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Old 08-17-2008   #41
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

Chris Brown will be fine after he knocks all the rust off that he has from missing so much time. He needs to runn with his pad level lower and I'm sure Chick Harris will be pointing that out to him in their film sessions.

As far as Jacoby goes here is a quote from Gary Kubiak from the Houston Texans website:

“It’s a problem right now,” Kubiak said. “We are trying to push the kid through it. We tried to get him another ball there to end the game on a reverse - from a confidence standpoint, try to get him a chance to make a play. But he’s struggling right now. He’s got a lot of ability. He can help us win, but we’ve got to get the issues fixed. I don’t think it’s a lack of effort on anybody’s part. We’ve got to regain this kid’s confidence somehow, and we’ll keep working through that.”
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Old 08-17-2008   #42
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by Carr Bombed View Post
.....Even though Molden got beat deep, I was more impressed with that one play than anything Reeves did tonight. Molden was able to close, get position, and stay right in the WRs hip pocket......it took a perfect pass to beat him and unfortunately that is what was thrown.

See, that's the kind of thing that's at the basis of my "Oh just go ahead and start Moldon until Dunta gets back" feeling. By midseason Moldon will be a pretty good corner and have learned a lot. Reeves will be still just be "Reeves". The results from those 6-8 weeks will be the same regardless but one has upside and the other is just in the midst of confirming what Dallas fans seem to already know.
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Old 08-17-2008   #43
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by Polo View Post
Schaub looked about as good against the Saints as he did last year...

I think Schaub is the guy, but I will really feel good aabout him when I see him perform against a team with a really good D...
You will feel a lot better about Schaub when he gets his main man in there.
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Old 08-17-2008   #44
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by Mr PC View Post
....CC Brown got in a very good hit to save a touchdown, perhaps he is poised for a solid year after all. I remain skeptical though, that play may have turned out different if it were Shockey in the endzone rather than Mark Campbell.
True but most teams in the NFL don't have Jeremy Shockey back there. CC Brown is fine back there if he's paired with a quality FS like Demps or better ("quality", I never said Demps was more than that). It's only when you have CC back there playing FS with another guy just like him playing SS that you run into trouble.

In this configuration Brown isn't the gaping hole he was before. He's not our ultimate answer but he'll do until Rick Smith can turn his attention to upgrading the spot.
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Old 08-17-2008   #45
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

Our CBs need to learn to "look over their shoulder" (at the ball). Otherwise, they will be "looking over their shoulder" for someone who can.
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Old 08-17-2008   #46
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
Our CBs need to learn to "look over their shoulder" (at the ball). Otherwise, they will be "looking over their shoulder" for someone who can.
IIRC, most CBs are taught to keep their eyes on the WR and only look back when the WRs look back otherwise they lose track of the WR leaving him WIDE open. Savvy WRs know this and will wait until the last moment to look up and find the ball thus giving the CB little time to react.

If the CB sees the WR's eyes go wide - meaning the ball is near - they could stick and arm up at that time ...but in today's NFL that's face-guarding and draws an "automatic" flag.
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Old 08-17-2008   #47
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

Our passing game is beginning to look outstanding, however, without a decent running game that won't be sustainable. I do think the running game will come with time, though.

What concerns me - and it echoes my post-Denver thoughts - is that we're really struggling on D. We've simply got to find a way to get teams off the field. These high-scoring shoot-outs are fun to watch but they're not a sensible basis for a play-off run.

On paper, our front 7 looks fine, and other than Reeves (who looks an utter liability) the secondary look serviceable too. So what's the problem here? It's probably too early to be pointing fingers at Richard 'vanilla' Smith again, but one has to wonder...
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Old 08-17-2008   #48
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
IIRC, most CBs are taught to keep their eyes on the WR and only look back when the WRs look back otherwise they lose track of the WR leaving him WIDE open. Savvy WRs know this and will wait until the last moment to look up and find the ball thus giving the CB little time to react.
If the CB sees the WR's eyes go wide - meaning the ball is near - they could stick and arm up at that time ...but in today's NFL that's face-guarding and draws an "automatic" flag.
I understand, but if you look at the Reeves' and Molden's "burned" plays, I think you'll see the the receivers "gave up their hands"......and it was not recognized or reacted to.

