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Old 08-13-2008   #41
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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Originally Posted by maddogmrb View Post
I've been a fan of Earl Cochran since he came to the Texans. I'm not sure he is a NFL quality starting DE, though and, if he's beating out Weaver, then that doesn't say a whole lot for our other DE position. I think Earl is a NFL quality backup unless he has progressed alot in this training camp/offseason and I hope he has.

Great points. This is why I am currently expecting the Texan's to pick a Defensive End in the first round of the 2009 NFL Draft.
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Old 08-13-2008   #42
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

Anthony Weaver has disappointed me more than any other player we have signed. When he came in I wasn't expecting him to be a Pro Bowler, but at least be above average. I never hear his name called during the games, hes like a ninja, you never see or hear from him. If Cochran can play better then put him in the game !!
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Old 08-14-2008   #43
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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why keep the far more expensive Weaver on the roster when Earl can get the job done vs. the run ?
Your answer lies within the question young grasshopper!
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Old 08-14-2008   #44
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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Great points. This is why I am currently expecting the Texan's to pick a Defensive End in the first round of the 2009 NFL Draft.
knowing our drafting history your probably right but if the running game still sucks this year i think Kubes might be convinced to change his phiosophy about drafting RBs in the first and then a DE in the second.
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Old 08-14-2008   #45
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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Originally Posted by V3rm0nt3r View Post
knowing our drafting history your probably right but if the running game still sucks this year i think Kubes might be convinced to change his phiosophy about drafting RBs in the first and then a DE in the second.
I think the Texans are getting to the point as far as talent and depth where I would not be completely disappointed with that scenario. However, at this point I am thinking DE in round one, and perhaps an RB in round 2. RB's just have such short careers on the average, it is hard to justify taking one in the first round.
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Old 08-14-2008   #46
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

I think a RB in the 1st round would make the most immediate impact, but a DE, OLB, or S would be a better long term pick for the team. This defense is going to be really scary.
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Old 08-14-2008   #47
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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I think a RB in the 1st round would make the most immediate impact, but a DE, OLB, or S would be a better long term pick for the team. This defense is going to be really scary.
Im hoping that Barber, Abidi, Ziles, or Slaton really steps up this year and makes that an easy decision. All of them seem to have potential at being a long term answer to a position of need
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Old 08-14-2008   #48
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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Originally Posted by Ole Miss Texan View Post
I think a RB in the 1st round would make the most immediate impact, but a DE, OLB, or S would be a better long term pick for the team. This defense is going to be really scary.

I completely agree. We can get a pretty darn good RB in the 2nd round, and I just love it when they pick lineman of any flavor in the 1st round.
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Old 08-14-2008   #49
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

if we can get one of the Clemson backs (preferably James Davis) in the second that would complement a guy like Slaton than go for it in the second round but i see that we will either have to trade up in the second or down in the first to snag a value RB with big upside but can still contribute right off.
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Old 08-14-2008   #50
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

it's weird to think of the Texans as a team with enough talent and depth that they would even consider trading up to get a player. i guess we're getting to that point though where we may be sitting there on draft day saying we need these two guys no matter what.

i don't know if we're there yet but it's weird to even think that it could be right around the corner.
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Old 08-15-2008   #51
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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Originally Posted by threetoedpete View Post
He's a three-four end stuck on a four-three team. Weaver neither created the situation or circumstance. That would be Charlie Caslery and Dom Capers. The crime here would be not getting any value for the guy after keeping him around for two extra years. That's on Smithiak.
Anthony Weaver was signed over a month after Gary Kubiak had been hired and had named Richard Smith as his defensive coordinator, so he was brought in for our current scheme. I don't know if Casserly can really be blamed too much for the contract situation, because he was probably just doing what Kubiak wanted him to do. Since we were moving from a 3-4 to a 4-3, we needed linemen that would fit that scheme....even if we had to overpay.
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Old 08-15-2008   #52
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

To address the original point of this thread, I think Cochran gives us more options as a starter than Weaver does. Even though we need our left DE to be primarily a run stopper on first and second downs, the offense will still throw the ball often and Cochran provides a better pass rush than Weaver. If Cochran proves to be able to play the run as well as Weaver, then he should definitely get the starting job.

However, there is still a need for Weaver on this team. Remember that our run defense was a weakness last year. Even if he isn't starting, Weaver will need to be part of the rotation at DE. In running situations, Weaver can spell either of the starters. In passing situations, Colvin will be able to enter the game.
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Old 08-15-2008   #53
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

Let's see what a fit Weaver can offer before crowning Cochran. I for one am buying into the "he's been injured since he's been here and battled through" story.

With Mario and Okoye, the QB will be getting pressured, we need to be able to stop the run too and till I see otherwise a healthy Weaver should be the man for that job.
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Old 08-15-2008   #54
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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Originally Posted by BornOrange View Post
Anthony Weaver was signed over a month after Gary Kubiak had been hired and had named Richard Smith as his defensive coordinator, so he was brought in for our current scheme. I don't know if Casserly can really be blamed too much for the contract situation, because he was probably just doing what Kubiak wanted him to do. Since we were moving from a 3-4 to a 4-3, we needed linemen that would fit that scheme....even if we had to overpay.
Richard Smith didn't get here till after the draft. Weaver was signed before the draft.

