I am hoping Slayton lights up the Cowgirls but even then I would be worried about him being our featured back when the games count. I have next to no faith in Green or Brown. I realize that if you put them together they might equal one good RB but they both could be down for the count by week 3.
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Old 08-18-2008   #53
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

Agreed.
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Old 08-18-2008   #54
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

Its so funny how many of you are talking about McNair's money like it was your own.

Cutting Green frees up a roster spot, sure, but thats about all the good it does. It doesn't free up cap space for us because of his prorated bonus payments. It owuld be better to cut him next year.

All it really does is save Mr. McNair 4 million bucks and give us 1 extra roster spot for a guy who most likely will play minimal minutes.

I say if Green can win us 1 game, keep him. Its not my money, so I don't really care. McNair won't go broke
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Old 08-18-2008   #55
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

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Originally Posted by Overalls View Post
I didn't like our RB situation before this signing and I still don't. I am hoping Slayton lights up the Cowgirls but even then I would be worried about him being our featured back when the games count. I have next to no faith in Green or Brown. I realize that if you put them together they might equal one good RB but they both could be down for the count by week 3.
Sadly after watching the first two games I have more faith in Brown than I do Taylor. Taylor looks slow to react to the one cut and I have seen several times he cuts into the defenders versus to where the hole is.
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Old 08-18-2008   #56
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

Kubiak just needed another body to take a few carries until the end of preseason. I doubt he makes the 53 man roster. Just another camp body. No need to panic Texan fans.
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Old 08-18-2008   #57
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

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Originally Posted by Specnatz View Post
Sadly after watching the first two games I have more faith in Brown than I do Taylor. Taylor looks slow to react to the one cut and I have seen several times he cuts into the defenders versus to where the hole is.
Taylor just looks like a guy who hasn't played football in over a year (which he is). Before he got hurt and sat for the 2007 season he was better than this. I'm not by any means a "Chris Taylor IS A BEAST!!!!!" fan and I've always wondered where that came from but he is (was?) serviceable and I expected better out of him than he's been giving. I think this is the result of sitting for a year. If I remember correctly he didn't even get camp last year. His injury was very early in training camp (anyone else remember that or am I wrong?) and so he's far removed from that very workmanlike but effective game he started against Cleveland at the end of the 2006 season.

Some guys can be out of football for a while and come back and not look too rusty but most players who stay out very long have a period of transition where they have to get back up to speed. Some guys never can seem to make it back and I hope Taylor isn't one of those guys. He hasn't done much this preseason though. Maybe next week.
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Old 08-18-2008   #58
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

You never know, this guy may come in here and do well.......... just kidding. I think his Shipp has sailed on his NFL career.
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Old 08-18-2008   #59
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

I am intrigued by Marcel Shipp. I remember a couple of years ago, some people were pretty high on him and then Arizona tried the whole Emmitt Smith thing. Then they brought in the guy who took Smith's job in Dallas. Shipp was injured during that stuff but he made it through McGinness, Denny Green and now he's expendible because of Edgerrin James, J. J. Arrington and Tim Hightower.

Shipp probably is just a warm camp body but I would be happy if he could come in here and either compete for a spot or light a fire under some of our young guys. Either way, it's nice to see that the coaches aren't satisfied with the 2-3 ypc we're getting out of our guys so far.
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Old 08-18-2008   #60
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Default Re: Marcel Shipp

Don't forget about Preist Holmes situation when he went to KC. This could be the same thing, Preist was never a starter with Baltamore..............I think we would be better off giving Shipp a chance & cutting Green!
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