******

As far as face-guarding, I believe there is no penalty unless there is contact.

Last edited by CloakNNNdagger; 08-17-2008 at 11:59 AM. Reason: face-guarding
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Old 08-17-2008   #49
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by markn View Post
Our passing game is beginning to look outstanding, however, without a decent running game that won't be sustainable. I do think the running game will come with time, though.

What concerns me - and it echoes my post-Denver thoughts - is that we're really struggling on D. We've simply got to find a way to get teams off the field. These high-scoring shoot-outs are fun to watch but they're not a sensible basis for a play-off run.

On paper, our front 7 looks fine, and other than Reeves (who looks an utter liability) the secondary look serviceable too. So what's the problem here? It's probably too early to be pointing fingers at Richard 'vanilla' Smith again, but one has to wonder...
I'd say that your first point, about our passing game is valid with the exception that Spencer Tillman brought up last night (I can't believe I'm quoting Spencer Tillman. Do I have a fever?) that it is possible that our running game may be not good enough to run first but, it could be adequate for a pass first-then run approach. We won't know until the games get real though so it's cause for concern even if it does turn out alright.

On your second point about the defense we're just like we were last season and that is totally dependent on other teams shooting themselves in the foot to get stops much of the time. We just don't seem to bring the pressure that you would expect of this bunch of 1's and I'm just hoping that when the Texans start putting Colvin out there regularly things may change. They're holding him back a lot because he's an older player and there's not much to gain by exposing him to the potential for preseason injury. It makes me nervous though. We have a "Must Get Pressure" secondary if ever I saw one and we can't afford for the Colvin experiment to not work out.

Richard Smith's defense is so far and I very much hope that if we see another finish this year where we improve by like 1 or 2 spots in ranking then he's gone. The Texans haven't settled for no-results anywhere since Kubiak and Rick Smith got here and I hope that they hold their defensive coordinator to the same standards. Richard Smith might be a friend and a good guy but I expect Kubiak to do what's best for the team (unlike Capers years ago who kept bad assistants out of loyalty).

If course if we vault into the top ten on defense this year then I'll gladly login, apologize publicly, and grab a big mug of Kool Aid.
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Old 08-17-2008   #50
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

Schaub was outstanding, even brilliant last night in NOLA. If the durability
issue does not return, he looks like every bit the player Rick & Kubiak expected and hoped for when they gave up 2 second-rounders for him.
And Slaton was a very pleasant surprise. He actually ran up the middle with some real heart, something they didn't advertise, while showing us that sweet little burst we don't see much of in these parts.
And great game by Walters, this guy just keeps getting better.
On the negative side, lot of concerns at corner and we still seem to be missing any kind of pass rush ?
And what's wrong with Jacobey, he's been regressing ever since his steller
rookie preseason ? I'm almost wondering if he wants to be cut ?
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Old 08-17-2008   #51
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

Haven't watched the game yet (Watching it Monday).

But from this thread, it sounds like JJ is spiraling downward.

I think JJ is living off a memory. He made some cool plays during last year's preseason (making SportsCenter highlights) and I just think the guy is riding each game off his past glory.

He thinks he can score every time he touches the ball, so he's not focusing on each step that comes BEFORE he breaks away. All he has in his mind is the image of him celebrating the score, hearing the thunder of applause and the roar of the crowd.

Sounds like he IS a liability at the moment.

I don't think he deserves to be cut. I sense that the coaches want him to get past his mistakes, they're desiring to see him overcome it.

The thing that I don't see anybody mentioning is this: We'd never CUT the guy...he'd be traded because he's talented yet NOT gelling here in Houston. JJ is certainly a guy who could command a draft pick compensation or another player from an interested team. Just my .02.
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Old 08-17-2008   #52
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

[quote=ObsiWan;974568]IIRC, most CBs are taught to keep their eyes on the WR and only look back when the WRs look back otherwise they lose track of the WR leaving him WIDE open. Savvy WRs know this and will wait until the last moment to look up and find the ball thus giving the CB little time to react.