Sadly enough Chris Olsen wasn't here at the time either which allowed Dan Ferens to draw up his last terrible FA contract for Weaver to sign. It was a nice way for him to end his legacy of overpriced FAs for this franchise.

Not saying we wouldn't have signed Weaver if Smith/Olsen were here at the time but I do believe the contract would've been much more cap friendly than it is now.
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Old 08-15-2008   #55
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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Richard Smith didn't get here till after the draft. Weaver was signed before the draft.
You mean Rick Smith, the GM. Richard Smith was hired about a week after Kubiak was named head coach. There was a lot of speculation about the DC job during that time. A lot of fans wanted Jim Bates. Kubiak wanted Frank Bush, but Arizona wouldn't let him out of his contract.
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Old 08-15-2008   #56
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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You mean Rick Smith, the GM. Richard Smith was hired about a week after Kubiak was named head coach. There was a lot of speculation about the DC job during that time. A lot of fans wanted Jim Bates. Kubiak wanted Frank Bush, but Arizona wouldn't let him out of his contract.
You are correct I meant slick Rick in my post.
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Old 08-16-2008   #57
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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Originally Posted by False Start On # 69 View Post
Anthony Weaver has disappointed me more than any other player we have signed. When he came in I wasn't expecting him to be a Pro Bowler, but at least be above average. I never hear his name called during the games, hes like a ninja, you never see or hear from him. If Cochran can play better then put him in the game !!

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stacy you forgot to sign it.

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Old 08-16-2008   #58
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

This is just speculation on my part. And there's really no scientific evidence to back it up so I shouldn't even bring it up but, he came over from the Ravens. He was the only guy we could expect to play a significant amount of time that was coming from a successful defense. I think the fact that he was on a great defense was important. We needed an attitude change because we completely lacked any semblance of a veteran leader at the time. His production on the field is extremely undervalued to this point because he is so solid against the run, he rarely breaks contain on his side. With our poor tackling, if he sacrifices 2 or 3 sacks a year but avoids getting burned 10 times, I'll take it. And its not like our announcers are saying "did you see Weaver, the way he forced the guy to hesitate on that run allowed Ryans to make a beautiful tackle". So the idea that we're upset because he doesn't get his name called, well its ridiculous.

"But we're terrible against the run"
Teams have, for years, killed us on the ground by running up the middle and setting up screens. That and the fact that we don't tackle. How many times have we had a back trapped on the side for a 1 or two yard gain only to miss a tackle and it turns into 4 or 5 yards. I won't pretend to know everything about or defense but I think if Weaver does his job, we won't notice him. Now if Earl can do the same thing, and provide pass rushing, then I'm all for it but given the choice, if I was charged with fixing our defense, I'd say that poor tackling has been a problem more than our RDE pot. I'm not suggesting that he's an all world DE. He's certainly limited because he doesn't get pressure on the passer.

If we can do better, then do it. But the call for Weaver's head is a bit out of line if you ask me.

Mike
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Old 08-16-2008   #59
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Default Re: Kubiak says Earl Cochran is serious threat to start at strongside DE

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Originally Posted by Texanmike View Post
This is just speculation on my part. And there's really no scientific evidence to back it up so I shouldn't even bring it up but, he came over from the Ravens. He was the only guy we could expect to play a significant amount of time that was coming from a successful defense. I think the fact that he was on a great defense was important. We needed an attitude change because we completely lacked any semblance of a veteran leader at the time. His production on the field is extremely undervalued to this point because he is so solid against the run, he rarely breaks contain on his side. With our poor tackling, if he sacrifices 2 or 3 sacks a year but avoids getting burned 10 times, I'll take it. And its not like our announcers are saying "did you see Weaver, the way he forced the guy to hesitate on that run allowed Ryans to make a beautiful tackle". So the idea that we're upset because he doesn't get his name called, well its ridiculous.

"But we're terrible against the run"
Teams have, for years, killed us on the ground by running up the middle and setting up screens. That and the fact that we don't tackle. How many times have we had a back trapped on the side for a 1 or two yard gain only to miss a tackle and it turns into 4 or 5 yards. I won't pretend to know everything about or defense but I think if Weaver does his job, we won't notice him. Now if Earl can do the same thing, and provide pass rushing, then I'm all for it but given the choice, if I was charged with fixing our defense, I'd say that poor tackling has been a problem more than our RDE pot. I'm not suggesting that he's an all world DE. He's certainly limited because he doesn't get pressure on the passer.

If we can do better, then do it. But the call for Weaver's head is a bit out of line if you ask me.

Mike


I generally agree with your point about Weaver's value. However, I think our poor run defense has more to do with being physically badly overmatched. I think our LBs are solid tacklers - greenwood and certainly ryans... and, outside of A. Winfield, Dunta is the best tackling CB in the NFL. I just think we've been old and weak on the DL. I also think our safeties, other than Earl, have been somewhat poor tacklers.

This year should be different. We at least have the opportunity to field an entire lineup of guys who play the run well; something like:

Mario, TJ, Okoye, Weaver or Cochran
Greeenwood, Ryans, Diles
Bennett, Fletcher (Dunta)
Earl, Barber
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