If the CB sees the WR's eyes go wide - meaning the ball is near - they could stick and arm up at that time ...but in today's NFL that's face-guarding and draws an "automatic" flag.[/QUOTE]

I previously wrote that face-guarding was not illegal without contact.
But actually I am not entirely correct, you may be closer to the "truth." Face-guarding is illegal, even without contact, IF the defender has his back to the play (without looking back).

Face-guarding without contact, though, does remain legal in college football, I believe.
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Old 08-17-2008   #53
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by Polo View Post
This is silly.

Had Jacoby come out and returned six punts for TD's in these two games the common thought would be..."It's just pre-season"...And with good reason...

Now that he's had some trouble holding onto the ball it's ok to read into the "pre-season"....Some folks tend to look at the negatives and run with them, some folks the positive...

Really I'm not trying to do either...I'm not saying he will or won't get better...All I said is that a guy with the kind of talent he has shouldn't be written off just yet....
yup. agreed.
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Originally Posted by Carr Bombed View Post
If my Aunt had balls.......well you know how it goes.

There isn't anything silly about it...it's actually silly to sit there and act like his poor play doesn't mean anything (or on the flip side, positive plays doesn't mean anything). This is the preseason, it's a lengthy job interview....the players that make a impact and big plays get a job and the ones that don't are in danger of not being hired. Some people will tell you "the preseason doesn't mean anything" but that is just a load of bull. Go ask someone like David Anderson (who has probably solidified himself ahead of Jacoby Jones on the depth chart) if the preason means anything.
This is like a job interview? Well the Texans must be the marine then, because they were the one that recruited Jones (drafted).

If they cut him now, Rick/Kubiak would look silly wasting a 3rd round pick on him. Pre-draft, they knew he came from a small school. They knew he wouldn't get it right away because of that. Transiting from a 3A school to the NFL isn't a easy task, and they knew that before they drafted Jones. I think there a 3 year window for this kind of "project". It's silly to think they would cut him now, when they already knew what they were getting when they drafted him, what his journey would be like to get to his potential, and how great the ending result could be.

Too early to have the discussion about cutting him. Come back with that next year.

Last edited by J-Russ; 08-17-2008 at 12:43 PM.
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Old 08-17-2008   #54
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
See, that's the kind of thing that's at the basis of my "Oh just go ahead and start Moldon until Dunta gets back" feeling. By midseason Moldon will be a pretty good corner and have learned a lot. Reeves will be still just be "Reeves". The results from those 6-8 weeks will be the same regardless but one has upside and the other is just in the midst of confirming what Dallas fans seem to already know.
I don't think thats wise or what the Texans will do. they'll need to be patient with Molden so he keeps progressing without set-backs. even though they may seem pretty close in coverage skills, Reeves still has the advantage in NFL expereince & is stronger despite losing chicken sratch with Reggie Bush.

We don't remember drafting Reeves because we didn't- Dallas did, in the 7th (2004) for compairson Faggins was drafted, by the Texans in the 6th (2002). The reason I bring this up is because he was a late rd. pick which means developmental, only entering his 5th year has better size & long speed which is what they are looking for. check out these #'s between cb's-

Fred Bennett- 6-0 197
Antwain Molden- 6-0 197
Jaques Reeves- 5-11 192

Those are some nice sized cb's. Bennett looks even more physical & bigger, also noticed him on the sideline talking to Molden after he was beaten showing leadership. For an area of the team that was a prioity need going into free agency & the draft Rick Smith & company did the best they could to address the need. Now its up to Reeves & Molden to accept the challenge, take notes in film study plus all the coaching up Jon Hoke offers.
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Old 08-17-2008   #55
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by J-Russ View Post
yup. agreed.


This is like a job interview? Well the Texans must be the marine then, because they were the one that recruited Jones (drafted).

If they cut him now, Rick/Kubiak would look silly wasting a 3rd round pick on him. Pre-draft, they knew he came from a small school. They knew he wouldn't get it right away because of that. Transiting from a 3A school to the NFL isn't a easy task, and they knew that before they drafted Jones. I think there a 3 year window for this kind of "project". It's silly to think they would cut him now, when they already knew what they were getting when they drafted him, what his journey would be like to get to his potential, and how great the ending result could be.

Too early to have the discussion about cutting him. Come back with that next year.
Hmm....Why didn't you quote the rest of my post....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carr Bombed View Post
I never said I was writing him off, I'm just speaking the truth......and the truth is, that if your a 4th stringer who is forming a habit of putting the ball on the ground, who is also moving down on the depth chart instead of up it....you tend to get on the coaches shit list regardless of how much talent you have. (This isn't Capers' Texans, there will be good players cut from this team)

There are mid-late round receivers with Jacoby like potential that come out every year. He will probably stick on the roster this season in that 5th string WR spot, but unless he really turns it on, I wouldn't expect him to be on the team much longer after that.
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Old 08-17-2008   #56
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
I don't think thats wise or what the Texans will do. they'll need to be patient with Molden so he keeps progressing without set-backs. even though they may seem pretty close in coverage skills, Reeves still has the advantage in NFL expereince & is stronger despite losing chicken sratch with Reggie Bush.

We don't remember drafting Reeves because we didn't- Dallas did, in the 7th (2004) for compairson Faggins was drafted, by the Texans in the 6th (2002). The reason I bring this up is because he was a late rd. pick which means developmental, only entering his 5th year has better size & long speed which is what they are looking for. check out these #'s between cb's-

Fred Bennett- 6-0 197
Antwain Molden- 6-0 197
Jaques Reeves- 5-11 192

Those are some nice sized cb's. Bennett looks even more physical & bigger, also noticed him on the sideline talking to Molden after he was beaten showing leadership. For an area of the team that was a prioity need going into free agency & the draft Rick Smith & company did the best they could to address the need. Now its up to Reeves & Molden to accept the challenge, take notes in film study plus all the coaching up Jon Hoke offers.
This is what I'm thinking also bearlover. Rushing Molden into service is a disaster waiting to happen. If he gets the patience Fred Bennet got he'll be O.K. There are worse things then finishing 7-9 or 8-8. Ruining a young prospect forever qualifies in my book. I can see what's around the corner so help me. Put lipstick on Reeves and hold your water on Molden.
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Old 08-17-2008   #57
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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This is what I'm thinking also bearlover. Rushing Molden into service is a disaster waiting to happen. If he gets the patience Fred Bennet got he'll be O.K. There are worse things then finishing 7-9 or 8-8. Ruining a young prospect forever qualifies in my book. I can see what's around the corner so help me. Put lipstick on Reeves and hold your water on Molden.
I agree. Bennett did not become a part of the regular rotation last year until week 5 or 6 I believe. He got some playing time here and there before that but he wasn't pressed into action until about 1/3 of the way into the season. The Texans should do the same thing with Molden.

Of course it would be awesome if Molden just steps up and becomes our #2 CB right away, but the Texans shouldn't put that pressure on him if he isn't ready.
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Old 08-17-2008   #58
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by threetoedpete View Post
This is what I'm thinking also bearlover. Rushing Molden into service is a disaster waiting to happen. If he gets the patience Fred Bennet got he'll be O.K. There are worse things then finishing 7-9 or 8-8. Ruining a young prospect forever qualifies in my book. I can see what's around the corner so help me. Put lipstick on Reeves and hold your water on Molden.
just made me laugh on that:

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Old 08-17-2008   #59
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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just made me laugh on that:

thats just plain wrong
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Old 08-17-2008   #60
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Default Re: Here's what I learned tonight.

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Originally Posted by Carr Bombed View Post
Hmm....Why didn't you quote the rest of my post....
My mistake. But from the looks of your other posts(mainly one in the game thread about getting his shit together) I figured you were in the 'send his ass out' camp.

Last edited by J-Russ; 08-17-2008 at 11:47 PM.
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